DU Game Thread and comments

[comebackkids0708]

Quick prediction. UD controls tempo and wins 31-21

[Avid Flyer]

10-7 Duq at the half, at least we are in it.

Saw where Steve V got sacked for 55 yard loss:eek:

[DetroitFlyer]

1. WE NEED A KICKER!!!!!

2. We are dominating them in the stats, but barely leading. Tino is the man.... He has the tools to be a special QB at UD. Extremely impressive game so far....

3. Outside of that first play, defense has been sharp.

We need to put this one away....

[DetroitFlyer]

1st and goal Dayton agter great Mack run. Our running game has come to life today....

Mack left, TD UD!!!!!!! Nice, I can breath a little easier now. We have owned these guys today, we have to put it away now!

Dayton 24 Duquesne 10

[DetroitFlyer]

DU ball.... 2nd and 6 from the 36. Come on defense, shut em down. DU run to the 50, first down. Dang it! New QB runs it. Three man rush not getting it done. Do not like the getting conservative thing.... DU to the 47. 2nd and 7. 4:48 to go.... DU pass, caught to the UD 26! Ouch!!!! Sack, by the Flyers, back to the 32. 2nd and 16, need more of that. DU run to the 25. 3rd and 9. Two down territory. Pass, short of the first. 4th and about 1.... DU going for it of course. Flag on the Flyers, huge mistake, and pass interference.... Huge mistakes. DU all the way to the 4.... DU pass, lost a yard. 2nd and goal from the 5.... Pass, TD DU. Wow, what a remarkably poor defensive series. Here is a thought, if what you are doing is working, keep doing it, that prevent stuff has put us in an uncomfortable position. I have seen this for years, and seen EXACTLY what just happened occur many times.

[DetroitFlyer]

Kick returned to the 38. 2:21 to play. Offense needs to step up and bail out the sorry defensive effort on the last series.... Run for no gain.... Not exactly a great start.... 2nd and 10 for the Flyers. TO Duquesne.... 2:14 to go.... Tino run to the 41. TO DU. 3rd and 7 for the Flyers.... We really need this first down. This could be the game right here.... 1 TO left for DU. Tino draw, short to the 46. Final TO for Duquesne. Not a good way to end a game. Defense chokes, offense chokes, we had better step it up on defense this series. Losing now would be horrible....

[DetroitFlyer]

DU ball. Pass, caught to the 30. First down.... 1:22 to go.... 2nd and 4. Pass, caught to the 41. 50 seconds left.... DU first down. Pass, incomplete.... 2nd and 10. 39 seconds to play and DU with no timeouts left.... Need a sack, interception, or fumble recovery.... We have to put this one away.... Ball at the DU 41.... Pass, caught to the 47 of the Flyers.... 1st down. 30 sec. left. Pass, incomplete. 23 seconds to play. 2nd and 10.... Pass, complete, short of the first. 10 seconds.... 4th and 1 with six seconds to go from the UD 38. Time for one, maybe two plays....

Here we go fans.... SACK or near sack, Dayton 24 Duquesne 17 FINAL!!!!

Nice win, glad to see we held on at the end.... Stats will look OK for this one. Nice day for the offense. Defense was very good except for the first play and the late defensive series which gave up the TD.

I think we can say that under TINO's leadership, the Flyers are back baby!

Way to battle again boys.

[Flyer Gramps]

Sorry, I didn't get to this thread!

So DF says keep the same QB.

But, what about his desire to play WR?

This is perfect example of how colleges play boys where most needed not necessarily where their future might be.

Now he has no receptions, no punt returns, no tackle on KO's. Less fun, more responsibility? I don't know; wasn't ready for this scenario in 2009.

[Flyer Gramps]

IMO, the prevent defense was brought out toooooooo sooooooon.

We also seem to need to have better 1st quarter starts.

But we end well! Is that what counts?

[UACFlyer]

DF, this game was the home highlight of the non-con season;....scholarship and A10 buddy DU will always be a good and worthy opponent. And we won!

Some questions:

1. How was the attendance and game atmosphere?

2. A topic we kicked around a lot during the off-season......flags? banners? signs?......typical of a college game, a Flyer home game, a PFL game??? Are you satisfied? (as if I didn't know the answer to that one!)

3. Considering that we knocked off two "Div I" teams after having lost to a Div II team;.....how does that affect your opinion of Div I non-schollie football compared to Div II football?

Any other observations?

Thanks.

(By the way, I just came home from watching FBS UConn defeat FCS Rhode Island 52-10. There is a bigggggg difference in talent level between FBS and FCS. Indeed, there is absolutely no comparison.)

[UDBrian]

Sorry, I didn't get to this thread!

So DF says keep the same QB.

But, what about his desire to play WR?

This is perfect example of how colleges play boys where most needed not necessarily where their future might be.

Now he has no receptions, no punt returns, no tackle on KO's. Less fun, more responsibility? I don't know; wasn't ready for this scenario in 2009.

That is an interesting question because he is no longer one of the three amigos. One part of that question is what is more fun, playing QB on a 9-2 team versus playing receiver on a 6-5 team. It is possible that Steve makes that much of a difference. Most people assume that everyone wants to be the QB if possible

I was told that Steve was sitting directly down from us at the vball game last night. His dad said something to a young fan (Smitch425 family) about going down to say hi. I almost walked down and took their picture together but didn't want to intrude on Steve's private time.

[UACFlyer]

No matter how much fun it may be to play WR it's hard to believe that a player would "want" to play in his "fun" position if he knows and the coaches make clear that he is much more valuable in another spot.

My gosh, want can be more fun or more rewarding than having it made clear that you are the most valuable guy on the team playing as QB?

I'll bet that if the coaches want Val at QB that's where he'll be the happiest. As had been pointed out....playing on a 9-2 team is a lot more fun than on a 6-5 team,....or a 4-7 team.

As I've pointed out before, the QB is the most important position in all of team sports. Just as Chef!

[San Diego Flyer]

This situation is a polar opposite. Usually a kid wants to play quarterback and the coaches sentence him to wr or db. Way to go tino and great team effort Flyers!! :banana:

[smitch425]

I would hate it for Tino if his true desire is to be a reciever, but as it stands now he is the best QB we've seen on the field. A BIG part of being a good reciever is having a QB that can accurately pass you the ball, and right now I don't think we really have that. I hate the possibility of going on the road two weeks in a row and not having Tino taking every snap. He is by far the best athlete on the offense, and I would have him getting his hands on the ball 100% of the plays instead of only a few plays all game. Tough call for the coaches and tough call for Steve.

[DetroitFlyer]

DF, this game was the home highlight of the non-con season;....scholarship and A10 buddy DU will always be a good and worthy opponent. And we won!

Some questions:

1. How was the attendance and game atmosphere?

2. A topic we kicked around a lot during the off-season......flags? banners? signs?......typical of a college game, a Flyer home game, a PFL game??? Are you satisfied? (as if I didn't know the answer to that one!)

3. Considering that we knocked off two "Div I" teams after having lost to a Div II team;.....how does that affect your opinion of Div I non-schollie football compared to Div II football?Any other observations?

Thanks.

(By the way, I just came home from watching FBS UConn defeat FCS Rhode Island 52-10. There is a bigggggg difference in talent level between FBS and FCS. Indeed, there is absolutely no comparison.)




I heard the attendance was 5100. I think it was "family weekend" and I heard that 900 folks from that activity would be at the game. I guess they showed up! Not a bad crowd, but this should be our minimum expectation. I was not at the game, so I cannot comment on how the stadium looked today. As far as knocking off two Division I teams, keep in mind that both now have solid losing records, Robert Morris at 0-4 and Duquesne at 1-3. It seems likely that neither team is very good.... Urbana also now sports a losing record at 2-3 having lost to NAIA Walsh this weekend.... Playing "down" is a 100% losing situation. There are more than enough FCS teams that would play us, we have no reason to play down. That ugly loss would not seem so bad now if we had lost to an FCS program. As it stands now, even if we go 10-1, a loss to a poor Division II team will really kill whatever slim chance we might have had at an at large bid to the playoffs.... Not true if we had just one FCS loss on the record....

Rhode Island is not exactly an FCS power.... Even so, that score could be very normal in the PFL in any given week and no one bats an eye.... I'm sure Rhode Island made a pretty penny, the kids got to play in a major FBS stadium in front of a bigger crowd than most of them ever imagined playing in front of on Saturday, and they surely made a few good plays that will build some confidence going forward. Trust me, Rhode Island got far more out of being spanked by UConn, then we did by losing to Urbana....

[Charlie B]

Lets make one thing clear. I know for sure Steve is the Consummate TEAM Player. He will play anywhere the Coaches want him to play. If the Coaches asked him to play Right tackle ,he would. IF he could, he would never leave the field. As long as he's playing somewhere he's happy.The main thing is to WIN THE GAME.

[UDBrian]

Well I hope that FlyerGramps can relax during this time, don't want someone to be stressed out for more than two months straight!

I know some of you don't consider Morehead a rival but I sure hope the team does or this could be a repeat.

[UACFlyer]

I mistakenly thought that DF was at the game and asked him some questions that only a person in attendance would be able to answer. Anyone else reading my questions for DF who was at WS in person able to reply/

DF, I agree, playing down is a no-win situation with much to lose.

As for URI, while not an FCS power they did hammer Fordham and played UMass relatively close. And, of course, UConn is not exactly an FBS power. Less than five minutes into the game and UConn up by 14 it appeared as if it was going to be an embarrassing, no-fun-to-be-there slaughter for fans or either team. But, the UConn guys got very casual and URI did pull off a few very nice plays,...so the next 55 minutes were tolerable (barely).

As you know, FBS teams are allowed to count games (wins) like UConn vs URI toward the six wins needed for bowl eligibility. So in that case "playing down" is not a no-win situation. BUT, the FBS schools are might careful with scheduling. No way would UConn risk scheduling a UMass or Villanova, for example, as their lone FCS opponent,....entirely too risky.

As for Dayton, I do not think the Flyers should schedule down;...and if/when the PFL gets a playoff spot that sort of thing will probably stop. Perhaps it has to stop; I don't know. We have just got to find a way to get an occasional Ivy or Pat school to play a series,...or even a one-way road game. I do not think we should schedule full scholarship FCS teams,...ever.

[DetroitFlyer]

I mistakenly thought that DF was at the game and asked him some questions that only a person in attendance would be able to answer. Anyone else reading my questions for DF who was at WS in person able to reply/

DF, I agree, playing down is a no-win situation with much to lose.

As for URI, while not an FCS power they did hammer Fordham and played UMass relatively close. And, of course, UConn is not exactly an FBS power. Less than five minutes into the game and UConn up by 14 it appeared as if it was going to be an embarrassing, no-fun-to-be-there slaughter for fans or either team. But, the UConn guys got very casual and URI did pull off a few very nice plays,...so the next 55 minutes were tolerable (barely).

As you know, FBS teams are allowed to count games (wins) like UConn vs URI toward the six wins needed for bowl eligibility. So in that case "playing down" is not a no-win situation. BUT, the FBS schools are might careful with scheduling. No way would UConn risk scheduling a UMass or Villanova, for example, as their lone FCS opponent,....entirely too risky.

As for Dayton, I do not think the Flyers should schedule down;...and if/when the PFL gets a playoff spot that sort of thing will probably stop. Perhaps it has to stop; I don't know. We have just got to find a way to get an occasional Ivy or Pat school to play a series,...or even a one-way road game. I do not think we should schedule full scholarship FCS teams,...ever.

Morehead State defeated a full scholarship, FCS team, just last week. If MSU can do it, no doubt our Flyers could do it.... You just have to find the right FCS team....

[Flyer Gramps]

I stand corrected on the prevent defense. On the radio i heard prevent defense starting at 5;30 to play. But that was only a couple plays. That long Duq scoring drive was simply not very good defense. I'm watching the webcast which came up about 7:00pm.

We rushed 4, sometimes a linebacker too, but coverage was loose and linemen tackling was fingernail style.

Sorry coach, I was wrong.

[chriscage]

We made the treck from Fort Wayne to UD today despite fear of a rainy day. We saw much more tailgating than in recent years...including two huge tents for UD parents.

We bought our way into the parent tent for $10 a piece and enjoyed burgers, dogs and UD logo trinkets.

The Flyers Club was there, but it looked like a BYO tailgate to us.

The stadium facelift is a definite improvement but the DPS ownership is more "in your face" than before.

All 5,100 fans were vocal and most were wearing UD colors. The Pride of Dayton band sounded great, the new football uniforms are cool and the Flyer cheerleaders were out in force, looking cute.

Duquense arrived without a band or cheerleaders. Theydon't travel with the full roster. I'm guessing they had about 65 players dressed. Jeez, their linemen are big and heavy.

Valentino is fun to watch; really quick and nimble. He has a decent arm too.

We congratulated Coach Chamberlin briefly after the game at Milano's. He had the look of sweet relief all over his face. Clearly this was a big win and a hard-earned one at that! :singer:

[chriscage]

We made the treck from Fort Wayne to UD today despite fear of a rainy day. We saw much more tailgating than in recent years...including two huge tents for UD parents.

We bought our way into the parent tent for $10 a piece and enjoyed burgers, dogs and UD logo trinkets.

The Flyers Club was there, but it looked like a BYO tailgate to us.

The stadium facelift is a definite improvement but the DPS ownership is more "in your face" than before.

All 5,100 fans were vocal and most were wearing UD colors. The Pride of Dayton band sounded great, the new football uniforms are cool and the Flyer cheerleaders were out in force, looking cute.

Duquense arrived without a band or cheerleaders. They don't travel with the full roster. I'm guessing they had about 65 players dressed...and jeez, their linemen are big and heavy!

Valentino is fun to watch; really quick and nimble. He has a decent arm too.

We congratulated Coach Chamberlin briefly after the game at Milano's. He had the look of sweet relief all over his face. Clearly this was a big win and a hard-earned one at that. :singer:

[jmitch]

I was disappointed in the atmosphere in yesterday's game. I've never heard 5,100 people all in one place make so little noise. We've been to every game this year and it is always the same story...UD fans are a reactive group, not a proactive group. If a big play happens, the UD fans will stand up and cheer. But UD fans don't seem to recognize the importance of some downs. A big third down play in most FBS stadiums would have everyone on their feet trying to help their defense, not at Welcome Stadium. Several times yesterday the players were begging for fan support by waiving their arms, they got very little response. Finally on the last two plays of the last ditch effort by Duquesne, the fans stood up and made some noise. I just wish that would happen more often.

BTW, the Flyer's Club tailgate was in full force yesterday. $5 got you all you could eat/drink hot dogs, sausages, pretzels, sodas, and beer.

[UACFlyer]

j, I think to make a fair comparison one would have to attend a few games at other FCS schools. The atmosphere is different ecerywhere;...the reason for going to the game is different everywhere;....the importance on wins and losses matters enormously.

A the Arena a Flyer game is a close to a life and death mattter;....not so at Welcome where the fans hope the Flyers win; but don't really care all that much.

I attend all UConn football games...and I can tell you the atmosphere is mighty different than elsewhere. When I see ND, Michigan, Tennessee, Penn State, etc, on TV the stadium is packed solid at kickoff, and probably well before. AT UConn the fans are really into tail gating, big time. That has really caught on. So much so, in fact, that although 40,000 tickets have been sold, at a UConn game the stadium is one third empty at kick off. By the end of the 1st Q the seats have gradually filled. But, clearly the game is not all that important. And, except for the most exciting, close games against a top opponent, by early in the 4th Q the place emptys. It's actually embarrassing when seen on TV because that just doesn't happen at places where football really matters.

I suppose that if UC ever has a Top 10 team, which they will, things will change. But, not yet. So far football is a fun outing with the game outcome of secondary importance. At Weclome the fans probably feel about the same way,....a fun outing. There is nothing wrong with that. I think UD should do all it can to make the Flyer football outing so much family fun that 5000+ is typical.

By the way, the fact that Dayton Public Schools is "more in your face than ever" really doesn't matter, in my opinion. If you are an opposing coach and team you want easy transportation, good, convenient lodging, good locker facilities and a good playing surface. The logos at mid-field and in the end zones matter not at all. Similarly, the fans want convenience and a good facility,....all else is secondary. The renovated WS has all the important stuff. UD can do anything it wants in terms of making WS look like a college stadium on game day. Of course, nothing is as important as attendance.

The FBS teams that play in their city's pro stadiums have NFL team names and logos everywhere. I don't think people care.

[Flyer Gramps]

I was disappointed in the atmosphere in yesterday's game. I've never heard 5,100 people all in one place make so little noise. We've been to every game this year and it is always the same story...UD fans are a reactive group, not a proactive group. If a big play happens, the UD fans will stand up and cheer. But UD fans don't seem to recognize the importance of some downs. A big third down play in most FBS stadiums would have everyone on their feet trying to help their defense, not at Welcome Stadium. Several times yesterday the players were begging for fan support by waiving their arms, they got very little response. Finally on the last two plays of the last ditch effort by Duquesne, the fans stood up and made some noise. I just wish that would happen more often.

BTW, the Flyer's Club tailgate was in full force yesterday. $5 got you all you could eat/drink hot dogs, sausages, pretzels, sodas, and beer.

Welcome to the forum. I presume you will post a second time and tell us about the game because when it comes to disappointing, those of us waiting for the webcast WERE REALLY just that. We saw nothing!

Lots of issues with the peripheral things of Flyer Football -- non-scholarship, schedule, field logos & markings, etc - but the success on the field with very,very intelligent scholar-athletes is really what I've settled on. The rest is just forum fodder; it's the "boys" that count.

So now, what did you really think of the game on the field not in the stands?

[flyer66]

I was at the game. The first thing I saw as I drove up to the tailgate area was the big increase of people. There was a special tent in the lot, usually an indication of special groups participating. I think it was family day and I know it was also Military Day with many service personnel in uniform. There was a huge blow-up helmet with the Army logo in the end zone.
I don't know what jmitch is talking about as far as lack of response by spectators. We were screaming like crazy every time our team did ANYTHING good on offense or defense. In the beginning it was a bit quiet because of the shocking score by DU in the first 20 seconds, but that was the wake up call our guys needed. SV is the classic UD QB--A scrambler who can change tactics in an instant if necessary.
I agree that we should have at least 5000 fans for every game, but it happens only on "special" days.
The Flyers' Club tailgate had twice as many attendees as usual and private parties were more plentiful. I always enjoy my hometown team, win or lose. :)

[smitch425]

I don't know what jmitch is talking about as far as lack of response by spectators. We were screaming like crazy every time our team did ANYTHING good on offense or defense.

That is what he is talking about. It's fantastic to cheer when the team "did" something, but we also need some noise before the play even starts. We, the fans, should be the 12th defender. In fairness, jmitch and I sit on the far end of the home stands--where the team enters and exits, and it is possible that the section at the other end (where the cheerleaders are) is making some noise, but in general when we look to our left we see stagnant people the majority of the time. Of course, our family is at the extreme end of the spectrum when it comes to being a Dayton fan. I'm sure anyone who knows us would agree:rolleyes:

[Avid Flyer]

J nice to see you chime in. Can't let S be the only one with spirit.
And when it comes to spirit S is right up there if not #1 herself.

This would have been a great weekend to be at UD. Four great teams to support and games to watch. (Okay wsoccer was in DC Sunday) but we won all five games this weekend. Hoot Hoot!!

[Avid Flyer]

Okay I broke open the piggy bank and renewed my subscription, now I can read all the neat stuff, not to mention get 100 pm's (seems I missed out on a few). Did I mention what a great value UDPRIDE Plus is, plus we help support this site.

What's that hun? I don't have a piggy bank:eek: We'll tell the grandkids I'll pay em back:rolleyes:.

[DetroitFlyer]

I'm sure that some of the "atmosphere" was due to very casual fans being present in large numbers.... I heard that maybe 1000 or so of the fans were family day folks. My guess is that for the majority of them, this will be the only football game they attend all year.... In fact, many of them probably do not know the game well enough to know the diffenence between a second down and a 4th and 1.... What I just cannot understand is how basketball can draw 10000 plus for an exhibition game against some no name Division II team, yet many of those fans will not come out for a football game.... I just don't get it.....

A couple of Dayton football stories from my world yesterday.... So, I'm watching the runners at my son's cross country meet yesterday. Of course I'm decked out in my normal UD attire. A guy comes up to me wearing a UD hat. He strikes up a conversation. Turns out he was Derek Hall's father. Derek was a punter for the Flyers that recently graduated. He came back to Michigan and is working to teach and coach football! We talked UD football for about 15 minutes and then went on our merry way.... I forgot to ask him why he was at the meet yesterday....

After the race, we had a team picnic. Of course I was listening to the game on my Sprint Touch Pro. The folks at the picnic thought I was listening to one of the Michigan schools games.... When I told them I was listening to the Duquesne at Dayton football game, most were surprised. One person even commented that they did not know Dayton had a football team.... Of course I had to bring them up to speed. Turns out his daughter was considering Dayton, after Michigan and Michigan State. I did my level best to convince them that any school other than Dayton would be a huge mistake.... If nothing else, I think they will now visit Dayton before making a decision.

It has been mentioned on this forum in many places before, but if you proudly wear your Dayton attire every chance you get, you will meet all kind
kinds of folks with various ties to Dayton. Maybe even the father of a recently graduated UD Football player or a person whose child is considering our favorite university in the land!

[jmitch]

So now, what did you really think of the game on the field not in the stands?

1. First play from scrimmage was a complete fluke. RB runs into the pile, stays there for a second, then bounces outside. The PA announcer had already begun stating that the RB was stopped for a short gain before he realized he was running down the sideline. Wasn't worried, knew the D would respond. Just like the week before, down early.
2. Offense responded well. Moved the ball down the field. Much more crisp than last week. Running game is improving, which is going to help out the passing game tremendously. RB by committee right now, but Mack looked impressive to me...young with a lot of upside. Need to be able to run to close out games. Not there yet.
3. Even without Tino in the receiver corp, I would still take our receivers over any in the PFL. Collins got banged up a little, but Watkins picked up just where he left off against RMU. Bellman had a sensational diving grab on the sideline, not to mention the long TD strike where he used a nice cutback and speed burst to beat 3 DBs to the end zone.
4. Defense had a few lapses, but still was solid. QB pressure continues to improve. The one "no-name" on the D-line (Ochab) was the stud of the day.
5. The WR screen did not work at all yesterday. WRs are not blocking on these plays and the recevier that catches the ball is not able to make a move quick enough to get back to the line of scrimmage.
6. Special teams had ups and downs. Glavine = down. Welsh = up. Miller & coverage = solid. No blocked kicks yet this year...that will soon change.
7. QB play has been impressive. Tino looked more comfortable this week. Ran when needed. Looking forward to seeing more improvement next week.

We'll be at Morehead next week. 3 hour drive from Dayton. Hope to see lots of player's families there.

[m21eagle45]

What I just cannot understand is how basketball can draw 10000 plus for an exhibition game against some no name Division II team, yet many of those fans will not come out for a football game.... I just don't get it.....


First off, let me say that I enjoy Dayton Football. I work with the football team everyday, consider many of the players good friends. But UD basketball plays at the highest level. They are able to compete with the best teams the country has to offer. They may not win, but they also would not be embarrassed. UD football can't even compete with the best FCS teams. The biggest games on the Football schedule are teams that if we played them in basketball our fans would be upset about being on our schedule. You would be totally shocked how many times I have heard players say they would rather be watching such and such FBS game than playing their own game and are serious. Many are not happy if they miss OSU or Michigan or whoever they rooted for growing up. You would also be shocked how many players refer to FBS games as "real" college football games. And this is the players for UD, how can you expect many fans at the games to think any differently.

[DetroitFlyer]

First off, let me say that I enjoy Dayton Football. I work with the football team everyday, consider many of the players good friends. But UD basketball plays at the highest level. They are able to compete with the best teams the country has to offer. They may not win, but they also would not be embarrassed. UD football can't even compete with the best FCS teams. The biggest games on the Football schedule are teams that if we played them in basketball our fans would be upset about being on our schedule. You would be totally shocked how many times I have heard players say they would rather be watching such and such FBS game than playing their own game and are serious. Many are not happy if they miss OSU or Michigan or whoever they rooted for growing up. You would also be shocked how many players refer to FBS games as "real" college football games. And this is the players for UD, how can you expect many fans at the games to think any differently.

Yet another good reason for the PFL to obtain an automatic bid to the playoffs. I still think the 2007, Kevin Hoyng led Flyers, that spanked a good Albany team in the Gridiron Classic could have competed in the playoffs.... Maybe we cannot hang with the best FCS teams week in and week out, but for a "one game series" in the playoffs, it might be a different story!

[m21eagle45]

Yet another good reason for the PFL to obtain an automatic bid to the playoffs. I still think the 2007, Kevin Hoyng led Flyers, that spanked a good Albany team in the Gridiron Classic could have competed in the playoffs.... Maybe we cannot hang with the best FCS teams week in and week out, but for a "one game series" in the playoffs, it might be a different story!

I agree completely. Any given day we could knock off one of these good FCS programs in the playoffs. We probably lose 8 of 10, but it would be the 2 wins that could really help our program. That is why I was very happy to read the PFL is going after a automatic playoff spot. I think it would not only help UD get better players if they can pull off a win, but would also give the fans more reason to support the team than the Gridiron Classic.

[chriscage]

The irony is...today's BCS programs bear little resemblance to the "student athlete" roots of college football.

While PFL and Ivy League teams truly mirror the student body of their respective schools, big time FBS programs are populated by ringers prepping for the NFL.

Yes, the big time programs play great "NFL-light" football, but what does that have to do with college?

Judging by Flyer football RPIs for recent years, UD has one of the truly elite non-scholarship programs in the country. Not only does UD win football games, it produces more academic all-Americans than any other D-1 school. That's REAL college football! :singer:

[signa]

Most of the BCS players freely admit they would not even be in college if not for their football scholarship. After their freshman year the GPA to stay eligible is a 1.7. The players on many teams are not even allowed to go to student parties by team rules.

[UACFlyer]

Chris, no doubt that many/most of the real football factories don't even pretend that their football players are students;....and most would not be in college other than to play football. But, while the schools that do pay attention to academics make sure that football players are actually students, it does not follow that they are representative of the student body.

One of my kids went to a prestigious Ivy and was himself a varsity athlete, a team captain, positioning him to have relatively frequent association with football players. More than once he remarked to me that the football players were thugs,....definitely atypical of the student body. Were they college material? Definitely, with SAT scores in the 1100-1200 range (UD students average about 1175).....but, the typical non-athlete student at that school sported an SAT of 1350-1450. So while the Ivy players belonged in college, no way would they have been in an Ivy except for the fact that they played football.

Indeed, when I was a UD student in the football scholarship days my freshman roomy was a football player;....and he gave new meaning to the word "thug".

Are there exceptions. Certainly! Gerald Ford was an All American; Byron White was a Supreme Court justice;....and there are countless similar examples. But, I'm speaking of the average football "student athlete", not the exception.

I love college football. But football is a violent sport....and those that enjoy playing the game are anything but typical.

Since many will howl and will violently disagree with my remarks, I repeat, I realize that there are exceptions, ...and I don't mean only 1-2%;....perhaps 25% are really typical of the student body. But in my experience and opinion, most are not.