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-   -   Duquesne Win (http://www.udpride.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31853)

SeasonTicketFan 02-07-2018 10:41 PM

Duquesne Win
 
Just when you think this team is in crash and burn, they pull out an unbelievable performance.

I heard one UD Assistant describe the game plan before the game. UD executed the game plan to perfection. Duquesne plays physical defense and they wanted to keep the score low. That did not work out. UD won some 50/50 balls and outrebounded the taller Dukes.

UD wins when they shoot lights out and outscore the opposition. They can't that every night, but when they get hot they blow out St. Bonaventure, VCU and now Duquesne.

I see one pattern. The UD team has some quickness. When teams overplay on defense, the UD players beat the defense and create lots of scoring opportunities with open players. The number of assists and dunks were outstanding.

In my opinion, if you want to beat UD, DON'T overplay. Play straight up and don't let the half court offense beat you to the basket. The only team to overplay and get away with it has been Rhode Island. What do I mean by overplay? Try to deny passes and passing lanes and pressure the guards intensely. When Crutcher handles the pressure the other team pays big time.

The stats from the game were stunning. UD shot 83% from the field in the second half. You better win the game with that shooting.

I also thought coaching moves were very good and interesting. Anthony substituted much earlier in the first half. The subs did not hurt the team and the team held their own during the last four minutes of the first half. I liked that substitution pattern. Interesting that Williams did not play. Crosby actually held his own. I don't think Matej or Kostas hurt the team either. I would love to see the +- for each play. Easier to substitute when those guys don't hurt you.

I also thought Anthony called timeouts at the right time. Maybe he got the timeout memo from the message board.

The offense was the fastest and most crisp all year. The ball movement and team motion was exceptionally good. There were some dumb traveling calls late in the first half, otherwise the turnovers were acceptable. 25 assists on 31 baskets. Jordan Davis broke out of his shooting slump in a big way. Maybe his best complete game as a Flyer.


The defense is getting more physical. Less open shots than early in the year. The team is now a man to man team. They still give up some dribble penetration, especially in the first half. Duquesne shot some long and off balance 3s. They have some good outside shooters. That kept them in the game. Otherwise, played had defense. Nowhere close to perfect but much challenging.

Great individual and team efforts. I wish this team was not red hot one night and totally flat the next, but they are young.

marco red eagle 02-07-2018 11:03 PM

On WHIO after the game it was mentioned that X Williams had a sore throat one day this week. At practice he told the coaches he couldn't play that day due to the sore throat. So he didn't practice.

As a result ... he most likely didn't play tonight.

This is how I heard it.

OSU Flyer 02-07-2018 11:05 PM

I don't believe one bit of injury news coming from WHIO/DDN or the school anymore

Sid Louick 02-07-2018 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OSU Flyer (Post 535424)
I don't believe one bit of injury news coming from WHIO/DDN or the school anymore

The XW news came from Nate Green on Flyer Feedback. He attends practices. He said you don't sit out practice with a sore throat. He further intimated that XW is causing problems in the locker room with his attitude. Nate was not at all surprised that XW didn't get into the game tonight.

udscott 02-07-2018 11:25 PM

I agree great win tonight, zero complaints !
Posted via Mobile Device

OSU Flyer 02-07-2018 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sid Louick (Post 535427)
The XW news came from Nate Green on Flyer Feedback. He attends practices. He said you don't sit out practice with a sore throat. He further intimated that XW is causing problems in the locker room with his attitude. Nate was not at all surprised that XW didn't get into the game tonight.

Great :(

priceg75 02-07-2018 11:40 PM

It would be nice to win a game when we don't have to shoot 60% in the game in order to win.

It is remarkable how many games this year we have had when we have just been on fire for a long stretch. If the defense had been there all year, this could've been a much better season.

OSU Flyer 02-07-2018 11:59 PM

Deflating news about X

T-Bone 84 02-08-2018 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sid Louick (Post 535427)
The XW news came from Nate Green on Flyer Feedback. He attends practices. He said you don't sit out practice with a sore throat. He further intimated that XW is causing problems in the locker room with his attitude. Nate was not at all surprised that XW didn't get into the game tonight.

Sorry to hear about X's attitude. Sounds like he might need what I like to call a “Cranial Rectalectomy”. Use your imagination.

Glad to know that Coach isn't putting up with it. He’s got enough problems this season. He doesn’t need problem children.

Smitty10 02-08-2018 01:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T-Bone 84 (Post 535442)
Sorry to hear about X's attitude. Sounds like he might need what I like to call a “Cranial Rectalectomy”. Use your imagination.

Glad to know that Coach isn't putting up with it. He’s got enough problems this season. He doesn’t need problem children.

This is the problem when you change coaches and systems. Add on that the NCAA doesn't wave the transfer rule for change of coaches and you're going to get this kind of stuff.

AG needed everyone possible to return. He didn't have time to go find what he really wanted. And I'm guessing he did a sell job on all of them with the only concern being keeping them. Juniors and Seniors get the short end of the stick especially because they now have to weight sitting a year or taking a chance with a coach they had no choice in. AG isn't looking at all of them as players he can fit into his system, he's looking at some of them as place holders. You can't really blame AG because if he was being completely honest with them as far as fitting into what he's really looking for there's the risk of not being able to field a real D1 basketball team.

It's just not a good situation all around. I think the NCAA needs to wave the rule under these circumstances. This way coaches can be more honest with the players he might inherit and also there will be a bigger pool of players from other teams that have coaching changes to fill his roster with.

I just can't fully blame a player for having his college career turned upside down due to things outside his control. I'm not blaming AG either, I blame the NCAA for not having a rule that states that a change in coaching allows a player to transfer and become immediately eligible to play.

OSU Flyer 02-08-2018 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smitty10 (Post 535445)
This is the problem when you change coaches and systems. Add on that the NCAA doesn't wave the transfer rule for change of coaches and you're going to get this kind of stuff.

AG needed everyone possible to return. He didn't have time to go find what he really wanted. And I'm guessing he did a sell job on all of them with the only concern being keeping them. Juniors and Seniors get the short end of the stick especially because they now have to weight sitting a year or taking a chance with a coach they had no choice in. AG isn't looking at all of them as players he can fit into his system, he's looking at some of them as place holders. You can't really blame AG because if he was being completely honest with them as far as fitting into what he's really looking for there's the risk of not being able to field a real D1 basketball team.

It's just not a good situation all around. I think the NCAA needs to wave the rule under these circumstances. This way coaches can be more honest with the players he might inherit and also there will be a bigger pool of players from other teams that have coaching changes to fill his roster with.

I just can't fully blame a player for having his college career turned upside down due to things outside his control. I'm not blaming AG either, I blame the NCAA for not having a rule that states that a change in coaching allows a player to transfer and become immediately eligible to play.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-fo...icks-up-steam/

oldfan 02-08-2018 07:38 AM

"UD wins when they shoot lights out and outscore the opposition."

As opposed to other teams that win even when they do not out score the opposition.
:)

Flyerferd 02-08-2018 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smitty10 (Post 535445)
This is the problem when you change coaches and systems. Add on that the NCAA doesn't wave the transfer rule for change of coaches and you're going to get this kind of stuff.

AG needed everyone possible to return. He didn't have time to go find what he really wanted. And I'm guessing he did a sell job on all of them with the only concern being keeping them. Juniors and Seniors get the short end of the stick especially because they now have to weight sitting a year or taking a chance with a coach they had no choice in. AG isn't looking at all of them as players he can fit into his system, he's looking at some of them as place holders. You can't really blame AG because if he was being completely honest with them as far as fitting into what he's really looking for there's the risk of not being able to field a real D1 basketball team.

It's just not a good situation all around. I think the NCAA needs to wave the rule under these circumstances. This way coaches can be more honest with the players he might inherit and also there will be a bigger pool of players from other teams that have coaching changes to fill his roster with.

I just can't fully blame a player for having his college career turned upside down due to things outside his control. I'm not blaming AG either, I blame the NCAA for not having a rule that states that a change in coaching allows a player to transfer and become immediately eligible to play.


I agree with your sentiments here. It’s crap that a coach can go wherever they want whenever they want, but players are penalized for transferring . That said, I see a potential opportunity for growth on the players‘ parts. If college basketball is really supposed to “prepare you for things later on in life, “ what happens later when these “student athletes “ get a new boss in the working world? That manager more than likely has some different ideas or a different... system/way of doing things . I wish mentors of these players talk about how this is an opportunity to learn to adapt to the best of their ability. Consequently, when they are sitting in an interview and asked a question about how that individual handles Situations when things go awry, They can lean on their college basketball experience, point to this exact situation, and have a great story to tell. *Yes, I realize I’m talking like a 30 something who’s been through these kinds of things a couple times, hence my mention of mentorship.*
Posted via Mobile Device

ud2 02-08-2018 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OSU Flyer (Post 535452)

How about making them sit out a year after transferring, but then giving them a 6th year of eligibility, if needed.

OSU Flyer 02-08-2018 08:52 AM

The other thing to consider is that maybe it takes going through preseason practice and games before a player realizes the new coaching regime isn't for him.

It's one thing to talk to a new coach after he's hired with the limit contact in the spring and summer. It's another to go through the real grind in the fall

ud2 02-08-2018 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OSU Flyer (Post 535478)
The other thing to consider is that maybe it takes going through preseason practice and games before a player realizes the new coaching regime isn't for him.

It's one thing to talk to a new coach after he's hired with the limit contact in the spring and summer. It's another to go through the real grind in the fall

Yes, that is true. Even the coach who recruited you out of high school may end up being a totally different person once you get on campus in the fall.

I read a story about ex-Bowling Green hc Dan Dakich: he was super-nice, polite, respectful, etc. to the player and his parents during the recruiting process. Once the player arrived on campus in the fall though, he found out that DD was a meaner, tougher taskmaster.

steve 02-08-2018 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan (Post 535415)
Just when you think this team is in crash and burn, they pull out an unbelievable performance.

I heard one UD Assistant describe the game plan before the game. UD executed the game plan to perfection. Duquesne plays physical defense and they wanted to keep the score low. That did not work out. UD won some 50/50 balls and outrebounded the taller Dukes.

UD wins when they shoot lights out and outscore the opposition. They can't that every night, but when they get hot they blow out St. Bonaventure, VCU and now Duquesne.

I see one pattern. The UD team has some quickness. When teams overplay on defense, the UD players beat the defense and create lots of scoring opportunities with open players. The number of assists and dunks were outstanding.

In my opinion, if you want to beat UD, DON'T overplay. Play straight up and don't let the half court offense beat you to the basket. The only team to overplay and get away with it has been Rhode Island. What do I mean by overplay? Try to deny passes and passing lanes and pressure the guards intensely. When Crutcher handles the pressure the other team pays big time.

The stats from the game were stunning. UD shot 83% from the field in the second half. You better win the game with that shooting.

I also thought coaching moves were very good and interesting. Anthony substituted much earlier in the first half. The subs did not hurt the team and the team held their own during the last four minutes of the first half. I liked that substitution pattern. Interesting that Williams did not play. Crosby actually held his own. I don't think Matej or Kostas hurt the team either. I would love to see the +- for each play. Easier to substitute when those guys don't hurt you.

I also thought Anthony called timeouts at the right time. Maybe he got the timeout memo from the message board.

The offense was the fastest and most crisp all year. The ball movement and team motion was exceptionally good. There were some dumb traveling calls late in the first half, otherwise the turnovers were acceptable. 25 assists on 31 baskets. Jordan Davis broke out of his shooting slump in a big way. Maybe his best complete game as a Flyer.


The defense is getting more physical. Less open shots than early in the year. The team is now a man to man team. They still give up some dribble penetration, especially in the first half. Duquesne shot some long and off balance 3s. They have some good outside shooters. That kept them in the game. Otherwise, played had defense. Nowhere close to perfect but much challenging.

Great individual and team efforts. I wish this team was not red hot one night and totally flat the next, but they are young.

Had UD just made 2-3 of the 5 missed bunnies/layups in the first half this game would have been as close to perfect as they can play. The Dukes hit multiple tough,defended 3's with the shot clock almost at zero last night where some of the UD players got caught in some screens but most of the game they fought harder defensively thru screens, switched off, and were more vocal than at any time I've seen them this year.

GoSteelers 02-08-2018 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sid Louick (Post 535427)
The XW news came from Nate Green on Flyer Feedback. He attends practices. He said you don't sit out practice with a sore throat. He further intimated that XW is causing problems in the locker room with his attitude. Nate was not at all surprised that XW didn't get into the game tonight.

The news also came in the pregame when Larry and Bucky noted the same information and stated they weren't sure if XW would play.

BTW, if you haven't heard, the flu is going around. I wouldn't want a sick XW anywhere near the rest of the team if he was sick. Maybe he was sent home as a precaution. And if I am XW, I am frustrated with this season. Injuries and losing don't bring happiness to a competitive spirit. How good a source is Nate Green on locker room attitudes if he sees it once or twice?

cj 02-08-2018 09:43 AM

One of my favorite things I have heard from an old coach, "There are two things you can control, your effort and your attitude. Even if you are having a bad day you can still control these two things."

OSU Flyer 02-08-2018 09:47 AM

Did X not dress for the game?
Posted via Mobile Device

Radar 02-08-2018 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OSU Flyer (Post 535496)
Did X not dress for the game?
Posted via Mobile Device

He dressed, but never sniffed the court for playing time....or appeared to look like he was interested. When the situation (breather or foul trouble presented itself for XW being the likely substitute, it was Matej. Another observation is that Pierce and XW seem to gravitate toward each other during warmups/timeouts. Draw your own conclusions...

SLUFLYER 02-08-2018 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyerferd (Post 535468)
I agree with your sentiments here. It’s crap that a coach can go wherever they want whenever they want, but players are penalized for transferring . That said, I see a potential opportunity for growth on the players‘ parts. If college basketball is really supposed to “prepare you for things later on in life, “ what happens later when these “student athletes “ get a new boss in the working world? That manager more than likely has some different ideas or a different... system/way of doing things . I wish mentors of these players talk about how this is an opportunity to learn to adapt to the best of their ability. Consequently, when they are sitting in an interview and asked a question about how that individual handles Situations when things go awry, They can lean on their college basketball experience, point to this exact situation, and have a great story to tell. *Yes, I realize I’m talking like a 30 something who’s been through these kinds of things a couple times, hence my mention of mentorship.*
Posted via Mobile Device

This is just way too logical. Seems obvious, and for those of us that have been through the trenches, we can relate. It's tough for 20 year olds to relate to this, however. There needs to be supporting personnel within the program and the player's family/internal circle that are trusted who can share these examples and experiences.

TerryK_67 02-08-2018 10:26 AM

wow .... and I thought just millennials were snowflakes.....

Smitty10 02-08-2018 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyerferd (Post 535468)
I agree with your sentiments here. It’s crap that a coach can go wherever they want whenever they want, but players are penalized for transferring . That said, I see a potential opportunity for growth on the players‘ parts. If college basketball is really supposed to “prepare you for things later on in life, “ what happens later when these “student athletes “ get a new boss in the working world? That manager more than likely has some different ideas or a different... system/way of doing things . I wish mentors of these players talk about how this is an opportunity to learn to adapt to the best of their ability. Consequently, when they are sitting in an interview and asked a question about how that individual handles Situations when things go awry, They can lean on their college basketball experience, point to this exact situation, and have a great story to tell. *Yes, I realize I’m talking like a 30 something who’s been through these kinds of things a couple times, hence my mention of mentorship.*
Posted via Mobile Device

I don't agree with that at all. For the skill set of players that UD gets, or at least that AM brought in here, basketball is another major for them. They chose their college based on a number of factors, but getting a paying job playing basketball after they're finished is one of them. If a student looking for another career doesn't like other aspects of the school, they can transfer without having to sit out of the classroom for a year. These players and their families take picking the right situation very seriously and the biggest factor in their choice is playing for the right system and coach. They shouldn't have something as huge as having to extend their college stay an extra year based on the luck of if your chosen coach stays or goes.

Not only that, it's a win/win situation for all involved. We'd see better basketball as a whole because coaches will be playing from the start with players that fit their system.

A lot posters here feel that AM's recruiting of talent diminished here the last few years. What I haven't heard is why that would be. Maybe it's because his name kept popping up as a top choice for bigger basketball programs as soon as he had his first real success in the 2013-2014 season. I wonder how many recruits liked the thought of playing for coach Miller but also didn't want to take the chance of having the rug pulled out from under them with having him move on after one or two or three seasons. Yes, it could happen anywhere but since his name moved quickly as a top 5 coach to be moving up, the odds increased for him. Those players probably would have been willing to take that chance if they knew they could transfer and not miss a year of basketball if he indeed moved on.

Having raw talent that could be molded by the right coach/system into a professional basketball career shouldn't be derailed by a change in coach/system with the thought of what a wonderful real life experience that would be.

springborofan 02-08-2018 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smitty10 (Post 535445)
This is the problem when you change coaches and systems. Add on that the NCAA doesn't wave the transfer rule for change of coaches and you're going to get this kind of stuff.

AG needed everyone possible to return. He didn't have time to go find what he really wanted. And I'm guessing he did a sell job on all of them with the only concern being keeping them. Juniors and Seniors get the short end of the stick especially because they now have to weight sitting a year or taking a chance with a coach they had no choice in. AG isn't looking at all of them as players he can fit into his system, he's looking at some of them as place holders. You can't really blame AG because if he was being completely honest with them as far as fitting into what he's really looking for there's the risk of not being able to field a real D1 basketball team.

It's just not a good situation all around. I think the NCAA needs to wave the rule under these circumstances. This way coaches can be more honest with the players he might inherit and also there will be a bigger pool of players from other teams that have coaching changes to fill his roster with.

I just can't fully blame a player for having his college career turned upside down due to things outside his control. I'm not blaming AG either, I blame the NCAA for not having a rule that states that a change in coaching allows a player to transfer and become immediately eligible to play.

I'm not sure I completely agree with your suggestion but do believe something needs to be done. Obviously any kid can transfer and gets five years to play 4.

Working on the premise that I'd rather a kid stick around for a year to see what it is like rather than jump just because a new coach is hired, it really just impacts incoming Jr's and Sr's. A kid with only one year left has to sell a school to burn 2 scholarship years for one year of playing. Assuming there truly is a disconnect between the coach and player, a kid like Williams or Crosby does the right thing and sticks around for a year, he is penalized for doing so. Trey Landers (as a sophomore) can offer two years of playing time for three years scholarship burn. That is a much more palatable option for a coach recruiting a transfer.

Perhaps the best solution is the kid still needs to sit out a year ( to minimize how often it happens) but the year he sits out isn't counted against the new schools 13 scholarship allotment? I'm sure some programs would try to game the system so cap it to one per year.

rollo 02-08-2018 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smitty10 (Post 535544)
A lot posters here feel that AM's recruiting of talent diminished here the last few years. What I haven't heard is why that would be.

It was well known throughout the team/AD office that Archie promised the 2017 Seniors that he would stay thru their Senior year but no promises were made beyond that. My AD contact was well aware of this and had no expectation that Archie would be here beyond that. Archie was true to his word, and UD was not caught off guard...but recruiting did take a hit as this 'rumor' I'm certain was used against us.

Smitty10 02-08-2018 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rollo (Post 535548)
It was well known throughout the team/AD office that Archie promised the 2017 Seniors that he would stay thru their Senior year but no promises were made beyond that. My AD contact was well aware of this and had no expectation that Archie would be here beyond that. Archie was true to his word, and UD was not caught off guard...but recruiting did take a hit as this 'rumor' I'm certain was used against us.

Well then, to expand on that these rules also encourage coaches to strike early while the iron is still hot. Getting moved up to elite status as a coach that is highly sought after means that your time window gets smaller if your ability to land the best possible recruits diminishes. I just don't see how any of this is good for anyone. Lot's of players playing in systems that they don't fit into and new coaches unable to quickly get a team together that fits their system means extended years of bad fits and bad basketball. Coaches feeling that they need to leave asap after moving up the ladder of potential power conference coaches makes these disruptions happen quicker and more frequently.

T-Bone 84 02-08-2018 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Radar (Post 535500)
He dressed, but never sniffed the court for playing time....or appeared to look like he was interested. When the situation (breather or foul trouble presented itself for XW being the likely substitute, it was Matej. Another observation is that Pierce and XW seem to gravitate toward each other during warmups/timeouts. Draw your own conclusions...

I couldn't remember the recent thread, but last night I paid special attention to see which players (if any) were kicking-back on the bench, with their arms spread across the chairs next to them, like they'd rather be anywhere but at The Arena. I noticed 1 player in particular exhibiting that behavior; a player who's been mentioned by reputable sources (including one with 47 years of experience broadcasting UD basketball) as having attitude issues. If there's more than 1 pea in that pod, then yes, some conclusions might be drawn...:(


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