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-   -   The road to the Final Four…th Spot in the Atlantic 10 Tournament. (http://www.udpride.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31827)

Flyerferd 02-02-2018 11:18 AM

The road to the Final Four…th Spot in the Atlantic 10 Tournament.
 
If we can, win tomorrow, get revenge against Duquesne Tuesday, Take care of some Road business at George Mason and LaSalle , And take care of home court with St. Louis and George Washington, I think we have a shot. I have us losing games at VCU, and Rhode Island. If we fail to do the above though, I am afraid we will have to win one of those two. Not much room for error, but I feel it’s possible. Go Flyers!
Posted via Mobile Device

San Diego Flyer 02-02-2018 12:21 PM

It's always good to talk about what is possible. It's what fans do.

Now let's talk about what's probable. The NIT or the CBI. The College Basketball Invitational is the one where delusional fans slit their wrists and call for boycotts of their program, while their young team goes off and gets valuable experience for the next season.

There is a lot that is possible which our 2013/14 squad proved to everyone's dismay starting in the month of February. That success was improbable against long odds.

What's probable is whatever 17 wins might get you.

Go Flyers!

Flyerferd 02-02-2018 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer (Post 533972)
It's always good to talk about what is possible. It's what fans do.

Now let's talk about what's probable. The NIT or the CBI. The College Basketball Invitational is the one where delusional fans slit their wrists and call for boycotts of their program, while their young team goes off and gets valuable experience for the next season.

There is a lot that is possible which our 2013/14 squad proved to everyone's dismay starting in the month of February. That success was improbable against long odds.

What's probable is whatever 17 wins might get you.

Go Flyers!


This is something I’ve been wrestling with. Is it better for us to Go to the tournament so we can say to recruits we have a five-year tournament streak, only to get humiliated in the first round? Or, as you mentioned, get valuable experience in another one of these tournaments, which I do not sneer at at all! If we go to another tournament, I wonder if Coach Grant says to Davis, “hey, you’ve been great, we appreciate all of your contributions, but this is about next year, so expect to be limited.“?
Posted via Mobile Device

superfan99 02-02-2018 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyerferd (Post 533974)
This is something I’ve been wrestling with. Is it better for us to Go to the tournament so we can say to recruits we have a five-year tournament streak, only to get humiliated in the first round? Or, as you mentioned, get valuable experience in another one of these tournaments, which I do not sneer at at all! If we go to another tournament, I wonder if Coach Grant says to Davis, “hey, you’ve been great, we appreciate all of your contributions, but this is about next year, so expect to be limited.“?
Posted via Mobile Device

The simple answer is...Going to the big dance is always better, regardless of outcome.

FrankStreetFlyer 02-02-2018 01:16 PM

There are only 2 goals to each season:
1) Go to the tournament
2) Win it.

Going to the NIT or CBI is worthless for this year but if it helps with the 2 goals for the next year, then fine play the extra games (preferably without seniors).

UD62 02-02-2018 02:08 PM

Going to the Dance is always better. However this year, barring a miracle, the CBI may well be our only option. Would be interesting to see if the Flyers would play in the CBI.

Smitty10 02-02-2018 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyerferd (Post 533974)
I wonder if Coach Grant says to Davis, “hey, you’ve been great, we appreciate all of your contributions, but this is about next year, so expect to be limited.“?
Posted via Mobile Device

No, No, no, no, no. Do you really wonder that? This university celebrates its seniors, it doesn't screw them. There's not enough experience you can gain by sitting a senior who's clearly earned the right to be getting as many minutes as anyone in his final games. You think that the experience that Jordan Pierce or John Crosby would get would offset any damage created by screwing Baby D? Not to mention it would leave a horrible taste in my mouth to see a guy I think has been screwed over and over at UD get it done to him one more time in his final opportunities.

frisco flyer 02-02-2018 03:39 PM

Sitting Baby D is a ridiculous idea. Every college player has aspirations to play at the next level, and every coach's job is to help them get there. AG should be doing everything he can to raise DD's profile and increase his market value at the next level. This includes giving him the opportunity to showcase his talent on the court. Anything less would be unbecoming of the head coach at UD and would send the wrong signal to our current players and potential recruits!

maddog07 02-02-2018 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smitty10 (Post 534007)
No, No, no, no, no. Do you really wonder that? This university celebrates its seniors, it doesn't screw them. There's not enough experience you can gain by sitting a senior who's clearly earned the right to be getting as many minutes as anyone in his final games. You think that the experience that Jordan Pierce or John Crosby would get would offset any damage created by screwing Baby D? Not to mention it would leave a horrible taste in my mouth to see a guy I think has been screwed over and over at UD get it done to him one more time in his final opportunities.

Experience for Pierce and Crosby??? We've experienced more than enough Crosby- the human turnover - a mistake to have taken him back. Pierce- he's not getting any time any now and is likely gone, sitting anyone won't get him any playing time.

How has DD been screwed? He's played in the NCAA three years straight even when he eiither had no interest or ability on defense.
Posted via Mobile Device

frisco flyer 02-02-2018 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyerferd (Post 533974)
I wonder if Coach Grant says to Davis, “hey, you’ve been great, we appreciate all of your contributions, but this is about next year, so expect to be limited.“?

You've been a good and faithful servant, Severus...

Smitty10 02-02-2018 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maddog07 (Post 534039)
Experience for Pierce and Crosby??? We've experienced more than enough Crosby- the human turnover - a mistake to have taken him back. Pierce- he's not getting any time any now and is likely gone, sitting anyone won't get him any playing time.

How has DD been screwed? He's played in the NCAA three years straight even when he eiither had no interest or ability on defense.
Posted via Mobile Device

Ooops, I got my Jordan's mixed up. I meant Davis not Pierce.

Jeff 02-02-2018 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyerferd (Post 533962)
If we can, win tomorrow, get revenge against Duquesne Tuesday, Take care of some Road business at George Mason and LaSalle , And take care of home court with St. Louis and George Washington, I think we have a shot. I have us losing games at VCU, and Rhode Island. If we fail to do the above though, I am afraid we will have to win one of those two. Not much room for error, but I feel it’s possible. Go Flyers!
Posted via Mobile Device

Sulu: She's supposed to have transwarp drive.

Scotty: Aye. And if my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a wagon.

shocka43 02-02-2018 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyerferd (Post 533974)
I wonder if Coach Grant says to Davis, “hey, you’ve been great, we appreciate all of your contributions, but this is about next year, so expect to be limited.“?
Posted via Mobile Device

If a coach did this they should be fired on the spot.

Viperstick 02-03-2018 01:10 AM

Talking about sitting Baby D in the post season is right up there with talking about what kind of drink Kate Upton is going to bring me this evening. Neither is going to happen because both are rooted in unrealistic fantasies.

bcross 02-03-2018 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UD62 (Post 534006)
Going to the Dance is always better. However this year, barring a miracle, the CBI may well be our only option. Would be interesting to see if the Flyers would play in the CBI.

We turned down the CBI in 2012-13 and the fields have continued to decline. If we're not in the NCAA/NIT, the coaches would be better served to be out recruiting

CE80 02-03-2018 09:02 AM

Not exactly on topic but what a difference a year makes. In the past I would be looking at the A10 scores, rooting for the top teams to lose so the Flyers could be at the top (at least in the top 4 for the bye until Friday in the A10 tourney). This year I am rooting for the bottom teams to lose so the Flyers can stay out of the bottom 4 and avoid playing on Wednesday,

OSU Flyer 02-03-2018 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcross (Post 534101)
We turned down the CBI in 2012-13 and the fields have continued to decline. If we're not in the NCAA/NIT, the coaches would be better served to be out recruiting

Normally I'd say sit on the CBI if we had a veteran team. I think the practice would only help the freshman. More practice I think would help guys like Crutcher, Jordan Davis, Kostas

Not playing seniors or veterans isn't the right way to go but the young guys will benefit more from the practice than the game experience.

Jeff 02-03-2018 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viperstick (Post 534086)
Talking about sitting Baby D in the post season is right up there with talking about what kind of drink Kate Upton is going to bring me this evening. Neither is going to happen because both are rooted in unrealistic fantasies.

I'll send her over.....hooo wah.

bcross 02-03-2018 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OSU Flyer (Post 534109)
Normally I'd say sit on the CBI if we had a veteran team. I think the practice would only help the freshman. More practice I think would help guys like Crutcher, Jordan Davis, Kostas

Not playing seniors or veterans isn't the right way to go but the young guys will benefit more from the practice than the game experience.

They will have been officially practicing for nearly 5 1/2 months after the A10 tournament, so I think the value of a couple additional practices gets overstated. After today's game, Crutcher will likely have logged more minutes than Scoochie did his entire freshman year. Davis is not too far behind.

San Diego Flyer 02-03-2018 10:47 AM

Preparation for post season play is the kind of "practice" we are talking about here. Preparing mentally and physically for the kind of compacted schedule we experienced in Charleston.

Not having the benefit of knowing for sure what opponent you might face. Making adjustments on the run is good prep for the coaching staff and the players.

There are 4 "fresh starts" in college ball each season. You have ooc, A10 league, A10 Championship, and then post-season play. The team needs to learn these are fresh starts and everyone is 0-0.

You have a chance to reboot.

Only a fool would pass up the chance to continue teaching.

bcross 02-03-2018 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer (Post 534120)
Preparation for post season play is the kind of "practice" we are talking about here. Preparing mentally and physically for the kind of compacted schedule we experienced in Charleston.

Not having the benefit of knowing for sure what opponent you might face. Making adjustments on the run is good prep for the coaching staff and the players.

There are 4 "fresh starts" in college ball each season. You have ooc, A10 league, A10 Championship, and then post-season play. The team needs to learn these are fresh starts and everyone is 0-0.

You have a chance to reboot.

Only a fool would pass up the chance to continue teaching.

The CBI is buy-game level competition. A fool like Archie Miller passed on it 2012-2013 and was in Elite 8 in the following year. Would have been the Final Four if he wasn't so foolish and passed on the CBI, am I right?

Alberto Strasse 02-03-2018 12:31 PM

No
 
When it comes to money UD is a donee not a donor. They will pass on paying money for a tournament.

OSU Flyer 02-03-2018 01:19 PM

What's more valuable to the youngsters on this team? 20/hrs per week of NCAA allowed practice time during the CBI or going down to 8/hrs for the off-season.

San Diego Flyer 02-03-2018 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcross (Post 534125)
The CBI is buy-game level competition. A fool like Archie Miller passed on it 2012-2013 and was in Elite 8 in the following year. Would have been the Final Four if he wasn't so foolish and passed on the CBI, am I right?

No, just a little twisted. :)_

312to937 02-03-2018 04:47 PM

I think you can close this thread. UD might be playing on Wednesday night.
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ruechalgrin 02-03-2018 05:49 PM

Play Kostas and Svboda a ton the rest of the way. Focus on development with Kostas and see if you want Svboda next year.

Season is done, no way to win 4 in a row in A-10 tournament with top team, much less a team ranked #145.

redbengal 02-04-2018 12:25 AM

I've heard Grant state several times that a team goal this year was a Top 4 finish in the A10. Obviously, much easier to win the tourney when you don't have to play an extra day. That dream is effectively over after the UMass loss. But to finish in the BOTTOM 4 and play on Wednesday night? Sad. First, they'll never win 5 days in a row (much less 4) with the bench they don't have. But what surprises me most about the season to date is that the steady improvement I expected we would see just didn't materialize. Some promising stretches by various starters for sure. And they are 4-1 vs the top 5 in the league. But I'm just not seeing the upward trend. They still have a month to figure things out. And it's not like anyone thought they had a chance of being NCAA at-large worthy. The goal was to get in a position to win the A10 Tournament. But unless power is restored to the bench then it's on to Cincinnati... I mean, on to next season.

FlyerBob 02-04-2018 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruechalgrin (Post 534508)
Play Kostas and Svboda a ton the rest of the way. Focus on development with Kostas and see if you want Svboda next year.

Season is done, no way to win 4 in a row in A-10 tournament with top team, much less a team ranked #145.

Fully agree. I don’t blame Coach Grant for playing his starters as that was his only repeat only way to win that game. Now it’s time to see what we got (unless he thinks he knows) and strategize for next year.. and letting the chips fall at the A10T. Miracles happen right gang?

ud2 02-04-2018 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redbengal (Post 534591)
But unless power is restored to the bench then it's on to Cincinnati... I mean, on to next season.

That was an excellent Bill Belichick reference. It took me a while to figure that out. Quite appropriate for Super Bowl weekend.

jack72 02-04-2018 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyerBob (Post 534613)
Fully agree. I don’t blame Coach Grant for playing his starters as that was his only repeat only way to win that game. Now it’s time to see what we got (unless he thinks he knows) and strategize for next year.. and letting the chips fall at the A10T. Miracles happen right gang?

I would like to see Kostas play more, but play him for whom? What message does that give Cunningham is he sits.

FlyerBob 02-04-2018 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jack72 (Post 534627)
I would like to see Kostas play more, but play him for whom? What message does that give Cunningham is he sits.

Agree that Josh cannot be benched. Play em both!

jack72 02-04-2018 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyerBob (Post 534642)
Agree that Josh cannot be benched. Play em both!

So who would you bench. Cunningham, Landers and Crutcher have to play. As much as we abuse DD, his scoring average is almost as good as Cunningham, and rebounding almost as good as Landers. DD is a turnover machine, but his asst to turnovers is close to Crutcher. So it is then Jordan who gets a bunch less minutes. I am for that the way Jordan is playing lately.

I do agree we need to play Kostas, because he has talent.

CE80 02-04-2018 02:41 PM

I don't think we really know what we have with Kostas. Yes he makes some great athletic plays but also makes some big time mistakes. I'd like to see what Kostas brings after he spends a year in a weight and conditioning program and a full summer working with the rest of the team and the coach. He has not done that yet. he couldn't practice with the team until second semester last year and last summer he was not around Dayton enough. I am afraid Kostas has seen how his 2 older brothers developed. That is not going to happen for him.

San Diego Flyer 02-05-2018 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jack72 (Post 534652)
So who would you bench. Cunningham, Landers and Crutcher have to play. As much as we abuse DD, his scoring average is almost as good as Cunningham, and rebounding almost as good as Landers. DD is a turnover machine, but his asst to turnovers is close to Crutcher. So it is then Jordan who gets a bunch less minutes. I am for that the way Jordan is playing lately.

I do agree we need to play Kostas, because he has talent.

Uummm, good thoughts but DD's A/TO ratio isn't even in the same zip code as Crutcher.

San Diego Flyer 02-05-2018 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyerBob (Post 534642)
Agree that Josh cannot be benched. Play em both!

Actually I'm not sure that would be difficult. Kostas leads the team in fouls/minute, so he might not last long. He seems to get 2 real quick and then calms down for stretch. But his fouling can turn a game around quickly. That's the issue.

Don 02-05-2018 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CE80 (Post 534104)
Not exactly on topic but what a difference a year makes. In the past I would be looking at the A10 scores, rooting for the top teams to lose so the Flyers could be at the top (at least in the top 4 for the bye until Friday in the A10 tourney). This year I am rooting for the bottom teams to lose so the Flyers can stay out of the bottom 4 and avoid playing on Wednesday,

So what would happen if the Flyers finish in the bottom four?
They have a game against a pretty weak opponent and an opportunity to win an extra game before bowing out. Granted our overall record would probably be better if we could win enough to avoid the bottom four, but if we can't it could be one more win than we would otherwise end up with.

CE80 02-05-2018 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don (Post 534890)
So what would happen if the Flyers finish in the bottom four?
They have a game against a pretty weak opponent and an opportunity to win an extra game before bowing out. Granted our overall record would probably be better if we could win enough to avoid the bottom four, but if we can't it could be one more win than we would otherwise end up with.

One more win?

Right now the Flyers are tied for a bottom 4 spot. Two other spots are taken by St Joe's and UMass. I wouldn't chalk up a Wednesday win yet.
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Jeff 02-05-2018 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jack72 (Post 534627)
I would like to see Kostas play more, but play him for whom? What message does that give Cunningham is he sits.

Cunningham doesn't have to come out. Sub out Davis, Davis, Crutcher, and Landers. 2 min each half for each of those = 16 min for Kostas. There's no compelling reason not to work on his development, skills, or just plain assess him in game conditions.

Based on how we are playing, our position in the conference, the lack of options, and Kostas clear need to develop, why spend next year on what can be invested in this year?

Alberto Strasse 02-06-2018 08:35 AM

This Season is Slipping Away
 
Creativity is required if the UD program is going to advance from here. One glaring weakness is the failure of the bench to produce. This may be tied to AG's blind allegiance to his starting five. The weakest starter recently has been JD who appears to have met the "Freshman Wall".
Why not strengthen the bench by sitting him and replacing him with KA? Let KA jump center and start from the beginning to play more minutes with JC on the floor. That means zone "D"
to keep him in the game. JD can be the first sub off the bench and maybe his legs will return for his great jump shot. Another move AG could make is to go small with the lineup and play more extended trap man pressure. When forced to do it this year the team has shown some ability to create opponent turnovers that lead to points off of the fast break. I want to see this team fight back by doing something different in the final 8 games. Doing the same thing and expecting this team to "get better" is IMHO insane.

OSU Flyer 02-06-2018 08:48 AM

After the secretiveness with Mikesell and Lander's injuries, would it be surprising to find out that Kostas or Matej were dealing with injuries all year

Buster Goode 02-06-2018 08:40 PM

Reading the first several posts on the thread....

You guys aren't serious are you? We are one and done in the conference tournament. Outside of the VCU game, what have we done to believe that we could win 4 games in a row....let alone in 4 days?


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