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  #1  
Old 09-14-2018, 01:55 PM
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Would you schedule this series?

Ohio State's AD offers Dayton:

2 games at Value City Arena in Columbus
1 game at UD Arena
1 game at Quicken Loans Arena in Cleveland (Home of the Cavs)
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  #2  
Old 09-14-2018, 02:00 PM
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Yes. That's better than our Louisville deal was awhile back that didn't have any games at UD Arena.
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Old 09-14-2018, 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Ohio State's AD offers Dayton:

2 games at Value City Arena in Columbus
1 game at UD Arena
1 game at Quicken Loans Arena in Cleveland (Home of the Cavs)

Yes

or change one of the Value City Arena games or the Quicken Loans game to Nationwide Arena so the Buckeyes can say it is a neutral court game.
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Old 09-14-2018, 02:06 PM
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  #5  
Old 09-14-2018, 02:27 PM
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No, I do not like the 4th game being played in Cleveland. I do not think either school would want the 4th game makes no sense for either school especially in Cleveland.

2 for 1 makes the most sense
1 At Value City, 1 at UD and 1 at Nationwide would work too.
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Old 09-14-2018, 02:29 PM
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Old 09-14-2018, 03:02 PM
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I love the idea of playing at The Q!!!
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Old 09-14-2018, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by m21eagle45 View Post
No, I do not like the 4th game being played in Cleveland. I do not think either school would want the 4th game makes no sense for either school especially in Cleveland.

2 for 1 makes the most sense
1 At Value City, 1 at UD and 1 at Nationwide would work too.
Supposedly Ohio State is looking for a neutral site game in Cleveland for a recruit they have coming in from Cleveland and some of the guys they're targeting in the upcoming classes
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Old 09-14-2018, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Supposedly Ohio State is looking for a neutral site game in Cleveland for a recruit they have coming in from Cleveland and some of the guys they're targeting in the upcoming classes
I am surprised they would feel the need to do that considering it is only an 1.5-2 hour drive down to Columbus. Normally when teams look for games like that for recruits it is out of state.
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Old 09-14-2018, 04:31 PM
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We played UC in Cleveland. Why not OSU?
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Old 09-14-2018, 04:51 PM
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Yes

It would be great.
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Old 09-14-2018, 05:48 PM
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YES, YES, YES, YEAH ABSOLUTELY!!!

It's such an obvious yes, I'm not sure it counts as a question...Cleveland or no Cleveland! However, it would be down right foolish to pass on a fourth game with one of the schools you are always wanting to schedule. Although, it would good of one of the Schott games were moved to Nationwide.

I asked in another thread if UD would accept a two year round Robin at Mutual site with OSU if the Flyers had to play Wright State the first year, but got Ohio state the second year. And folks are afraid to answer, or bring themselves to go there. But if Ohio state offers that, UD better darn well take it.
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Old 09-14-2018, 06:24 PM
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4 games with OSU? In a freakiní heartbeató get it done Neil!
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  #14  
Old 09-14-2018, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Beatty Town Coach View Post
Y

I asked in another thread if UD would accept a two year round Robin at Mutual site with OSU if the Flyers had to play Wright State the first year, but got Ohio state the second year. And folks are afraid to answer, or bring themselves to go there. But if Ohio state offers that, UD better darn well take it.
What would UD, OSU, and whoever is putting on said event gain from inviting WSU and their traveling group of 38 fans?
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Old 09-14-2018, 10:00 PM
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I'd do that type of deal with Indiana as well.
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Old 09-14-2018, 11:05 PM
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Just general comments.

1. For the anniversary of flight, we played North Carolina at there facility. I thought there was an agreement that they were to give us a return game at U.D. Arena, Never happened.

2. We had Kentucky down in Cincinnati. I thought I remembered that we were the home team, got maybe 20% of the tickets. The Flyer Fans out cheered their team and got a nice victory. The look on the Kentucky fans faces...priceless.

3. Dayton has done fairly well against the so called power 5 conferences.

4. Top schools just won't come to the arena. Be afraid. Be very afraid

5. Would love to see an inner state holiday tournament.
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Old 09-15-2018, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by N2663R View Post
I'd do that type of deal with Indiana as well.
Archie is smart. I donít see him bringing his team to UD Arena.
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Old 09-15-2018, 10:53 AM
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Archie coached at Western Kentucky, North Carolina State, Ohio State, Arizona State and Arizona and he never got Dayton fans any games with those schools. So, why think that he would get the Dayton fans an Indiana game?

But, of course, you know he loves us Dayton fans. That is why he betrayed us at his first opportunity and was looking to leave to jump up to a bigger school for several years prior to his eventual escape.

Do I have hard feelings? Dayton loved him and did everything we could for him and he still left.
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Old 09-15-2018, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Buckleyma View Post
Archie coached at Western Kentucky, North Carolina State, Ohio State, Arizona State and Arizona and he never got Dayton fans any games with those schools. So, why think that he would get the Dayton fans an Indiana game?

But, of course, you know he loves us Dayton fans. That is why he betrayed us at his first opportunity and was looking to leave to jump up to a bigger school for several years prior to his eventual escape.

Do I have hard feelings? Dayton loved him and did everything we could for him and he still left.
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I sure hope you've never changed jobs...otherwise you'd be a hypocrite.
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Old 09-15-2018, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by MNFats View Post
I sure hope you've never changed jobs...otherwise you'd be a hypocrite.
While I understand your sentiment, the comparison is not exactly the same.

It should be more like, changing jobs, where they attempted to match the salary, the job environment was friendly, inviting, and you had everyone eating from the palm of your hands. You wanted for nothing, and everything you needed was given. The grass was always green and was maintained perfectly.

So, when Buckleyma left McDonald's to work at UD during his college years, then went to his first job out of college who didn't appreciate them, underpaid them, and they found a job that would appreciate them and pay them more, that's not the same as Archie.

In my career, I've lost my job because of contract loss twice, and left the other 2 on my own accord, 1 where I wasn't being paid my worth, and the other where the environment was becoming toxic. So, my career path cannot be compared the belief of what Archie did to Dayton fans.

As for Archie, except for Ohio State the same year, if he hadn't taken the Indiana job, I presume he would have been at Dayton for at least 4-6 years until another blue-blood type program opened. I'm not sure any jobs this year he would have taken. I certainly don't blame him for taking the job, but he could have been King (sorry rollo) in Dayton if he stayed and kept the trajectory going for the basketball team.
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Old 09-15-2018, 01:32 PM
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Book it!
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Old 09-15-2018, 03:38 PM
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Figgie123: My reference was that we want the Dayton head coaching job to be a destination job not where a coach steps on our head on the way out after a couple years. The biggest disappointment was that Archie did not groom adequately one of his assistant coaches for the job so the transition was not so severe. We lost last year to transition and maybe this year to a re-build.

By the way, McDonalds wouldnít hire me during college. So, I worked at the donut shop during college and then got a construction worker job during the summer.
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Old 09-15-2018, 04:49 PM
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Yep. While we’re at it,make it a three way with Cincy.
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Old 09-16-2018, 09:36 PM
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No brainer. Absolutely.
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Old 09-16-2018, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Flyer Dave View Post
1. For the anniversary of flight, we played North Carolina at there facility. I thought there was an agreement that they were to give us a return game at U.D. Arena, Never happened.

2. We had Kentucky down in Cincinnati. I thought I remembered that we were the home team, got maybe 20% of the tickets. The Flyer Fans out cheered their team and got a nice victory. The look on the Kentucky fans faces...priceless.

3. Dayton has done fairly well against the so called power 5 conferences.

4. Top schools just won't come to the arena. Be afraid. Be very afraid

5. Would love to see an inner state holiday tournament.
Also UCLA hosed us on a return date to UD Arena after we visited Pauley Pavilion in 1971 during the Bruins heydays.
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Old 09-17-2018, 12:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeff View Post
Yep. While weíre at it,make it a three way with Cincy.
Sounds good. Make mine with cheese please.
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Old 09-17-2018, 12:38 AM
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Cool That's not the question

Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan View Post
What would UD, OSU, and whoever is putting on said event gain from inviting WSU and their traveling group of 38 fans?
My question was: Would UD agree to it?

Furthermore, who in the world hopes the opponent brings more fans, to an event that will virtually sellout anyway?

As for your question, why in the hell would THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY waste it's time scheduling a game against upstart dayton??!!!
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Old 09-17-2018, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Beatty Town Coach View Post

Furthermore, who in the world hopes the opponent brings more fans, to an event that will virtually sellout anyway?

Ohio State. Ohio State hopes the opponent brings fans. That way the stands won't be empty. That includes a game played in Columbus, Cleveland, anywhere tOSU is playing a non-top-5 school.
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Old 09-17-2018, 10:57 PM
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Letís see, so two of the games would be about a mile and a half from where I live? Appso****lutely! Ohio State average is about 12,000 for their nonconference schedule. The shot seats 19. And thatís probably paid attendance by the way, tickets would be a plenty. Even if the team gets good, which I expect they will, that doesnít matter until after the college football playoff is over. Now, what I could see Ohio State do, is get cute and move the game to St. John Arena which seats about as many people as ours. That would satisfy the number of people from Ohio State wanting to go while limiting our fans from getting in. They typically play one game a year over there.
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Old 09-18-2018, 12:12 AM
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If you are gonna fantasize about something that will never happen, why not do a home and home with Kansas followed with North Carolina? That has just as good a chance of coming through......
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Old 09-18-2018, 10:10 AM
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Given the perceived difficulties that UD and other non P5 schools will have in scheduling non conference games in the future, does it make sense for UD to offer 2 for 1 games? Since we travel well, these games might be a bit more like neutral games than full away games. Could be an additional recruiting tool as well. Thoughts?
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Old 09-18-2018, 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Ohio State's AD offers Dayton:

2 games at Value City Arena in Columbus
1 game at UD Arena
1 game at Quicken Loans Arena in Cleveland (Home of the Cavs)
As long as it doesn't conflict with our North Florida or Presbyterian games.
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Old 09-18-2018, 04:10 PM
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What station will these games be on? Virtual Reality Channel?
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Old 09-18-2018, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by TerryK_67 View Post
If you are gonna fantasize about something that will never happen, why not do a home and home with Kansas followed with North Carolina? That has just as good a chance of coming through......
This series is pretty slanted towards Ohio State. 2 games at home for them and a neutral court that'll favor them

Davidson plays series like this without the home game but 2 and neutral, home and neutral with schools like North Carolina and Wake Forest
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Old 09-18-2018, 08:36 PM
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Given the new realities of post RPI measurement, I think UD is going to have to break the scheduling mold. I wouldn't be in favor of 2 away, 1 home, and 1 neutral but I would consider a straight 2 for 1 deal. Pair it up with a team like Murray St. for a 2 home 1 away we did with them a few years ago.

This gives us two quality games every year (1 home, 1 away) and bite the bullet by dropping two buy games. Couple this with the traditional two h/h's we get from teams from the SEC or strong mid majors and a solid in season tourney and there is enough meat there to get an at large bid if the W's are there.

I know I'm sounding like UD2 and opening up a can of worms that is digested about this time every year but the landscape is changing (20 game conf schedule and new "metrics") and there ain't nothing a program like UD can do about it--adapt or die.

Yes, UD will get one less gate. Make it up by NCAA tourney $, TV $, raise per game prices a few $'s and or tighten the belt on other program's spending.

Last edited by springborofan; 09-18-2018 at 08:39 PM.. Reason: Added last thought
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Old 09-20-2018, 01:50 AM
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Lightbulb Not against UD

Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
Ohio State. Ohio State hopes the opponent brings fans. That way the stands won't be empty. That includes a game played in Columbus, Cleveland, anywhere tOSU is playing a non-top-5 school.
You meant TOSU.

If The Ohio State University is playing in a double header with the Dayton Flyers also in same double header, them my presumption is that the game is sold-out; and therefore Ohio state wouldnt need or want more Wright State fans.

Obviously, I could easily keep pushing the point about UD'S neurotic need to avoid Wright State at all cost; but the greater point was to what length of far-out point would the administration go to avoid a WSU match-up. Would it be to the point of missing out on an othherwise great opportunity??? Unfortunately, I think that's the case.

Inaccurate try Gazoo, because The Ohio State University might want some extra money, they sure as heck don't need it; and thus it would be much more about a homecourt advantage for them, regardless of who else was playing. When you draw 105,000 to the stadium every week, you've got it going on in real big time athletics. That's not exactly Fordham or LaSalle style.

Like I said, if UD ever gets the chance to play Ohio state, xavier, or UC, again in regular season, and the deal comes with a game against Miami or Wright State, they better take that deal and get over their Atlantic 10 selves.

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Old 09-20-2018, 02:14 AM
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If schools have no interest in playing UD in a 1 for 1, they are not going to have any interest in playing UD in a 2 for 1. Its as much about the decline of available non-conference games and dates as it is the opponent. Power-5 schools dont want to be on the hook for three seasons against a non Power-5 school -- any school, but let alone one like Dayton, St. Marys, Wichita State, URI, VCU, etc. They simply don't need that much help.


You are overestimating the importance of Power-5 non-conference seasons to consider they need Dayton on their schedules for 3 years. They dont even need Dayton on the schedule for 2. Thats the problem. They can go fishing for far cheaper and less competitive non-cons every year from the MEAC and NEC to fill those slots -- and never have to give up a road game to boot. These schools want a Power-5 road game when they want one. No matter what UD offers, they cannot dangle that carrot and for 90% of these institutions thats the only carrot that matters.


Andy Kennedy was a habitual exception in college scheduling.
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Old 09-20-2018, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Beatty Town Coach View Post
You meant TOSU.


Like I said, if UD ever gets the chance to play Ohio state, xavier, or UC, again in regular season, and the deal comes with a game against Miami or Wright State, they better take that deal and get over their Atlantic 10 selves.
And the reason tOSU, X and or UC would want to schedule US and Wright State is ...........................................

It may work in a reality game scenario but in real life
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Old 09-20-2018, 12:14 PM
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Wink Wrong Emphasis

Originally Posted by NJFlyr71 View Post
And the reason tOSU, X and or UC would want to schedule US and Wright State is ...........................................

It may work in a reality game scenario but in real life
Yes, you are correct, but I'm asking the question and answering the original question, from a University of Dayton decision making standpoint, not the perspective of Xavier, Cincinnati, or The Ohio State University. You are proving my point, that UD'S ability to schedule said three schools is non-existent without some substantial give and take. Therefore if want to play any of them ever again in regular season, then you might have to be willing to suck-it-up and play a game you don't normally desire. UD'S extreme angst about playing Miami and Wright State is at a down right embarrassing level; to the point where I suspect normal decision making could be adversely impacted.

I never suggested that the TOSU, XAVIER, or CINCINNATI, are realistically going to present this exact plan, and that wasn't my question. However, it is true that the new Ohio State coach was indicating early on after his hire, that he wanted to create an in-state round robin match up between several schools around the state; and, the original question in this thread concerned if you would schedule a game against Ohio State in an unusual set up or location, and apparently Ohio State is looking for a match up in Cleveland or elsewhere. Therefore I didn't just get these ideas out of thin air, they are in fact something that fans around the state of been discussing during the past year.

To that end, it more than merely appeared to me that a plethora of UD fans felt this automatically meant they were going to include UD in such a process. Unfortunately, I think a lot of that is akin to pipe dreaming. I wish that wasn't so, but realistically speaking I think the Ohio State coach came in discussing this concept because he was Desiring to get the Buckeye basketball program back on equal footing with Xavier, Cincinnati, and Dayton, without ever playing a game. From my perspective this is a very creative and clever way for him to remind everyone in the state and around the Midwest that Ohio State basketball was as good, if not better, or at-least on par with the other significant programs in the their own state. Immediately, many UD fans were so sure that UD was going to be included in such a format, or that it would happen at-all.
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Old 09-20-2018, 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris R View Post
If schools have no interest in playing UD in a 1 for 1, they are not going to have any interest in playing UD in a 2 for 1. Its as much about the decline of available non-conference games and dates as it is the opponent. Power-5 schools dont want to be on the hook for three seasons against a non Power-5 school -- any school, but let alone one like Dayton, St. Marys, Wichita State, URI, VCU, etc. They simply don't need that much help.


You are overestimating the importance of Power-5 non-conference seasons to consider they need Dayton on their schedules for 3 years. They dont even need Dayton on the schedule for 2. Thats the problem. They can go fishing for far cheaper and less competitive non-cons every year from the MEAC and NEC to fill those slots -- and never have to give up a road game to boot. These schools want a Power-5 road game when they want one. No matter what UD offers, they cannot dangle that carrot and for 90% of these institutions thats the only carrot that matters.


Andy Kennedy was a habitual exception in college scheduling.
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Old 09-20-2018, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Beatty Town Coach View Post
You meant TOSU.

If The Ohio State University is playing in a double header with the Dayton Flyers also in same double header, them my presumption is that the game is sold-out; and therefore Ohio state wouldnt need or want more Wright State fans.


. . .



Inaccurate try Gazoo, because The Ohio State University might want some extra money, they sure as heck don't need it; and thus it would be much more about a homecourt advantage for them, regardless of who else was playing. When you draw 105,000 to the stadium every week, you've got it going on in real big time athletics. That's not exactly Fordham or LaSalle style.

You meant "then."
You meant "doubleheader." Twice.
You meant "sold out" (no hyphen).
You meant Ohio "State."
You meant "wouldn't."
You meant "7 times per year".
Are you done making distinctions without a difference, or shall we continue toward rational discussion points? Because, honestly, I'm pretty good at this game. And you suck.

You asked who wants an opponent to bring fans to an event that would sell out anyway. Do you even recognize your circular logic, or do I need to explain it to you Yogi? OK here goes: if the home town fans fully sell out the stadium, you don't need the opponents to bring fans and reduce the home court advantage. But if you have fans who are lackluster at best for basketball, then THE ONLY WAY TO SELL OUT THE COURT IS IF THE OPPONENTS BRING FANS. If the opponent didn't bring fans, it would not "sell out anyway."

You're the one who said it would sell out anyway, not me. So why are you now changing your strawman argument to reflect the fact that tOSU doesn't need the money because of football? Congrats, you are correct, they don't need the money, and it is also wholly irrelevant to the discussion of whether or not it would "sell out anyway."

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Old 09-20-2018, 04:32 PM
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Old 09-20-2018, 04:43 PM
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OSU must have heard that Sam Miller is playing for Charleston.

On a serious note, let's see if the third game at Charleston is actually played. Many are not.
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Old 09-20-2018, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris R View Post
And the oceans have purple lobsters. The exception proves the rule.
2 for 1s and some variation of Home, Road and Neutral games series are out there beyond this
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Old 09-20-2018, 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris R View Post
If schools have no interest in playing UD in a 1 for 1, they are not going to have any interest in playing UD in a 2 for 1. Its as much about the decline of available non-conference games and dates as it is the opponent. Power-5 schools dont want to be on the hook for three seasons against a non Power-5 school -- any school, but let alone one like Dayton, St. Marys, Wichita State, URI, VCU, etc. They simply don't need that much help.


You are overestimating the importance of Power-5 non-conference seasons to consider they need Dayton on their schedules for 3 years. They dont even need Dayton on the schedule for 2. Thats the problem. They can go fishing for far cheaper and less competitive non-cons every year from the MEAC and NEC to fill those slots -- and never have to give up a road game to boot. These schools want a Power-5 road game when they want one. No matter what UD offers, they cannot dangle that carrot and for 90% of these institutions thats the only carrot that matters.


Andy Kennedy was a habitual exception in college scheduling.
I've been beating the drum in the schedule theory and 20 game schedule threads about this

No disagreement with you there but there are some openings out there
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Old 12-07-2018, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by m21eagle45 View Post
No, I do not like the 4th game being played in Cleveland. I do not think either school would want the 4th game makes no sense for either school especially in Cleveland.

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Sources: Ohio State will play West Virginia in a neutral site game at Quicken Loans Arena in Cleveland on Sunday December 29th, 2019.

Ohio State board says Dayton fell through for this game as part of a series
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Old 12-07-2018, 11:50 AM
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I never thought OSU would want to do another series with UD because the only other time they did, years ago, we beat them 2 out of 3. 1st game at OSU, they won. 2nd game at UD, we won. 3rd game back at OSU, we won again! They beat us in Buffalo in an NCAA tournament game and then then we beat them in the first NCAA game in our Elite 8 season. Do they really want to chance it again?
Even though UD is not considered a "higher tier" program, the Flyers have a habit of beating those teams, which makes it hard to schedule them again.
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Old 12-07-2018, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by 66flyer View Post
They beat us in Buffalo in an NCAA tournament game and then then we beat them in the first NCAA game in our Elite 8 season.
Ohio State beat UD in the NIT at the Schottenstein back in March 2008. The Buffalo NCAA game was the Elite 8 season.
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Old 12-07-2018, 12:00 PM
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Yes

The new NET evaluation tool does not penalize you for playing and losing to highly ranked teams. It penalizes you for playing weak teams. UD needs all of the quality opponents it can line up. Especially with UD's recruiting ascending to a level perhaps beyond the A-10 level under AG. This year's team will thrive over losses to Virginia (#1) Auburn (#8) Oklahoma (#16)
and Mississippi State (#32). And...we still have a chance to beat Auburn. Go Flyers!
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Old 12-07-2018, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
@jonrothstein
Sources: Ohio State will play West Virginia in a neutral site game at Quicken Loans Arena in Cleveland on Sunday December 29th, 2019.

Ohio State board says Dayton fell through for this game as part of a series
Posted via Mobile Device

Read it on the internet.

I highly, highly doubt that even if true the UD admin said "no, we've got Coppin State penciled on that date already."
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Old 12-07-2018, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by 66flyer View Post
I never thought OSU would want to do another series with UD because the only other time they did, years ago, we beat them 2 out of 3. 1st game at OSU, they won. 2nd game at UD, we won. 3rd game back at OSU, we won again!

We beat them 2 out of 4 from 85-86 through 88-89. Fourth game at UD, they beat us 104-76.
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Old 12-07-2018, 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted by 66flyer View Post
I never thought OSU would want to do another series with UD because the only other time they did, years ago, we beat them 2 out of 3. 1st game at OSU, they won. 2nd game at UD, we won. 3rd game back at OSU, we won again! They beat us in Buffalo in an NCAA tournament game and then then we beat them in the first NCAA game in our Elite 8 season. Do they really want to chance it again?
Even though UD is not considered a "higher tier" program, the Flyers have a habit of beating those teams, which makes it hard to schedule them again.
OSU series:





FWIW, IINM, URI recently got home-and-home series with Harvard, MTSU, WKU, and Charleston. Some of those teams might be hit-and-miss. I think that all 4 of those teams would schedule a h-and-h with us, so if we are looking for some additional h-and-h opponents, then give those schools a call.

Judging from past schedules, I also think that these schools would play us in a h-and-h: Temple, Boise State, Belmont, Murray State, Old Dominion, Illinois State, Valpo, New Mexico, Tulsa, and BYU. Again, some might be hit-and-miss.
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Old 12-07-2018, 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
@jonrothstein
Sources: Ohio State will play West Virginia in a neutral site game at Quicken Loans Arena in Cleveland on Sunday December 29th, 2019.

Ohio State board says Dayton fell through for this game as part of a series
Posted via Mobile Device
This probably is true given we just signed up for the game at the United Center against Colorado.

I think I see the scheduling philosophy is shifting ever so slightly.. Along with the Nov pre season tournament, one neutral site game, one game in A10/Mountain West challenge and HOPEFULLY one additional H/H series.
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