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  #1  
Old 11-25-2017, 10:38 PM
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Akron Thoughts

Good win. 3-0 vs the MAC. Hard to tell how good this team based upon MAC games.

Akron was very physical and the team responded. Good sign. UD hustled and dove for loose balls. They did not let Akron push them around.

UD will be streaky all year. Tonight was a great example. Akron scored 13 straight to take a lead by 8 in the first half. UD hit a 3 to cut the lead to 5 to end the half. Then UD score 13 straight points to start the 2nd half. 13 straight points followed by 16 straight points.

Defense was much improved tonight. UD clamped down on Akron in the 2nd half. Interesting adjustment by Anthony to put Josh on #3 Utomi.

Offense flowed better too. 21 assists on 27 baskets!

Kostas can be a game changer. Box score showed only 2 blocks but he altered quite a few. He will have a challenge to stay out of foul trouble. A10 big men will isolate him and try to get him in foul trouble on the low blocks. Kostas likes to reach a lot and will get over the back calls.

Nice night by the other 3 freshmen. Davis had a nice stroke. Crutcher showed some nice hands on D.

The team stopped dribble penetration for the first time this year.

Last. Josh. When he dominates UD wins. He did it all. Monster game on the boards and covered their best player on D at times. Akron could not stop him inside.

Interesting to see how they progress against Auburn. Hope they have Landers and Williams back.
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Old 11-25-2017, 11:35 PM
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Thought after a few minutes into the game that DD was going to have an off-game. Until he didn't. DD has definitely assumed the role of a senior leadership. I was wrong about him regaining his mojo he had as a freshman in regard to his shooting. Thought Jordan had a good game though he forced a few, especially early on. He's a confident shooter and he may lean on his floater too much but I like him. Kostas keeps making my jaw drop with his game-altering play on both ends. Cunningham may be the best surprise though for me. I said XW would be the best player on the team and discounted what JC had done when he was healthy. He's a better player than XW at this point, hands down. So far the best player on the team night in, night out. Just needs to reach less on defense so he can keep off the bench. Played well as a unit tonight I thought, which I'd been looking for more of.
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Old 11-25-2017, 11:39 PM
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Slow start, which hurt. Against a better opponent, we would have been buried. Team fell asleep on D for awhile.

Kostas almost carried the team in the first half. When he went out with 2 fouls, Akron went back ahead. Nice 3 and the end of the first half to cut deficit to 5.

Second half looked like a different team. Much better team defense. Darrell had a nice segment where he brought the team ahead, then Josh took over.

Crutcher can't seem to buy a 3 but he had plenty of assists. Seeing him on the court a lot and Crosby on the bench. Crosby doesn't seem to play much D.

Jordan Davis doesn't look like the typical freshman. Plays hard D and has a good eye for the basket. Good 3pt shooting as well.

Svoboda did some good, but he looks stiff out there. 3pt shooting doesn't look good, although he hit one. Made some plays around the basket.

Better rebounding tonight than the past.

Biggest key was much better defensive execution in second half than I've seen all year.
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Old 11-26-2017, 12:05 AM
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Biggest shot of the night- Svoboda trey at the end of the first half. It looked like a called play for him out of the timeout. Big difference between being down 8 and down 5.


Prettiest play of the night - Crutcher anticipates a pass and picks it off cleanly under the bucket. He then throws a perfect lob pass over the top full court for one bounce and Josh needs to do nothing but grab it and flush it. It was the perfect pass in that situation.Trying to throw it directly to Josh on the run makes it a far more difficult play as he has to catch it on the run and most likely take a dribble as well.


Defense - the switching between man-to-man and the match-up zone worked well. The zone slowed dribble penetration, allowed Kostas to protect the middle, and helped us stay away from even more serious foul trouble.


Don't think Josh touched the 3-point shooter. Looked more like the Reggie Miller school of acting to me.


Frosh are going to be up and down. Tonight they were up.
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Old 11-26-2017, 09:01 AM
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Jordan Davis reminds me of Tony Stanley. I doubt he'll end up a top five all time leading scorer but he's going to be a good one. He can score many different ways and the floater will begin falling soon enough.
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Old 11-26-2017, 09:57 AM
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Wow, Jordan has such confidence as a freshman. You can't teach that. Even when he gets beat on defense, it is not due to lack of position or effort. If he is open he is shooting, and count most of them.

Crosby, except for one bad, got caught in the lane with no place to go, played another very good game. His defense is pretty darn good, certainly no drop of from Scoochie, who I adored, but would take plays off on a regular basis. That twisting layup he made was certainly Scoochie like. We are getting very little outside shooting from either he or Crutcher, and that has to happen to spread the defense. Crutcher is a keeper. It will just take confidence to penetrate more, and Grant putting his foot on his throat until he starts playing good defense.

Cunningham eats up the average size and talent bigs, but can he do it against some better bigger ones?

Kostas and Matej are still growing. Lots of good things and some bad things. Glad to see Matej go inside and also rebound. Those three games I saw in Charleston he stayed near the three point line.

DD has become the player we all wanted. Down at the half he comes out and smokes em. He now draws such attention from the defense that it makes things happen for other guys.
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Old 11-26-2017, 10:18 AM
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Not one word in the above comments . . . .ok, I'll say it . . . on .COACHING! Quite good coaching . . . quite evident of excellent follow up on issues seen in Charleston.

Just a reminder that bad games are not always the coaching and good games are not always the players.
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Old 11-26-2017, 10:22 AM
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Best ball movement of the year. Period.
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Old 11-26-2017, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by springborofan View Post
Jordan Davis reminds me of Tony Stanley. I doubt he'll end up a top five all time leading scorer but he's going to be a good one. He can score many different ways and the floater will begin falling soon enough.
He is also very strong.
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Old 11-26-2017, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by FLYER5 View Post
Thought after a few minutes into the game that DD was going to have an off-game. Until he didn't. DD has definitely assumed the role of a senior leadership. I was wrong about him regaining his mojo he had as a freshman in regard to his shooting. Thought Jordan had a good game though he forced a few, especially early on. He's a confident shooter and he may lean on his floater too much but I like him. Kostas keeps making my jaw drop with his game-altering play on both ends. Cunningham may be the best surprise though for me. I said XW would be the best player on the team and discounted what JC had done when he was healthy. He's a better player than XW at this point, hands down. So far the best player on the team night in, night out. Just needs to reach less on defense so he can keep off the bench. Played well as a unit tonight I thought, which I'd been looking for more of.

Josh has been pretty solid this season. Couple of off games. But he will toast and eat up all the MAC teams and the A10 teams without a true big or center.

He's easily an 18 an 15 guy when he has other other team overmatched physically. Great offensive rebounder, GREAT hands, and great positioning.
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Old 11-26-2017, 10:57 AM
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Excellent adjustments at halftime. First set of second half, UD immediately goes down low to Josh; great called play, and it helped open everything up.

I was extremely impressed with of the UD passes last night; wow, some of those dump-offs, were the whip. Very fun to watch.

I hate to say it, but I think that XWilliams, will be severely challenged to get or keep his starting role back. Realistically, they only time his absence was felt was when Josh got the 2nd foul, the last few minutes of the first half. Competition is good for everything; so I hope the Junior Pride of Beatty responds.

As for the 3-0 against the MAC, I find that to be a very positive indicator; as al three MAC teams UD has beaten, will compete in their conference. And if Dayton is better than every MAC team, then no reason to think Flyers cannot compete in the A10. Will no more very soon!
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Old 11-26-2017, 11:39 AM
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XW should get his starting spot back as soon as he is healthy. Kostas is amazing, but he can’t stay out of foul trouble to play extended minutes. This is likely to keep happening all season because he is physically challenged. His length and athleticism are game-altering, and we need him on the floor as much as possible, but the longer he is out there, the more likely he will commit stupid reaching fouls that tired players tend to commit.

Also, I am not sure that XW and GFII are mutually exclusive. When we play zone defense, having the two of them in the game at the same time is a huge advantage.
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Old 11-26-2017, 11:53 AM
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Wink Right, but......

Originally Posted by frisco flyer View Post
XW should get his starting spot back as soon as he is healthy. Kostas is amazing, but he can’t stay out of foul trouble to play extended minutes. This is likely to keep happening all season because he is physically challenged. His length and athleticism are game-altering, and we need him on the floor as much as possible, but the longer he is out there, the more likely he will commit stupid reaching fouls that tired players tend to commit.

Also, I am not sure that XW and GFII are mutually exclusive. When we play zone defense, having the two of them in the game at the same time is a huge advantage.
True enough, but that doesn't necessarily translate into "starting Job", or holding said position indefinitely. And, Landers is bound to get some time as well. I am only saying I don't think it is as clear cut as it was a month ago. Like I said, competition is good for the gander.
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Old 11-26-2017, 11:57 AM
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Worth the Price of Admission

One of the all-time great plays by UD Flyer was Kostas blocking a shot on defense then running the floor and catching a pass in traffic and finishing with a left hand layup on the fast break. Wow!
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Old 11-26-2017, 12:24 PM
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A Salute to UD's Freshman Class

and their 38 points 13 rebounds and 12 assists against Akron. You talk about stepping up big time with two starters out injured. They look like a very talented class.
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Old 11-26-2017, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Jeff View Post
Best ball movement of the year. Period.
With some really nice interior passing for easy buckets.
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Old 11-26-2017, 12:53 PM
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Nobody has mentioned transition offense. I know this ties into offense from defense, but I think it’s worth mentioning on its own right.

The team pushed the ball better than I have seen in any of the past games. We are at our best when we are running. Our length and athleticism makes up-tempo offense favorable. I really enjoyed the speed we played with in this game.

Somebody last week mentioned the need for outlet passes to be at or around half court, and I recall a few times where the guards ran toward half court before getting the pass. I credit Grant for that adjustment. Defense creates offense.

Proud of our guys, however Xeyrius mentioned “havoc” preseason and I’d like to see more of that going forward defensively.
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Old 11-26-2017, 01:22 PM
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Freshman are pretty impressive. Last night they were hitting...which I stated elsewhere...is what will make AG's offense productive. If individual players are shut down, the offense will not be nearly as effective.

AG did draw up a few one hitters which is good...the but to that is that fact that 80%+ of your possessions aren't drawn up. AG's switching of defenses is nice to see. We hit Akron out of a timeout in zone which threw them off...it is the same thing guys are doing to us. Draw up a play out of a timeout and you get hit with zone instead of man. General motion offense was exactly the same as it was in Charleston...guys just happened to hit shots. That makes this offense look really good...hit the open shots and get the ball inside. STF hits it in the original post, assists...21 on 27 fg's. Rebounding. I thought we were in for a long night when Akron got 3 shots on their first possession...then UD got their stuff together on the boards. Rebounding is huge with these guys and as short as we are in depth we can't afford to give up defensive rebounds...creating more shots for the opponent and more chances to get in foul trouble.

This team did a better job flashing to the ball in the paint and back cutting off the wing. The problem still...is the players have to create the shots versus the offense creating them. It is hard to execute when you have young players or guys that aren't accustomed to having to create. DD has embraced that role which is why he is being successful. Cunningham is a workhorse and it getting his on the glass. He got into a few nice positions on offense where the guards found him...specifically on some back cuts. If these guys would simply set a proper screen, the offense would be much more reliable. Akron drilled our guys on back screens from the wing and got open shots heading towards the rim. All by doing the same thing UD was doing, but actually setting a screen. It is kind of like the wide out that is thinking touchdown before he catches the ball...just set a screen...then roll or flare. Don't just occupy space and move...the defense doesn't have to do anything.

Great second half. They came out working the ball much better than the first. Being short in depth they did a good job by sustaining effort and working with the foul trouble. Great effort on the defensive boards in the second half. Akron wasn't the most skilled team by any means, but they must have one hell of a weight program. They were strong at every position except for number 11 who looked like a midget Brittney Griner with that hair.

Definitely a tale of two halves and winning the half that meant the most. They need to figure out how to get the 2nd half results in the first half. Whether it is lineups or what.
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Old 11-26-2017, 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Bigtimeflyersguy View Post
Nobody has mentioned transition offense. I know this ties into offense from defense, but I think it’s worth mentioning on its own right.
Even more impressive is the transition offense by the bigs running the floor. Nothing moistens my giblets more than a big getting a killer block, keeping it in bounds, then running the floor and getting the finish on the break. That is a testament to the effort by the bigs and the guards rewarding the guy that got them the transition.
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Old 11-26-2017, 01:42 PM
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Second half was Flyer basketball. Nice to see the Arena lit up like that. Couldn't help think when the crowd went nuts how our newbies reacted inside. Most had never seen a crowd like that support them.

A few late thoughts:
*we must fix the in-bounds end line defense
*X should get his spot back. If we are going anywhere we need last season's Xeyrius. Play him until he figures it out.
*Need more runouts like Crutcher to Josh or Kostas or Matej.
*Jordan Davis is obviously comfortable draining threes on the break. Let him release early.
*Be tolerant of the kids mistakes, they are learning fast.
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Old 11-26-2017, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by shocka43 View Post
Even more impressive is the transition offense by the bigs running the floor. Nothing moistens my giblets more than a big getting a killer block, keeping it in bounds, then running the floor and getting the finish on the break. That is a testament to the effort by the bigs and the guards rewarding the guy that got them the transition.
And it’s a testament to teamwork. I think Anthony is really pushing this principle, based on both statistics (the Assist-to-Field-Goal ratio) and the eye test (had great seats last night). And, I think the players are buying-in.

Also, it looks like roles are starting to get clarified a bit. The younger guys are looking up to Darrell & Josh as the leaders, and those two are realizing how the younger guys can help meet team goals. Jordan D is a strong shooter. Kostas can do a bit of everything. Crutch does a decent job of handling the rock. Svoboda is starting to learn how to use that thick body on pick-n-rolls. And, as for the leaders, Josh is proving to be all we hoped he’d be when he transferred from Bradley, and Darrell is playing like a man on a mission. Last night, at least in the last 20 minutes, a lot of things came together.
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Old 11-26-2017, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by GoFlyer View Post
Not one word in the above comments . . . .ok, I'll say it . . . on .COACHING! Quite good coaching . . . quite evident of excellent follow up on issues seen in Charleston.

Just a reminder that bad games are not always the coaching and good games are not always the players.
R u serious ? Akron went on a 13-0 run in the last three mins of the first half and we never called a timeout
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Old 11-26-2017, 04:35 PM
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The team won and looked good against a middle of the pack MAC team. Winning cures lots of ills and criticism. I am talking about Ohio U. Ditto with Akron. I'll get happier if they beat a good Auburn team, or at least play a close game.
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Old 11-26-2017, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Beatty Town Coach View Post
I hate to say it, but I think that XWilliams, will be severely challenged to get or keep his starting role back.
No.

Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
The team won and looked good against a middle of the pack MAC team. Winning cures lots of ills and criticism. I am talking about Ohio U. Ditto with Akron. I'll get happier if they beat a good Auburn team, or at least play a close game.
You know what else helps? 43% from 3, on 9-21 shooting. If they shoot 33 of them like they did against ODU they just look like chuckers with no offensive plan. When they go in some people want to say how great the coach is.

You know what is interesting? We've shot better from 3 every game this season.

0.250
0.273
0.345
0.364
0.429

You know what else is interesting? Until Akron, we took more 3's in every game this season.
16
22
29
33
21

29 and 33 are far too many 3's. Low 20's is the right number. If they're raining in from everywhere and you just can't miss, maybe 25-27.
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Old 11-26-2017, 07:47 PM
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No Reason

to change the starting lineup against Auburn. X must earn his way back as should Trey. The starting lineup performed quite well against Akron.
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Old 11-26-2017, 08:10 PM
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I would read much more into the execution by the players than major changes in coaching.

As mentioned...defensive stops, rebounding, and hitting shots cures quite a bit. I wouldn't call feeding the post more in the 2nd half a revolutionary focus as that is basic.
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Old 11-26-2017, 11:41 PM
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True, feeding the post is a basic concept. And yet, this program has suffered "post play anorexia" through the tenure of multiple coaches...with a few exceptions...see Finn/Waleskowski Senior year, and Kavanagh/Oliver final dozen games...in the 14 seasons prior to Grant's Tenure.

To sugest UD has been performing said basic with regularity during that time, would be a very generous and gross exaggeration. I am not counting layups and drives down the lane; specifically I am critiquing the very absence of consistent post play throughout much of the past fourteen seasons.
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Old 11-27-2017, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Beatty Town Coach View Post
True, feeding the post is a basic concept. And yet, this program has suffered "post play anorexia" through the tenure of multiple coaches...with a few exceptions...see Finn/Waleskowski Senior year, and Kavanagh/Oliver final dozen games...in the 14 seasons prior to Grant's Tenure.

To sugest UD has been performing said basic with regularity during that time, would be a very generous and gross exaggeration. I am not counting layups and drives down the lane; specifically I am critiquing the very absence of consistent post play throughout much of the past fourteen seasons.
With ya...wasn't referring to your post...was referring to GoFlyers...
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Old 11-27-2017, 09:32 AM
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When guards/wings have the ball on the perimeter and aren't aggressive attacking or probing the defense the offense can look really bad. They end up with 25-28 seconds of DHOs and perimeter passes without ever getting the ball inside the arc and then chucking a 3 (reminiscent of the BG years). Thankfully we didn't see too much of that Saturday.

Also, I hope the guards get a lot better at recognizing lob opportunities. With Kostas' and Josh C's ability to go up and up and up they should each be wrecking rims on lobs a couple times every game.
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Old 11-27-2017, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Whacker View Post
When guards/wings have the ball on the perimeter and aren't aggressive attacking or probing the defense the offense can look really bad. They end up with 25-28 seconds of DHOs and perimeter passes without ever getting the ball inside the arc and then chucking a 3 (reminiscent of the BG years). Thankfully we didn't see too much of that Saturday.

Also, I hope the guards get a lot better at recognizing lob opportunities. With Kostas' and Josh C's ability to go up and up and up they should each be wrecking rims on lobs a couple times every game.
Whenever I see an offense struggling, as the Flyers did in Charleston, I always look at the point guard to see if he is doing his job. He should be probing, penetrating, dishing, and kicking out. When this isn't happening, you end up with an offense that keeps working the ball horizontally instead of vertically...i.e. perimeter passing and clanking threes! I was at the game on Saturday and the Flyer point guards, for the most part, ran the offense vertically. There was a world of difference when they did this, creating lots of inside opportunities and dishes off to cutters to the bucket. Even the other guards and forwards understood the need for a vertical offense. Scoochie understood that very well and he executed it to near-perfection. I hope Crosby and Crutcher understand this as the Flyers proceed through the season.
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Old 11-27-2017, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
No.
You know what is interesting? We've shot better from 3 every game this season.

0.250
0.273
0.345
0.364
0.429
At this rate, by game 10 we will be shooting 0.646 and by game 15, 0.871 from three. Sounds good to me.
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Old 11-27-2017, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by T-Bone 84 View Post
And it’s a testament to teamwork. I think Anthony is really pushing this principle, based on both statistics (the Assist-to-Field-Goal ratio) and the eye test (had great seats last night). And, I think the players are buying-in.

Also, it looks like roles are starting to get clarified a bit. The younger guys are looking up to Darrell & Josh as the leaders, and those two are realizing how the younger guys can help meet team goals. Jordan D is a strong shooter. Kostas can do a bit of everything. Crutch does a decent job of handling the rock. Svoboda is starting to learn how to use that thick body on pick-n-rolls. And, as for the leaders, Josh is proving to be all we hoped he’d be when he transferred from Bradley, and Darrell is playing like a man on a mission. Last night, at least in the last 20 minutes, a lot of things came together.
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GREAT Observations Tbone!!!
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Old 11-27-2017, 03:53 PM
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It really looked to me like JC was told "whatever you do, don't turn the ball over" in Charleston. Or maybe he was just scared to take any risks after the amount of heat he took the first 2 years. Against Akron he was just a touch more aggressive which turned into more TO's but also better overall aggressiveness by the offense. And then Crutcher got 8/0 on A/TO, putting them in a virtual tie on both assists and TO for the year.

It's a balance. I'm not totally dissatisfied with JC's play to date. I'd actually like to see him take a couple more 3's but he's doing an OK job of feeling his way through it. Should a junior PG still be feeling his way through? Yeah, probably not. But here we are.
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Old 11-27-2017, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
It really looked to me like JC was told "whatever you do, don't turn the ball over" in Charleston. Or maybe he was just scared to take any risks after the amount of heat he took the first 2 years. Against Akron he was just a touch more aggressive which turned into more TO's but also better overall aggressiveness by the offense. And then Crutcher got 8/0 on A/TO, putting them in a virtual tie on both assists and TO for the year.

It's a balance. I'm not totally dissatisfied with JC's play to date. I'd actually like to see him take a couple more 3's but he's doing an OK job of feeling his way through it. Should a junior PG still be feeling his way through? Yeah, probably not. But here we are.
Agree with your assessment of Crosby. I'm okay with him taking the open 3. It's when he tries to create the 3 by himself that I have a problem with him taking. The same goes for X.
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Old 11-28-2017, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
The team won and looked good against a middle of the pack MAC team. Winning cures lots of ills and criticism. I am talking about Ohio U. Ditto with Akron. I'll get happier if they beat a good Auburn team, or at least play a close game.
I'd never advocate losing as a teaching tool. But truthfully the kids learn more after a loss. They listen to the coach. After a blow out win they are hard to reach for a spell.
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Old 11-28-2017, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
I'd never advocate losing as a teaching tool. But truthfully the kids learn more after a loss. They listen to the coach. After a blow out win they are hard to reach for a spell.
Losing teaches you how to lose.

I'm in favor of near misses over losses.
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Old 11-28-2017, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
It really looked to me like JC was told "whatever you do, don't turn the ball over" in Charleston. Or maybe he was just scared to take any risks after the amount of heat he took the first 2 years. Against Akron he was just a touch more aggressive which turned into more TO's but also better overall aggressiveness by the offense. And then Crutcher got 8/0 on A/TO, putting them in a virtual tie on both assists and TO for the year.

It's a balance. I'm not totally dissatisfied with JC's play to date. I'd actually like to see him take a couple more 3's but he's doing an OK job of feeling his way through it. Should a junior PG still be feeling his way through? Yeah, probably not. But here we are.
Who is JC? Josh Cunningham, John Crosby or Jalen Crutcher...
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Old 11-28-2017, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
Losing teaches you how to lose.

I'm in favor of near misses over losses.
Umm, who wouldn't be?
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Old 11-28-2017, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
Umm, who wouldn't be?
"I'd never advocate losing as a teaching tool. But truthfully the kids learn more after a loss. They listen to the coach. After a blow out win they are hard to reach for a spell." -SDF

What they learn after a loss is how to lose. What they learn after a near miss is an equal training tool, gained in a better fashion than after a loss. So I'm saying there is nothing to be gained from losing except learning how to lose.

So I would rank the usefulness of each outcome like this:

1. Winning in a near miss
2. Winning by a comfortable margin
3. Winning in a blowout

Not ranked: losing in any fashion, which teaches little of positive value (they DO NOT "learn more after a loss" except how to lose), and what is learned of positive value is overwhelmed by the negatives.
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Old 11-28-2017, 03:49 PM
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We can agree to disagree about the opportunity to learn from a loss. Anyone would love to do all the learning from wins. It's not the way the world works. Should Anthony throw out the losses to learn from, and miss opportunities on film?

By all means, let's sit around and mope for a week after a loss. You can learn from the whole schedule, and certainly it's more FUN to learn from wins. But speaking from my experience on the court and coaching, you have their full attention after a loss--as well they should.
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Old 11-28-2017, 04:28 PM
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I guess if you win all the time you don't really need to worry about learning anything.
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Old 11-28-2017, 10:01 PM
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If you're a winner losing will teach you to hate losing. So the sting leaves a mark where a near-miss won't sting. Valuable teaching tool.

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Old 11-29-2017, 09:04 AM
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Winning vs. Losing. Most normal people love to win. Most normal people hate to lose. But “winners” are the ones who can (a) look back at a victory and understand why they won, (b) look back at a loss and find the real reason for why they lost, and (c) work to maximize the strengths and eliminate the weaknesses. So lessons can be learned from both wins and losses. And the people who learn both types of lessons are the ones who become “winners”.
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  #44  
Old 11-29-2017, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
We can agree to disagree about the opportunity to learn from a loss. Anyone would love to do all the learning from wins. It's not the way the world works. Should Anthony throw out the losses to learn from, and miss opportunities on film?

By all means, let's sit around and mope for a week after a loss. You can learn from the whole schedule, and certainly it's more FUN to learn from wins. But speaking from my experience on the court and coaching, you have their full attention after a loss--as well they should.
When did I say to sit around and mope after a loss? What du fuh are you talking about??

I'm not trying to say there is no opportunity to learn anything after loss, I'm saying that there are factors that negate that benefit on net. You said they learn MORE after a loss. I am just saying they DO NOT LEARN MORE after a loss than they do after a near miss. Why is this so hard to understand?

I'm not saying everyone wouldn't rather win every game.
I'm not saying there is literally never an opportunity to learn after a loss.
I'm not saying you should sit around and mope after a loss.
I'm not saying the way the world works is that you win every game.
I'm not saying AG should throw out the film of every loss and never look at it.

I'm saying: you do not learn MORE from a loss. If you had said you sometimes learn SOMETHING from a loss I would not have disagreed. You did not. You said "truthfully the kids learn more after a loss."

And by that logic, if you don't win a game all year, you should be given a #1 seed in the NCAA tournament. Those kids have learned more than anyone all season, they're so learned they should be pushed directly into the NBA finals.

Originally Posted by FLYER5 View Post
If you're a winner losing will teach you to hate losing. So the sting leaves a mark where a near-miss won't sting. Valuable teaching tool.
If you're a winner and hate losing, that's a lesson already (unavoidably) learned in life. Nobody goes undefeated. The more you lose the more you risk getting comfortable with it.
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Old 11-29-2017, 12:00 PM
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..... and losers DON"T reflect and learn the valuable lessons they should have.
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Old 12-07-2017, 05:38 PM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
I'd never advocate losing as a teaching tool. But truthfully the kids learn more after a loss. They listen to the coach. After a blow out win they are hard to reach for a spell.
Interesting quote by #5 ranked Florida's Coach Mike White after their 3rd straight loss:

“We’re a team that has been told for about two months how good we are. It’s been at an all-time high in the past 10 days, so hopefully we’ve been humbled a little bit,” White said, harping on the Gators’ defensive struggles.

“We can not shoot our way into being an elite team. It’s not going to happen. Hopefully our guys know why now.

You have to learn how to win games when you’re not making shots at a high level. And this group has zero buy-in with that aspect. Hopefully more buy-in now. Hopefully it will start improving, not that I wish for a loss ever.”
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