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  #1  
Old 05-08-2017, 10:07 PM
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Balance the classes

There is only one scholarship open if Crosby comes back. Archie would hold on to one in case a hot transfer is available. Should Grant do so also?

With only one senior next year, does it make sense to just hold that last scholarship to get more balance in classes?

Having 5 in one class and 1 in one class makes it more difficult to build program continuity.

Last edited by SeasonTicketFan; 05-09-2017 at 01:59 PM..
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Old 05-08-2017, 10:20 PM
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AG should not take Crosby back...PERIOD
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  #3  
Old 05-08-2017, 10:35 PM
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Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan View Post
There is only one scholarship open if Ctosby comes back. Archie would hold on to one in case a hot transfer is available. Should Grant do so also?

With only one senior next year, does it make sense to just hold that last scholarship to get more balance in classes?

Having 5 in one class and 1 in one class makes it more difficult to build program continuity.
I actually like the large class-small class pattern that AM had going. Reason being you never had an inexperienced team. You'd have either a large class of juniors/freshman or a large class of seniors/sophomores at all times.

Now of course the problem happens when the coach leaves and you have a large class of freshman coming in as is what we are seeing. But if UD is truly the destination job for AG, I see no problem with.

With all that said, I could see him wanting to leave a scholarship open so that he has two to fill when he can put a whole recruiting season in.
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Old 05-08-2017, 10:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Piqua Flyer '66 View Post
AG should not take Crosby back...PERIOD
Do you know the details of what happened?

I know I don't. Seems like a really strong stance to take when the facts aren't out yet.
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Old 05-08-2017, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Piqua Flyer '66 View Post
AG should not take Crosby back...PERIOD
Believe you will be in for a bit of a disappointment Piqua
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Old 05-08-2017, 11:17 PM
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Balanced classes also have experience. If you have 3/3/3/3, you always 6 players in the junior/senior class. And the 13th player can go wherever so sometimes you'd have 7 in the junior/senior class.

Ideal in my mind looks something like this:
Fr: PG, Wing, Post
So: Combo Guard, Wing, Post
Jr: PG, Wing, Post
Sr: Combo Guard, Wing, Post

And then 13th scholarship is just best available or held open for late transfers.

So you have 4 post players and always have 2 upperclassmen who can start, unless you get an underclassman who outplays them. You always have 2 point guards, but you also have 2 combo guards who can be emergency ball handlers or serve as the backup until the freshman PG is ready for major minutes. And with the combo guards you have 6 wings for SG/SF, and enough to play small if talent dictates that you want to go with just one post player.
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Old 05-08-2017, 11:22 PM
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Oh, as far as our current situation, I think we should take the best grad transfer that wants to come here. Even if they're pretty terrible (a d2 backup transferring up to UD for one year), if it's for one year you don't lose anything and you get at the least another practice body that is probably better than the walk-ons.
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Old 05-08-2017, 11:38 PM
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We have no scholarships available if Crosby and Carter remain with the team.
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Old 05-08-2017, 11:41 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
We have no scholarships available if Crosby and Carter remain with the team.
Is Carter still in play?
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  #10  
Old 05-08-2017, 11:55 PM
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Originally Posted by FlyingArrow View Post
Is Carter still in play?
I have not been paying close attention lately, I assumed that he was still in play based upon his verbalcommits page.

But, 247sports seems to show him having no interest in UD now.


http://247sports.com/Recruitment/Nah...cruitInterests
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Old 05-08-2017, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by FlyingArrow View Post
Is Carter still in play?
I'd rule him out. But I also ruled Svoboda out. You think I can go for 0-2?
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Old 05-08-2017, 11:58 PM
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Carter visited Georgetown on May 6 and St. John's May 7.

http://247sports.com/Player/Nahziah-...TimelineEvents
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Old 05-09-2017, 12:05 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
I have not been paying close attention lately, I assumed that he was still in play based upon his verbalcommits page.

But, 247sports seems to show him having no interest in UD now.


http://247sports.com/Recruitment/Nah...cruitInterests
Were we still interested in him? Sounded like it after the comments from Carter's mother. But AG said we were still recruiting "some" of Archie's recruits. Who was excluded? We all thought it was Svoboda but now he's here. Maybe AG had already given up on Wright? Seems unlikely given the PG need that we had. That leaves Carter. Or maybe "some" meant "all". *shrug*
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Old 05-09-2017, 12:16 AM
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If Crosby comes back, and if you go by his Twitter profile pic he is, doubt we try to pick up another PG. In that case, probably save the scholarship.

But, I'd take one of the following:
Grad transfer C
Grad transfer SG
Transfer (sit 1 year any class) C
Transfer (sit 1 year soph) SG - Would have two years left

After this year, Jordan Davis is our only SG, so that would seem to be a position of need. Also, we only have one true C on the roster and that is Jordan Pierce, so having another big body would be helpful. Hate the idea of only having one scholarship for next year though.
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Old 05-09-2017, 12:42 AM
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Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan View Post
If Crosby comes back, and if you go by his Twitter profile pic he is, doubt we try to pick up another PG. In that case, probably save the scholarship.

But, I'd take one of the following:
Grad transfer C
Grad transfer SG
Transfer (sit 1 year any class) C
Transfer (sit 1 year soph) SG - Would have two years left

After this year, Jordan Davis is our only SG, so that would seem to be a position of need. Also, we only have one true C on the roster and that is Jordan Pierce, so having another big body would be helpful. Hate the idea of only having one scholarship for next year though.
Is Trey Landers gone? Seems strange how little respect or "talk" Trey gets. Hope he makes a big jump this year.
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Old 05-09-2017, 12:45 AM
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Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan View Post
If Crosby comes back, and if you go by his Twitter profile pic he is, doubt we try to pick up another PG. In that case, probably save the scholarship.

But, I'd take one of the following:
Grad transfer C
Grad transfer SG
Transfer (sit 1 year any class) C
Transfer (sit 1 year soph) SG - Would have two years left

After this year, Jordan Davis is our only SG, so that would seem to be a position of need. Also, we only have one true C on the roster and that is Jordan Pierce, so having another big body would be helpful. Hate the idea of only having one scholarship for next year though.
Is it a given that Trey Landers isn't going to be a SG?
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Old 05-09-2017, 01:06 AM
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Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan View Post
If Crosby comes back, and if you go by his Twitter profile pic he is, doubt we try to pick up another PG. In that case, probably save the scholarship.
We'll probably add another PG in the 2018 class regardless if Crosby comes back. I think they'd actually love to take an upperclassman transfer PG - grad transfer or sit a year, play two, but not sure that guy is out there. Three guys who can run the point, especially if you can space them out in years, is really an ideal number.
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Old 05-09-2017, 07:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Smitty10 View Post
Is it a given that Trey Landers isn't going to be a SG?
I think he'll be classified as an almost "everything" type positional player, aka Kyle Davis, Alex Robertson. At this point, he's a tweener..Did everything in HS because he was the best athlete on the floor and has the physical strength right now somewhere between a 2 man and a 4 man but the traditional height of just a 2...Just not sure he has the 2 guard skills offensively but in AG's system he'll be the perfect player, imo, with lots of defensive pressure, trapping, and full court pressure to utilize his athletic ability as well as being a pretty decent scorer...

I'd bet that Trey is presently on a pretty good workout regimen and a bit better diet to shed a few pounds and comes back a little bit more sleek ...

Last edited by steve; 05-09-2017 at 07:36 AM..
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Old 05-09-2017, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Smitty10 View Post
Is it a given that Trey Landers isn't going to be a SG?
Most of the people I've heard indicate Trey is more of a SF than a SG. I certainly don't think he's a prolific scorer, especially from outside.
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Old 05-09-2017, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by FlyerinChicago View Post
Is Trey Landers gone? Seems strange how little respect or "talk" Trey gets. Hope he makes a big jump this year.
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It's not about lack of respect. Seems most people don't consider him a true SG, he is more of a short SF. I don't think Landers has much of an outside game, typical of a SG.
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Old 05-09-2017, 08:49 AM
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At this point, if I was AG, I wouldn't worry about class balance. I would be more concerned with getting the type of players he wants that fit his system as soon as possible. The transfer bug will eventually hit UD. I can't believe how lucky we have been during this transfer epidemic. With so many players available this time of year, it is much easier to fill holes with transfers than ever before.
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Old 05-09-2017, 08:54 AM
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Balancing classes went out the window years ago, when transferring became the fashionable thing to do. It's an exercise in futility.
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  #23  
Old 05-09-2017, 09:03 AM
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It is theoretically possible that Mikesell is back and ready to go by season's beginning but I doubt it. If he isn't, I expect Landers to see quite a bit of time at the 3, as we already have a returning senior starter at the 2 spot and a very talented freshman that is more of a true SG.

If I were AG I'd strongly consider trying a big lineup from time to time, with DD bringing the ball up, Trey at the 2, Xeyrius at the 3, and then 2 of Kostas/Miller/Pierce. Matej could also be squeezed in there somewhere as he seems like a pretty big dude.

As for the actual topic of the thread, I think AG will use the ship. In no particular order: another freshman PG, a grad transfer PG, a transfer PG, a combo guard of any of those eligibility statuses, or just the best available player of any status/position.

Last edited by hawkoooo; 05-09-2017 at 09:14 AM.. Reason: forgot my boy svoboda
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Old 05-09-2017, 09:04 AM
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Don't believe we "all" wrote off Svoboda. There seemed to be a consensus that since we have not heard from each recruit, they would not be Flyers. Many posters wanted to wait until something was announced before they wrote off ANY of Archies recruits.

As far as Landers there are some who feel he is a tweener at any position-- like a short SF. But we just graduated the best really small forward in UD history. Just don't know how they are going to produce until they are afforded ample court time.

We have had lengthy threads on this class balance issue. A lot of the discussion seemed to support that total class balance is virtually unachievable since we now have multiple options to acquire recruits. Personally I think AG will add two more pg's, and one will be Crosby.
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Old 05-09-2017, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
Don't believe we "all" wrote off Svoboda. There seemed to be a consensus that since we have not heard from each recruit, they would not be Flyers.
I think the reason many had written off Svoboda was not because we hadn't heard from him, but because he hadn't heard from us (per a quote from him in the DDN).
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Old 05-09-2017, 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
But we just graduated the best really small forward in UD history.
Velvet says hi.

Edit: so does Donnie May.
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Old 05-09-2017, 12:13 PM
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Can't argue with those two. But they were both 6'4" SF's and not really small ( did they even call them SF's back then?) and Kyle was barely 6' even though some scouting releases had him a 6'2". His 42"+ hops fooled a lot of folks into think he was taller.
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Old 05-09-2017, 12:38 PM
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Old 05-09-2017, 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted by longtimefan View Post
I think the reason many had written off Svoboda was not because we hadn't heard from him, but because he hadn't heard from us (per a quote from him in the DDN).
Just proves that coaches aren't the only ones that spin. I believe the real story will surface at some point, and it won't be very exciting.
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Old 05-09-2017, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by DallasFlyer View Post
Balancing classes went out the window years ago, when transferring became the fashionable thing to do. It's an exercise in futility.
See, this is why I finally bought into AM's big class/small class way of recruiting. If player transfers out of big class, you replace him with another in the same class which keeps things status quo as far as balance goes or replace with another in small class which adds more balance.
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Old 05-09-2017, 10:06 PM
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Someone, anyone, name me one NCAA basketball program who has perfectly balanced classes of 3/3/3/3 and the random 1, who has maintained this balance for at least the last 5 seasons. Yea, on paper it sounds great, in reality this is 2017 where everyone always thinks the grass is greener on the other side.
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Old 05-09-2017, 11:08 PM
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They may not be 3/3/3/3 (with the odd one thrown in somewhere), but they usually aren't 1/4/1/6 either.
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Old 05-09-2017, 11:15 PM
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we have better balance than Kentucky
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Old 05-10-2017, 01:07 AM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
Don't believe we "all" wrote off Svoboda. There seemed to be a consensus that since we have not heard from each recruit, they would not be Flyers. Many posters wanted to wait until something was announced before they wrote off ANY of Archies recruits.

As far as Landers there are some who feel he is a tweener at any position-- like a short SF. But we just graduated the best really small forward in UD history. Just don't know how they are going to produce until they are afforded ample court time.

We have had lengthy threads on this class balance issue. A lot of the discussion seemed to support that total class balance is virtually unachievable since we now have multiple options to acquire recruits. Personally I think AG will add two more pg's, and one will be Crosby.
The DDN speaking directly with the player (Svoboda) and him stating he hadn't been contacted and had no idea what was going on doesn't count as something being announced?
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Old 05-10-2017, 02:16 AM
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Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan View Post
They may not be 3/3/3/3 (with the odd one thrown in somewhere), but they usually aren't 1/4/1/6 either.
If your 1/4/1/6 is referencing the Flyers, your math is off.

We are currently 1/5/1/5 with 1 left to go possibly.

After this year with Mikesell redshirting (Thread hijack warning- it will happen) we will be at 4/2/5/ and we assume 2 in coming freshmen (to be determined). A step closer to the perfect numbers everyone dreams of, and realistically probably as close as we will ever get.
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Old 05-10-2017, 08:54 AM
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I left off Crosby. Forgot he had returned for a moment. But it doesn't really change much. Still potentially only have one scholarship to give out every other year. I can't imagine that's an ideal scenario
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Old 05-10-2017, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan View Post
If your 1/4/1/6 is referencing the Flyers, your math is off.

We are currently 1/5/1/5 with 1 left to go possibly.

After this year with Mikesell redshirting (Thread hijack warning- it will happen) we will be at 4/2/5/ and we assume 2 in coming freshmen (to be determined). A step closer to the perfect numbers everyone dreams of, and realistically probably as close as we will ever get.
Believe RM redshirting does not affect his scholarship status.
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Old 05-10-2017, 09:09 AM
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Originally Posted by UD62 View Post
Believe RM redshirting does not affect his scholarship status.
I think he was saying that Mikesell would now be part of Landers class making it a 2 person class instead of 1.
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Old 05-10-2017, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by TX Flyer View Post
The DDN speaking directly with the player (Svoboda) and him stating he hadn't been contacted and had no idea what was going on doesn't count as something being announced?
In this specific case, it does not. What is the DDN in this wide world, including Europe. Did he say no one from Dayton talked to his uncle. Or how about his aunt in Long Island? Spin.
With all the turmoil going on with the coaching change and multitude ways of communication you really believe no backdoor message in some form got to MS as in "Dayton people will be reaching out directly to you soon in a positive way"?

Now someone puts a mike in face and he says I haven't heard from UD. And he is technically correct.
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Old 05-10-2017, 09:41 AM
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Thumbs up We reached out to all the recruits from the previous coach

Compliments of ClaytonFlyer:

Comments from Grant on his live radio interview on WHIO, I am paraphrasing here but you get the point.

1. "First thing we did is we reached out to all the current players, and all are coming back". Are you all convinced now that Cunningham will be back?

2. "Then we reached out to all of the recruits from the previous coach, and we were able to retain 3 out of 5." My hunch is if there was any doubt, the ship has sailed for this season (and probably forever) on Carter. 60% retained, I would say good job coach.
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