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  #301  
Old 04-03-2018, 12:38 AM
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I listened to parts of both team casts on TV, and I was agreeing almost completely with Michigan's Jay Feely complaining about several bad calls from the refs, but still, I can't have any sympathy for the p5.

I was extremely surprised that the refs IMO favored Villanova.
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  #302  
Old 04-03-2018, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
4 redshirts in the top 8 of Jay Wrights rotation
I saw that too. I dug a little deeper.

Paschall - red shirt because of a transfer after his freshman year at Fordham.
Booth - red shirt due to medical issues in 16-17 season.
Spellman - red shirt for academic reasons.
Bridges - red shirted his freshman season

It appears Bridges was the only, what I would call traditional red shirt.
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  #303  
Old 04-03-2018, 09:09 AM
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Jalen Brunson had that "throw back your head" move after minimal contact and the refs bought it repeatedly. That move never worked for Darrell Davis.
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  #304  
Old 04-03-2018, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows View Post
Jalen Brunson had that "throw back your head" move after minimal contact and the refs bought it repeatedly. That move never worked for Darrell Davis.
Tons of respect for DiVincenzo, kid was phenomenal... Lost all respect for Brunson dude is bum and flopper
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  #305  
Old 04-03-2018, 09:55 AM
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That Italian kid on Nova played like superman. He had a couple of blocked shots you just do not see from a kid his size. Wow, could he dribble drive and shoot the three. Of course his free throws sucked. Nova's point sits with fouls, so DiVincenzo runs the offense. Maybe the best overall performance by a player I have seen this year. And BTW, he is Nova's sixth man!
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  #306  
Old 04-03-2018, 10:40 AM
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Dispell a Myth: it used to be said that football players needed short bulging muscles and basketball players needed long thin muscles. I think that the Villanova team dispelled this myth. All of the starting five for Villanova looked like football players. The had a lot of muscle. These guys are thick burly man-children who spent considerable amounts of time in the weight room. Compare these man-children to Dayton’s very skinny kids and you can see why Villanova is the championship team. Some, not all, of the reasons they win is earned in the weight room and at the dinner table. IMO.
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  #307  
Old 04-03-2018, 10:44 AM
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GQ Jay now joining some elite company.



https://www.cbssports.com/college-ba...ltiple-titles/:


Coaches with Multiple NCAA Tournament Championships

Coach School NCAA Tournament titles

John Wooden UCLA 10

Mike Krzyzewski Duke 5

Adolph Rupp Kentucky 4

Roy Williams North Carolina 3

Jim Calhoun UConn 3

Bob Knight Indiana 3

Jay Wright Villanova 2

Billy Donovan Florida 2

Denny Crum Louisville 2

Henry Iba Oklahoma State 2

Ed Jucker Cincinnati 2

Branch McCracken Indiana 2

Dean Smith North Carolina 2

Phil Woolpert San Francisco 2

Note: Rick Pitino would be on this list -- as the only coach to win titles at two schools (Kentucky in 1996, Louisville in 2013) -- had the Cardinals' title not been vacated by the NCAA.

Last edited by ud2; 04-03-2018 at 11:24 AM..
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  #308  
Old 04-03-2018, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows View Post
Jalen Brunson had that "throw back your head" move after minimal contact and the refs bought it repeatedly. That move never worked for Darrell Davis.
There were also some "and-1" calls that I thought the referees overlooked. Another "foul" that I noticed they overlooked were the "arm bars." I thought that Villanova was especially good at controlling dribble penetration, and I believe arm-bars played a role in that. Irrespective of the referees' calls, Villanova is just too talented through 8 or 9 players. The Philadelphia area produces some wonderfully talented basketball players.
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  #309  
Old 04-03-2018, 11:13 AM
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Value to Villanova

The economic and academic impact of the BB program to VU is beyond incalculable. VU BB is regarded as the best program in the Country and Wright the best coach. And the PR!

If you are an alumnus of Tufts or Lehigh, for example, two top-tier NE private universities a solid notch above VU academically....and you live in Ala, Tex, CA, Kansas, or Ohio,...and you mention that you went to TU or LU you almost surely will be greeted with the blank stare I receive 100% of the time when I mention I went to UD. But say Villanova in any of those states or others and the school's name recognition will be instant....athletic success at the highest level is that important.

Villanova's basketball reputation and resulting institutional recognition means as much to the school, if not more, than anything else. Jay Wright may decide someday he'd like to coach a pro team. But, VU will never lose him to another school. I'm certain VU would match any offer JW will ever receive. He's got it made and probably knows it.

Having been raised in the shadow of VU, almost went there myself, as did each of my two best friends,...I'm green with envy. What has been achieved at VU is beyond our wildest dreams and ambitions. Great for them, I'm happy for VU (but I'm very envious.).
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  #310  
Old 04-03-2018, 11:23 AM
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The questions to ask each year. What is the difference between UD and Villanova, or other highly successful Catholic colleges?

Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
The economic and academic impact of the BB program to VU is beyond incalculable. VU BB is regarded as the best program in the Country and Wright the best coach. And the PR!

If you are an alumnus of Tufts or Lehigh, for example, two top-tier NE private universities a solid notch above VU academically....and you live in Ala, Tex, CA, Kansas, or Ohio,...and you mention that you went to TU or LU you almost surely will be greeted with the blank stare I receive 100% of the time when I mention I went to UD. But say Villanova in any of those states or others and the school's name recognition will be instant....athletic success at the highest level is that important.

Villanova's basketball reputation and resulting institutional recognition means as much to the school, if not more, than anything else. Jay Wright may decide someday he'd like to coach a pro team. But, VU will never lose him to another school. I'm certain VU would match any offer JW will ever receive. He's got it made and probably knows it.

Having been raised in the shadow of VU, almost went there myself, as did each of my two best friends,...I'm green with envy. What has been achieved at VU is beyond our wildest dreams and ambitions. Great for them, I'm happy for VU (but I'm very envious.).
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  #311  
Old 04-03-2018, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
That Italian kid on Nova played like superman. He had a couple of blocked shots you just do not see from a kid his size. Wow, could he dribble drive and shoot the three. Of course his free throws sucked. Nova's point sits with fouls, so DiVincenzo runs the offense. Maybe the best overall performance by a player I have seen this year. And BTW, he is Nova's sixth man!
He really wasn't a 6th man last night. DiVincenzo played 37 minutes. Part of the reason was because he lit it up as soon as he came in, part of it was because of the foul trouble with Brunson. All you have to do is compare last night's 6th men - DiVincenzo vs Robinson. Tells you all you need to know as to why Villanova was so dominating.
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  #312  
Old 04-03-2018, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by CE80 View Post
He really wasn't a 6th man last night. DiVincenzo played 37 minutes. Part of the reason was because he lit it up as soon as he came in, part of it was because of the foul trouble with Brunson. All you have to do is compare last night's 6th men - DiVincenzo vs Robinson. Tells you all you need to know as to why Villanova was so dominating.
Just a great Nova' player in a long line of them who bought into their system. Bought what Wright was selling and has been rewarded and will be professionally, as well..
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  #313  
Old 04-03-2018, 11:29 AM
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Villanova only has 2 5-star players on their roster, Brunson and Spellman.

I am very glad that coaching and teamwork still matter, and that you do not have to recruit like Kentucky in order to win the title.
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Old 04-03-2018, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan View Post
The questions to ask each year. What is the difference between UD and Villanova, or other highly successful Catholic colleges?
When the times were a changing, UD's missteps with conference affiliation and the coaching change at the end of the Donoher era allowed those Catholic schools to get a leg up on UD. Many state schools passed UD too. UD has never been able to recover.
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  #315  
Old 04-03-2018, 01:22 PM
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Villanova BB history...and opinions

Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan View Post
The questions to ask each year. What is the difference between UD and Villanova, or other highly successful Catholic colleges?
Originally Posted by CE80 View Post
When the times were a changing, UD's missteps with conference affiliation and the coaching change at the end of the Donoher era allowed those Catholic schools to get a leg up on UD. Many state schools passed UD too. UD has never been able to recover.
Going back several decades ( to our Donoher era) VU has been coached by Massimino, Lappas and now Wright. Each of the three had been a head coach...but not at big name schools, Stony Brook, Manhattan and Hofstra, respectively. Each had a relatively long VU tenure, at least a decade. Massimino was quite successful winning a championship; had the Old Big East going for him...but then faded. Lappas was mediocre by VU standards. Wright...we all know about his success.

But the importance of BB to VU dates way before Massimino..back to the 30s and well before UD's rise to prominence. I think the fact that VU is located essentially in a large sports city accounts for some of that...and Phila was a major force in the national sports scene in the 30s, 40s, 50s,.....much more so than today. In the late 40s Penn football lead the nation in attendance. That's Penn...not Penn State.

UD's BB ascendancy was pretty much an accident...hiring Tom Blackburn; followed by the success of a top assistant, Donoher,...rather than due to a history of solid BB and/or athletic leadership and planning.

When the national scene changed UD tolerated poor performance by Donoher for too long; and then made a dreadful hire to replace him. By then things were spinning out of control.....and we did not have the advantage of big city exposure, a good conference affiliation or, most important, I think, good athletic leadership. Ted Kissell was the first professional AD UD ever had...and he resurrected the BB program and established for the very first time a broad-based Div1 athletics program at UD.

All aspects of athletics at UD are infinitely better because of Kissell.

Things that have not changed are the Dayton location and a stable, but not prominent conference affiliation. Yet, essentially neighboring schools like Butler and Xavier have exceeded far beyond UD operating with about the same advantages and disadvantages. They don't have UD's facilities and they have not had great coaching stability.

We lucked out in recent years with a hire that worked out well...Miller, an assistant, whose NCAA success we couldn't have imagined a decade ago. But given our recent decades of under-performance the bar was not set high. Four consecutive NCAA appearances including an Elite 8 was a huge leap up for UD. But really doesn't compare all that well when measured against the two "neighbors" mentioned above and, of course, pales in comparison to Villanova.

Bringing in good players consistently is critical...they play the game. Miller pulled that off reasonably well until his last year or two. So we find ourselves starting over, essentially. I, and I'm guessing other Priders, can't help thinking that we're doing something "not quite right" considering that our more than ample resources and desire to succeed are not limited. Since there are a few (not many) more successful BB schools that can be compared fairly with UD, I wish I understood the situation better than I do.

I have no reason to believe that Neil is not a top-flight AD that we're lucky to have. But often "fresh eyes" are very helpful. I would love an independent assessment of our program by a paid outside expert consultant who is highly experienced in the 21st century Div 1 BB environment and understands UD's goals, our advantages and disadvantages....to help us get to where we want to be and stay there. Possibly our goal is not realistically attainable. If so, knowing that would be helpful.

This is hard....that's one thing I do know. But seeing at least a few other similar institutions succeed in a way that eludes us is frustrating. Hopefully Coach Grant will be able to get the Flyer Express back on track, soon. But, I'm a bit worried.

Just thoughts
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  #316  
Old 04-03-2018, 01:24 PM
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Dayton's biggest problem is that they have failed to hire coaches that could do three things that make teams great. 1) Recruiting, 2) coaching up, getting guys better before and during the season and 3) in game x's and go's. Blackburn's hayday was a little before my time so I cannot comment on him, but after that not sure that any of our coaches could do all three.

When we get that guy, we can be a top ten team. Maybe we have that guy, but I need more time to make that evaluation.
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Old 04-03-2018, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by John C. View Post
Dayton's biggest problem is that they have failed to hire coaches that could do three things that make teams great. 1) Recruiting, 2) coaching up, getting guys better before and during the season and 3) in game x's and go's. Blackburn's hayday was a little before my time so I cannot comment on him, but after that not sure that any of our coaches could do all three.

When we get that guy, we can be a top ten team. Maybe we have that guy, but I need more time to make that evaluation.
I'm confident AG can accomplish #'s 1 and 2. And with help (sharp assistants)...#3 as well. I too welcome to hear what a consultant familiar with the "territory" would suggest for UD to have sustained success ala _avier. Until then, however, I remain convinced it can't happen in the woeful A10.
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  #318  
Old 04-03-2018, 01:53 PM
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It will probably take baby steps unfortunately. As much as we were thrilled with our 4 straight NCAA appearances, as others have mentioned, we have not dominated the A-10. Until we start dominating our own conference, we're always going to be at the mercy of which way the wind is blowing.
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  #319  
Old 04-03-2018, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
This is hard....that's one thing I do know. But seeing at least a few other similar institutions succeed in a way that eludes us is frustrating. Hopefully Coach Grant will be able to get the Flyer Express back on track, soon. But, I'm a bit worried.

Just thoughts
The one thing that AG brings to the table is stability, in that he's an alum. No longer can coaches who recruit vs. UD say "Oh he's not gonna be there long" like they could with Archie. I don't think I'm alone in saying that Archie always appeared to be looking over his shoulder for that next opportunity. They can't do that with Coach Grant.
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  #320  
Old 04-03-2018, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by CE80 View Post
I saw that too. I dug a little deeper.

Paschall - red shirt because of a transfer after his freshman year at Fordham.
Booth - red shirt due to medical issues in 16-17 season.
Spellman - red shirt for academic reasons.
Bridges - red shirted his freshman season

It appears Bridges was the only, what I would call traditional red shirt.
Done Divincenzo was a redshirt too
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Old 04-03-2018, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by CE80 View Post
When the times were a changing, UD's missteps with conference affiliation and the coaching change at the end of the Donoher era allowed those Catholic schools to get a leg up on UD. Many state schools passed UD too. UD has never been able to recover.
I hate to sound like a fatalist, and I realize I'm impugning my hometown by saying it, but I think part of the problem also is the city and metro area itself. If a millennial has a choice between going to college in Philly, Cincy, Indy, Chicago, etc., or Dayton, and if "city life" means anything to them, they're probably not going to pick Dayton.

The youth of today want "bright lights/big city" more than my generation did (back in the late '70s and early '80s), and the whole YouTube culture promotes a "Look at me!" mentality that features places like LA, NYC, South Beach, etc. Face it - Courthouse Square is "Mayberry" compared to that. And while I realize that UD Arena is big-time, the places our guys have to play when on the road in-conference largely scream "Hoosiers" (as in the movie, not the team coached by our former HC).

I know we need to dominate the A-10 before any other conference will take a serious look at us, and that if we didn't do it in the last 4 years of the Miller era, it'll probably be at least another 5-6 years before we have a chance at it again, but still, Dayton and the surrounding areas are the snot-nosed little brother when compared to the metropoli that I mentioned earlier. There's no escaping that fact. All we can do is try to appeal to the more limited supply of kids that don't necessarily want to go to a college in cities that don't sleep, and want to be the big fish in a small pond. If you want "big fish/small pond", then we're your school!

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Old 04-03-2018, 02:29 PM
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Spokane, Washington, Indianapolis & Omaha aren't exactly bright lights big city. St. John's playing at Madison Square Garden and it's location in New York or Georgetown in D.C. haven't done them many favors
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Old 04-03-2018, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Done Divincenzo was a redshirt too
I don't know why I didn't list him too because I knew he also got hurt his freshman year.

Tim Delaney also was a redshirt for medical reasons.

Nova really has had to deal with some bad breaks injury wise. Who knows, some of those things may have actually worked to their advantage

I thought one could only apply for another year of eligibility for medical reasons after all their eligibility was up. Is that not the case or is Nova assuming all the medically redshirt guys will get that extra year?
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Old 04-03-2018, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by T-Bone 84 View Post
I hate to sound like a fatalist, and I realize I'm impugning my hometown by saying it, but I think part of the problem also is the city and metro area itself. If a millennial has a choice between going to college in Philly, Cincy, Indy, Chicago, etc., or Dayton, and if "city life" means anything to them, they're probably not going to pick Dayton.

The youth of today want "bright lights/big city" more than my generation did (back in the late '70s and early '80s), and the whole YouTube culture promotes a "Look at me!" mentality that features places like LA, NYC, South Beach, etc. Face it - Courthouse Square is "Mayberry" compared to that. And while I realize that UD Arena is big-time, the places our guys have to play when on the road in-conference largely scream "Hoosiers" (as in the movie, not the team coached by our former HC).

I know we need to dominate the A-10 before any other conference will take a serious look at us, and that if we didn't do it in the last 4 years of the Miller era, it'll probably be at least another 5-6 years before we have a chance at it again, but still, Dayton and the surrounding areas are the snot-nosed little brother when compared to the metropoli that I mentioned earlier. There's no escaping that fact. All we can do is try to appeal to the more limited supply of kids that don't necessarily want to go to a college in cities that don't sleep, and want to be the big fish in a small pond. If you want "big fish/small pond", then we're your school!
Spokane, WA?
Wichita, KS?
Lubbock, TX?
Syracuse, NY?

Dayton can compete with those cities.
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Old 04-03-2018, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by CE80 View Post
Spokane, WA?
Wichita, KS?
Lubbock, TX?
Syracuse, NY?

Dayton can compete with those cities.
Still a very real scanario as to why kids don't come to UD. Combine that with a very distinguished academic institution and another very real issue being in the A10.Can't compare our situation to Syracuse with them being in the ACC and Texas Tech the BIG 12. Not saying UD can't, and won't, get bigger and better players, though. AG off to a great start with Cohill. In BB, all it takes is a couple of studs to fall in love with your program and a real foundation can build.

With Gonzaga, since the 2000-2001 season, 23 players have joined the Zags on transfer as either regular or graduate transfers. During that same time span, the Zags have had 95 players on their rosters, meaning transfer players have made up just over 24 percent of all players in Mark Few’s tenure as head coach (not including the 1999 season). Add those transfers in with other pretty good players fairly close to Gonzaga who don't want to go to Oregon or Washington and you can see how the program can build..

I've scratched my head plenty of times as to "why" isn't UD more consistently on par with those schools you mentioned and others as far as getting bigger, faster, stronger and better players..

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Old 04-03-2018, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by steve View Post
Still a very real scanario as to why kids don't come to UD. Combine that with a very distinguished academic institution and another very real issue being in the A10.Can't compare our situation to Syracuse with them being in the ACC and Texas Tech the BIG 12. Not saying UD can't, and won't, get bigger and better players, though. AG off to a great start with Cohill. In BB, all it takes is a couple of studs to fall in love with your program and a real foundation can build.

With Gonzaga, since the 2000-2001 season, 23 players have joined the Zags on transfer as either regular or graduate transfers. During that same time span, the Zags have had 95 players on their rosters, meaning transfer players have made up just over 24 percent of all players in Mark Few’s tenure as head coach (not including the 1999 season). Add those transfers in with other pretty good players fairly close to Gonzaga who don't want to go to Oregon or Washington and you can see how the program can build..
Agreed on transfers. That's been a backbone of Gonzaga and Xavier when they were in the A10. You go over the top 100 lists since 98 and none of the programs that we see as comparable to us like Butler, Gonzaga, Xavier, Creighton and Wichita St were built with top 100 recruits.

Program building in the A10 I don't think works on the traditional we'll out recruit you for highly regarded high schoolers strategy. Non qualifiers, transfers, JUCOs, you've got to use an all of the above strategy when it comes to building a roster in the non power leagues.
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Old 04-03-2018, 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by steve View Post
Still a very real scanario as to why kids don't come to UD. Combine that with a very distinguished academic institution and another very real issue being in the A10.Can't compare our situation to Syracuse with them being in the ACC and Texas Tech the BIG 12. Not saying UD can't, and won't, get bigger and better players, though. AG off to a great start with Cohill. In BB, all it takes is a couple of studs to fall in love with your program and a real foundation can build.

With Gonzaga, since the 2000-2001 season, 23 players have joined the Zags on transfer as either regular or graduate transfers. During that same time span, the Zags have had 95 players on their rosters, meaning transfer players have made up just over 24 percent of all players in Mark Few’s tenure as head coach (not including the 1999 season). Add those transfers in with other pretty good players fairly close to Gonzaga who don't want to go to Oregon or Washington and you can see how the program can build..

I've scratched my head plenty of times as to "why" isn't UD more consistently on par with those schools you mentioned and others as far as getting bigger, faster, stronger and better players..
I don't disagree with you but T-Bone was saying that the metro area of Dayton may be the problem. I was just saying that the Dayton metro area can compete with those 4 other not so garden spots I listed. Also, the general student population at UD is growing. You would think a more appealing metro area would be more important to the non-athlete than the athlete.
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Old 04-03-2018, 03:28 PM
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Gregg Marshall was getting kids from Houston, Georgia and across the south to come to Wichita State in the Missouri Valley. I doubt the appeal of Wichita, Kansas made a difference
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Old 04-03-2018, 03:36 PM
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Again, it's a mix of ingredients in what floats the boat of a recruit with one of them being the metro area of location just as it is for a Florida kid that doesn't want to come north to play football due to weather being a big factor. But in this regard below, it's a heck of alot easier to get a kid into Wichita State than it is UD. Does UD get some allowable breaks by the Admin. in basketball recruits? I would assume they do but not every tom, Dick and Harry can get in and, more importantly, stay in school..


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Old 04-03-2018, 03:42 PM
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If the big city life is all that important then cincy, cbus and indy arentry all that far away.

Have a friend whose daughter went to visit a cousin at X and the two weekend she was there they treked up to UD for excitement.
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Old 04-03-2018, 03:44 PM
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We take people like Big Steve, Kostas, Obi Toppin, Monty Scott & I'm sure others that were non qualifiers academically out of high school. They get significant academic support while at Dayton so I'm not sure that's true.
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Old 04-03-2018, 04:29 PM
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The "knack" of recruiting...

A given.....you need good players. Something has to make them want to come to your school. There may be more of a special knack to that than we realize.

I had a birthday last week....and a lifelong friend gave me a copy of new book written by Ray Allen (with a ghost writer). Allen was one of the best NBA players ever....had an 18 year career and was/is the best three point shooter in NBA history. In college he was an All American...and coming out of high school he was a highly sought after recruit.

Allen went to UConn; which is why my friend thought I might find the book interesting. I've read about half of it. Allen begins his story as a kid growing up in South Carolina, followed by HS, college and the NBA, the latter dominating his story.

Here is what I found so interesting: around 1990 Calhoun was just beginning to build his resume as a great coach of what turned out to be a great program. But when Allen was being recruited out of HS the big name programs of the time were after him, as well as Calhoun at UConn. When Allen's friends learned UConn was on his list of final candidates their response was, UConn! Are you nuts...or something like that.

Well Allen chose UConn over the big names....and the deciding factor was the way he was treated by the Calhoun and his staff and the players he met during his campus visit. Allen goes on to explain the things
that turned him off by the sales pitches he received at his other final schools; the way he was treated during his campus visits; and little slights that annoyed him. He names the schools and coaches as he describes what he didn't like about their recruitment process/tactics.

Think about that. Here is one of the countries top HS players who can go anywhere he wants...and winds up staring in college and the pros...and what really impacts his college decision is the impression made by the way he treated during the recruiting process and campus visit. To the point that he chooses a school out in the sticks that is just beginning its rise to prominence

Obviously Allen goes into much detail. But his bottom line was that Calhoun/staff/current players treated him with respect; were genuinely friendly; acted as if they really wanted him; and, very important, there was no canned sales pitch or BS. At UConn he felt comfortable and wanted.

Now anyone (at least me) would think that any school trying to recruit a kid would do everything they could to put their best foot forward and impress him with how much he's going to love their place..and that it's the place for him/her. Apparently, though, some places are quite a bit more effective at that than others. Allen's description makes that very clear. Believe it or not, he even sites a racial incident that occurred at one southern school.

Now UD has very impressive facilities...a plus. If we can get a kid on campus, the way he/she is treated,...made to feel,..is likely to be very important. And we won't ever get them to campus for a visit unless they are very favorably impressed by our initial contacts with them. I recall hearing that Jabir would explain to a recruit's parents (in their living room, I presume) that if their daughter came to Dayton "she would get a good education and he would treat her as if she was his own daughter." That would impress me as a parent.

My bottom line with this rambling is that it may be a mistake for us to think that we don't have a chance recruiting against the big time schools. The big timers don't always treat recruits as well as they should (read Allen)...and sometimes misread what's important to a kid and his parents. Some coaches have a natural ability to make a HS player and his family feel comfortable and "want" to play at his/her school. The ability to create that sort of favorable impression in a young kid's mind (and parent's) is really important. I hope coaches Grant, Greene and staff have what it takes.
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Old 04-03-2018, 05:41 PM
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I think the one thing you can say about Grant, like him or not, is that he does not seem afraid to get involved with recruits who are being courted by P5/BE schools.
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Old 04-03-2018, 06:14 PM
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I also suspect that Grant is a very straight shooter. No promises on playing time, etc. Buy into the system he's selling, buy into UD as an institution, etc. There are plenty of kids who don't care about that stuff but they are not likely coming here regardless. But for the ones who do develop that personal relationship, who are treated with respect, and believe in what the coach is selling, I think they'll buy in, regardless of being located in Dayton.
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Old 04-03-2018, 08:51 PM
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I used to think that the city a school was in made a difference, but I am now convinced it means almost nothing, and ranks very low on almost all recruits' lists. Witness the other Phil schools other than VU, the Chicago schools other than LOC this year, the NY schools, the LA and SF and SD schools, SMU and STL. And on the other side, UVA, IU, UM, PU, MSU, VCU and KSU. Most kids do not care about cold weather or warm weather or how big the town is or where it is located.

They also do not care that much about how many people attend games. Most HS seniors care about a winning program, playing time, TV exposure, a known school name and a top conference and a nice campus with great living quarters.
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Old 04-03-2018, 09:09 PM
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The top priority is getting to the NBA for most these I kids I would think and how can do the best of job of that
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Old 04-03-2018, 09:47 PM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
I used to think that the city a school was in made a difference, but I am now convinced it means almost nothing, and ranks very low on almost all recruits' lists. Witness the other Phil schools other than VU, the Chicago schools other than LOC this year, the NY schools, the LA and SF and SD schools, SMU and STL. And on the other side, UVA, IU, UM, PU, MSU, VCU and KSU. Most kids do not care about cold weather or warm weather or how big the town is or where it is located.

They also do not care that much about how many people attend games. Most HS seniors care about a winning program, playing time, TV exposure, a known school name and a top conference and a nice campus with great living quarters.
As much as I hate to admit, when _avier went to the new Big East they pretty much checked all the boxes in your last sentence. They went from recruiting mostly 3 star players to mostly 4 star and 5 star players. At this point in time AG needs to focus on getting quality athletes that fit his system, regardless of the number of stars, and concentrate on winning the A-10 year in and year out. This is what Gonzaga does! They win their conference and go to the NCAAT every year. Lets face it, UD has not been very successful in the A-10 outside of Archie's last 3 seasons. _avier used to win it every season and, starting next season we should aspire to that goal.

I think we have a pretty good nucleus with the 8 scholarship players we currently have on the roster. If AG and his staff wisely use the 5 they have available we should be right in the mix next season because the A-10 does not have a clear leader like Rhode Island was this past season.
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Old 04-04-2018, 07:48 AM
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Gonzaga gets plenty of excellent, highly-rated HS players that can play anywhere these days. This modern day Gonzaga is not our dad's Gonzaga. They've utilized the transfer market as much if not more than any quality team in the country. Almost 25% of all of Mark Few's players since he's been HC are transfers, JUCOS or grad transfers..That's around 3 per year..

Basketball is one heck of alot easier to recruit than football and it's far easier to have that chance to become a really good team. Only takes 2 excellent players to change a program for at least a couple years to become Sweet 16 worthy. Now, to go beyond and become consistently good it takes far more and requires the program foundation itself to rise up.

I could care less about how many stars some local basketball junkie slaps on a kid. Most of those guys know no more about the game than I do when watching a player. I know a 4-5 star the second I see him and if he's worthy of that as there are also plenty of players that get that same status that are just the 3rd/4th best player on their HS team as far as numbers/contribution but project down the road to become elite due to size, length, athletic ability, etc..

I like the position AG is in.He'll get some real nice players and athletes here that will fit his system. The real key, imo, is to always be as strong as they possibly can at that PG position along with depth there. Mix in a couple 2's and 3's and UD can remain a top tier team in the A10. Get THAT occasional stud here and there and Sweet 16's are in the horizon and maybe more..AG's track record thus far in his short tenure looks to have been pretty fantastic in regards to recruiting......
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Old 04-04-2018, 10:58 AM
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All of the Catholic Colleges that are discussed as being similar institutions to UD like X, Gonzaga, and Villanova spend more money on their basketball programs.

When I see the question asked, what can UD do to become more like these programs? One of the answers is spend about 2 million more dollars.

Here's a list of basketball budgets posted by Mark Adams: https://www.facebook.com/enthusiadam...33130316961851

Last edited by st marys; 04-04-2018 at 11:04 AM.. Reason: added budgets link
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Old 04-04-2018, 11:37 AM
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Figures are misleading...

Originally Posted by st marys View Post
All of the Catholic Colleges that are discussed as being similar institutions to UD like X, Gonzaga, and Villanova spend more money on their basketball programs.

When I see the question asked, what can UD do to become more like these programs? One of the answers is spend about 2 million more dollars.

Here's a list of basketball budgets posted by Mark Adams: https://www.facebook.com/enthusiadam...33130316961851
Schools have great latitude re the way the report expenses....hard to compare figures meaningfully. For example, Stanford is ranked below UD. I get to Stanford's campus quite often and I'll tell you the poles supporting the practice soccer goals are pure gold. Kidding, of course, but at Stanford the athletic facilities and everything associated with athletics are second to none...have to be seen to be believed.

Re UD: What would we spend more money on? The men's/women's BB teams should be flying charter, always...are they? I hope the budget for recruiting is better than adequate. Coach's salaries have to be competitive.

With our income from men's BB we should be limited in no way. Chris, have you ever heard Neil suggest he was limited financially?
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  #341  
Old 04-04-2018, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by st marys View Post
All of the Catholic Colleges that are discussed as being similar institutions to UD like X, Gonzaga, and Villanova spend more money on their basketball programs.

When I see the question asked, what can UD do to become more like these programs? One of the answers is spend about 2 million more dollars.

Here's a list of basketball budgets posted by Mark Adams: https://www.facebook.com/enthusiadam...33130316961851
I am curious what makes up the difference? Coaching salaries? Other staff comp? Facilities? Player pay, oops?
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Old 04-04-2018, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by SLUFLYER View Post
I am curious what makes up the difference? Coaching salaries? Other staff comp? Facilities? Player pay, oops?
Villanova pays rent everytime they play in the Wells Fargo Center or whatever the NBA arena in Philly is called. Jay Wright and his assistants are probably flying private to every AAU tourney/recruiting event they go to
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Old 04-04-2018, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Villanova pays rent everytime they play in the Wells Fargo Center or whatever the NBA arena in Philly is called. Jay Wright and his assistants are probably flying private to every AAU tourney/recruiting event they go to
Archie flew private, on a booster's plane, to recruit too, so I am assuming AG does too.
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Old 04-04-2018, 05:00 PM
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The rent on the Wells Fargo Center I know is not cheap for a game.
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Old 04-04-2018, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by SLUFLYER View Post
I am curious what makes up the difference? Coaching salaries? Other staff comp? Facilities? Player pay, oops?
Shut up, Calipari!
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