Roster Status

[OSU Flyer]

Originally Posted by tirebiter What's the difference between a walk-on and a preferred walk-on?

preferred's have a spot of roster and don't have to try out to make the team once they get to campus

[lhsgolf19]

Originally Posted by tirebiter What's the difference between a walk-on and a preferred walk-on?

https://www.asmsportsgroup.com/news/...zmg9yjsa6z59sg

[Lifelong Flyer Fan]

Preferred Walk on is guaranteed a spot. Others must tryout.

[springborofan]

Originally Posted by tirebiter What's the difference between a walk-on and a preferred walk-on?

Preferred walk-ons are guaranteed a spot on roster but not given a scholarship. Regular walk-ons go to the gym on a specified date/time (or two) and try out along with any other students who want to try. A small minority of these kids actually make the team.

Even preferred walk-ons rarely make it all four years on the team. It’s demanding from a time perspective and without any scholarship $, it can get old. Others, though, show huge value and get a scholarship at some point in their four (or five) years.

[sabo2]

One walks-on and the other is asked to walk-on.

[springborofan]

A quick overview of what has changed in 12 months (as of 6PM today—with no official announcements of going pro from either Camara or Holmes):

OUT
Baker
Amafuele
Washington
Sharavjamts
Blakeney
Amzil

These are in order of insignificance to significance. If I were to place a WAR (wins above replacement) to this overall group it would not be high.

IN
Simon
Erceg
Jacks
Bennett
Cheeks

At this point (huge disclaimer based on what happens to Camara and Holmes), the team is stronger than last year. Not only does the team have more able bodied players (availability is a skill set), the guard situation is vastly improved between new players and return to health of Elvis, Mali, and Brea.

Maybe the naysayers were a little premature? We’ll see. I think Camara is gone but I think Holmes stays. If I’m correct, that means there are still 3 scholarships to offer (I think my math is correct!). I’m not suggesting Grant will find a one for one replacement for Camara but there is still talent available in the portal.

I realize this post may not age well given the NBA declaration deadline is tonight…

[OSU Flyer]

It sounds like Camara is gone based off of going to and his play at the PIT

[ud2]

Originally Posted by springborofan OUT Baker Amafuele Washington Sharavjamts Blakeney Amzil

Is there a thread or posts on udpride tracking where these guys end up?

Baker...southwestern Florida JUCO school
Amafuele
Washington
Sharavjamts
Blakeney
Amzil...University of New Mexico

[OSU Flyer]

Originally Posted by ud2 Is there a thread or posts on udpride tracking where these guys end up? Baker...southwestern Florida JUCO school Amafuele Washington Sharavjamts Blakeney Amzil...University of New Mexico

I think that's all that's known right now. Washington had a list of couple schools awhile back but I haven't seen anything on the others

[CT Flyer]

Originally Posted by springborofan A quick overview of what has changed in 12 months (as of 6PM today—with no official announcements of going pro from either Camara or Holmes): OUT Baker Amafuele Washington Sharavjamts Blakeney Amzil These are in order of insignificance to significance. If I were to place a WAR (wins above replacement) to this overall group it would not be high. IN Simon Erceg Jacks Bennett Cheeks At this point (huge disclaimer based on what happens to Camara and Holmes), the team is stronger than last year. Not only does the team have more able bodied players (availability is a skill set), the guard situation is vastly improved between new players and return to health of Elvis, Mali, and Brea. Maybe the naysayers were a little premature? We’ll see. I think Camara is gone but I think Holmes stays. If I’m correct, that means there are still 3 scholarships to offer (I think my math is correct!). I’m not suggesting Grant will find a one for one replacement for Camara but there is still talent available in the portal. I realize this post may not age well given the NBA declaration deadline is tonight…

So can we officially commence with the most talented, deepest team in UD history posts?

[UD62]

Originally Posted by CT Flyer So can we officially commence with the most talented, deepest team in UD history posts?

It worked out so well for us last year. We do seem to overstate out outlook almost every year. This year will probably be no different.

[Flyers98]

Shocked there is no news of any kind on Holmes. I guess technically you don't have to announce anything if you aren't changing anything but I am surprised (pleasantly) if that is the way things work out.

I will also say, if Duece comes back that tells me all I need to know about the players' thoughts on our coach, (or at least our best player's thoughts). That is admittedly one data point to be considered but an important one, if it turns out that way.

[hawkoooo]

PG: Enoch Cheeks (Sr.)* Malachi Smith (Jr.), Javon Bennett (So.)
SG: Koby Brea (Jr.)*, Kobe Elvis (Jr.)*
SF: Jaiun Simon (Fr.)
PF: Zimi Nwokeji (Jr.)*, Vasilije Erceg (Fr.)
C: Daron Holmes (Jr.), Isaac Jack (So.)

*has extra year of eligibility

As of today, if no other players enter the portal/go pro, we have three scholarships available.

[rollo]

There is a very high probability that Holmes will be 4* next season. His NBA development/future is dependent on his ability to face the basket and hit midrange jumpers.

[flyer016]

Some important deadlines ahead:

Transfer portal remains open until May 11. You don't have to choose your destination by the deadline, but if you intend to transfer you need to be in by that date.

Early NBA Draft entry withdrawal is May 31. Players like Camara (that entered but retained eligibility) have until that date to decide whether they'll stay in the draft.

I still wouldn't be surprised to see Holmes explore his options and wouldn't be shocked to see his name on the NBA early entry list today. Frankly, I'm surprised he hasn't already entered the draft just to get NBA evaluations and feedback. It comes as no harm to his eligibility and would seem to raise his profile a bit.

[hawkoooo]

Originally Posted by rollo There is a very high probability that Holmes will be 4* next season. His NBA development/future is dependent on his ability to face the basket and hit midrange jumpers.

I think the poster is saying if Holmes leaves Zimi would be the starting 4, which is very possible.

[Lifelong Flyer Fan]

According to Jonathon Givony of Draft Express, A "source" told ESPN that DaRon entered his name before midnight.

[hawkoooo]

Originally Posted by Lifelong Flyer Fan According to Jonathon Givony of Draft Express, A "source" told ESPN that DaRon entered his name before midnight.

https://ftw.usatoday.com/2023/04/nba...-waters-dayton

[lhsgolf19]

"Holmes tells me he has signed with an agent but is maintaining his collegiate eligibility. Will certainly be someone NBA teams want to guy eyes on during the pre-draft process and draft combine."

[superfan99]

Originally Posted by Lifelong Flyer Fan According to Jonathon Givony of Draft Express, A "source" told ESPN that DaRon entered his name before midnight.

What was the benefit/point of waiting until the last possible second to declare?

I had expected him to declare shortly after the season ended, but when there still was no news this morning I thought we were in the clear. I am disappointed to hear this.

[N2663R]

Originally Posted by lhsgolf19 "Holmes tells me he has signed with an agent but is maintaining his collegiate eligibility. Will certainly be someone NBA teams want to guy eyes on during the pre-draft process and draft combine."

I wonder where Holmes will be rated versus Camara - higher / lower?

[funeralplanner]

Zimi a starter......ugh

[flyerfanatic86]

Originally Posted by superfan99 What was the benefit/point of waiting until the last possible second to declare? I had expected him to declare shortly after the season ended, but when there still was no news this morning I thought we were in the clear. I am disappointed to hear this.

I would've been disappointed if he didn't. There is 0 reason not to enter his name and get some feedback, it was the only logical move.

[superfan99]

Originally Posted by flyerfanatic86 I would've been disappointed if he didn't. There is 0 reason not to enter his name and get some feedback, it was the only logical move.

The one reason not to is because he wants so badly to keep playing for the Flyers, you know, that team we all love and root for. lol.

I understand the point you are making and don't disagree. It's just the last minute nature that allowed me to get my hopes up and let my guard down. That made it sting a little more than it would have otherwise.

[Lifelong Flyer Fan]

Originally Posted by superfan99 What was the benefit/point of waiting until the last possible second to declare? I had expected him to declare shortly after the season ended, but when there still was no news this morning I thought we were in the clear. I am disappointed to hear this.

DaRon is very loyal to Dayton, especially AG. Perhaps he waited because he didn't want to add any fuel to "the sky is falling" fire (with the transfers announcing) and waited until a number of roster spots were filled. There was no advantage to him to wait, but it might have been an assist to the program.

I am not surprised he hasn't made a personal announcement either. He isn't one to draw much attention to himself from what I have observed. He may not make any announcement until he makes a decision on whether or not he stays in the draft.

[lhsgolf19]

As expected, especially after PIT, Camara going pro

https://twitter.com/toomany_buckets/...tQmU2tS3tDrHhw
Posted via Mobile Device

[ChampCar]

Holmes update ...



https://www.daytondailynews.com/spor...KWTVY7QZC3BX4/

[NJFlyr71]

Originally Posted by springborofan At this point (huge disclaimer based on what happens to Camara and Holmes), the team is stronger than last year. Not only does the team have more able bodied players (availability is a skill set), the guard situation is vastly improved between new players and return to health of Elvis, Mali, and Brea. Maybe the naysayers were a little premature? We’ll see. I think Camara is gone but I think Holmes stays. If I’m correct, that means there are still 3 scholarships to offer (I think my math is correct!). I’m not suggesting Grant will find a one for one replacement for Camara but there is still talent available in the portal. I realize this post may not age well given the NBA declaration deadline is tonight…

At this point the team is stronger than last year!!!???

Not so fast ... as we have seen any hype does not forecast well into the future season.

With everyone coming back last year and the almost success getting into the NCAA one would have thought that last years team would be GREAT. Baker was highly thought of as a new transfer, Washington was expected to contribute and everyone else was adding experience to the formula .... WOW what could not be liked by the prospects.

Turned out not quite the hype we believed in.

So here we are again claiming everything all over again just with a new set of characters. I've seen this show before.

With all the new additions and questions on how the surgeries may pan out on two guards ... I don't think we should place too much on how wonderful everything is.

[NJFlyr71]

Originally Posted by lhsgolf19 As expected, especially after PIT, Camara going pro https://twitter.com/toomany_buckets/...tQmU2tS3tDrHhw Posted via Mobile Device

Likely a difficult decision!

Let's see "NIL money or NBA MONEY", hmmmmmmmm.

[momszer]

Or no money in US. Perhaps Euros.

[momszer]

Lunardi now lists VCU as the auto bid from the A10 in his latest bracketology update.

[AZFlyer85]

Originally Posted by momszer Lunardi now lists VCU as the auto bid from the A10 in his latest bracketology update.

That's good. St. Joe Homer Joey had UD winning it last preseason

[m21eagle45]

Originally Posted by AZFlyer85 That's good. St. Joe Homer Joey had UD winning it last preseason

Why is that good? We should want to have the expectations of making the NCAA tournament.

[lhsgolf19]

It's April... Bracketology doesn't mean a freaking thing right now

[ud2]

Originally Posted by lhsgolf19 It's April... Bracketology doesn't mean a freaking thing right now

Oh bs, if we were like a 10 seed or better/not right on the bubble in this bracket, then we'd be all pumped up and praising Grant. This bracket doesn't mean much, but it means at least a little.

[CoffeeCan]

The problem/challenge with the portal/NIL as they are currently constructed (and they are not going anywhere anytime soon) is that there is no true "rebuild"... it is win now every year. And that includes the 23-24 Flyers. Hope we see some more additions because I see a 0.500 team at best.

Yes, I know there are still roster spots to be added to... just not seeing many difference makers at present

[T-Bone 84]

Originally Posted by m21eagle45 Why is that good? We should want to have the expectations of making the NCAA tournament.

Maybe that was AZFlyer85’s way of saying that Joey Brackets was wrong last year, so we may not want him to designate us as the favorite this year. Admittedly, a big reason why he was wrong last year is because of our injury-riddled failure to meet expectations, but I think he’s just throwing darts at this point in the offseason, anyway.
Posted via Mobile Device

[hawkoooo]

Originally Posted by CoffeeCan The problem/challenge with the portal/NIL as they are currently constructed (and they are not going anywhere anytime soon) is that there is no true "rebuild"... it is win now every year. And that includes the 23-24 Flyers. Hope we see some more additions because I see a 0.500 team at best. Yes, I know there are still roster spots to be added to... just not seeing many difference makers at present

Or at least, no more subtractions. If Holmes actually stays I wouldn't be remotely surprised to see another number next to our name preseason.

[ud2]

https://www.espn.com/espn/feature/st...ld-predictions

There is the bracket.

VCU...11 seed

Indiana...first team out...fire the coach!

Florida Atlantic...4 seed

Wright State...15 seed

Ohio State...11 seed

Saint Mary's...5 seed


Looks like the A10 being a one bid league is the new normal, that is a major, major problem.

[ud2]

Nothing new...this is just the list of early draft entrants...Daron's name is on the list, he can still return to UD, the deadline is May 31 to withdraw from the draft


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023..._underclassmen

[Kool-ade Flyer]

Roster status.... ASSUMING DaRon returns... CAG likes projects, so I see a true freshman guard with 'potential' signing late. If DaRon returns maybe a legit true freshman big to support DaRon and know that the spot is his the next year. The big question is will CAG leave a scholarship open just to drive folks on this forum nuts for another year or does he do what many have suggested and just get a solid 1-year 'grad' transfer who just wants to play at UD arena??? I hope for the latter but could easily see the former.

If DaRon goes pro......... buckle up udpride

[TXFlyerFan]

I don't know what DaRon will do. He probably doesn't either at this point. But, I'd be willing to bet that if he holds to the last minute and then stays in the draft, we'll end up not filling his scholarship. It's highly unlikely there would be any serious talent left in the portal by then, so we probably leave it open and hope for some kind of mid-season transfer or maybe another Amzil type who comes in 1/2 through the year.

[hawkoooo]

Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan I don't know what DaRon will do. He probably doesn't either at this point. But, I'd be willing to bet that if he holds to the last minute and then stays in the draft, we'll end up not filling his scholarship. It's highly unlikely there would be any serious talent left in the portal by then, so we probably leave it open and hope for some kind of mid-season transfer or maybe another Amzil type who comes in 1/2 through the year.

What about the other three scholarships we have open, regardless of Holmes' choice?

I hope none are left open, but we've a long way to go.

[flyer016]

Originally Posted by hawkoooo What about the other three scholarships we have open, regardless of Holmes' choice? I hope none are left open, but we've a long way to go.

Agreed. Fill the roster.

We need talent and bodies.

In the portal era, it's even easier to take a big swing on a kid. If you miss, he's likely dipping after a year or two to find his level.

[TXFlyerFan]

Originally Posted by hawkoooo What about the other three scholarships we have open, regardless of Holmes' choice? I hope none are left open, but we've a long way to go.

Well I'm assuming those will be filled. Was only commenting specifically on Deuce's roster spot. I don't see any way we have 3-4 scholarships that aren't filled, or we'll have walk-ons playing significant roles. They may be preferred walk ons, and they may have some level of skill, but not sure that's where we want to be from a roster standpoint.

[OSU Flyer]

Originally Posted by ud2 https://www.espn.com/espn/feature/st...ld-predictions There is the bracket. VCU...11 seed Indiana...first team out...fire the coach! Florida Atlantic...4 seed Wright State...15 seed Ohio State...11 seed Saint Mary's...5 seed Looks like the A10 being a one bid league is the new normal, that is a major, major problem.

Based off on the portal comings and goings, I think the league could be even worse next year

[AZFlyer85]

Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan I don't know what DaRon will do. He probably doesn't either at this point. But, I'd be willing to bet that if he holds to the last minute and then stays in the draft, we'll end up not filling his scholarship. It's highly unlikely there would be any serious talent left in the portal by then, so we probably leave it open and hope for some kind of mid-season transfer or maybe another Amzil type who comes in 1/2 through the year.

I think that there will still be talent left in the portal on 5/31, the deadline date for DaRon staying in the draft. There's over a thousand in now, and more are being added daily.

[TXFlyerFan]

Originally Posted by AZFlyer85 I think that there will still be talent left in the portal on 5/31, the deadline date for DaRon staying in the draft. There's over a thousand in now, and more are being added daily.

Most of them are not talent though, and a good chunk won't even be picked up by another team.

[hawkoooo]

PG: Enoch Cheeks (Sr.)* Malachi Smith (Jr.), Javon Bennett (So.)
SG: Koby Brea (Jr.)*, Kobe Elvis (Jr.)*, Marvel Allen (Fr.)
SF: Jaiun Simon (Fr.)
PF: Zimi Nwokeji (Jr.)*, Vasilije Erceg (Fr.)
C: Isaac Jack (So.)

*has extra year of eligibility

As of today, if no other players leave, we have three scholarships available.

Notes: I've taken Holmes off for now, as I did the same for Camara when he declared. I wasn't totally sure how to classify Allen so I went with SG.

[Fudd]

Originally Posted by hawkoooo PG: Enoch Cheeks (Sr.)* Malachi Smith (Jr.), Javon Bennett (So.) SG: Koby Brea (Jr.)*, Kobe Elvis (Jr.)*, Marvel Allen (Fr.) SF: Jaiun Simon (Fr.) PF: Zimi Nwokeji (Jr.)*, Vasilije Erceg (Fr.) C: Isaac Jack (So.) *has extra year of eligibility As of today, if no other players leave, we have three scholarships available. Notes: I've taken Holmes off for now, as I did the same for Camara when he declared. I wasn't totally sure how to classify Allen so I went with SG.

It's amazing how dynamic rosters can be this day in age. And still 3 scholarships to give!

[TXFlyerFan]

At this point, if Holmes does return, it looks like we'll have a good complement of guards. Still need a Toumani replacement. I still think it's 60/40 Holmes stays in the draft.

[OSU Flyer]

Based on the current roster composition, I'd have to think they'd be rolling out a lot of 3 and maybe even 4 guard lineups

[springborofan]

Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan At this point, if Holmes does return, it looks like we'll have a good complement of guards. Still need a Toumani replacement. I still think it's 60/40 Holmes stays in the draft.

Assuming DaRon decides to return, does anyone else think this team still lacks a solid 3pt. shooter as the last piece? Can AG count on Brea? I suppose he was hurt but his 1 for 18(?) 3 pt shooting in A10 tournament indicated to me AG needs a strong back up plan. Is that guy now on the roster. Ercig?

[Flyers98]

Originally Posted by springborofan Assuming DaRon decides to return, does anyone else think this team still lacks a solid 3pt. shooter as the last piece? Can AG count on Brea? I suppose he was hurt but his 1 for 18(?) 3 pt shooting in A10 tournament indicated to me AG needs a strong back up plan. Is that guy now on the roster. Ercig?

I would think that IF Mali, Brea and Elvis return to pre-inury form we have decent perimeter shooting with those three and the new guys. However, that is a big IF and not one I want the season bet on, (again with the assumption Holmes returns). So I agree a proven shooter should be a top priority. Good news is, that guy is likely to be a guard so it checks a couple boxes if we can find him.

[m21eagle45]

Originally Posted by springborofan Assuming DaRon decides to return, does anyone else think this team still lacks a solid 3pt. shooter as the last piece? Can AG count on Brea? I suppose he was hurt but his 1 for 18(?) 3 pt shooting in A10 tournament indicated to me AG needs a strong back up plan. Is that guy now on the roster. Ercig?

Good teams have more than 1 good shooter. Even if Brea comes back fully healthy and plays well, we still need another outside shooter to play when Brea is off the floor or having an off night.

[TXFlyerFan]

Bennett dramatically improved from 3 during the year, so that's possibly one. Mali's highest percentage came from 3 point set shots, not really coming off screens or moving. I wouldn't count on him being reliable there. Maybe if Koby and Kobe's injuries heal and they can eventually get some good training in, they could be that. And we don't really know what we have in Marvel Allen.

Erceg showed capability as a big from 3, but we need someone else at the 3 spot to be able to really nail 3s as well. There has to be a risk from all four out positions to be effective. Otherwise, you're just dependent on a random event to occur and succeed.

[Marysville Flyer]

Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan Bennett dramatically improved from 3 during the year, so that's possibly one. Mali's highest percentage came from 3 point set shots, not really coming off screens or moving. I wouldn't count on him being reliable there. Maybe if Koby and Kobe's injuries heal and they can eventually get some good training in, they could be that. And we don't really know what we have in Marvel Allen. Erceg showed capability as a big from 3, but we need someone else at the 3 spot to be able to really nail 3s as well. There has to be a risk from all four out positions to be effective. Otherwise, you're just dependent on a random event to occur and succeed.

If Deuce comes back I would expect him to shoot a bunch of 3s since that’s needed for him to take the next step. AG allowed that with Toumani both years and 1st year especially he didn’t start out good. I expect a lot of the same from Daron with him at the 4 more than the 5.
Posted via Mobile Device

[momszer]

Then who's our 5 if Daron's our 4? Forgot about Jack.

[longtimefan]

Originally Posted by momszer Then who's our 5 if Daron's our 4?

Would have to be Isaac Jack.

[TXFlyerFan]

DaRon is not a 4, doesn't play as a 4, and won't be a 4. He doesn't have the athletic mobility of a 4. Compare DaRon to Obi, Durant, etc, in terms of mobility. DaRon is a center. Is he a center that can shoot 3s? Possibly. He was not asked to do so but there's no doubt the more he works at it, the better he will be. But there's no way, if Grant also wants to win games, that he's parking DaRon at the 3 point line and telling him to chuck away so that he can impress NBA scouts.

[bcross]

Daron can step out and shoot 3's as a 5. Had plenty opportunities this year if he was looking to take them.

[TA111]

Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan DaRon is not a 4, doesn't play as a 4, and won't be a 4. He doesn't have the athletic mobility of a 4. Compare DaRon to Obi, Durant, etc, in terms of mobility. DaRon is a center. Is he a center that can shoot 3s? Possibly. He was not asked to do so but there's no doubt the more he works at it, the better he will be. But there's no way, if Grant also wants to win games, that he's parking DaRon at the 3 point line and telling him to chuck away so that he can impress NBA scouts.

Let me give you some history and perspective. DaRon played the 4 at Compass Prep his senior year. Adrame Diong was the center and DaRon did in fact take, and make a decent amount of 3’s. I actually saw him play in Vandalia. When he arrived at UD he was slotted at the 5 because we had no one else who could play the position. In fact, this past year he was the only option inside at the post.
So, to say he can’t play the 4,imo, is shortsighted. As to “parking” him at the 3 point line, that isn’t going to happen with anyone on the team. Will he have the opportunity to shoot more 15-20’ shots? Probably. But with Jack inside it will certainly give him more room to roam away from the basket.

[TXFlyerFan]

Originally Posted by TA111 Let me give you some history and perspective. DaRon played the 4 at Compass Prep his senior year. Adrame Diong was the center and DaRon did in fact take, and make a decent amount of 3’s. I actually saw him play in Vandalia. When he arrived at UD he was slotted at the 5 because we had no one else who could play the position. In fact, this past year he was the only option inside at the post. So, to say he can’t play the 4,imo, is shortsighted. As to “parking” him at the 3 point line, that isn’t going to happen with anyone on the team. Will he have the opportunity to shoot more 15-20’ shots? Probably. But with Jack inside it will certainly give him more room to roam away from the basket.

Anyone who watched DaRon play would know he's not a 4 in terms of how the game is played under Grant. There's simply no comparison to DaRon even with most NBA 4s, regardless of what he did in HS. He's a slightly undersize 5. And when I say park him at the 3 line, I don't mean he stands there like Obi on the Knicks, though I suspect you knew that. I am saying in order for Holmes to take enough 3s to impress NBA scouts, it would be detrimental to our offense and chances at winning unless he's dropping them at a 40% clip.

I don't see the athleticism of DaRon of guarding someone on the wing with any consistency. He's best suited within 10-12 feet of the rim on defense. On offense, he's best suited from 10-12 feet and in, especially where he can use his quickness against slower 5s.

None of this is to say he can't become a decent 3 point shooter. He can. I just don't believe that will amount to any significant part of Dayton's offense and without sufficient volume, it won't matter to NBA scouts.

[Mr_Sweets]

PG: Enoch Cheeks (Sr.)* Malachi Smith (Jr.), Javon Bennett (So.)
SG: Koby Brea (Jr.)*, Kobe Elvis (Jr.)*, Marvel Allen (Fr.)
SF: Jaiun Simon (Fr.)
PF: Zimi Nwokeji (Jr.)*, Vasilije Erceg (Fr.)
C: DaRon Holmes II (Jr.) , Isaac Jack (So.)

*has extra year of eligibility

With Daron returning, do we have 2 scholarships available?
Posted via Mobile Device

[Swampy Meadows]

Originally Posted by Mr_Sweets With Daron returning, do we have 2 scholarships available? Posted via Mobile Device

Yup, 2 scholarships.

[rollo]

Originally Posted by Mr_Sweets PG: Enoch Cheeks (Sr.)* Malachi Smith (Jr.), Javon Bennett (So.) SG: Koby Brea (Jr.)*, Kobe Elvis (Jr.)*, Marvel Allen (Fr.) SF: Jaiun Simon (Fr.) PF: Zimi Nwokeji (Jr.)*, Vasilije Erceg (Fr.) C: DaRon Holmes II (Jr.) , Isaac Jack (So.) *has extra year of eligibility With Daron returning, do we have 2 scholarships available? Posted via Mobile Device

Zimi won't start*.

[Bucketnight]

Interesting pendulum swing to go from tallest roster to what appears to be one built more for a 3 guard attack.

[m21eagle45]

Originally Posted by Mr_Sweets PG: Enoch Cheeks (Sr.)* Malachi Smith (Jr.), Javon Bennett (So.) SG: Koby Brea (Jr.)*, Kobe Elvis (Jr.)*, Marvel Allen (Fr.) SF: Jaiun Simon (Fr.) PF: Zimi Nwokeji (Jr.)*, Vasilije Erceg (Fr.) C: DaRon Holmes II (Jr.) , Isaac Jack (So.) *has extra year of eligibility With Daron returning, do we have 2 scholarships available? Posted via Mobile Device

More Likely
PG Bennet or Mali depending on Mali's health
G Elvis, Cheeks, Allen
G/F Brea, Simon, Allen
F Erceg, Zimi
C Holmes, Jack

[Don]

Originally Posted by m21eagle45 More Likely PG Bennet or Mali depending on Mali's health G Elvis, Cheeks, Allen G/F Brea, Simon, Allen F Erceg, Zimi C Holmes, Jack

My GUESS for early starters would be
Inside: Holmes and Jack
Outside: Cheeks, Bennet
Fifth Spot: TBD

I'm skeptical that Brea can compete at the DI level with a metal rod in his leg
I"m also skeptical that Smith will be ready for the early games after major surgery on BOTH feet

For the TBD spot I'm guessing it will be between Simon, Elvis, Erceg
AGAIN....only 'way too early' guesses based on stats I've seen for the new faces

[steverino015]

I have been on so many web pages, will try and backtrack...
I read where Marvel Allen's coach for his first 2 yrs
in high school said he is now 6'4" and
210lbs and built like a linebacker....
psyched about him, think we got ourselves a real good one

[MrFlyerFanatic]

I see Deron playing a lot at the 4 this season. Give him an opportunity to showcase development of a 3pt shot.
As a 4, I'm confident that CAG won't be having him standing in the corner watching guards go 1 on 1. He'll actually be part of the offense.

[TA111]

Originally Posted by MrFlyerFanatic I see Deron playing a lot at the 4 this season. Give him an opportunity to showcase development of a 3pt shot. As a 4, I'm confident that CAG won't be having him standing in the corner watching guards go 1 on 1. He'll actually be part of the offense.

This is what I said earlier. With Issac Jack coming in I see DaRon playing a bit more of the 4. Jack didn’t transfer here to get 6 minutes per game as DaRon’s backup at the 5. I’m sure this has already been discussed with the layers and coaching staff.

[ClaytonFlyerFan]

Originally Posted by Don I'm skeptical that Brea can compete at the DI level with a metal rod in his leg I"m also skeptical that Smith will be ready for the early games after major surgery on BOTH feet

This answers a few questions about Smith and Brea status for the upcoming season!

https://twitter.com/i/status/1664337674683949079

[lhsgolf19]

Jabo with AG today

"Dayton newcomers Marvel Allen, Enoch Cheeks, Javon Bennett and Isaac Jack are all on campus. Jaiun Simon is scheduled to arrive today, and Vasile Erceg sometime later this month."

"Asked about the two open scholarships, Anthony Grant said the coaches are "actively recruiting."

"Anthony Grant said he expects Koby Brea and Malachi Smith to be ready for the start of the season."

[podcast411]

This is how the roster changed (so far)

DaRon Holmes ---> DaRon Holmes
Mali Smith ---> Mali Smith
Kobe Elvis ---> Kobe Elvis
Koby Brea ---> Koby Brea
Zimi Nwokeji ---> Zimi Nwokeji
RJ ---> Marvel Allen
Camara ---> Jaiun Simon
Amzil ---> Vasilige Ercig
Amaefule ---> Issac Jack
MMike ---> Enoch Cheeks
Open Scholarship ---> Javon Bennett
Tyrone Baker ---> Open Scholarship
Kaleb Washington ---> Open Scholarship

Green = We improved
Red = We got worse
Black = Push

Overall - 7 Green to 1 Red. Roster looks greatly improved for 23/24 season.
Summer bonding time in Europe should also help quite a bit.

[The Fly]

As much as I like the Marvel Allen signing, I’m not so sure he represents — as a freshman — an improvement over RJ. I HOPE he’s a big improvement, but I’d classify it a “push” until he’s shown us something on the court. The Amzil to freshman Ercig “push” is awfully generous as well.

[bcross]

Originally Posted by MrFlyerFanatic I see Deron playing a lot at the 4 this season. Give him an opportunity to showcase development of a 3pt shot. As a 4, I'm confident that CAG won't be having him standing in the corner watching guards go 1 on 1. He'll actually be part of the offense.

Obi attempted more 3's (82) at the 5 spot than Camara (80) attempted at the 4 spot. It's not a matter of what "spot" he plays. If he can hit them, fire away.

[Buckleyma]

Originally Posted by The Fly As much as I like the Marvel Allen signing, I’m not so sure he represents — as a freshman — an improvement over RJ. I HOPE he’s a big improvement, but I’d classify it a “push” until he’s shown us something on the court. The Amzil to freshman Ercig “push” is awfully generous as well.

I concur. Let’s wait and see what Marvel Allen has to offer. Why is everyone so down on Blakney, other than he left the team? RJ was definitely a division 1 athlete. Every game that I watched, I thought that he was a good player. I kept waiting for the light bulb to come on and he would turn from being good to being great. I guess, we’ll never know exactly why. He had all the tools and a great background story from his mother’s basketball success at Maryland.
Posted via Mobile Device

[OSU Flyer]

Bring back the double PG lineup
Posted via Mobile Device

[flyer016]

Originally Posted by podcast411 This is how the roster changed (so far) DaRon Holmes ---> DaRon Holmes Mali Smith ---> Mali Smith Kobe Elvis ---> Kobe Elvis Koby Brea ---> Koby Brea Zimi Nwokeji ---> Zimi Nwokeji RJ ---> Marvel Allen Camara ---> Jaiun Simon Amzil ---> Vasilige Ercig Amaefule ---> Issac Jack MMike ---> Enoch Cheeks Open Scholarship ---> Javon Bennett Tyrone Baker ---> Open Scholarship Kaleb Washington ---> Open Scholarship Green = We improved Red = We got worse Black = Push Overall - 7 Green to 1 Red. Roster looks greatly improved for 23/24 season. Summer bonding time in Europe should also help quite a bit.

This is a fun exercise, but it feels wildly optimistic to me. (Also, the gain-loss binary isn't super apt.)

First, Camara to Simon is like minus-4. Simply calling it a downgrade doesn't get at the drop in roster talent.

I think Amzil to Erceg is a big drop as well, but I suppose that's a bit up in the air. If I could bring one guy back, it'd be Amzil. He's exactly what the roster needs.

Same with Blakney to Allen. I think you're undervaluing R.J. by a good margin. It wasn't always pretty (though sometimes it was electrifying) but he was very good defensively and was a smart offensive player.

Overall, I think we lost more than many are willing to admit. Most freshman don't come in an contribute a great deal on a consistent basis. I'm excited about next season, but I'll need to see it with a lot of these new faces.

[T-Bone 84]

Originally Posted by podcast411 This is how the roster changed (so far) DaRon Holmes ---> DaRon Holmes Mali Smith ---> Mali Smith Kobe Elvis ---> Kobe Elvis Koby Brea ---> Koby Brea Zimi Nwokeji ---> Zimi Nwokeji RJ ---> Marvel Allen Camara ---> Jaiun Simon Amzil ---> Vasilige Ercig Amaefule ---> Issac Jack MMike ---> Enoch Cheeks Open Scholarship ---> Javon Bennett Tyrone Baker ---> Open Scholarship Kaleb Washington ---> Open Scholarship Green = We improved Red = We got worse Black = Push Overall - 7 Green to 1 Red. Roster looks greatly improved for 23/24 season. Summer bonding time in Europe should also help quite a bit.

Not sure I’d have Simon replacing Camara in that analysis, position-wise. From the press I’ve read, he seems more like a 3, so he would be what we hoped Washington would become. In that regard, it moves a Red to a Green. That said, it also means we’re comparing Camara to an Open Scholarship, which is a big, old RED mark there.

Also, (a) I have to agree that Blakney-to-Allen is a “push” until Allen lives up to the expectations that are based on the recruit ratings, and (b) Amzil-to-Erceg is a slight shade of red until Erceg can prove otherwise.
Posted via Mobile Device

[hawkoooo]

Originally Posted by Mr_Sweets PG: Enoch Cheeks (Sr.)* Malachi Smith (Jr.), Javon Bennett (So.) SG: Koby Brea (Jr.)*, Kobe Elvis (Jr.)*, Marvel Allen (Fr.) SF: Jaiun Simon (Fr.) PF: Zimi Nwokeji (Jr.)*, Vasilije Erceg (Fr.) C: DaRon Holmes II (Jr.) , Isaac Jack (So.) *has extra year of eligibility With Daron returning, do we have 2 scholarships available? Posted via Mobile Device

Thanks for doing this. Was travelling this morning when the news dropped.

[hawkoooo]

Originally Posted by OSU Flyer Bring back the double PG lineup Posted via Mobile Device

I think we will see a three guard lineup out of the gate with Brea (if healthy) at the "3."

[springborofan]

I would add Mali, Koby, and Kobe are hopefully not in the “push” category either. All three either missed significant games and/or were playing hurt. We won’t know until the season begins but this teams needs all three to play better than they did this past year.

I wouldn’t call Ercig a push with Amzil. Maybe it will be but we don’t know much about him. Ditto with Simon and Allen. It’s hard to get a feel for how a FR’s game will translate (especially on D).

It’s obvious ANY warm body over 6’8” is better than Amafuele so Jacks should be an upgrade. Cheeks and Bennet are better than Washington and Baker.

The team lost a lot in Camara, Amzil, RJ, and Mike. It seemed like RJ and Mike were both on the outs by the end of the year.

Overall, I think the team will be better…a lot depends on the health (and improvement) of the returning players.

[Flyer Dave]

If we have 3 healthy guards, maybe we can have a faster style of game. I hate when Dayton would slowly bring the ball up the court.

[podcast411]

Originally Posted by springborofan I would add Mali, Koby, and Kobe are hopefully not in the “push” category either. All three either missed significant games and/or were playing hurt. We won’t know until the season begins but this teams needs all three to play better than they did this past year. I wouldn’t call Ercig a push with Amzil. Maybe it will be but we don’t know much about him. Ditto with Simon and Allen. It’s hard to get a feel for how a FR’s game will translate (especially on D). It’s obvious ANY warm body over 6’8” is better than Amafuele so Jacks should be an upgrade. Cheeks and Bennet are better than Washington and Baker. The team lost a lot in Camara, Amzil, RJ, and Mike. It seemed like RJ and Mike were both on the outs by the end of the year. Overall, I think the team will be better…a lot depends on the health (and improvement) of the returning players.

I think there were some players that were not team players and that caused issues - MMike and RJ clearly seem to be two of those and their removal is addition by subtraction. MMike had potential - but Zero D and did not flow in our offense. I believe we will find Cheeks is a HUGE step up over MMike. Same with Allen. But only time will tell.

[OSU Flyer]

Originally Posted by hawkoooo I think we will see a three guard lineup out of the gate with Brea (if healthy) at the "3."

I wouldn’t be opposed to running 4 guards and trying to get as many shooters on the floor as possible around Holmes
Posted via Mobile Device

[steverino015]

the best part is we still have 2 scholarships to give,
which CAG said he is actively pursuing...

so, perhaps more to come
stay tuned

[Viperstick]

So with Deuce back, has the Jazz Gardner ship sailed?

[m21eagle45]

Originally Posted by Viperstick So with Deuce back, has the Jazz Gardner ship sailed?

That ship sailed months ago. UD stopped recruiting him because of some baggage issues. Also, Jazz just released his top 3 or top 5 and UD was not on it.

[Jeff]

Originally Posted by Mr_Sweets PG: Enoch Cheeks (Sr.)* Malachi Smith (Jr.), Javon Bennett (So.) SG: Koby Brea (Jr.)*, Kobe Elvis (Jr.)*, Marvel Allen (Fr.) SF: Jaiun Simon (Fr.) PF: Zimi Nwokeji (Jr.)*, Vasilije Erceg (Fr.) C: DaRon Holmes II (Jr.) , Isaac Jack (So.) *has extra year of eligibility With Daron returning, do we have 2 scholarships available? Posted via Mobile Device

If Mali & Elvis are healthy, they start. AG will start them no matter what.

[podcast411]

Originally Posted by m21eagle45 That ship sailed months ago. UD stopped recruiting him because of some baggage issues. Also, Jazz just released his top 3 or top 5 and UD was not on it.

To be fair - NONE of his previous Final 4 - are in his new Final 4. And they are a considerable step down on the new Final 4 than the past Final 4. Something is definitely going on with Jazz. So maybe bullet dodged there.

[steverino015]

Originally Posted by Jeff If Mali & Elvis are healthy, they start. AG will start them no matter what.

we'll see.. guesswork as they have not practiced,
but I disagree... I say Enoch Cheeks starts: somehow,
someway

[hawkoooo]

Originally Posted by Jeff If Mali & Elvis are healthy, they start. AG will start them no matter what.

I don't necessarily disagree, but the list you're quoting was clearly made in order of seniority.

[TXFlyerFan]

Originally Posted by Jeff If Mali & Elvis are healthy, they start. AG will start them no matter what.

If they're not the best players at their positions to start, then I wouldn't call that a plus. If they are the best players, then I hope that Cheeks and Bennett are at least good backups, because we need more talent at those positions than we had last year.

[Buckleyma]

On Daytonflyers.com roster page, only Amzil has been removed. Everybody else is still present even Amaefule who signed with that community college in Florida. I suspect this means nothing. The web master is just slow and behind the announcements. When web pages are not accurate, it always annoys me.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Bucketnight]

Apparently there is a forward coming in for a visit. It's behind a pay wall so I couldn't see who or when. It will probably come out eventually.

There was a HS coach on a local sports radio station the other day that mentioned that he is seeing a big decrease in the recruitment level of kids that was directly attributable to the amount of time now spent working kids in the portal. He said he thought the portal had become a logjam as some of the higher rated kids waited to see who declared/rescinded for the pros, next level kids in the portal waiting to see who else from the portal signed at the schools they were looking at, and it resulting in recruiters not having enough time to devote to HS kids. Basically, it keeps trickling down. Interesting to hear it from another perspective.

Circling back, hopefully we start hearing more info on the recruiting front as some of the logjam starts to clear.

[TXFlyerFan]

There's also still a bit of an issue with the extra covid year of eligibility, which is creating more players available than typically would be. And, not basketball related, but I saw on Jeopardy yesterday that there is/was a player who was on the Oregon football team for 9 years!

https://www.si.com/college/2022/12/1...of-eligibility

[steverino015]

Originally Posted by Bucketnight Apparently there is a forward coming in for a visit. It's behind a pay wall so I couldn't see who or when. It will probably come out eventually. There was a HS coach on a local sports radio station the other day that mentioned that he is seeing a big decrease in the recruitment level of kids that was directly attributable to the amount of time now spent working kids in the portal. He said he thought the portal had become a logjam as some of the higher rated kids waited to see who declared/rescinded for the pros, next level kids in the portal waiting to see who else from the portal signed at the schools they were looking at, and it resulting in recruiters not having enough time to devote to HS kids. Basically, it keeps trickling down. Interesting to hear it from another perspective. Circling back, hopefully we start hearing more info on the recruiting front as some of the logjam starts to clear.

that is what I was hoping to hear... that CAG has players to
pursue based on DaRon coming back, and a plan B if he
chose the draft... we'll find out soon enough.

[Flyer 86]

Of course we are a LONG way off from preseason and the season beginning. It's really a get to know you season for the 5 or 6 new guys, meeting and practicing against the upper class guys. And getting immersed in our dayton hoops environment .

That said as a fan. If our season began tmrw . With all healthy gotta state that I believe this to be our depth Cary.

Enoch and Mali start.
Kobe Brea
Pf a mystery ?
Center. HOLMES

Elvis first sub for Enoch.
Bennett spells Mali and hopefully gets more guard minutes

Simon, Allen, New European guy are our 8 to 10 bench depth guys.

Just not known where Zimi falls yet. Backup at the 4?
Potential starter???