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Old 07-14-2017, 01:08 PM
shapanud shapanud is offline
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NCAA: Tournament Committee to emphasize road wins

The new "Team Sheet" will still have four columns but they will no longer be sorted just by RPI rank of team played.

From the NCAA's article:
"There still will be four separate columns, with the first column consisting of home games against teams ranked 1-30, neutral-site games against teams ranked in the top 50 and road games against opponents ranked in the top 75. The second column will include home games against teams ranked 31-75, neutral-site games versus teams ranked 51-100 and road games against teams ranked 76-135."

http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/...es-quality-win

This is certainly an improvement and has to be good news for all non-Power 5 teams. It incentivizes teams to play non-conference away games against Top 75 teams and it gives more credit for road wins when non-Power 5 go on the road in non-conference games (as they often have to) and win against Top 75 teams.
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Old 07-14-2017, 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by shapanud View Post
The new "Team Sheet" will still have four columns but they will no longer be sorted just by RPI rank of team played.

From the NCAA's article:
"There still will be four separate columns, with the first column consisting of home games against teams ranked 1-30, neutral-site games against teams ranked in the top 50 and road games against opponents ranked in the top 75. The second column will include home games against teams ranked 31-75, neutral-site games versus teams ranked 51-100 and road games against teams ranked 76-135."

http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/...es-quality-win

This is certainly an improvement and has to be good news for all non-Power 5 teams. It incentivizes teams to play non-conference away games against Top 75 teams and it gives more credit for road wins when non-Power 5 go on the road in non-conference games (as they often have to) and win against Top 75 teams.
I disagree that this will make teams go to play on the road for OOC games. The power 5 can still get many opportunities to play top 100 teams on the road just by completing their conference schedule. If anything, this will make it harder for mid majors because they will have less chances to pick up these wins.
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Old 07-14-2017, 03:56 PM
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Does Anyone Know

what AG's lifetime coaching road record is?
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Old 07-14-2017, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by m21eagle45 View Post
I disagree that this will make teams go to play on the road for OOC games. The power 5 can still get many opportunities to play top 100 teams on the road just by completing their conference schedule. If anything, this will make it harder for mid majors because they will have less chances to pick up these wins.
Good teams won't need to go on the road to get road wins--and never did. Average teams (Clemson at 15-15 as a bubble team?!) will. So Clemson, stay at home and hope you win all those games at your own peril.

This opens up spots for teams like UD if we go on the road and win games against teams and win. And if we don't win, haven't we said all along "fair enough, I guess we're not that good"?
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Old 07-15-2017, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by m21eagle45 View Post
I disagree that this will make teams go to play on the road for OOC games. The power 5 can still get many opportunities to play top 100 teams on the road just by completing their conference schedule. If anything, this will make it harder for mid majors because they will have less chances to pick up these wins.
In a way I agree with you. I think it'll make it more lucrative for the bottom of power 5 conferences to play OOC games on the road against team ranked 50 to 75. This could hurt UD as they seem to be in the ranges of 31 to 45 or so. Why would those teams that can't win on the road much in their conference want to come to UD arena to pad their OOC read record? The hope is that the Louisvilles, Notre Dames, etc.. won't be afraid of what losing at UD Arena will do to their status like it would've before.

Even if this is the case, I somehow find it hard to believe that it won't help the bottom power 5 teams get in the dance more than it will help a team like Dayton. The answer will be clear in a couple years. How many teams do the Power conferences get in and how many do the non power conferences get in? My prediction is it either doesn't change or the A10 and similar conferences get less. NCAA decisions are not made these days to help the Daytons of the world at the expense of the Clemsons, Depauls and Georgia Techs.
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Old 07-15-2017, 05:33 PM
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Not sure the change is going to do much. The math does not change at all. All the MCAA is doing is collating the same exact data in a different way. But if you are doing your job, nothing the new breakdowns will tell you is something you didn't already know or should know and have already been considering I'm your team evaluations. I suppose in a literal sense it's progress but I see it as relabeling soda pop as carbonated beverages. A good win isn't what the NCAA math says, it's what the selection member thinks and says. The data is just a tool. Whether it carves fine granite is up to those holding the tool. You can argue the RPI formula is flawed and fix the math. But rearranging deck chairs won't yield much. What's to prevent a committee member from nullifying a quality win with their evaluating as they do now? Not much. They are jurors. Jurors can decide whatever they like for any reason they like despite the evidence.
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Old 07-16-2017, 01:00 PM
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What the committee could do to level the playing field is to have all of the resumes/team profiles as anonymous as possible.

There will always be SOME reason to get a Power school in the dance at the expense of a non-Power school.

Last edited by CoffeeCan; 07-16-2017 at 01:08 PM..
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Old 07-18-2017, 03:30 PM
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Old 07-19-2017, 02:36 AM
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agree that it won't make that much of a difference.

In regards to the Clemson and Georgia Techs of the world I'm not sure it'll make much of a difference. The ACC is going to 20 games next year, the Big 10 is talking about it and I'm sure the discussion will start with the PAC 12.

The cake is already baked for most of those schools in OOC. Take Clemson and Georgia Tech. With 20 ACC games, the ACC/B10 challenge and a yearly in state SEC rivalry game (South Carolina/Georgia) they have 22 games locked in every year. Through in an exempt tourney and it's conceivable those two schools never play on the road outside of the Challenge and their SEC rivals indefinitely.

I suspect with the conference challenges, OOC rivalry games and neutral court games (exempt tourney or yearly events like Champions Classic, Crossroads Classic, CBS Sports Classic, etc.) that with the 20 game schedule the majority of the ACC or Big 10 will never set foot on a non Power 5/Big East outside of a UConn again.

It's crazy how we've moved from a world in the mid 2000s when OOC was almost 50% of a teams schedule (at one point Dayton was playing 13 OOC & 14 A10 games) to conference play being 2/3 of the schedule
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Old 07-19-2017, 09:19 AM
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OK, so I'll play devil's advocate.

If Clemson plays 22 games against real competition, and goes 8-14 against that competition, then schedules the remainder as cupcakes, they end the season with about 16 wins. At roughly .500 they're not a serious contender for the tournament.

Under the old model Clemson schedules almost all cupcakes, wins 20+ games mostly on the back of teams like SW Missouri Tech A&M (South Branch), and gets in the tournament because they won 1 game against Duke at home late in the season.

Now if Clemson plays 22 games against real competition and wins 18 of them, who are we to say they don't belong in?

Seems like this could also work in our favor. No, they're not going on the road to play a tough OOC schedule, but, they're also playing more tough games on neutral courts and home games against tough competition. The pretenders will be separated more clearly.
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Old 07-19-2017, 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Through in an exempt tourney and it's conceivable those two schools never play on the road outside of the Challenge and their SEC rivals indefinitely.
If they did this I think it would hurt them in the long run. A big knock on teams is not going on the road and playing big games in the OOC. This is very important in football too, especially if your conference isn't great.

For example, these H&Hs with Auburn and Mississippi are extremely important for those schools. Included in that agreement are a road trip for each of them to an extremely difficult place to play. You're telling me just because they add one more road game to their schedule in 20-game league format the importance of a series like Dayton would diminish for these schools?
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Old 07-19-2017, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo View Post
If they did this I think it would hurt them in the long run. A big knock on teams is not going on the road and playing big games in the OOC. This is very important in football too, especially if your conference isn't great.

For example, these H&Hs with Auburn and Mississippi are extremely important for those schools. Included in that agreement are a road trip for each of them to an extremely difficult place to play. You're telling me just because they add one more road game to their schedule in 20-game league format the importance of a series like Dayton would diminish for these schools?
I don't think it is as much that Hawkoo as it is the number of eligible road games. When these conferences move to 20 games, most will maintain the same number of buy games--just like UD did when the A10 went to 18 games. The buy games keep the lights on.
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Old 07-19-2017, 05:41 PM
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Remember too that they'll now have 10 conference games to get high quality wins in addition to OOC. With 20 games or 2/3 of your schedule against the ACC, they've got plenty of chances to put together a resume in conference play.
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Old 07-20-2017, 10:50 AM
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I'm curious, would people on this board be interested in the A10 going to 20? If the fears here are genuine, which they seem to be, wouldn't that be a potential solution?

We're at 14 now. You could play 7 teams twice and 6 teams once. Wouldn't be that difficult to sort out. That would give Dayton one more true road game and one more conference home game. Any takers?
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Old 07-20-2017, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by shapanud View Post
The new "Team Sheet" will still have four columns but they will no longer be sorted just by RPI rank of team played.

From the NCAA's article:
"There still will be four separate columns, with the first column consisting of home games against teams ranked 1-30, neutral-site games against teams ranked in the top 50 and road games against opponents ranked in the top 75. The second column will include home games against teams ranked 31-75, neutral-site games versus teams ranked 51-100 and road games against teams ranked 76-135."

http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/...es-quality-win

This is certainly an improvement and has to be good news for all non-Power 5 teams. It incentivizes teams to play non-conference away games against Top 75 teams and it gives more credit for road wins when non-Power 5 go on the road in non-conference games (as they often have to) and win against Top 75 teams.
We'll see what happens come selection Sunday. My guess is that we'll still hear a bunch of BS about the "eye test". Hope I'm wrong.
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Old 07-20-2017, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo View Post
I'm curious, would people on this board be interested in the A10 going to 20? If the fears here are genuine, which they seem to be, wouldn't that be a potential solution?

We're at 14 now. You could play 7 teams twice and 6 teams once. Wouldn't be that difficult to sort out. That would give Dayton one more true road game and one more conference home game. Any takers?
We play 18 A10 games now. Have for a few years. But I would be against moving to 20 A10 games. Too many weak teams in the league to lower our RPI.
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