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Old 07-27-2017, 10:50 AM
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Who Will Start the First Game?

I know it is way too early to tell anything and that we all know the starters will earn it in practice. But let's have a little summer fun and predict the starting lineup absent the senior class with the most wins in Men's Flyer history. No initials please as this is a team filled with newbies. Here is my starting five:
Josh Cunningham
Xeyrius Williams
John Crosby
Darrell Davis
Matej Svoboda
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Old 07-27-2017, 11:16 AM
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Alberto Strasse: Thank you for starting this string. You were reading my mind. A line-up without any newcomers of Miller, Cunningham, Williams, Davis and Crosby will be challenged this year. I believe that, at least two of the newcomers need to punch their ticket into the starting line-up for Dayton to get into the NCAA this year. Two of: Kostas, Pierce, Svoboda or Crutcher. Who will punch their ticket?

Kostas: If he is as good as we hope, he will be impossible to keep on the bench. He is long, athletic and talented. But, he is skinny. Rebounds and loose balls that two years from now, he will snatch; will go to his opponent this year. He will be pushed around and out muscled. He will make freshman mistakes. He will miss the open man on passes. He will get his pocket picked by more mature experienced players.

Pierce: If he could just play big this year, he could start every game like Huelsman did for four years. He is tall, big and aggressive (in high school at least). If he could play solid defense and get solid rebounds and not get into foul trouble, he could start. He doesn't have to score (he did not in high school), just hit the open shot. In other words, just make the open layup.

Svoboda: We know so little about him. If he is the scorer that he was in Europe, then he'll be too good to leave on the bench. He'll need to learn to play defense. He'll be a defensive liability. His opponent will make the big play and score the big shot. If he could be a leader (he is older than any other player), he could start.

Crutcher: Starting a freshman point guard is a tough sell. In video, he has good size and athletic ability. He'll make freshman mistakes. He'll pass the ball to the wrong person. Older, more experienced opponents will pick his pocket. Point guards are not born, they are developed SLOWLY. If we push him to hard, you'll ruin his confidence. He needs to play with courage and no conscience. He can't be thinking about his mistakes, which will be many. If he starts, then either he is much better than expected or we have a BIG problem with our current point guard (like an injury or some such).
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Old 07-27-2017, 11:16 AM
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PG - John Crosby
SG - Darrell Davis
SF - Xeyrius Williams
PF - Kostas A........
C - Josh Cunningham
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Old 07-27-2017, 11:19 AM
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I didn't mention Obadiah Toppin because I think he is a year away and will need to get stronger and more experienced.
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Old 07-27-2017, 11:30 AM
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PG - John Crosby
SG - Darrell Davis
SF - Xeyrius Williams
PF - Josh Cunningham
C - Sam Miller
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Old 07-27-2017, 12:30 PM
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PG Crosby
SG D Davis
F Kostas (If hurt then Svoboda)
F X
F Cunningham

Last edited by m21eagle45; 07-27-2017 at 12:36 PM..
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Old 07-27-2017, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
PG - John Crosby
SG - Darrell Davis
SF - Xeyrius Williams
PF - Josh Cunningham
C - Sam Miller
With all the new and/or inexperienced faces, Sam Miller has to start game 1. I'm not saying he'll start game 20, but day 1, game 1, he has to be given the job.
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Old 07-27-2017, 12:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Buckleyma View Post
I didn't mention Obadiah Toppin because I think he is a year away and will need to get stronger and more experienced.
What about Jordan Davis? No one has mentioned him. I'm not predicting a starting spot, but I think he will definitely contribute this year.
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Old 07-27-2017, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
With all the new and/or inexperienced faces, Sam Miller has to start game 1. I'm not saying he'll start game 20, but day 1, game 1, he has to be given the job.
Agreed. I think the game 1 and game 20 starting lineups look different even if everyone stays healthy.

DD, XW, and JoshC are the only guys I feel super confident are starting game 20. The other 2 will be determined by who is developing and showing some consistency.

Game 1 starters will be returning players.
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Old 07-27-2017, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by m21eagle45 View Post
PG Crosby
SG D Davis
F Kostas (If hurt then Svoboda)
F X
F Cunningham
This most closely resembles what I was thinking. Basically X and Kostas are interchangeable at the 3/4 offensively. A lot depends on what kind of system CAG decides to implement
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Old 07-27-2017, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
With all the new and/or inexperienced faces, Sam Miller has to start game 1. I'm not saying he'll start game 20, but day 1, game 1, he has to be given the job.
Originally Posted by MNFats View Post
Agreed. I think the game 1 and game 20 starting lineups look different even if everyone stays healthy.

DD, XW, and JoshC are the only guys I feel super confident are starting game 20. The other 2 will be determined by who is developing and showing some consistency.

Game 1 starters will be returning players.
I agree that the lineups will change throughout the year, but just because a player is returning doesn't mean they will or should start on Day 1. Plus with a new coach and system all the players have a similar starting point in learning the system and gaining the trust of the coaching staff.
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Old 07-27-2017, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Lifelong Flyer Fan View Post
What about Jordan Davis? No one has mentioned him. I'm not predicting a starting spot, but I think he will definitely contribute this year.
I expect Jordan Davis to be the best player in this class when it's all said and done. Kostas has more potential but I think Davis is going to be a complete player before any of the other freshmen.

I'm excited to see Jordan challenge D Davis for minutes as the year progresses, pushing them both to get better.
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Old 07-27-2017, 01:24 PM
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X used the "H" (havoc) word in the DDN article yesterday. I don't think it matters who starts, I think we will play nearly everyone to play the pace at which it sounds like CAG may be implementing. Not saying it's Paul Westhead fast, but I would guess at least defensively, it will be very dynamic. Given that we will have a fair number of players with length and athleticism, look for a lot of rotation.

Still, game 1 starters:

Crosby, J
Davis, D
Williams, X
Cunningham, J
Miller, S
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Old 07-27-2017, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Lifelong Flyer Fan View Post
What about Jordan Davis? No one has mentioned him. I'm not predicting a starting spot, but I think he will definitely contribute this year.
Lifelong Flyer: good point, somehow, i am subconsciously thinking that Jordan will be Darrell's understudy for one year then the job is probably his in his sophomore year. But, no one is mentioning Trey Landers either? That is probably unfair to Trey since he was hurt during his freshman year?
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Old 07-27-2017, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Buckleyma View Post
Lifelong Flyer: good point, somehow, i am subconsciously thinking that Jordan will be Darrell's understudy for one year then the job is probably his in his sophomore year. But, no one is mentioning Trey Landers either? That is probably unfair to Trey since he was hurt during his freshman year?
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If we are going to play a fast pace and high pressure D - that should suit Landers just fine. He needs to cut down on the fouls, but part of that was him being a Freshman. As athletic and strong as he is he will be a key part of a high pressure defense off the bench...just not as a starter this year.
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Old 07-27-2017, 04:35 PM
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There are a few ways I think it can go...

Lineup A: Worry is it gets us killed on the boards. Cunningham has to gobble up all the rebounds with no help.

PG - John Crosby
SG - Darrell Davis
SF - Matej Svoboda
PF - Xeyrius Williams
C - Josh Cunningham

Lineup B: "Smaller lineup" similar to above, but Landers could mix it up and give Cunningham some help crashing the glass.

PG - John Crosby
SG - Darrell Davis
SF - Trey Landers
PF - Xeyrius Williams
C - Josh Cunningham

Lineup C: Kostas Antetokuompo shows up with two working legs, and says I got this. Lineup offers the length and speed that Grant covets.

PG - John Crosby
SG - Darrell Davis
SF - Kostas Antetokuompo
PF - Xeyrius Williams
C - Josh Cunningham

Lineup D: Neither Kostas, Matej, or Landers does enough to force their way into the lineup. So seniority factors in. Sam gets to start. He adds a bit of girth/size and offers a more traditional lineup.

PG - John Crosby
SG - Darrell Davis
SF - Xeyrius Williams
PF - Josh Cunningham
C - Sam Miller

Best guess? I'll go with D to start the year, until a freshman or two (or a sophomore in Landers) forces their way into the starting lineup.
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Old 07-27-2017, 06:05 PM
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I'm not going to do the whole starting lineup because I really can't figure out the PG. I do think Williams, Cunningham and Baby D are locks. The PG is a toss up. But, if KA is not ready, I'm going to go out on a limb here and predict that AG will fall in love with Trey Landers effort and athleticism and start him. Remember, if this comes to fruition, it came from me first. If it doesn't come to fruition, go ahead and don't remember it.
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Old 07-27-2017, 08:17 PM
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This sort of fits in this thread. Veterans speak on the newcomers.
http://www.mydaytondailynews.com/spo...socYXaMkyPMZJ/
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Old 07-27-2017, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
PG - John Crosby
SG - Darrell Davis
SF - Xeyrius Williams
PF - Josh Cunningham
C - Sam Miller
This.

If Kostas is healthy I'd probably put him at PF and move Josh to C.
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Old 07-27-2017, 09:27 PM
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Nov. 10:

1) Crosby
2) Davis, D.
3) X
4) Landers
5) Cunningham
6) Svoboda
7) Davis, J.
8) Crutcher

Jan. 1:

1) Crutcher
2) Davis, D.**
3) X
4) Kostas*
5) Cunningham
6) Svoboda
7) Landers
8) Davis, J.

Boom

* assuming he is recovering from injury Nov. 10.
** assuming his perimeter defense is as good as it was last year; otherwise move 8 to 2.

Last edited by Kid Flyer; 07-27-2017 at 09:52 PM..
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Old 07-28-2017, 04:47 AM
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Look for cunningham to play aggressive this year with added depth. Last year there were times he could not be an enforcer because there was no one to fill in for him.
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Old 07-28-2017, 08:08 AM
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C - Cunningham
PF- Williams
SF- Svoboda
SG - D Davis
PG - Crosby
Antetokounmpo first off bench as both PF and SF
Williams occasionally plays C but Miller and Pierce split the rest of minutes.
Toppin plays a few minutes at both PF and SF
Landers plays some at both SF and SG
J Davis gets most of bench minutes at SG
Crutcher gets 16min off bench at PG
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Old 07-28-2017, 09:38 AM
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Old 07-28-2017, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by MNFats View Post
If we are going to play a fast pace and high pressure D...
The beginning of the dismantling of Archie's offense...fast pace and high pressure defense, sounds like BG 2.0.

Last edited by ud2; 07-28-2017 at 10:40 AM..
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Old 07-28-2017, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Lifelong Flyer Fan View Post
What about Jordan Davis? No one has mentioned him. I'm not predicting a starting spot, but I think he will definitely contribute this year.
I agree Jordan will be an impact player from the get go. So is he now Baby D?
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Old 07-28-2017, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
The beginning of the dismantling of Archie's offense...fast pace and high pressure defense, sounds like BG 2.0.
IMO, you are really looking at things through a negative light to come up with the above post when they haven't even played a pre-season game yet. Seems like quite a leap.

Ha. What happened to "I am not planning on making a lot of criticism of AG during his first 3 years"?
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Old 07-28-2017, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
The beginning of the dismantling of Archie's offense...fast pace and high pressure defense, sounds like BG 2.0.
If I remember correctly, over our runs in the NCAA tournament, Archie's Def efficiency was consistently ranked way higher than Archie's offense efficiency. Last 3 years for sure. Just saying...
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Old 07-28-2017, 02:46 PM
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Old 07-28-2017, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
The beginning of the dismantling of Archie's offense...fast pace and high pressure defense, sounds like BG 2.0.
Just can't let it rest can you ud2.
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Old 08-01-2017, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by superfan99 View Post
IMO, you are really looking at things through a negative light to come up with the above post when they haven't even played a pre-season game yet. Seems like quite a leap.

Ha. What happened to "I am not planning on making a lot of criticism of AG during his first 3 years"?
No, I disagree. IMO, AG's teams at Alabama looked somewhat like BG's teams at UD. My comment was not just some random comment that I threw out there.

A lot of emphasis being placed by AG on fast pace/running in transition and playing high pressure defense sounds a lot like BG's coaching philosophy.

And I said "I am not planning on making a lot of criticism..." I did not say that I would stop my criticism altogether.




Look, I have a lot of anxiety about this hire. If this does not work out, and it takes 8 years for things to get resolved, like it did with BG, then we might be looking at 2025 before the program starts heading back in the right direction.

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Old 08-01-2017, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
No, I disagree. IMO, AG's teams at Alabama looked somewhat like BG's teams at UD. My comment was not just some random comment that I threw out there.

A lot of emphasis being placed by AG on fast pace/running in transition and playing high pressure defense sounds a lot like BG's coaching philosophy.

And I said "I am not planning on making a lot of criticism..." I did not say that I would stop my criticism altogether.




Look, I have a lot of anxiety about this hire. If this does not work out, and it takes 8 years for things to get resolved, like it did with BG, then we might be looking at 2025 before the program starts heading back in the right direction.
O lordy, I don't know which would be worse, it doesn't work out and the team must rebuild, or it doesn't work out and we have to listen to you go on, and on and on about it. So far you have taken shots at AG whenever you can, I don't look for that to change. He could win 20 in a row, but drop the next one and guess who will be on him.
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  #32  
Old 08-16-2017, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
playing high pressure defense sounds a lot like BG's coaching philosophy.
That would be the virtual opposite of BG.
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  #33  
Old 08-16-2017, 03:04 PM
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I guess we should revive this one eh?

With Miller and Mikesell gone and Kostas a question mark, here is my guess:

Crosby
D. Davis
Svoboda
Williams
Cunningham
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  #34  
Old 08-16-2017, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo View Post
I guess we should revive this one eh?

With Miller and Mikesell gone and Kostas a question mark, here is my guess:

Crosby
D. Davis
Svoboda
Williams
Cunningham
If Kostas isn't ready to log big minutes, medically or otherwise, then I think it probably comes down to either playing one PG, three shooters and one post/rebounder (as in the above lineup) or one PG, two shooters and two post/rebounders (as below) with Landers bodying up.

PG - John Crosby
SG - Darrell Davis
SF - Trey Landers
PF - Xeyrius Williams
C - Josh Cunningham
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Old 08-16-2017, 06:47 PM
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To be fair BG promised and claimed he ran up an uptempo, fast paced system
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Old 08-16-2017, 08:34 PM
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In offense. He never said he ran a high pressure defense. In fact he disavowed high pressure defense as something that can't win championships.
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Old 08-16-2017, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by DallasFlyer View Post
If Kostas isn't ready to log big minutes, medically or otherwise, then I think it probably comes down to either playing one PG, three shooters and one post/rebounder (as in the above lineup) or one PG, two shooters and two post/rebounders (as below) with Landers bodying up.

PG - John Crosby
SG - Darrell Davis
SF - Trey Landers
PF - Xeyrius Williams
C - Josh Cunningham
I vacillated between Svo and Trey quite a bit but ultimately I think Svo fits a lineup with 2 guards already in it a little better than Trey. Wouldn't be remotely surprised if your version won out though. Regardless both players should see quite a bit of PT.
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