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  #1  
Old 12-17-2018, 02:49 PM
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Shooting Slumps

Maybe Figgie or someone else knows on historical shooting slumps and where Jordan Davis falls in this. Since the North Florida game he's 9 for 41 from 3

I know Paul William's senior year in A10 play he had an ice cold stretch where he couldn't hit anything. Luke Fabrizius I think had a pretty bad slump at one point is his career
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Old 12-17-2018, 03:15 PM
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I believe Marc Jones had a long streak to start a season one year as well but then actually had some torrid streak right after IIRC.
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Old 12-17-2018, 11:02 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Maybe Figgie or someone else knows on historical shooting slumps and where Jordan Davis falls in this. Since the North Florida game he's 9 for 41 from 3

I know Paul William's senior year in A10 play he had an ice cold stretch where he couldn't hit anything. Luke Fabrizius I think had a pretty bad slump at one point is his career
Well, it all depends on the criteria for said slump.

(All stats since 2000-01 season, and in-one-season only stretches...)

If we assume any nine consecutive games in a season with at least 41 three point attempts, he has the worst shooting percentage out of 493 situations. (players can have multiple per year...) Josh Parkers was 23.8% (10/42) in 2011-12 season.

If we drop the attempts to 30 over 9 games, Chris Johnson went 7/32 or 21.9%, to push Jordan to #2. (819 situations).

If we look at first 10 games of the year, 30 three point attempts minimum, Jordan is #2 with 25.6% (11/43). First is Rob Lowery in the 2008-09 season when he started 9/37 or 24.3% (finished the year at 33.7%). 38 times a player had 30 or more three pointers in the first 10 games.

Oh, and Paul Williams junior and senior seasons, he was 55.6% and 48.8% in his first 10 games of each year, finishing at 41.8% and 35.0%, respectively.

Stats provided by Figstats
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Old 12-18-2018, 12:57 PM
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This is why we need the kid from Sinclair
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Old 12-18-2018, 01:02 PM
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This is why we need the shooter from Sinclair!!!
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Old 12-18-2018, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by ohioflyer View Post
This is why we need the shooter from Sinclair!!!
I agree...we need a starting two-guard for next year and maybe a three as well.
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Old 12-18-2018, 01:05 PM
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Figgie did Paul Williams not have a slump his senior or at least one point in his career?
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Old 12-18-2018, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Figgie did Paul Williams not have a slump his senior or at least one point in his career?
Again, the definition of "slump" is necessary.

For this specific thread, someone mentioned a 9 game sample for Jordan Davis, so I was comparing to that. Using that 9-game 30 min 3pt attempt metric, Paul Williams had a 7/30 23.3% slump in 09-10 and a 9/37 24.3% slump in 2011-12. His full year stats were 35.1% and 35.0%, respectively.

I misread the original comment when I added Paul's year start stats in his last 2 years.
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Old 12-18-2018, 02:03 PM
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And are you sure Mark Jones didn't go through an atrocious spell?
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Old 12-18-2018, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Figgie did Paul Williams not have a slump his senior or at least one point in his career?
Paul Williams had a 4 year slump.
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  #11  
Old 12-18-2018, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Paul Williams had a 4 year slump.
Bingo. I think many of us on here thought he was going to be the second coming of Roosevelt Chapman, based on all the hype we read on here before he even dressed for the first game. Now I know better.
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Old 12-18-2018, 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Paul Williams had a 4 year slump.
I'm okay with a 36.4% career slump at the 3 pt line.
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Old 12-18-2018, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
And are you sure Mark Jones didn't go through an atrocious spell?
Here is the list of 10 worst 9 game stretch with at least 30 attempts, only 1 time listed per player, since the 00-01 season:

(game num is the start game #)
Code:

 get_player_info  | year | game_num | gms | tpm | tpa | tppct 
------------------+------+----------+-----+-----+-----+-------
 Chris Johnson    | 2008 |        4 |   9 |   7 |  32 | 0.219
 Jordan Davis     | 2018 |        2 |   9 |   9 |  41 | 0.220
 Jimmy Binnie     | 2007 |       16 |   9 |   8 |  36 | 0.222
 Jalen Crutcher   | 2017 |        8 |   9 |   7 |  31 | 0.226
 Mark Jones       | 2003 |        3 |   9 |   8 |  35 | 0.229
 Paul Williams    | 2009 |        8 |   9 |   7 |  30 | 0.233
 Rob Lowery       | 2008 |        1 |   9 |   8 |  34 | 0.235
 Josh Parker      | 2011 |        6 |   9 |  10 |  42 | 0.238
 Darrell Davis    | 2015 |        1 |   9 |   9 |  35 | 0.257
 Kevin Dillard    | 2011 |       10 |   9 |   8 |  31 | 0.258


Stats provided by Figstats
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  #14  
Old 12-18-2018, 02:48 PM
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Baby D's sophomore year was pretty bad as a whole shooting
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Old 12-18-2018, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Paul Williams had a 4 year slump.
Originally Posted by Figgie123 View Post
I'm okay with a 36.4% career slump at the 3 pt line.
Even 8 years after Paul graduated, the mere mention of his name still makes my sphincter tighten as it did with every shot he took.

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Old 12-18-2018, 03:22 PM
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Williams was one of the better shooters of the BG era
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Old 12-18-2018, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Even 8 years after Paul graduated, the mere mention of his name still makes my sphincter tighten as it did with every shot he took.[/URL]
Media Guide career 3 point accuracy requirements are at least 50 three pointers made in the players career. Currently, 46 players fall into that category, and Paul Williams ranks 20th at 36.4%.

If your sphincter tightens from those stats, you better start doing some kegel's, because Jordan Davis is #22 at 36.2%, and Jalen Crutcher is #23 at 36.1%. Oh, you must not have liked Scoochie's career, he's at #19 with 36.8%.

There are those that have grimaced at Devin Oliver or Kyle Davis, and they improved over their careers, but they are #42 and #45 respectively on the list of 46.

#46's percentage was 27.2%. Who was it?

Last edited by Figgie123; 12-18-2018 at 03:27 PM..
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Old 12-18-2018, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Figgie123 View Post

#46's percentage was 27.2%. Who was it?
Marcus Johnson?
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Old 12-18-2018, 03:33 PM
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Chris Wright
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Old 12-19-2018, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Figgie123 View Post
I'm okay with a 36.4% career slump at the 3 pt line.
As you and I know, percentages don't tell the whole story. If Paul could make 9/25 consistently I'd take the 36%, but he was more likely to go 1/6, 2/7, 2/6, 4/6 = 9/25.

But I'll defer to Sir Figgie's stats to prove me wrong!
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Old 12-19-2018, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Figgie123 View Post
#46's percentage was 27.2%. Who was it?
Originally Posted by CE80 View Post
Marcus Johnson?
Marcus Johnson is #34 on the list with a 32.9% career average.

Originally Posted by cj View Post
Chris Wright
Chris Wright didn't make the cut, since he didn't make 50 3-pt field goals in his UD career. He only made 25 3-pt field goals, with a 22.9% average.

#46 on the list was Darnell Hahn.
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Old 12-19-2018, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
As you and I know, percentages don't tell the whole story. If Paul could make 9/25 consistently I'd take the 36%, but he was more likely to go 1/6, 2/7, 2/6, 4/6 = 9/25.

But I'll defer to Sir Figgie's stats to prove me wrong!
I agree with your comment, but really, that is in play for all players. The question would be maybe around standard deviation. Did Paul Williams have a knack for going from one extreme to another from game to game. Hitting nothing 1 game, than missing almost nothing in another? Of course, how do you gauge that when maybe you only take 1 3-ptr in certain games. That 0.000 or 1.000 can skew standard deviations.
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Old 12-19-2018, 10:45 AM
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FWIW: Figgie has a way of making me think, so I did a little research.

FWIW2: In Paul's best 3-point shooting season (2010-11, 41%) he only had 4 games (out of 37) where he made more 3s than he missed and none of those 4 came in the A10 season (he did go 4/6 vs_avier in the A10 Tourny, though!). IMRO, a good shooter should make more than they miss more often than that...and should do it more often in big games.

FWIW3: I'm royally well aware that 33% shooting on 3s = 50% on 2s.

FWIW4: The mention of Paul's name still makes my backside pucker.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb...1/gamelog/2011
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Old 12-19-2018, 01:49 PM
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Paul Williams was Stephen Curry shooting the ball compared to some of the folks in the BG era
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Old 12-19-2018, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Williams was one of the better shooters of the BG era
Shooting wasn’t a high priority in BG’s recruiting.
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Old 12-19-2018, 04:29 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
FWIW2: In Paul's best 3-point shooting season (2010-11, 41%) he only had 4 games (out of 37) where he made more 3s than he missed and none of those 4 came in the A10 season (he did go 4/6 vs_avier in the A10 Tourny, though!). IMRO, a good shooter should make more than they miss more often than that...and should do it more often in big games.

SS did it 6 times in his senior season and shot 40% for the year. That tells me PW was more consistent, albeit less prolific since SS made 47 of them.
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Old 12-19-2018, 04:34 PM
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Didn't Jimmie Binnie start his sophomore season going 0 for 17 from the 3?
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Old 12-19-2018, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by tirebiter View Post
Didn't Jimmie Binnie start his sophomore season going 0 for 17 from the 3?
That sounds right
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Old 12-19-2018, 05:29 PM
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Would Paul Williams not be a net positive if he was on the current roster?
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Old 12-19-2018, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by tirebiter View Post
Didn't Jimmie Binnie start his sophomore season going 0 for 17 from the 3?
Junior Year, 0-10 in 3 games.
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  #31  
Old 12-20-2018, 09:54 AM
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Jordan Davis is completely lost right now. His shooting slump IMRO is affecting every other aspect of his offense (weak passes...aggressiveness, etc) and defense. Trey, Toppin, Crutcher etc... are visibly having fun on the court. The first minute of the 2nd half didn't go well and Grant had to sub him out to save the team and Jordan's confidence (or what remains of it).

Jordan isn't enjoying himself or the game and that needs to change quickly because Cohill isn't ready for major minutes, either.
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Old 12-20-2018, 10:29 AM
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I was in the camp that Davis will shoot his way out of his slump at first. But now I have real concern about his shooting which seems to also be affecting his overall offensive game. I'll agree that he plays hard and is certainly an asset on defense but if that's all we will get from him then his role may have to change. Although with the lack of depth that won't be easy either. But maybe moving Mikesell to the 2 (although he's also having his own scoring issues of late) and inserting Obi into the starting lineup is the way to go. Then bring Jordan in as more of a defensive stopper.
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Old 12-20-2018, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Jordan Davis is completely lost right now. His shooting slump IMRO is affecting every other aspect of his offense (weak passes...aggressiveness, etc) and defense. Trey, Toppin, Crutcher etc... are visibly having fun on the court. The first minute of the 2nd half didn't go well and Grant had to sub him out to save the team and Jordan's confidence (or what remains of it).

Jordan isn't enjoying himself or the game and that needs to change quickly because Cohill isn't ready for major minutes, either.
Disagree that it's affecting his defense. I think he realizes that, despite the shooting slump, he needs to maintain his defense in order to see the court.
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  #34  
Old 12-20-2018, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by TommyGola View Post
I agree...we need a starting two-guard for next year and maybe a three as well.
We have a starting two guard. Unless you are expecting several defections after this season, I do not understand your comment.
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Old 12-20-2018, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo View Post
We have a starting two guard. Unless you are expecting several defections after this season, I do not understand your comment.
Maybe he is saying we need a more reliable and effective #2? We have a starting #2, sure. We start five players. However, JD has been quite ineffective thus far.
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Old 12-20-2018, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by pmcmullen View Post
Maybe he is saying we need a more reliable and effective #2? We have a starting #2, sure. We start five players. However, JD has been quite ineffective thus far.
So he should be canned for some unknown freshman or a flavor of the week JUCO? He's started since day one. Pretty sure AG isn't going to lose faith over a shooting slump. Also, what about Cohill, Trey, Matos, Ibi? Wouldn't they be considered if such a hole needed to be filled?
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Old 01-18-2019, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Maybe Figgie or someone else knows on historical shooting slumps and where Jordan Davis falls in this. Since the North Florida game he's 9 for 41 from 3

I know Paul William's senior year in A10 play he had an ice cold stretch where he couldn't hit anything. Luke Fabrizius I think had a pretty bad slump at one point is his career
What a difference a month makes. Since the Presbyterian game, Jordan is shooting 3's just south of 50% for those 6 games. And that includes getting stuck with a half court heave several times due to our team not watching the shot clock. Not his first choice. Might be time to start setting some picks/plays for him?
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  #38  
Old 01-18-2019, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
What a difference a month makes. Since the Presbyterian game, Jordan is shooting 3's just south of 50% for those 6 games. And that includes getting stuck with a half court heave several times due to our team not watching the shot clock. Not his first choice. Might be time to start setting some picks/plays for him?
He has made a dramatic comeback in his three-ball. Also, that scoop/layup in the second half of the VCU game was incredible. It must have just been a confidence issue.
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Old 01-18-2019, 02:06 PM
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For the last three games Jordan is at 65% on three's.
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