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  #101  
Old 05-02-2019, 05:24 PM
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ud2, same song, different day
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  #102  
Old 05-02-2019, 06:27 PM
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Interesting...scheduling sheets with open dates for a bunch of schools.

https://basketballtravelers.com/docu...cheduling_.pdf
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  #103  
Old 05-02-2019, 06:36 PM
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UD2, certainly a few teams I would think would be of interest to UD.
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  #104  
Old 05-02-2019, 07:34 PM
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  #105  
Old 05-02-2019, 08:24 PM
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This is like Sears in 2006 saying, "Change is coming? Our business model has worked for the last 50 years."
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  #106  
Old 05-02-2019, 09:40 PM
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Never been a question of Dayton offering to play good teams -- home, neutral, or away. The impasse is getting those opponents to want to play Dayton. Most dont want anywhere near the game. They dont want Dayton, they dont need Dayton.

NC State didnt miss the NCAA Tournament because their Non-Con SOS was worst in the country. They missed the tourney because they didnt win enough ACC games. They had more than enough chances to not just punch their ticket but make it with room to spare in spite of the non-con. That's the latitude Power-6 schools have with scheduling -- the 1/3 of the season carved out for the non-conference is meaningless anymore. All the games you could ever want to punch your Dance Card are sitting there for you after Christmas.

These P6 teams want pushover buy games, not competitive buy games. Its not in their best interest to do otherwise. The non-con for them is like spring training for the Reds. The Schedule Fairy cannot make a team that says "no f'ing way" to say yes against their will.

I cant believe Im about to say this, but it might be time to rethink playing Wright State. You know its dire straits when Im even considering the notion. It would not be a Quad 1 game, but playing at WSU could potentially be a Quad-2 win at the NutHouse. And where else could be secure a reasonable chance at a Quad-2 win with 5,000 butts in the seats rooting for the Flyers. The Raiders are winning 18-20 games a year. Even winning at home would be better than playing most other "buys". Since the game would be a series it wouldnt cost us buy money either.

When WSU was 12-20, the game made no sense. It was a difference time too when Power conferences still playing 16-game league seasons. There are too few games left to schedule with these teams now and too many taams wanting to play them. WSU needs to improve their NET, but some of their metrics are pretty solid.

We still shouldnt play Miami until they get their act together, but Wright State might make "metric sense". I'll float this topic the next time I see Neil. I couldnt care less about what it does for WSU. All I care about is if the game (both home/away) can help Dayton.
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  #107  
Old 05-02-2019, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by cj View Post
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That’s some deep stuff...you come up with that yourself?
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  #108  
Old 05-02-2019, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
With all due respect, you just sound like a whiny cry-baby with this type of post. You don't hear the p5/Big East schools whining about having to play several tough games in a row sometimes with little rest. That is the unfortunate reality of life in the higher-rated leagues in college basketball.

We need to man up/suck it up and schedule up and earn the better seed/git 'r done no excuses.

The better seeds are not just handed out, they are earned, and we will never consistently get a better seed and have a shot at the national title at the rate we are going.

If we want to truly be taken seriously as a national title contender, then we have GOT to come up with a better OOC schedule.

Stop being satisfied with just eking by and getting an 11 seed and start demanding more from UD.

We are consistently in the top 25 in college basketball revenue year after year, we should be doing a lot better than we are.
And you sound like a fanatic who won't listen to reason, won't address the fact that your points have been disproven, and won't change the subject.

When we get automatically in the tournament unless we prove otherwise like the power 5, call me. Until then, we're out unless we prove otherwise.
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  #109  
Old 05-03-2019, 01:28 AM
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Originally Posted by IndianaFlyer View Post
UD2, certainly a few teams I would think would be of interest to UD.
what teams do you think would be worthwhile to add to the schedule and would be willing to play at UD ?
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  #110  
Old 05-03-2019, 10:10 AM
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The Scheduling Sheets contain only a few teams that could be a Quad 1 or a glamour name. Are those teams seeking buy games? Almost everyone listed are the same teams we tend to get on our schedule already.
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  #111  
Old 05-03-2019, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
Interesting...scheduling sheets with open dates for a bunch of schools.

https://basketballtravelers.com/docu...cheduling_.pdf

Reading from the top, November 5th - 10th:

U. of Arkansas Pine Bluff
Bradley
LMU
Denver
Western Kentucky
UIC
High Point
Colgate
Alcorn State
Jacksonville State
McNeese State
South Dakota
Boise State
Dartmouth
VMI
Louisiana Tech
CSU Northridge
Furman
*UConn*
Ashland
North Florida

It's a who's-who of the basketball world.

Just call UConn and then kick off from work early for the weekend I guess, it's such an easy job I'm surprised they even pay full time wages.
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  #112  
Old 05-03-2019, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by NCkevi View Post
what teams do you think would be worthwhile to add to the schedule and would be willing to play at UD ?
Lol, please reread my post that you quoted. I didn't even hint that any of the teams I find of interest would have interest in UD, home or away.
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  #113  
Old 05-03-2019, 01:59 PM
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As long as we are still in the Atlantic 10 conference, let's just all agree that no higher-tier P5 school is going to travel and play us at home. This is why playing the early season tournaments like Atlantis or Maui are critical to getting us a shot at a good team outside of the conference.
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  #114  
Old 05-03-2019, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by IndianaFlyer View Post
Lol, please reread my post that you quoted. I didn't even hint that any of the teams I find of interest would have interest in UD, home or away.
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So your post in a thread on next year's schedule has nothing to do with a realistic look at next years schedule? Next you'll be telling us how UD should offer to visit Duke if they play 2 at UD arena
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  #115  
Old 05-03-2019, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
Reading from the top, November 5th - 10th:

...
Jacksonville State
...

It's a who's-who of the basketball world.
We do NOT want to play a Ray Harper team!!
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  #116  
Old 05-06-2019, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by NCkevi View Post
So your post in a thread on next year's schedule has nothing to do with a realistic look at next years schedule? Next you'll be telling us how UD should offer to visit Duke if they play 2 at UD arena

I could be wrong but I think he's saying UD would love to schedule them (because we only schedule garbage in his mind) but HE doesn't want to schedule those team.
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  #117  
Old 05-06-2019, 11:45 AM
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Davidson being a H/H in A10 is one of the easiest ways to get a likely quad win on the schedule next year (assuming the H/H adds a road game at Davidson)

Will the A10 do the right thing?
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  #118  
Old 05-21-2019, 11:16 AM
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https://florida.rivals.com/news/gato...rence-schedule

For ud2, Florida's OOC this season. 2 road games, 5 neutral site
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  #119  
Old 05-22-2019, 01:09 PM
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Xavier Schedule: 3 Neutral, 2 road
https://admin.goxavier.com/news/2019...le-is-out.aspx

Purdue: 3 Neutral, 1 Road with 2 locations TBD in B1G/ACC & Gavitt Games. This is on top of a 20 game B1G schedule
https://purduesports.com/news/2019/5...-schedule.aspx
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  #120  
Old 05-22-2019, 02:37 PM
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Is it true? Someone on this blog probably has the statistics, but my general feeling is: the higher a school is in the Basketball pecking order then the sooner the school will be able to publish their out-of-conference schedule. So Xavier posts now and Dayton will not post until September or October. Dayton will schedule whatever teams are left over
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  #121  
Old 05-22-2019, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Buckleyma View Post
Is it true? Someone on this blog probably has the statistics, but my general feeling is: the higher a school is in the Basketball pecking order then the sooner the school will be able to publish their out-of-conference schedule. So Xavier posts now and Dayton will not post until September or October. Dayton will schedule whatever teams are left over
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You need to read Chris' posts concerning scheduling on Pride+.
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  #122  
Old 05-22-2019, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Buckleyma View Post
Is it true? Someone on this blog probably has the statistics, but my general feeling is: the higher a school is in the Basketball pecking order then the sooner the school will be able to publish their out-of-conference schedule. So Xavier posts now and Dayton will not post until September or October. Dayton will schedule whatever teams are left over
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The power conference schools have so much of their schedule already baked in with things like conference challenges. Add in a 20 game schedule and it's easier for them to put together
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  #123  
Old 05-22-2019, 07:41 PM
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I'm sure Neil could fill the schedule tomorrow. He doesn't because he's holding out for the best games he can get. And yes, it is easier for power conference teams to fill their schedule. They aren't hunting for quality games, those are already in their conference schedule.
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  #124  
Old 05-22-2019, 08:36 PM
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Like's take a random power conference team like Wisconsin

20 B1G games, Play in the B1G/ACC, Marquette, exempt tourney, possibly the Gavitt Games every year. 26-27 out of 31 games that are a done deal every year without thinking

At that point their AD is just sprinkling in a couple buy games and the schedule is done
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  #125  
Old 05-22-2019, 10:46 PM
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The more difficulty you have in scheduling, the longer you leave as many dates open to attract, sign, and seal the best opponents you are striving to play.

Its a game of chicken. Wait long enough to give yourself as much flexibility and options as possible, but at some point if you wait too long you start missing out on scheduling those Akron and Ga Southern buy games b/c they have completed most of their schedule and have few open dates left -- and those games are just as important b/c they plump your non-con into consistent respectability.

If you realllly wait too long, you wont even be able to buy #275 RPI teams. All that will be left are the Coppin States at #350.

I can guarantee you this will be the most challenging year to schedule in UD basketball history. Other than Colorado and Maui, we may not have another Power conference foe.

Nevada recently inked a home/home with Santa Clara. On the surface the response is "Santa Clara! Come on!" But Nevada has been completely decimated by graduation and transfers since March. It will be a completely new Wolfpack team and not the 29-5 Top-10 team.
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  #126  
Old 05-22-2019, 11:58 PM
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With the NET and the committees emphasis on racking up quad1/quality wins I’d take a Coppin St or Youngstown St if it meant a high quality series
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  #127  
Old 05-23-2019, 07:39 AM
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With NET, there doesn't seem to be a difference between a 275 or a 350 RPI team.
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  #128  
Old 05-23-2019, 09:53 AM
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What year does the A10/Mountain West challenge start?
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Old 05-23-2019, 04:24 PM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
What year does the A10/Mountain West challenge start?
20-21 season
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  #130  
Old 05-23-2019, 04:47 PM
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Originally Posted by NCkevi View Post
what teams do you think would be worthwhile to add to the schedule and would be willing to play at UD ?
Murray State is looking for a H/H on two different dates on that sheet.

Sure I'd love to get a Miss. State or Auburn again but assuming the well is dry on power conferences the Racers could be a good series.

They'll drop some after losing Morant but that's been consistently good program across multiple coaches. They've got 2 of their top 4 scorers back

Bradley is looking for a road game. They could be a MVC contender next year

Oregon State has an open date

Western Kentucky has open dates
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  #131  
Old 05-23-2019, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by longtimefan View Post
You need to read Chris' posts concerning scheduling on Pride+.
Originally Posted by Chris R View Post
The more difficulty you have in scheduling, the longer you leave as many dates open to attract, sign, and seal the best opponents you are striving to play.

Its a game of chicken. Wait long enough to give yourself as much flexibility and options as possible, but at some point if you wait too long you start missing out on scheduling those Akron and Ga Southern buy games b/c they have completed most of their schedule and have few open dates left -- and those games are just as important b/c they plump your non-con into consistent respectability.

If you realllly wait too long, you wont even be able to buy #275 RPI teams. All that will be left are the Coppin States at #350.

I can guarantee you this will be the most challenging year to schedule in UD basketball history. Other than Colorado and Maui, we may not have another Power conference foe.

Nevada recently inked a home/home with Santa Clara. On the surface the response is "Santa Clara! Come on!" But Nevada has been completely decimated by graduation and transfers since March. It will be a completely new Wolfpack team and not the 29-5 Top-10 team.

I'm trying to drum up some business for Pride+ and you go and give away some of your expertise for free.
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  #132  
Old 05-24-2019, 09:07 AM
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'19-'20 scheduling - Assuming that Obi returns, and given the predictions, is this a year (and maybe next year as well) that we stretch ourselves and play the best teams we can on the road without a home/home? Is that a way to "break through" so to speak? We don't have the scheduling luxury that power 5 schools have, so we need to take the fight on the road. We travel well so that helps, and it takes the brand to a larger audience. We rarely embarrass ourselves against this level of talent.

Scheduling in general - Outside of above, our only way to consistently play "power 5" level teams are the in season travel tournaments. Thank God we are a favorite to be included in those. We need to dominate those tournaments.

That all said, these are "plan B" efforts. Just win the *^%&! A10 TOURNAMENT!
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Old 05-24-2019, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by N2663R View Post
'19-'20 scheduling - Assuming that Obi returns, and given the predictions, is this a year (and maybe next year as well) that we stretch ourselves and play the best teams we can on the road without a home/home? Is that a way to "break through" so to speak? We don't have the scheduling luxury that power 5 schools have, so we need to take the fight on the road. We travel well so that helps, and it takes the brand to a larger audience. We rarely embarrass ourselves against this level of talent.

On the "regular board" Chris has said the following: "Never been a question of Dayton offering to play good teams - home, neutral or away. The impasse is getting those opponents to want to play Dayton...These P6 teams want pushover buy games, not competitive buy games." He has gone into more detail on Pride+.
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Old 05-24-2019, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
The Scheduling Sheets contain only a few teams that could be a Quad 1 or a glamour name. Are those teams seeking buy games? Almost everyone listed are the same teams we tend to get on our schedule already.
Disagree...I question if we could buy UConn, WKU, Boise, maybe Bradley, or maybe North Dakota.

I would rather play BYU, MTSU, NMSU, Chattanooga, the 4 North Dakota and South Dakota schools, Wofford, UNLV, Nevada, Utah State, SDSU, Northen Iowa, Illinois State, Iona, Harvard, Buffalo, Northeastern, Old Dominion, Temple, Charleston, Vermont, Tulsa, SMC, New Mexico, WKU, Boise, Belmont, Oregon State, Murray State, etc. home and home than 2 buy games. I realize that this is not easy, and we may not be able to get more p5's than we already have. So, just take the next best available. We are not ever going to progress as a program if we are not willing to tweak the scheduling model. We keep doing the same thing and getting the same results. Try something different.

Do your research and try to figure out who is likely to have a good year and target them. To a degree this is a guessing game, but that is really our only option at this point.

Last edited by ud2; 05-24-2019 at 01:10 PM..
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Old 05-24-2019, 02:16 PM
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scheduling is extremely difficult for a school in UD's position and it's getting harder by the season with expanded conference schedules/events for the power conferences and the erosion of good mid majors

Looking at the final NET rankings for last year there are teams that are realistic for a quad 1 road win. Quad 1 home wins are Top 25 in the NET which is extremely difficult. If Dayton wants to accumulate Quad 1 wins it's almost certainly going to have to get them on the road in OOC & A10 play

Some teams like Nevada or Buffalo were an easy projection for being a good team. Furman being 58 or Liberty being 53 was harder.

Ted Kissell had has new realities thing about scheduling back in the 00s and I think UD is entering another new reality
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Old 05-25-2019, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Murray State is looking for a H/H on two different dates on that sheet.

Bradley is looking for a road game. They could be a MVC contender next year

Oregon State has an open date

Western Kentucky has open dates
This got me thinking that scheduling is extremely difficult. If you're scanning a big list and you glean a few nice games like these then you have to just hope they happen to have the same open date you do (for both years in the case of a H&H). What are the odds of that? Can't be good.

Side note, does Bradley asking for a "road game" mean it can be a "buy game?" That would be a nice addition to the home schedule that wouldn't require committing to a H&H.
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Old 05-25-2019, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo View Post
This got me thinking that scheduling is extremely difficult. If you're scanning a big list and you glean a few nice games like these then you have to just hope they happen to have the same open date you do (for both years in the case of a H&H). What are the odds of that? Can't be good.

Side note, does Bradley asking for a "road game" mean it can be a "buy game?" That would be a nice addition to the home schedule that wouldn't require committing to a H&H.
Would guess the Braves are looking for a high major game. They would probably consider UD a peer instution and not in a position to be "bought" by UD. Probably willing to receive some $$ from Duke, UNC or Kansas though.
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Old 05-25-2019, 04:00 PM
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Since UD has the potential to schedule 31 games with a Maui on the Mainland game providing a 4th exempt game.

Could Dayton not go 16/15 this season?
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  #139  
Old 05-26-2019, 08:46 AM
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Why is it always $$$ or strength of schedule and such that determines who we get to play in the OOC schedule? Why isn’t It more about our affiliations? But then I started to ask myself, who are our affiliations? I guess that we have a lot of friends in low places? Aren’t the other Catholic or Christian schools our friends? Aren’t the other Ohio schools our friends? Or are they just recruiting, fandom and $$$ competitors?
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Old 05-26-2019, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Buckleyma View Post
Why is it always $$$ or strength of schedule and such that determines who we get to play in the OOC schedule? Why isn’t It more about our affiliations? But then I started to ask myself, who are our affiliations? I guess that we have a lot of friends in low places? Aren’t the other Catholic or Christian schools our friends? Aren’t the other Ohio schools our friends? Or are they just recruiting, fandom and $$$ competitors?
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What affiliations? As far as other Catholic schools, DePaul, Notre Dame, and Marquette will no longer play us. As far as Ohio schools, OSU, UC, and X won't play us. You need to read Chris' posts on scheduling on Pride+.
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Old 05-26-2019, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by IndianaFlyer View Post
I'm sure Neil could fill the schedule tomorrow. He doesn't because he's holding out for the best games he can get. And yes, it is easier for power conference teams to fill their schedule. They aren't hunting for quality games, those are already in their conference schedule.
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I know this is mixing topics - and I'm not looking to change the subject here - but this is why I have a hard time with folks saying the A10 is the right spot for us and we shouldn't aspire to join the likes of the BE or AAC.

Scheduling is exponentially harder since we can't count on our conference schedule for much.
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  #142  
Old 05-26-2019, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by MNFats View Post
I know this is mixing topics - and I'm not looking to change the subject here - but this is why I have a hard time with folks saying the A10 is the right spot for us and we shouldn't aspire to join the likes of the BE or AAC.

Scheduling is exponentially harder since we can't count on our conference schedule for much.
Aspiring for a better conference is good. The trick is actually getting an offer to join. It appears that currently there appears to be no offers in the near future. Scheduling as best we can, and performing well in conference is our only course of action, while continuing attempts to secure an offer in the future.

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Old 05-26-2019, 12:48 PM
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I'd be curious if AG's friendship with Frank Martin and I assume John Brannen would open the chance for South Carolina or UC
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Old 05-26-2019, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
https://florida.rivals.com/news/gato...rence-schedule

For ud2, Florida's OOC this season. 2 road games, 5 neutral site
I was looking at last year's schedules...Nevada played 7 away/neutral and 9 away league games.

The new reality might be that we might have to start playing one-way away games at p5's(p5's that we have a legit chance to beat)every now and then if we want to beef up the schedule.

Nevada:
Neutral: Tulsa, UMass, Arizona State
Away: Southern Cal, Loyola Chicago, Utah, Grand Canyon

Are Southern Cal and Utah really going to play a return game at Nevada this year or maybe next year?

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Old 05-26-2019, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
I was looking at last year's schedules...Nevada played 7 away/neutral and 9 away league games.

The new reality might be that we might have to start playing one-way away games at p5's(p5's that we have a legit chance to beat)every now and then if we want to beef up the schedule.

Nevada:
Neutral: Tulsa, UMass, Arizona State
Away: Southern Cal, Loyola Chicago, Utah, Grand Canyon

Are Southern Cal and Utah really going to play a return game at Nevada this year or maybe next year?
The Wolf Pack also set up home-and-home series with BYU (no payment), USC (no payment) and Utah (Nevada will get $20,000 this year)

http://nevadasportsnet.com/news/repo...cost-it-400000
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  #146  
Old 05-26-2019, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
The Wolf Pack also set up home-and-home series with BYU (no payment), USC (no payment) and Utah (Nevada will get $20,000 this year)

http://nevadasportsnet.com/news/repo...cost-it-400000
BYU is another one of the aspirational non-p5 programs. Through the years off and on they have been willing to play more than the normal/average amount of away/neutral games, so I am not at all surprised that they are willing to play Nevada in a home and home.
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Old 05-26-2019, 04:39 PM
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Old 05-26-2019, 05:03 PM
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Not much to report on SLU scheduling yet. Many potential opponents still on the board with very little in place. Neutral site game(s) a strong possibility. Ford said this has been toughest year yet to schedule at SLU.

-St. Louis beat writer, so we're not the only ones
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Old 05-26-2019, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
https://florida.rivals.com/news/gato...rence-schedule

For ud2, Florida's OOC this season. 2 road games, 5 neutral site
WKU played 7 away/neutral last year, but there were some iffy opponents in there.

Away: Washington, Arkansas, Indiana State, and Missouri State

Neutral: WVU, Valpo, and UCF
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Old 05-27-2019, 12:16 AM
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All of the following played at least 6 ooc away/neutral and at least 15 total away/neutral last year: WKU, Vermont, Harvard, Northern Iowa, Illinois State, Long Beach State, Grand Canyon, MTSU, NMSU, Old Dominion, Nevada, Iona, Belmont, Oregon State, BYU, Boise State, and Temple.

These are the schools that I would target if we are coming up short with p5 home and home series.

Some of them might be good h and h opponents. At the very least you could likely/probably get a q2 road win.

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Old 05-27-2019, 12:58 PM
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More non-p5's that I would target that meet the above criteria: Butler, Villanova, Seton Hall, St. John's, and UConn.

All 5 played at least 6 ooc away/neutral and at least 15 total away/neutral.

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Old 05-27-2019, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
More non-p5's that I would target that meet the above criteria: Butler, Villanova, Seton Hall, St. John's, Houston, Cincinnati, and UConn.

My guess as to how many of those teams would play us - zero.
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  #153  
Old 05-27-2019, 01:28 PM
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maybe you hope that Coach Grant's relationship with Mike Anderson might open the door for St. Johns
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Old 05-27-2019, 01:36 PM
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Unbelievable!

Originally Posted by Chris R View Post
Dayton had to pay St. Mary's CA to play at St. Mary's CA. That's how desperate things are.
In addition to the many so-called mid-majors like UD that do not play FBS football, approximately half of the FBS FB schools are not in P5 conferences. If you think we have it tough, examine the sea of red ink flowing from the non-P5 FBS schools.

I wonder how long it will be before one of those schools, or perhaps a group, takes legal action against the P5-TV cartel whose collusion/conspiracy is so financially damaging to schools that are deliberately locked out.

Indeed, every action of the P5 cartel is taken to ensure that the conferences comprised of~ 60 schools riding the TV gravy train are protected at the expense of the have-nots. And, of course, the NCAA is complicit.

It's tough for UD; but at least we're not hemorrhaging dollars as we struggle.
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Old 05-27-2019, 01:47 PM
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Might it be time to bring back a bracket-busters type event? It's hard to predict what "mid-major" teams are going to be good and have the foresight and luck to schedule them 1-2 years in advance. If schools with at-large aspirations knew they'd be getting a top-75ish OOC team at year's end that might ease the burden.

We already use "challenges" and holiday tourneys and tournaments for cancer, etc. What's one more gimmicky set of games to break up the monotony of conference play and hype things up prior to conference tourneys? Plus this one already existed and people enjoyed it.
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Old 05-27-2019, 03:36 PM
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I know Dayton used to be opposed to 2 for 1s but that might be worth exploring now. Or setting up a 1-1-1 with a friendly neutral site to other team. IE, playing a Kansas State at the Sprint Center in Kansas City or a Midwestern team at the United Center in Chicago

New Mexico State might start a series at UD to get AJ Harris a game back home
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Old 05-27-2019, 06:34 PM
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ud2, doing some more digging around Nevada got the USC H/H using their football team as a chip in a guarantee game

Western Kentucky did this to a get a H/H with Arkansas and I have to assume Ohio U got Purdue at home this year using their football team as a bargaining chip
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  #158  
Old 05-28-2019, 08:47 AM
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How about we give Florida 3 football games in the same season for a H/H?

I guess we are going to have to get real innovative.
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Old 05-28-2019, 11:55 AM
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Innovation?

Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
I know Dayton used to be opposed to 2 for 1s but that might be worth exploring now. Or setting up a 1-1-1 with a friendly neutral site to other team. IE, playing a Kansas State at the Sprint Center in Kansas City or a Midwestern team at the United Center in Chicago

New Mexico State might start a series at UD to get AJ Harris a game back home
Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
How about we give Florida 3 football games in the same season for a H/H?

I guess we are going to have to get real innovative.
Picking up on the two posts above: The notion of "homecoming" games might not be on the radar of most coaches/ADs. But if pointed out to them it might strike a chord for at least some.

For a long time the UConn women have arranged a homecoming game for all starters in their senior year....a game with an opponent as close as possible to the players home town. Many years ago UD was approached and turned down UConn's request....UConn played at Wright State instead.

Anyway, suppose we identified top players who lived and went to HS within an hour's drive of Dayton and approached those schools with the homecoming game concept. The schools would be ones we wanted to play H/H, of course; and the players would/should be starters.

When the UConn women do this the game is publicized and typically hundreds show up. The concept might work for women's games but not men's which sell out, essentially.

OK, maybe the idea would have legs if Coach Green tried it. I'm sure there are teams that otherwise would not play in Dayton that might be enticed by having one of their players feted at the Arena with a few hundred cheering fans.

Just a few thoughts.
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Old 05-28-2019, 07:59 PM
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Early prediction on South Florida's 19-20 starting five: LaQuincy Rideau, David Collins, Justin Brown, Alexis Yetna, Michael Durr.

Return over 90 percent of scoring, minutes, and rebounding from a 24-win team.

Wonder if BG would be game for a series?

Will be an NCAA contender in 2020.
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  #161  
Old 05-28-2019, 08:10 PM
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USF

Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Jon Rothstein
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Early prediction on South Florida's 19-20 starting five: LaQuincy Rideau, David Collins, Justin Brown, Alexis Yetna, Michael Durr.

Return over 90 percent of scoring, minutes, and rebounding from a 24-win team.

Wonder if BG would be game for a series?

Will be an NCAA contender in 2020.
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How could a nice guy like BG turn down Neil? BG loves the Pine Club...that alone should be enough of an enticement.
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Old 05-28-2019, 08:45 PM
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I wonder if Obi's presence might give our quest for a better schedule a boost. Would we not be a tad bit more attractive?
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Old 05-28-2019, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
How could a nice guy like BG turn down Neil? BG loves the Pine Club...that alone should be enough of an enticement.
I used to run into BG at the Nugget at breakfast on a regular basis. Super friendly great guy. I will sweeten the pot and offer to buy if he comes back, haha
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Old 05-28-2019, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
Picking up on the two posts above: The notion of "homecoming" games might not be on the radar of most coaches/ADs. But if pointed out to them it might strike a chord for at least some.

For a long time the UConn women have arranged a homecoming game for all starters in their senior year....a game with an opponent as close as possible to the players home town. Many years ago UD was approached and turned down UConn's request....UConn played at Wright State instead.

Anyway, suppose we identified top players who lived and went to HS within an hour's drive of Dayton and approached those schools with the homecoming game concept. The schools would be ones we wanted to play H/H, of course; and the players would/should be starters.

When the UConn women do this the game is publicized and typically hundreds show up. The concept might work for women's games but not men's which sell out, essentially.

OK, maybe the idea would have legs if Coach Green tried it. I'm sure there are teams that otherwise would not play in Dayton that might be enticed by having one of their players feted at the Arena with a few hundred cheering fans.

Just a few thoughts.
I'm in, let's get Michigan State on the schedule. I don't have a problem if we happen to play them twice, once here for Ahrens, and once in Maui for the title.
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Old 05-28-2019, 10:24 PM
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There's a lot of Dayton fans/alums down on the Gulf Coast of Florida. I wonder if some enticement of a certain number of tickets sold by UD or the prospect of Dayton fans showing up would factor into their decision making

USF averaged 2,569 per game per the last NCAA release I could find. Their athletic department is losing the last of the grandfathered in Big East revenue so they need money

AG's hasn't landed anyone from Florida yet but he's an active down there recruiting so getting a game in the Sunshine state could help on that front
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  #166  
Old 05-29-2019, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
I wonder if Obi's presence might give our quest for a better schedule a boost. Would we not be a tad bit more attractive?
I wonder if Obi's presence might give us a chance to win the A10 Tournament . . . so the schedule is less relavent.
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  #167  
Old 05-29-2019, 09:34 AM
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I would not think it's an either/or deal. There are two ways to get an NCAA bid, and Obi's presence can contribute to both.
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Old 05-29-2019, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by N2663R View Post
I wonder if Obi's presence might give us a chance to win the A10 Tournament . . . so the schedule is less relavent.
You do realize, the A10 is still a multi-bid league. Might need some help some years, but they still get multiple teams in.
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Old 05-29-2019, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
I would not think it's an either/or deal. There are two ways to get an NCAA bid, and Obi's presence can contribute to both.
Originally Posted by m21eagle45 View Post
You do realize, the A10 is still a multi-bid league. Might need some help some years, but they still get multiple teams in.
I completely agree with both of you, but IMHO the first order of business is to win your regular season championship and your conference tournament, year after year after year after year. In the case of UD, it opens up other doors, such as making non-con scheduling easier and and getting invited to a better league. I think we end up spending a lot of time worrying about the non-con schedule/results, because we think it's our only way to the NCAA. I say this because of our history in the A10 tournament. We never win it so we have to hope we do well during the A10 season and hope that that we can schedule/win meaningful non-con games. We lose the A10 Tournament before the season starts. Would you rather have 6 more A10 banners hanging in the arena or non-con wins over Michigan State, Duke, Gonzaga, etc?

I get frustrated that we want to run with the big dogs but we can't even win the dog fights in our own yard.

That said, with Obi back, this could be a VERY special year for the Flyers and the start of a multi year run like the glory years in the 50's & 60's! AG clearly was able to recruit the talent, now he has to win big with that talent. Go Flyers!
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  #170  
Old 05-29-2019, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Jon Rothstein
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Early prediction on South Florida's 19-20 starting five: LaQuincy Rideau, David Collins, Justin Brown, Alexis Yetna, Michael Durr.

Return over 90 percent of scoring, minutes, and rebounding from a 24-win team.

Wonder if BG would be game for a series?

Will be an NCAA contender in 2020.
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Use relationship with BG to get South Florida on the schedule.

Use Anthony Grant and Darren Hertz's relationship with University of Florida to get them on the schedule.

Use Greer's relationship to get Central Florida on the schedule.

Any of the above would be good series, especially given all the recruiting activity that's gone on down there.
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  #171  
Old 05-30-2019, 12:54 PM
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https://twitter.com/JonRothstein/sta...36687539785728

Harvard & Utah State in Rothstein's Top 25 for next season. Might be get-able series

Western Kentucky gets Charles Bassey back from the NBA draft so a game with them would be really attractive now
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Old 05-30-2019, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by DallasFlyer View Post
Use relationship with BG to get South Florida on the schedule.

Use Anthony Grant and Darren Hertz's relationship with University of Florida to get them on the schedule.

Use Greer's relationship to get Central Florida on the schedule.

Any of the above would be good series, especially given all the recruiting activity that's gone on down there.
BG won't play us because he knows what it is like to play at UD arena and knows it is a game he probably won't win.

Florida already announced their schedule for this year. Maybe for the future, but remember AG and DH have been gone from Florida for awhile now.

Central Florida would be a good school to target, but they could be down this year. Lost a lot from last years teams.
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Old 05-30-2019, 01:38 PM
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UCF is rebuilding, Fall and Taylor were the last of the Donnie Jones guys down there
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Old 05-30-2019, 01:59 PM
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East Tennessee State and Missouri State are two teams that should be at the top of their conferences next year that would be probably be game for playing a series
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Old 05-30-2019, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by m21eagle45 View Post
BG won't play us because he knows what it is like to play at UD arena and knows it is a game he probably won't win.

Probably true, but a home-and-home would give him a very good home game.
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Old 05-30-2019, 05:51 PM
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Drop football and play more away games. Problem solved since we don’t have to pay for a large cost in the sports department
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Old 05-30-2019, 07:18 PM
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Originally Posted by TX Flyer View Post
Drop football and play more away games. Problem solved since we don’t have to pay for a large cost in the sports department
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The 2 are totally unrelated.
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  #178  
Old 05-30-2019, 10:49 PM
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Originally Posted by TX Flyer View Post
Drop football and play more away games. Problem solved since we don’t have to pay for a large cost in the sports department
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Your suggestion for a better basketball schedule is to knock around 100 athletes out of the opportunity to play college football for our university?
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  #179  
Old 05-30-2019, 11:16 PM
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Football doesnt cost us much. In fact Im guessing its actually a net gain for the university after the smoke clears -- whether financially or otherwise. The kids are not in scholarship which is the biggest savings. But you're also recruiting high-level academic kids that were it not for the ability to play football would likely just go to Purdue or Case Western or UC or Michigan or Northwestern and be a regular student and not play sports at all. The football is what's tilting their decision to come to Dayton and continue their athletic careers. Young men are competitive. Even ones that are 40lb too light and 5 inches too short to play DI football.

By the time these kids bring their brains and wallets, they elevate the academic profile of UD with much better overall core grades and scores across the freshmen class and also pay for a large chunk of the $45,000 a year to be a Flyer. Many will obviously get some grants or academic scholarships -- but those are not athletic department costs.

Its why we bring in a lot of Chinese students --- they are smart but also dont mind paying full tuition. They have no concept of what the social status difference is between Dayton and Ohio State.

Besides, Neil has told me on several occasions he'll go to the grave with UD football and is not going to be "the guy" that axes it. Too much history at the school, too many great coaches and players. No doubt times have changed but football is just the easy whipping boy for other obstacles in the department from other non-football related factors.
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  #180  
Old 05-31-2019, 12:38 AM
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maybe we can offer up the football team to get a game
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Old 06-03-2019, 01:44 PM
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https://kuathletics.com/documents/20...0_schedule.pdf

Looks from Kansas's schedule that East Tennessee State is one of the Mainland teams for Maui

-for ud2, Kansas is playing 7 road/neutral games in OOC
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  #182  
Old 06-03-2019, 01:58 PM
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At some point the NCAA needs to step in and make some scheduling requirements for all schools, including the blue blood conferences.
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Old 06-03-2019, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
https://kuathletics.com/documents/20...0_schedule.pdf

Looks from Kansas's schedule that East Tennessee State is one of the Mainland teams for Maui

-for ud2, Kansas is playing 7 road/neutral games in OOC

Apples/Oranges.


I assume Kansas makes good money for playing in the champions classic each year (as well as Duke, UK and Mich State) not to mention prime time marquee exposure in fertile recruiting ground.


UMKC at the Sprint Center in KC, yeah that's gonna be a home game feel at a place they play annually.


At nova (I assume as part of a home and home), yeah pretty sure UD would jump at that as well (as they did not too long ago)


At Stanford, see Nova, though without UD having had the opportunity to play them home & home.
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Old 06-03-2019, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by cj View Post
At some point the NCAA needs to step in and make some scheduling requirements for all schools, including the blue blood conferences.
Too late. The tail can no longer wag the dog. The money and big conferences are in control.
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  #185  
Old 06-03-2019, 03:07 PM
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Originally Posted by cj View Post
At some point the NCAA needs to step in and make some scheduling requirements for all schools, including the blue blood conferences.
I do not agree with this at all. Schools have always had control of their schedules, as they should. If the NCAA needs to fix anything to level the playing field it is setting more set rules on tournament selection. For example, need at least a .500 conference record to make the tourney unless they win the conference tourney. Put a cap on how many schools can make it from each conference. The B10 does not deserve 8 teams in the field. But the NCAA needs to stay out of the schedule making.
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  #186  
Old 06-03-2019, 04:38 PM
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Scheduling difficulties become a moot point if they shorten the season by two games and let everyone play in the tournament.
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  #187  
Old 06-03-2019, 07:22 PM
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UD74--OSU has no desire to lose to us again. Years ago we played a 3-game series with them. They won the first game at their place, we won the second one at UD, then the next year we beat them again-- at their place. Eventually, they beat us again in an early NCAA game in Buffalo. But the coup de gras came when we beat them in the first game of the NCAA in 2014, an 11 beating a 6, when they thought they were invincible with the great Aaron Craft on their team. Having Jordan Sibert, an OSU transfer, playing for UD and running rings around Aaron, added insult to injury. Memories are long and I doubt they will EVER voluntarily play UD again, especially with our promising teams coming up in the future.
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  #188  
Old 06-03-2019, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by 66flyer View Post
UD74--OSU has no desire to lose to us again. Years ago we played a 3-game series with them. They won the first game at their place, we won the second one at UD, then the next year we beat them again-- at their place. Eventually, they beat us again in an early NCAA game in Buffalo. But the coup de gras came when we beat them in the first game of the NCAA in 2014, an 11 beating a 6, when they thought they were invincible with the great Aaron Craft on their team. Having Jordan Sibert, an OSU transfer, playing for UD and running rings around Aaron, added insult to injury. Memories are long and I doubt they will EVER voluntarily play UD again, especially with our promising teams coming up in the future.
That was a 4 game series and the 4th game came in Donoher's last season. It was a very lopsided loss at the Arena.
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  #189  
Old 06-03-2019, 08:02 PM
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And the NCAA loss was a NIT Quarterfinal game at Schottenstein Center. Dayton lead at halftime. Chris Wright freshman season.
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Old 06-03-2019, 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Medford View Post
Apples/Oranges.


I assume Kansas makes good money for playing in the champions classic each year (as well as Duke, UK and Mich State) not to mention prime time marquee exposure in fertile recruiting ground.


UMKC at the Sprint Center in KC, yeah that's gonna be a home game feel at a place they play annually.


At nova (I assume as part of a home and home), yeah pretty sure UD would jump at that as well (as they did not too long ago)


At Stanford, see Nova, though without UD having had the opportunity to play them home & home.
Fair enough...let's just do something like BYU and MTSU did last year.

Byu a/n...Nevada, Utah, Illinois state, UNLV, SDSU, and Miss State.

MTSU a/n...Belmont, Virginia, Butler, Stanford, Vandy, Ole Miss, Rhody

All we have to do is play our usual 3 exempt tourney games and 2 of our usual away p5 opponents but then add a good/decent a/n non-p5. I think that is very doable. And if we can only get 1 p5 away then add an extra non-p5 a/n.

We have just as much pull as byu and mtsu IMO. How comes they can get more of these type of games and we can't?

Last edited by ud2; 06-03-2019 at 11:34 PM..
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  #191  
Old 06-04-2019, 04:42 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
Fair enough...let's just do something like BYU and MTSU did last year.

Byu a/n...Nevada, Utah, Illinois state, UNLV, SDSU, and Miss State.

MTSU a/n...Belmont, Virginia, Butler, Stanford, Vandy, Ole Miss, Rhody

All we have to do is play our usual 3 exempt tourney games and 2 of our usual away p5 opponents but then add a good/decent a/n non-p5. I think that is very doable. And if we can only get 1 p5 away then add an extra non-p5 a/n.

We have just as much pull as byu and mtsu IMO. How comes they can get more of these type of games and we can't?
That assumes a P5 team will play UD on a neutral court or at their place.
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Old 06-04-2019, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
Fair enough...let's just do something like BYU and MTSU did last year.

Byu a/n...Nevada, Utah, Illinois state, UNLV, SDSU, and Miss State.

MTSU a/n...Belmont, Virginia, Butler, Stanford, Vandy, Ole Miss, Rhody

All we have to do is play our usual 3 exempt tourney games and 2 of our usual away p5 opponents but then add a good/decent a/n non-p5. I think that is very doable. And if we can only get 1 p5 away then add an extra non-p5 a/n.

We have just as much pull as byu and mtsu IMO. How comes they can get more of these type of games and we can't?
Current conditions would indicate that we do not have as much pull as BYU and MTSU. Appears the Catholic schools have a pretty united effort to not play UD, and the P-5 schools, save some SEC schools, have the same approach. We are not the studs we think we are.
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  #193  
Old 06-04-2019, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by cj View Post
At some point the NCAA needs to step in and make some scheduling requirements for all schools, including the blue blood conferences.
That will never happen, for better or worse, the NCAA "is" the blueblood programs/conferences.
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  #194  
Old 06-04-2019, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Flyers98 View Post
That will never happen, for better or worse, the NCAA "is" the blueblood programs/conferences.

And if the NCAA decides to get into scheduling, the blueblood conferences will just say, fine, we will just break away. We already make enough money with football without you, we don’t need you for basketball.
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  #195  
Old 06-04-2019, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by UD62 View Post
Current conditions would indicate that we do not have as much pull as BYU and MTSU. Appears the Catholic schools have a pretty united effort to not play UD, and the P-5 schools, save some SEC schools, have the same approach. We are not the studs we think we are.
Or maybe those schools feel like a home-home series with UD will likely result in at least one loss and don't need to take the risk
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  #196  
Old 06-04-2019, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by NCkevi View Post
Or maybe those schools feel like a home-home series with UD will likely result in at least one loss and don't need to take the risk
That could be true also, bottom line we don't get the games. perhaps AG is in the process of elevating the program so that those type games become more of a possibility. I believe we are in a "no man's land". Better than the majority of mid-majors, but not quite good enough to be considered a "big boy".
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  #197  
Old 06-04-2019, 06:49 PM
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Originally Posted by NCkevi View Post
Or maybe those schools feel like a home-home series with UD will likely result in at least one loss and don't need to take the risk

And we can't even get them to buy us. As Chris said, they want easy buy games, not competitive buy games.
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  #198  
Old 06-04-2019, 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted by NCkevi View Post
Or maybe those schools feel like a home-home series with UD will likely result in at least one loss and don't need to take the risk
I am just having a very hard time reconciling that with all those years where Temple and Xavier, when they were in the A10, were consistently able to get more good quality home and home series than us. Wouldn't the same logic have applied back then? Why would anybody want to play either of those two in a h and h then if the likelihood of 1 or 2 losses was high?

During that whole time span the argument on here was still always that nobody wanted to play us. You can't have it both ways. Why would they be willing to play those two but not us? That makes no sense at all.

Or even look at a few years ago, X played 6 or 7 quality a/n games when they were already in the BE, why would anybody want to play them? This has happened a couple of times since they joined the BE.

And the same thing happened several times with Temple in the American.

And the same thing has happened countless times over many years with many other good non-p5 teams such as VCU, BYU, Gonzaga, New Mexico, Butler, Wichita State, Seton Hall, St. John's, SDSU, Nevada, Belmont, Northen Iowa, etc.

None of the reasoning given on here makes any sense to me, none of the reasoning on here explains any of the many discrepancies.

It is my opinion that UD can in fact get more of these higher quality games, but UD has a very strict policy of never ever playing fewer than 16 home games no matter what. And that policy is going to forever handicap UD and make consistently getting a better seed and advancing in the ncaat a virtually nearly certain impossibility.

You have to give something to get something, and UD is unwilling to give up any more home games.
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  #199  
Old 06-04-2019, 10:41 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
I am just having a very hard time reconciling that with all those years where Temple and Xavier, when they were in the A10, were consistently able to get more good quality home and home series than us. Wouldn't the same logic have applied back then? Why would anybody want to play either of those two in a h and h then if the likelihood of 1 or 2 losses was high?

During that whole time span the argument on here was still always that nobody wanted to play us. You can't have it both ways. Why would they be willing to play those two but not us? That makes no sense at all.

Or even look at a few years ago, X played 6 or 7 quality a/n games when they were already in the BE, why would anybody want to play them? This has happened a couple of times since they joined the BE.

And the same thing happened several times with Temple in the American.

And the same thing has happened countless times over many years with many other good non-p5 teams such as VCU, BYU, Gonzaga, New Mexico, Butler, Wichita State, Seton Hall, St. John's, SDSU, Nevada, Belmont, Northen Iowa, etc.

None of the reasoning given on here makes any sense to me, none of the reasoning on here explains any of the many discrepancies.

It is my opinion that UD can in fact get more of these higher quality games, but UD has a very strict policy of never ever playing fewer than 16 home games no matter what. And that policy is going to forever handicap UD and make consistently getting a better seed and advancing in the ncaat a virtually nearly certain impossibility.

You have to give something to get something, and UD is unwilling to give up any more home games.
I can't imagine why Neil hasn't hired you to do scheduling yet.
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  #200  
Old 06-04-2019, 10:55 PM
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Decision making

Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
I am just having a very hard time reconciling that with all those years where Temple and Xavier, when they were in the A10, were consistently able to get more good quality home and home series than us. Wouldn't the same logic have applied back then? Why would anybody want to play either of those two in a h and h then if the likelihood of 1 or 2 losses was high?

During that whole time span the argument on here was still always that nobody wanted to play us. You can't have it both ways. Why would they be willing to play those two but not us? That makes no sense at all.

Or even look at a few years ago, X played 6 or 7 quality a/n games when they were already in the BE, why would anybody want to play them? This has happened a couple of times since they joined the BE.

And the same thing happened several times with Temple in the American.

And the same thing has happened countless times over many years with many other good non-p5 teams such as VCU, BYU, Gonzaga, New Mexico, Butler, Wichita State, Seton Hall, St. John's, SDSU, Nevada, Belmont, Northen Iowa, etc.

None of the reasoning given on here makes any sense to me, none of the reasoning on here explains any of the many discrepancies.

It is my opinion that UD can in fact get more of these higher quality games, but UD has a very strict policy of never ever playing fewer than 16 home games no matter what. And that policy is going to forever handicap UD and make consistently getting a better seed and advancing in the ncaat a virtually nearly certain impossibility.

You have to give something to get something, and UD is unwilling to give up any more home games.
OK, let's suppose there's something to this line of reasoning. Who is it that decides UD is unwilling to give up one or two home games as a means to achieve its primary objective...that being regular NCAA berths with reasonably good seeds?

We have a president and an AD who are relatively new in their jobs. And we are a school willing to invest an amount approaching $100 million to renovate its BB palace. Men's BB is a very big deal for our U....and success is defined one way for us, filled Arena seats, the NCAAs regularly.....success in the NCAAs. Seems to me that a new president (who comes to us from a big-time BB school) would support just about any decision his AD would make toward those ends. Right?

In my opinion.....opinion....the most important thing UD can/should do is to produce teams that are consistently dominant in the A10....the clear-cut cream of the crop winning the regular season and tournament consistently. A tall order? The A10 is not the BE or the Big Ten or the ACC. Demonstrating dominance in our own respectable conference combined with solid OOC performance is the ticket to where we want to be....in my opinion. If we do that the rest will take care of itself.
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3 UDPriders Offer Mad Props to UACFlyer For This Totally Excellent Post:
bigudfan (06-05-2019), ChrisInVenice (06-09-2019), Flyer Al (06-04-2019)
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