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  #1  
Old 12-03-2019, 11:51 PM
Fudd Fudd is offline
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Did we hit the jackpot on transfers?

Think of what we received among the transfers who became eligible to play for us this year:

Rodney Chatman
Ibi Watson
Chase Johnson
Jordy Tshimanga

I think of all of those guys as very high quality players at this stage. That is an amazing haul of talent. We have a history of getting some really good transfers, but this is a high volume of very good players to get all at once. Grant and staff really hit a home run on this group.
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  #2  
Old 12-04-2019, 12:18 AM
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Certainly a much deeper team.
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Old 12-04-2019, 12:18 AM
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I’m cautiously optimistic given the opponent but it was nice to see Jordy and Chase get in the flow. If those guys can give quality minutes while Toppin and Mikesell get rest that could make a huge difference down the stretch. If Jordy comes along he will be a huge difference maker when we play teams with quality big men (like in the tourney). Chatman and Watson have been plug and play since day one. I agree 100%. This is a great collection of guys who all do different things well around an NBA forward, (although the first half defense was atrocious tonight).
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Old 12-04-2019, 12:46 AM
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I think Jordy and Chase have a lot of upside left this season

Jordy had 10 & 8 against Kansas and 15 & 8 against Michigan State as a freshman. Coming off injury he needs some game action and get back into the groove.

Chase with his injuries it sounds like is essentially a freshman out there now. 6 games and 45 minutes played coming into this season plus a lot practice time lost
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  #5  
Old 12-04-2019, 01:31 AM
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Overall, no question the transfers are helping the Flyers; and yet, I feel there is still substantial room for enhancements from each transfer, and the entire team. As for Chase and Jordy, I expect they both might need to make substantial contribution against Saint Mary's. There is at-least six or seven regular season games left, that will likely demand more of true frontline presence. Especially on defense.

Fudd, I can tell you more, on the Tuesday before the Masters Golf Tournament.
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Old 12-04-2019, 01:41 AM
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hey now..
Can you can tell all of us, on the Tuesday before the Masters Golf Tournament?...)

just sayin,
if it's something you can share,
please don't feel like you have to bogart the "more"... let us in
on the "more" too...) we won't tell anybody
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Old 12-04-2019, 01:52 AM
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I assume that the Tuesday before the Masters is because it's the day after the national championship game.
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  #8  
Old 12-04-2019, 03:56 AM
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Originally Posted by sheg View Post
I assume that the Tuesday before the Masters is because it's the day after the national championship game.
gotcha, lol at me!...)

I thought I was going to have to step into my
Longstreet alter ego, and start snooping, lol...)

I just went old school,
anyone remember Longstreet, from the 70's?...
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  #9  
Old 12-04-2019, 10:51 AM
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We have 11 quality guys playing, and any of them could be a starter. The drop off to our subs is minimal. The upside of Johnson and Tshimanga are really intriguing. If Chase gets an outside shot, lookout.
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  #10  
Old 12-04-2019, 11:09 AM
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Absolutely interested to see how Chase and Jordy develop. Chase hasn't played in like 3 years, and I suspect there could be some hesitation (I don't really know the nature of his concussions, so I'm just guessing) As he grows confidence not only in his game but his body, he could become a strong force down low. Jordy isn't nearly as far removed from real games, but it will take some time for his knee and body to get back into shape, granted the competition was crap, but he looked like he moved a lot better last night than the prior games in Maui. For a dude that had a suspect shooting % his first 2 years at Nebraska, he appears to have a very soft touch around the bucket; he's clearly improved his game (and body).
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  #11  
Old 12-04-2019, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
Think of what xxxwexxx xxxreceivedxxx AG absolutely worked his butt off for among the transfers who became eligible to play for us this year:

Rodney Chatman
Ibi Watson
Chase Johnson
Jordy Tshimanga

I think of all of those guys as very high quality players at this stage. That is an amazing haul of talent. We have a history of getting some really good transfers, but this is a high volume of very good players to get all at once. Grant and staff really hit a home run on this group.
Fixed it for you
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  #12  
Old 12-04-2019, 11:26 AM
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I try not to call out individual players too much in a negative light, particularly when the team has this much upside, so I will try to make this comment with the lightest steps I can take...

I'd much rather see some of the minutes Cohill is getting go into further developing Chase and Jordy. I appreciate his hustle, more on the defensive side, but I'm not impressed with his knuckleball shooting stroke or passes that are consistently off the mark.

I love having Chatman and Crutcher on the floor together, but we can run a true PG rotation with those two, let some of our 6'5 boys play 2 & 3, then stack up the middle with a 3-man rotation between Obi, Chase and Jordy. Maybe save Cohill for games against high-efficiency, speed-focused teams where size comes is second behind athleticism.

Otherwise, do what finally winded up beating us in the Kansas game - pound the ball inside with a strong inside-out game ready to go!

On the topic of the thread though - we definitely got some boys that can play off the transfer market! I love Ibi's rainbow splashes that flip the net higher than the rim. And Chatman has been a little off the last couple games IMHO, but he's a dog on the floor!
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Old 12-04-2019, 11:30 AM
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Chase is stronger down low than I expected.
So much good news to enjoy and be happy about
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Old 12-04-2019, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by pmcmullen View Post
I love having Chatman and Crutcher on the floor together, but we can run a true PG rotation with those two, let some of our 6'5 boys play 2 & 3, then stack up the middle with a 3-man rotation between Obi, Chase and Jordy.
The true point guard rotation won't happen because Grant values Crutcher way too much to not have him on the floor the most. It has been evident since he first put him in the starting lineup as a freshman. Although his overall minutes played may end up being a bit lower this year you can bet he will still play most of the minutes as either the PG or SG in any games that are close/meaningful.
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Old 12-04-2019, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
We have 11 quality guys playing, and any of them could be a starter. The drop off to our subs is minimal. The upside of Johnson and Tshimanga are really intriguing. If Chase gets an outside shot, lookout.
Chase already has an outside shot. Watch him during the pre-game shooting. He has a nice touch from 15 feet.
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Old 12-04-2019, 01:39 PM
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Ibi and Jordy are the X factors this season. I donít believe weíve yet seen anything close to what their capabilities are. Ibi is starting to show some but I think
he is still shaking off rust. Jordy could be a force in the A10 by the end of the season. If Iím right, this team has everything for a deep run. It takes some luck and it takes chemistry. Some guys are going to have to suppress individual goals for team goals.
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Old 12-04-2019, 01:48 PM
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Jordy is going to be a beast . He defends on the floor and protects the basket. He scores in the post. Chase needs some work on defense but it is all about how bad he wants it.
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  #18  
Old 12-04-2019, 01:54 PM
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I really have a man crush on this team.

So much fun to watch; such a tight knit group of guys.

I pray we see them in Atlanta next March/April. Iím so there.
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Old 12-04-2019, 02:58 PM
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With Jordy, I felt like he was being too aggressive with his hands on defense against Kansas. Of course, getting dropped into that game as your introduction to the season is a tall order coming off an injury and very little practice. But, I don't think we needed him to be blocking shots or shutting anyone down completely, just slowing them down and making things more difficult with his size. I'm hoping he calibrates his defense to the situation as the season goes forward.
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Old 12-04-2019, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
With Jordy, I felt like he was being too aggressive with his hands on defense against Kansas. Of course, getting dropped into that game as your introduction to the season is a tall order coming off an injury and very little practice. But, I don't think we needed him to be blocking shots or shutting anyone down completely, just slowing them down and making things more difficult with his size. I'm hoping he calibrates his defense to the situation as the season goes forward.
When the big guy he is guarding is a poor FT shooter, I have no problem with him blocking shots or shutting them down in the process of sending them to the line. In the case of Kansas, that's what was needed. Maybe he should've been allowed to foul out doing so, we'll never know. As he becomes healthy and more a part of the plan, he'll have to watch his fouling, but in the case of Kansas, I thought it was necessary.

Last edited by Smitty10; 12-04-2019 at 04:21 PM..
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Old 12-04-2019, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by pmcmullen View Post
I try not to call out individual players too much in a negative light, particularly when the team has this much upside, so I will try to make this comment with the lightest steps I can take...

I'd much rather see some of the minutes Cohill is getting go into further developing Chase and Jordy. I appreciate his hustle, more on the defensive side, but I'm not impressed with his knuckleball shooting stroke or passes that are consistently off the mark.

I love having Chatman and Crutcher on the floor together, but we can run a true PG rotation with those two, let some of our 6'5 boys play 2 & 3, then stack up the middle with a 3-man rotation between Obi, Chase and Jordy. Maybe save Cohill for games against high-efficiency, speed-focused teams where size comes is second behind athleticism.

Otherwise, do what finally winded up beating us in the Kansas game - pound the ball inside with a strong inside-out game ready to go!

On the topic of the thread though - we definitely got some boys that can play off the transfer market! I love Ibi's rainbow splashes that flip the net higher than the rim. And Chatman has been a little off the last couple games IMHO, but he's a dog on the floor!
I think AG is absolutely the kind of coach who rewards buy-in and hard work and for that reason alone, Cohill is going to play. Aside from that, coaches don't just put whoever they want in the game, they have to match up and based on what I have seen so far, Chase and Jordy are going to last about 3 minutes if they are asked to check the other team's best guard on the perimeter, (which is what Cohill does when he comes in the game).
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:07 PM
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RE Cohill, he's still a soph. Get him some minutes and I think his offense will improve.
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
RE Cohill, he's still a soph. Get him some minutes and I think his offense will improve.
I hope you are right, but I still see that side-spinning knuckle ball fly off his hands and I cringe - every time! Like many of you, I've played and watched a lot of ball, and most of the time the really good, pure shooters have a very smooth stroke with a nice backspin. It's just a rule of thumb, I get that, but it has very few exceptions.

Maybe he'll just find his way as a role-player with much less of an offensive focus, more like a DO most of his tenure, or a KD? I don't know, but thus far, he strikes me as a weakest link.

All comments IMHO...
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Flyers98 View Post
Iím cautiously optimistic given the opponent but it was nice to see Jordy and Chase get in the flow. If those guys can give quality minutes while Toppin and Mikesell get rest that could make a huge difference down the stretch. If Jordy comes along he will be a huge difference maker when we play teams with quality big men (like in the tourney). Chatman and Watson have been plug and play since day one. I agree 100%. This is a great collection of guys who all do different things well around an NBA forward, (although the first half defense was atrocious tonight).
We need Jordy against Langevine and the SLU goons
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by pmcmullen View Post
I hope you are right, but I still see that side-spinning knuckle ball fly off his hands and I cringe - every time! Like many of you, I've played and watched a lot of ball, and most of the time the really good, pure shooters have a very smooth stroke with a nice backspin. It's just a rule of thumb, I get that, but it has very few exceptions.
Very good observation. The ideal shot will have backspin on it so that after it swishes it will bounce back to you.

I remember reading an interview with Larry Bird when he was shooting around with the author. He noted that Bird swished 10 shots in a row and each time the backspin brought the ball right back to Larry, who naturally thought it was no big deal.
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by pmcmullen View Post
I hope you are right, but I still see that side-spinning knuckle ball fly off his hands and I cringe - every time! Like many of you, I've played and watched a lot of ball, and most of the time the really good, pure shooters have a very smooth stroke with a nice backspin. It's just a rule of thumb, I get that, but it has very few exceptions.

Maybe he'll just find his way as a role-player with much less of an offensive focus, more like a DO most of his tenure, or a KD? I don't know, but thus far, he strikes me as a weakest link.

All comments IMHO...
I'm not sure he'll ever be a pure shooter or someone you want taking a lot of perimeter shots but if he can develop into someone like Kyle Davis who can make an open 3 and force defenses to respect him I'd be happy

Long term I think his value is going to be as a defender. He just needs enough offense so he's not a liability on the floor. This year there's enough guys to carry the load on offense that I can think he can carve out a niche as a defender

Like some of the other bench players with the rest of the home OOC schedule and some of the weaker A10 teams, he can get some experience and hopefully develop and build up his confidence
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:16 PM
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Chase and Jordyís demeanor on the court tells us they are out to show and prove. They are about business which is a good balance for this fun team. Notice how last game Coach Grant and Jordy had a good laugh during a time out. Jordy was playing well ,so I hope Coach Grant was saying doesnít this feel good young fella.
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Old 12-04-2019, 10:53 PM
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Cohill is very effective going to the rim, maybe even more effective than anyone else on the team. His outside shot is unreliable, but his defense and his offensive production in the paint will earn him minutes. His outside shot is not the worst i’ve seen from Flyer guards in recent memory, but it definitely needs further development.
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Old 12-04-2019, 11:50 PM
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Originally Posted by frisco flyer View Post
Cohill is very effective going to the rim, maybe even more effective than anyone else on the team. His outside shot is unreliable, but his defense and his offensive production in the paint will earn him minutes. His outside shot is not the worst iíve seen from Flyer guards in recent memory, but it definitely needs further development.
For some of you oldtimers Ray Springer a 1986 graduate of Meadowdale who played for UD from 1987 to 1990 comes to mind. He always shot his jump shot with side rotation that looked like a knuckleball but he actually made a good percentage of them! Cohill's shot is not nearly as bad as Springer's was but he may get better if he finds a groove. In the meantime he does other things (defense and drives to the basket) which make him an asset and I am happy he is on our team! I followed him very closely two years ago when we were recruiting him from Holy Name High School in Cleveland. He scored 2,182 points over his varsity career and he scored all those points in a variety of ways. Instead of being critical of his release we just need to sit back and enjoy the ride.
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Old Yesterday, 12:01 AM
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I really liked watching Chase and Jordy this past game. Jordy's quickness looked much improved. A few days full go at practice can make a huge difference. Chase is looking more confident and comfortable with his movement. The athleticism shows. It still looks like he's hesitant on D due to a lack of wanting contact (probably due to his injury history).

Off season reports said he was a good defender and rebounder. I hope his confidence and D continue to grow with more games. It's just nice knowing that we have a backup #4 that can score 18....not sure we've ever had that

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Old Yesterday, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by pmcmullen View Post
I hope you are right, but I still see that side-spinning knuckle ball fly off his hands and I cringe - every time! Like many of you, I've played and watched a lot of ball, and most of the time the really good, pure shooters have a very smooth stroke with a nice backspin. It's just a rule of thumb, I get that, but it has very few exceptions.

Maybe he'll just find his way as a role-player with much less of an offensive focus, more like a DO most of his tenure, or a KD? I don't know, but thus far, he strikes me as a weakest link.

All comments IMHO...
Reggie Miller anyone?
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Old Yesterday, 12:23 AM
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Originally Posted by CvilleFlyer View Post
For some of you oldtimers Ray Springer a 1986 graduate of Meadowdale who played for UD from 1987 to 1990 comes to mind. He always shot his jump shot with side rotation that looked like a knuckleball but he actually made a good percentage of them! Cohill's shot is not nearly as bad as Springer's was but he may get better if he finds a groove. In the meantime he does other things (defense and drives to the basket) which make him an asset and I am happy he is on our team! I followed him very closely two years ago when we were recruiting him from Holy Name High School in Cleveland. He scored 2,182 points over his varsity career and he scored all those points in a variety of ways. Instead of being critical of his release we just need to sit back and enjoy the ride.
I remember Coach Donoher taped Springerís fingers together to try to correct the English on his jump shot to no avail.
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Old Yesterday, 10:43 AM
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Springer had a weird shot but it was working in that 111-108 win over avier - 26 points on 10/15 shooting! (Of course, Negele had 30 points on 11/13 - not bad when your guards shoot 75% from the field.)
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Originally Posted by longtimefan View Post
Springer had a weird shot but it was working in that 111-108 win over avier - 26 points on 10/15 shooting! (Of course, Negele had 30 points on 11/13 - not bad when your guards shoot 75% from the field.)
My favorite game of all time!
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Old Yesterday, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
My favorite game of all time!

One of my favorites too, except that we almost blew a 65-42 halftime lead. Think about that - we scored 65 points in a half (but avier scored 66 in the second half).
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Old Yesterday, 04:04 PM
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AG made a comment during his radio show that I first found strange until he went into more detail.
Larry asked how much the teams play and sharing the ball was a benefit of the transfer being able to practice last year. His initial reply was something to the effect of "not much."
Strange?
He then went on to talk about how those guys were always the scout team playing like an opponent. Although they heard the terminology and saw the offensive and defensive sets, they didn't get the exposure of running the sets themselves or with the starters because they were trying to simulate the other teams. On top of that, Ibi, Jordy, and others have missed time with injuries, so they've only really been able to go full participation for about 2 weeks.
Makes sense.
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Old Yesterday, 11:29 PM
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Guess this an appropriate thread to post today's article, a good one, from Archdeacon on Chase
https://www.daytondailynews.com/spor...H4LL8VxZPoD8N/
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Old Yesterday, 11:58 PM
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In 85% of the last 20 Flyer seasons, Johnson, Watson, and Tshimanga would all be starting.

I like all three. I view them as starters like the other guys. I dont feel like we really have "bench" players. And I think Grant has transmitted the same message. If you can help, you're gonna play. And everybody has been playing.
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