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10-06-2015, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Figgie123
Man, does that hit home. SI Swimsuit Calendar, in my cubicle, that could only be seen if you were completely in my cubicle, sitting on my desk, looking at the entrance. Nevermind, that you couldn't be sitting on my desk, while I'm sitting in my chair, inside my cubicle.
Was told to take it down. Sexual harassment. Poor Kathy Ireland.
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Originally Posted by Smitty10
Oh for Pete's sake, admit that you had a cover of SI swimsuit issue but the guts contained the latest edition of Hustler. I hate when you leave out the full story.
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The best part about this worthless training was the 2nd session that focused on Diversity in the Workplace. It was at that time we were taught that Michelangelo (1475-1564) and Galileo (1564-1642) were famous Italian-Americans, Gandhi (1869-1948) was a great Indian-American, Winston Churchill was a famous English-American and, of course, how could we forget the most famous Spanish-American, Christopher Columbus (1451-1506), who was Italian.
For the ignorant out there who don't get my point, Michelangelo, Columbus and Galileo died long before America became a country, Gandhi never set foot in this country and Churchill never in a million years would consider himself an American.
Of course, none of us dared to disagree with what the highly paid minority contractor was telling us for fear of being labeled a racist or possibly fired.
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Last edited by rollo; 10-06-2015 at 02:42 PM..
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10-06-2015, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo
Yes. 100% yes, it's all about the punishment. However...
After reading the CoC and having been trained by UD in Sexual Harassment and my obligation to report even the rumor of such, I know what's expected of the process and feel UD and their Review Court did their job.
But I also read the UDPD Report, and personally feel that Gazoo is right...this is an obvious case of 'regret' and both parties should be held equally responsible under the 'It Takes 2-to-Tango' clause. Unfortunately, women's lib'ers haven't figured out that by making women the victim of every mistake they make doesn't empower them, it only makes them weaker.
Regardless...Pierre knew the policy - and has first hand experience with its application thanks to the behavior of a couple of his former teammates - and should be held at least partially responsible for causing his own troubles. And IMRO, suspension/forced withdraw is wayyyyyyy, wayyyyy, wayyyyy to harsh a punishment for an obvious consensual one-night stand. I mean, seriously, with witnesses everywhere, Devon Scott dragged his baby-momma to the street, tossed her clothes all over Brown Street and was never taken in front of the Hearing Board...if that isn't against the CoC, nothing is.
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Finally, we are getting somewhere! Now about that thing in Syria . . . .
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10-06-2015, 03:29 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Originally Posted by rollo
Since I'm King, I can say what I want.
Yes. 100% yes, it's all about the punishment. However...
After reading the CoC and having been trained by UD in Sexual Harassment and my obligation to report even the rumor of such, I know what's expected of the process and feel UD and their Review Court did their job.
But I also read the UDPD Report, and personally feel that Gazoo is right...this is an obvious case of 'regret' and both parties should be held equally responsible under the 'It Takes 2-to-Tango' clause. Unfortunately, women's lib'ers haven't figured out that by making women the victim of every mistake they make doesn't empower them, it only makes them weaker.
Regardless...Pierre knew the policy - and has first hand experience with its application thanks to the behavior of a couple of his former teammates - and should be held at least partially responsible for causing his own troubles. And IMRO, suspension/forced withdraw is wayyyyyyy, wayyyyy, wayyyyy to harsh a punishment for an obvious consensual one-night stand. I mean, seriously, with witnesses everywhere, Devon Scott dragged his baby-momma to the street, tossed her clothes all over Brown Street and was never taken in front of the Hearing Board...if that isn't against the CoC, nothing is.
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Rollo - You running for POTUS?
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10-06-2015, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by CE80
Rollo - You running for POTUS?
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Why would I voluntarily want to demote myself?
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10-06-2015, 03:56 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo
Since I'm King, I can say what I want.
Yes. 100% yes, it's all about the punishment. However...
After reading the CoC and having been trained by UD in Sexual Harassment and my obligation to report even the rumor of such, I know what's expected of the process and feel UD and their Review Court did their job.
But I also read the UDPD Report, and personally feel that Gazoo is right...this is an obvious case of 'regret' and both parties should be held equally responsible under the 'It Takes 2-to-Tango' clause. Unfortunately, women's lib'ers haven't figured out that by making women the victim of every mistake they make doesn't empower them, it only makes them weaker.
Regardless...Pierre knew the policy - and has first hand experience with its application thanks to the behavior of a couple of his former teammates - and should be held at least partially responsible for causing his own troubles. And IMRO, suspension/forced withdraw is wayyyyyyy, wayyyyy, wayyyyy to harsh a punishment for an obvious consensual one-night stand. I mean, seriously, with witnesses everywhere, Devon Scott dragged his baby-momma to the street, tossed her clothes all over Brown Street and was never taken in front of the Hearing Board...if that isn't against the CoC, nothing is.
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In that case, I think we're totally on the same page. I just don't like hearing that DP brought this on himself. OK, yes, he put himself in a situation that could potentially end up leading to something bad, but if we're going to abandon every person / employee / basketball player / fan who does that it will be a lonely place to watch a game.
The rule is unreasonable, the enforcement is cowardice, and the punishment is disproportionate.
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10-06-2015, 04:04 PM
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General
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Originally Posted by rollo
The best part about this worthless training was the 2nd session that focused on Diversity in the Workplace. It was at that time we were taught that Michelangelo (1475-1564) and Galileo (1564-1642) were famous Italian-Americans, Gandhi (1869-1948) was a great Indian-American, Winston Churchill was a famous English-American and, of course, how could we forget the most famous Spanish-American, Christopher Columbus (1451-1506), who was Italian.
For the ignorant out there who don't get my point, Michelangelo, Columbus and Galileo died long before America became a country, Gandhi never set foot in this country and Churchill never in a million years would consider himself an American.
Of course, none of us dared to disagree with what the highly paid minority contractor was telling us for fear of being labeled a racist or possibly fired.
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See, you learned something that day. You learned how reparations get made in this country.
That didn't actually happen, did it?
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10-06-2015, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo
In that case, I think we're totally on the same page. I just don't like hearing that DP brought this on himself. OK, yes, he put himself in a situation that could potentially end up leading to something bad, but if we're going to abandon every person / employee / basketball player / fan who does that it will be a lonely place to watch a game.
The rule is unreasonable, the enforcement is cowardice, and the punishment is disproportionate.
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Plus we moved down maybe 4 spots in preseason rankings.
Bring on Saginaw Valley!
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10-06-2015, 04:24 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Originally Posted by rollo
Any basketball player at UD who is stupid enough to ignore the antics of their teammates for the past 4 or 5 years, the CoC/Title IX training and how they are related and relevant to their world - keeping in mind that the school repeatedly forces down this stuff down their throats - gets exactly what they deserve.
Let's stop making excuses for Pierre. It only gives the rest of the team and future players excuses to continue the behavior...as will any impulsive changes to the current policies in place motivated solely to appease a basketball player.
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Lets stop crucifying him.
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10-06-2015, 04:28 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo
UD is a private school. It is not a state actor and doesn't have to "honor the constitution."
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Isn't that what I said, they don't follow the constitution. Now I do not agree they can ignore the consitution.
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10-06-2015, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo
That didn't actually happen, did it?
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Yup...and not long after the training, I faxed the manual to Mike McConnell at WLW who was gracious enough to read it verbatim over the airways. Unfortunately, he read it just before the top-of-the-hour news so it didn't get the attention it so definitely deserved. I thought I still had the manual in my desk but I can't find it...if it pops up, I'll share more enlightening tidbits of BS that can only be described at PC-gone-wild.
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10-06-2015, 06:44 PM
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10-06-2015, 06:54 PM
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10-06-2015, 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Ready Action
Dunk you very much.
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Not one person from the UD team (players,coaches, student managers, Dayton basketball accounts) liked or commented on his video. All of the players and majority of the coaches have a Instagram account. Why wouldn't somebody on the team like this photo if he was indeed returning?
I think he is suing the school, told the team goodbye, and looking at other schools now. Based on Twitter profile, he is erasing UD from his memory and not associating himself with anything UD
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10-06-2015, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by FlyerNation23
Not one person from the UD team (players,coaches, student managers, Dayton basketball accounts) liked or commented on his video. All of the players and majority of the coaches have a Instagram account. Why wouldn't somebody on the team like this photo if he was indeed returning?
I think he is suing the school, told the team goodbye, and looking at other schools now. Based on Twitter profile, he is erasing UD from his memory and not associating himself with anything UD
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That would indeed be unfortunate!
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10-06-2015, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by FlyerNation23
Not one person from the UD team (players,coaches, student managers, Dayton basketball accounts) liked or commented on his video. All of the players and majority of the coaches have a Instagram account. Why wouldn't somebody on the team like this photo if he was indeed returning?
I think he is suing the school, told the team goodbye, and looking at other schools now. Based on Twitter profile, he is erasing UD from his memory and not associating himself with anything UD
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First, I hope your assessment is wrong. Secondly, I would guess that everyone associated with UD athletics is being told to avoid contact or social media commenting, etc. until advised otherwise. Just look at all of the speculation generated from what we have today, which is one single document and one single statement from an attorney.
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10-06-2015, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by FlyerNation23
Not one person from the UD team (players,coaches, student managers, Dayton basketball accounts) liked or commented on his video. All of the players and majority of the coaches have a Instagram account. Why wouldn't somebody on the team like this photo if he was indeed returning?
I think he is suing the school, told the team goodbye, and looking at other schools now. Based on Twitter profile, he is erasing UD from his memory and not associating himself with anything UD
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Unfortunately i agree... regardless of rollo saying he (DP) was screwed, but deserves it because he(DP) should know better (which are both true), and everyone defending her (rollo) and arguing with her(rollo) seem to only go around in pointless circles i will say this... i can only imagine that he (DP) is not coming back. It's a shame, he seemed to be a great kid, a pillar of our team since he (DP) arrived and helped us get to two runs in the NCAAs. Regardless of all the various circumstances everyone had invented/assumed, he (DP) can BALL and i wish him the best...
i wish it could have been four years with my alma matter...
the team i bleed for...
The team i love...
The team my father raised me on...
And the team i raise my kids on...
GO UD
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10-07-2015, 07:24 AM
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If you (31770) can paste one of my (King Rollo) quotes showing where I (King Rollo) defended her (her) or argued for her (her), I (King Rollo) will agree and 'thank' you (31770). Because I (King Rollo) have said multiple times that she (her) is just as guilty as he (DP).
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10-07-2015, 07:24 AM
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Major General
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Originally Posted by FlyerNation23
Not one person from the UD team (players,coaches, student managers, Dayton basketball accounts) liked or commented on his video. All of the players and majority of the coaches have a Instagram account. Why wouldn't somebody on the team like this photo if he was indeed returning?
I think he is suing the school, told the team goodbye, and looking at other schools now. Based on Twitter profile, he is erasing UD from his memory and not associating himself with anything UD
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One could only hope that he is indeed suing UD- I know I would. His reputation has been ruined. What other choice does he have? I wish him nothing but the best. I suspect he'll land at another school out west, somewhere hot and dry just east of California where he'll sit out a year and help that team towards a national championship. I don't think he did anything that any other person on this board hasn't done at a similar age.
Posted via Mobile Device
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10-07-2015, 07:29 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo
If you (31770) can paste one of my (King Rollo) quotes showing where I (King Rollo) defended her (her) or argued for her (her), I (King Rollo) will agree and 'thank' you (31770). Because I (King Rollo) have said multiple times that she (her) is just as guilty as he (DP).
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missed my point...
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10-07-2015, 07:30 AM
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Regardless of what our team did last year in the face of adversity, this loss hurts more. Pierre was either our #1 or #2 best player. This was going to be a special year with so much to look forward to. IMO, our best team possibly I've lived to see with a legit shot to make a huge run in the tournament. Legit run meaning, final four potential and I don't throw those words around lightly because I'm a realist. This was the first time I've thought that in my lifetime as a UD fan.
Just another painful experience in the life of a Dayton basketball fan.
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10-07-2015, 08:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Buster Goode
Regardless of what our team did last year in the face of adversity, this loss hurts more. Pierre was either our #1 or #2 best player. This was going to be a special year with so much to look forward to. IMO, our best team possibly I've lived to see with a legit shot to make a huge run in the tournament. Legit run meaning, final four potential and I don't throw those words around lightly because I'm a realist. This was the first time I've thought that in my lifetime as a UD fan.
Just another painful experience in the life of a Dayton basketball fan.
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Not saying he was the best player but I think Scoochie was the player we could least afford to lose. Pierre was next.
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10-07-2015, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Buster Goode
Regardless of what our team did last year in the face of adversity, this loss hurts more. Pierre was either our #1 or #2 best player. This was going to be a special year with so much to look forward to. IMO, our best team possibly I've lived to see with a legit shot to make a huge run in the tournament. Legit run meaning, final four potential and I don't throw those words around lightly because I'm a realist. This was the first time I've thought that in my lifetime as a UD fan.
Just another painful experience in the life of a Dayton basketball fan.
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This sums up my feelings. Although, I don't think there's any doubt that he's our best player. His knack for getting the ball in the hoop around a lot of trees and then popping from beyond the arc was our most important part of the offense. He also was money at the FT line when the situation demanded it. And his rebounding is going to be missed terribly. Just thinking what he would do his senior season with some bigger guys in the lineup made me drool.
Yes, AM will adjust and get the most out this team, but getting the most with DP and without DP are two very, very different things.
If this is a decision that was made just to alleviate a .001 percent chance of causing legal issues or worse yet, ignored and not overturned to not contradict a bad decision by a kangaroo court, my love of UD basketball will take a little bit of a hit. Dammit, I've been following them for the past 48 seasons and it just really hurts when they finally give me a feeling that a final 4 isn't beyond the realm of possibility before the season starts.
Yes, my feelings are selfish, I also feel for DP and am quite embarrassed that he comes here from Canada and gets royally screwed by the school that he's given so much to.
And this feeling won't go away after the season is over. This could have ramifications that last forever if AM feels that he's getting the shaft on this and/or talented recruits decide that being accused of rape and having the school suspend based on he said/she said evidence just doesn't give them a warm secure feeling.
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10-07-2015, 09:08 AM
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It comes down to a terribly leadership decision by Dr. Dan.
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10-07-2015, 09:16 AM
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What's the next step? Is there a deadline approaching where he must be eligible by? Does anyone know if he has a meeting with UD? Is there a court date with his lawyer and UD?
As much as I love seeing people go back and forth about their own moral interpretation of 'right vs wrong', when it comes to the facts and future, what's the next step or announcement? Anyone have any idea?
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10-07-2015, 09:22 AM
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If we have Final 4 potential and DP comes back, then we still have final 4 potential. He'll miss 10 games? If we have final 4 potential, then we should run right over the A10 and at least make the finals of the conference tournament. That will get us in even if we're .500 until DP returns. Then we're full strength for the Final 4 run.
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10-07-2015, 09:27 AM
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This 12/22 ship has sailed. DP is not coming back. He has moved on from UD and the team has moved on from him. It is time for us to move past this and look forward to the players we have.
1 month away from exhibition game! Let's start focusing on the 2015 team and not Pierre.
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10-07-2015, 09:37 AM
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Sorry FlyerNation23, your so called "move on" theory does not correct the mistakes that were made by the University. From Student Boards to assanine rules in the Code of Conduct to Dr. Dan's disappearance. Corrections need to be made or history will keep repeating itself.
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10-07-2015, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by FlyerNation23
This 12/22 ship has sailed. DP is not coming back. He has moved on from UD and the team has moved on from him. It is time for us to move past this and look forward to the players we have.
1 month away from exhibition game! Let's start focusing on the 2015 team and not Pierre.
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You seem pretty sure? Do you have details, have you spoken to DP? Do you know what the players are saying? If not, just more speculation? Just wondering?
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10-07-2015, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by FlyerNation23
Not one person from the UD team (players,coaches, student managers, Dayton basketball accounts) liked or commented on his video. All of the players and majority of the coaches have a Instagram account. Why wouldn't somebody on the team like this photo if he was indeed returning?
I think he is suing the school, told the team goodbye, and looking at other schools now. Based on Twitter profile, he is erasing UD from his memory and not associating himself with anything UD
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This picture he just posted on his Twitter might say something different, the logo on his shirt look familiar?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQsGjvnWwAEWZMs.jpg
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10-07-2015, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by College B-Ball Fan
You seem pretty sure? Do you have details, have you spoken to DP? Do you know what the players are saying? If not, just more speculation? Just wondering?
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He is as sure as he was when he posted this 5 days ago.
Originally Posted by FlyerNation23
My source at UD has told me that do not rule out the option of Pierre scenario following the same path as Kavanuagh in which DP would sit out this year and return next year. While I want Peirre to play now and play this year, if it shapes up this way - next year could be really special.
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10-07-2015, 09:57 AM
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A really unfortunate occurrence...judging by the incident report, sure seems like he is getting a really, really bad deal.
UD really needs to examine the way they handle cases like this and make some big big changes to their procedures.
Losing him really hurts very, very bad.
Hopefully both present and future players remember this and learn from it.
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10-07-2015, 09:58 AM
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I have heard various updates from various people on campus. Last week, I heard a return next year was possible. Over the weekend, I heard he packed up his stuff and will not be returning.
One fact we do know: DP twitter was full of Dayton basketball related tweets as of last week and he removed all of them over the weekend. He also changed his profile picture and twitter bio too. DP did post a Instagram video wearing Dayton shorts but he has been given free gear for past 3.5 years so probably majority of his clothes is Dayton related.
In regards to the picture that DP posted in Twitter, notice the shirt is inside out?
I would love to see DP come back and I agree UD screwed up this whole process and dropped the ball on this. I am just saying that we have 12 scholarship guys who are currently on the team and 1 month away from the season starting. I would hate to go through the entire season saying "What if"? We owe it to Archie and the team to be supportive of them and hope they step up and have another special season
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10-07-2015, 10:02 AM
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General of the Air Force
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Originally Posted by FlyerNation23
I have heard various updates from various people on campus. Last week, I heard a return next year was possible. Over the weekend, I heard he packed up his stuff and will not be returning.
One fact we do know: DP twitter was full of Dayton basketball related tweets as of last week and he removed all of them over the weekend. He also changed his profile picture and twitter bio too. DP did post a Instagram video wearing Dayton shorts but he has been given free gear for past 3.5 years so probably majority of his clothes is Dayton related.
In regards to the picture that DP posted in Twitter, notice the shirt is inside out?
I would love to see DP come back and I agree UD screwed up this whole process and dropped the ball on this. I am just saying that we have 12 scholarship guys who are currently on the team and 1 month away from the season starting. I would hate to go through the entire season saying "What if"? We owe it to Archie and the team to be supportive of them and hope they step up and have another special season
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So your answer to College B-Ball Fan is that you are just speculating like everyone else.
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10-07-2015, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by The Fly
In regards to the picture that DP posted in Twitter, notice the shirt is inside out?
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Uh, if it were inside/out, you'd be reading Dayton backwards. Just saying ...
Last edited by The Fly; 10-07-2015 at 10:07 AM..
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10-07-2015, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by The Fly
Uh, if it were inside/out, you'd be reading Dayton backwards. Just saying ...
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Uh, it is inside out, since the wording on the wall behind DP is backwards. Just sayin' . . .
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQsGjvnWwAEWZMs.jpg
Last edited by N2663R; 10-07-2015 at 10:23 AM..
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10-07-2015, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Buster Goode
Regardless of what our team did last year in the face of adversity, this loss hurts more. Pierre was either our #1 or #2 best player. This was going to be a special year with so much to look forward to. IMO, our best team possibly I've lived to see with a legit shot to make a huge run in the tournament. Legit run meaning, final four potential and I don't throw those words around lightly because I'm a realist. This was the first time I've thought that in my lifetime as a UD fan.
Just another painful experience in the life of a Dayton basketball fan.
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There are at least 20 teams every year that could legitimately make the final 4 with just the right amount of luck and seeding. I think UD was finally in that group this year, even if it was only a 2% chance. Did I expect it? No. But it was finally POSSIBLE.
I feel like a Browns / Indians / Cavs fan. Oh, wait, I am.
Originally Posted by FlyerNation23
I would hate to go through the entire season saying "What if"? We owe it to Archie and the team to be supportive of them and hope they step up and have another special season
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Bad news for you, the whole season will be filled with "what if" after every game. It's not like when Kav got kicked off. DP was our best all-around player. Every game we lose will be "what if" and every game we win will be "great win, all things considered."
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10-07-2015, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by 224
What's the next step? Is there a deadline approaching where he must be eligible by? Does anyone know if he has a meeting with UD? Is there a court date with his lawyer and UD?
As much as I love seeing people go back and forth about their own moral interpretation of 'right vs wrong', when it comes to the facts and future, what's the next step or announcement? Anyone have any idea?
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From a purely "operational" standpoint, your deadline question is the most important. Is there any way DP can play before 12/22 (if he wants to)? First, Team DP, UD and its legal brain trust, and the complainant would probably all have to agree somehow, someway, that they are OK with DP returning to UD before 12/22. I would also assume that UD would have to be VERY comfortable with, however that determination was made, fits within the parameters of Title IX (good luck with that). If that scenario cannot be accomplished, I assume the next step would be to find a legal remedy that would at least temporarily allow DP to return to UD (no one has seen anything like that happen yet). Once either of those play out, you then need to determine if UD rules and NCAA rules would permit DP to enroll and rejoin the team.
I'm sure I've probably missed about a dozen other issues that need to be addressed, so you need to either start drinking heavily, or praying heavily, . . . or both.
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10-07-2015, 11:56 AM
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And yet, without Kavanaugh, 99% chance UD doesn't even make the NCAA Tourney in 2014, and thus does not make a run to the NCAA Regional Title Game, etc. Sorry Gazoo, but Kavs (and that's Mr. Kavanaugh to you peasant rollo(ver) and go back to being an academia follower), made that run possible. Sure many of you, like Archie Miller, at the beginning of 2013-14 season, attempted, in-correctly, to throw Kavs (#35) under the proverbial "he cannot play bus"; as it turns out, he saved the season, and the program from what was otherwise a serious NCAA Run drought of 30yrs. Archie misused Kavs for the first two months of that season; yanking him in the first 1-2 minutes of every game, solely because a post player from another team scored one basket, etc..
So, perhaps Kavs was not seen as the best player on the team, but without an experienced, relatively productive, big body filling and defending the lane, and providing reasonable offense, then that run never happens, and likely there would not have even been an NCAA tourney appearance. But don't think Pierre's absence wont be felt in much of the same way...it likely will. I would not be surprised to the Flyers at 6-6 after non-conference season ends. The non-conference slate is a reasonable "tall order".
The only way the Flyers avoid that is if Cooke and Big Steve are instantly ready. Otherwise, stay tuned for the moaning and groaning.
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10-07-2015, 12:03 PM
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Posted without comment. Just rumors, but usually when there's smoke there's fire:
https://twitter.com/Cdn_Ballers/stat...rc=twsrc%5Etfw
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10-07-2015, 12:08 PM
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On a similar not, if UD had not falsely and erroneously accused and suspended Kavanaugh for crime he didn't commit; then he isn't even on the 2013-14 team, as he was supposed to gone and graduated. Instead, the administration and coaching, get to take credit for an NCAA Great Eight Run, that by all means, wouldn't even have existed, if they didn't sting Kavanaugh. Amazing!!!!!!
Coupled with the Pierre situation, a dangerous president is potentially in-place to suspend an experienced star player for their senior year, only to later say, hey look what a god job as administrators we are doing!!!????????????????????
They should be saying thank you Kavanaugh for dating and hooking up with the right wrong Trixie on campus, so that we can finally show the Big East President's how good are program really is..........GO FIGURE. and, GO FLYERS! Especially you star senior players who we will gladly throw under the bus, and accuse of a rape you didn't commit. Wow, what managerial technique...rollo probably lectures on this unique UD academic and administrative formula.
Next thing you know, you will see players like (i.e. Jordan Siebert) in videos with victim advocate; or, in this case the 20yr old officers of the UD CoC. Sick!!!!!!!!!!!!11
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10-07-2015, 12:14 PM
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My guess is that he will go for a waiver immediately(like Wells got). He could possibly play with another team for the next semester/quarter.
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10-07-2015, 12:36 PM
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I concede. Didn't see that on first glance. Just saying ... you're right. :-)
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10-07-2015, 12:43 PM
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No, where there is smoke, generally that's from only one of the few smokers left, and it's weed not tobacco. And who the hell is Sonny Bairos? And simply another rumor with zero credibility.
Rumors start from:
TV talking heads.
Any one of a million sports twits.
A classmate who doesn't want him back.
Her father.
One of our opponents who hope to hell it's true someday.
Hillary "it's in one of my emails" Clinton.
(Add your own stupid baseless source right here - or just make another uninformed guess)
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10-07-2015, 12:47 PM
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We will know soon enough if some things leak out from schools he is talking to. In the meantime there is nothing but speculation.
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10-07-2015, 12:51 PM
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Jeff Goodman - "Dayton's Dyshawn Pierre is suing the school following suspension due to sexual assault allegations. His Lawyer told ESPN. Story coming"
Last edited by FlyerNation23; 10-07-2015 at 01:09 PM..
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10-07-2015, 01:02 PM
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David Jablonski @DavidPJablonski · 3m3 minutes ago Columbus, OH
Lawsuit seeks "to allow Dyshawn to return immediately to the University."
David Jablonski @DavidPJablonski · 2m2 minutes ago
In statement, Pierre says his dream of bringing national championship to Dayton has been threatened. Calls situation "grossly unfair."
David Jablonski @DavidPJablonski · 1m1 minute ago
Dyshawn Pierre in statement: "I want justice and a return to my normal life."
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10-07-2015, 01:10 PM
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To the Lawyers on the Board
Will UD counter sue? Whose actions damaged whom?
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10-07-2015, 01:15 PM
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10-07-2015, 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Alberto Strasse
Will UD counter sue? Whose actions damaged whom?
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For what? I don't really get why he's suing the school. If it gets him back on the team great, but the school should be able to kick out any student it wants for any reason (not saying they should, but that they have the right to).
The real person Pierre should be suing is the girl.
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10-07-2015, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by FlyerNation23
Jeff Goodman - "Dayton's Dyshawn Pierre is suing the school following suspension due to sexual assault allegations. His Lawyer told ESPN. Story coming"
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UD now officially in a PR lose/lose.
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10-07-2015, 01:29 PM
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I hope Pierre nails the University. He needs to sue the girl too. Totally idiotic for the University to dig their heels in. So much to lose.
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10-07-2015, 01:40 PM
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10-07-2015, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Alberto Strasse
Will UD counter sue? Whose actions damaged whom?
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In other words, will UD pour gasoline on a raging tire fire?
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10-07-2015, 01:58 PM
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Dyshawn Peirre: "What has been done to me has been grossly unfair. The allegations against me are false. And now, I find myself with my reputation tarnished, my schooling interrupted and my dream of helping the basketball team win a national championship being threatened. I want justice and I want a return to my normal life."
How does President Current, other high up UD officials, or big-time donors ignore this statement? DO THE RIGHT THING UD AND LET HIM PLAY
Why is it worth for UD to stick to their initial decision and keep him suspended? Is it worth paying a player big money, making your star coach upset, frustrating thousands of fans, killing a potential dream season to keep the Title 9 office happy? SOMEBODY AT UD NEEDS TO GET A BACKBONE AND STEP UP!!
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10-07-2015, 02:20 PM
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No They Don't
Originally Posted by hawkoooo
For what? I don't really get why he's suing the school. If it gets him back on the team great, but the school should be able to kick out any student it wants for any reason (not saying they should, but that they have the right to).
The real person Pierre should be suing is the girl.
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True, he should be suing the complainant. However, I wouldn't exactly refer to her as a girl. She is an adult woman.
But, more to your point, UD has no right to "just simply kick students out because they want to". I know what you mean, and yes, they do have the power to remove folks in certain incredible ethical scenarios; but this isn't one of those situations. Reasonable, accurate, appropriate, and credible thresholds must exist. Clearly, they don't
And no, UD, or any other college or university, does not have the right to participate in wich hunting and man hating, solely because another 21 year old says so. That is not an acceptable threshold...not even close. Let's say she accused him, or any other student, of something other than sexual issues, should we take her word for it, under similar kinds of circumstances, facts, evidence, and/or lack thereof? Absolutely not! What if she simply said he was drinking, and she didn't like it? Would that be good enough to kick him out? No, it wouldn't be. Largely because, it is fundamentally un-fair, but additionally because of the dangerous precedent in which any student can be falsely accused of anything, and kicked out, solely based on the second rate testimony of other twenty year old students. Not good enough!!
In both the Pierre and Kavanaugh cases, UD purposefully stacked the deck, and then wonders why there is an issue. You cannot treat one group of students one way, and another group of students differently than that, and somehow think that does not equate to a problem, is further evidence of a catastrophic administrative problem. It reeks of disparate impact. Just imagine the numeric count of cases brought before the CoC of students going out drinking, dancing, and whatever else, that were not suspend for a semester. That number is practically unknown...huge list of such cases.
UD does not, and should not, have the right to kick students out for the heck of it. Otherwise, it is mass chaos. If Pierre had said she touched him wrong, would she be kicked out? We know the answer is no.
UD cannot show actual damage from anything Pierre did to them, because they have no evidence of it. That in itself is the reason they are put in such an awkward position with his suspension and any law suits against them. They have virtually zero evidence to counter the claims against them. And, the only evidence they might have, opens them up to extreme comparable scrutiny for how they handled any previous cases, including the other witnesses and complainants in Pierre's case, and quite frankly the Kavanaugh case will now get thrown back at them again, because it demonstrates a wrongful conduct habit on the part of UD.
Pierre is suing the right people, and he will come out a head, even if he never comes back to Dayton. If I am Pierre's lawyer, then I say don't do to my client what you incorrectly did to Mr. Kavanaugh. Shame on you for that, and shame on you for not learning your lesson, and now trying to do the same to Mr. Pierre.
Any negative ruling against UD, and the Administration has really earned it.
Last edited by Beatty Town Coach; 10-07-2015 at 02:26 PM..
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10-07-2015, 02:43 PM
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Being a bureaucrat generally means never having to admit you're wrong or say that you're sorry.
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10-07-2015, 02:47 PM
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My guess is that if UD refuses to reinstate him then he will petition the NCAA for a waiver and transfer somewhere else and be eligible to play next semester/quarter.
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10-07-2015, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Sea Bass
My guess is that if UD refuses to reinstate him then he will petition the NCAA for a waiver and transfer somewhere else and be eligible to play next semester/quarter.
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He would wait until next season. Unrealistic to think he would step onto the court with a completely new team and make the kind of impact he is capable of making. Plus, I don't think the NCAA would act that fast. It would be best for him to get in with a new program before next summer and then have all summer to work out with the rest of the team. Have a full year to contribute in the way we were expecting him to impact this year.
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10-07-2015, 03:08 PM
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Just read the Statement. Beautifully played by Ginsberg.
Gave it to ESPN.
Sea Bass is right. If the UD Admin fights back, he will simply transfer. He is saying the right things in the public eye...
unproven, grossly unfair
reputation tarnished
dream ruined... to bring a championship to the Univ of Dayton
I want justice, and a return to normalcy
Who is posting on another thread, about the Team kicked him off and not the Univ hearing Board? Is that true, and what does that mean, if so?
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10-07-2015, 03:09 PM
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I very much look forward to UDs official statement regarding the law suit. On one side they have Pierre and his high priced lawyer, on the other is Title IX and women's lib groups...and in the middle is their CoC and Review Board.
Sh*t, meet fan!
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10-07-2015, 03:17 PM
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"Who is posting on another thread, about the Team kicked him off and not the Univ hearing Board? Is that true, and what does that mean, if so?[/QUOTE]
Clarified in the other thread, that comment was not about Pierre, but a reference to the article that was posted about Rutgers.
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10-07-2015, 03:29 PM
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General
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo
For what? I don't really get why he's suing the school. If it gets him back on the team great, but the school should be able to kick out any student it wants for any reason (not saying they should, but that they have the right to).
The real person Pierre should be suing is the girl.
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yes and no Hawkoo.
this statement is intended to have UD look bad in the press and play it out in public opinion. If i'm interpreting properly... if Dyshawn gets back to practicing and on the team in the next 10 days.... the lawsuit will be dropped.
It will have achieved the aim here. To play and get his life restored, and reputation on the mend.
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10-07-2015, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by xubrew
Title IX, in and of itself, is not the problem. It's actually a very good thing that has done far more good than bad. It prevents sex based discrimination (both men and women) at educational institutions that receive federal funding, and is applied very broadly.
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I'm sure when Title IX was introduced in the 70s that it was with good intentions and addressing a specific problem at the time. Of course regulations morph overtime especially when the original problem they address is 'solved'. With females making up more than half of enrollment, I'm not quite sure there is a need to police higher education for sexual discrimination.
Now, we have a federal law with broad scope being wielded by an agency that provides substantial direct and indirect funding to essentially all institutions of higher education. The highly regulated and expensive business of providing higher education seems ripe for technological disintermediation.
Hopefully, the case of DP gets resolved fairly one way or the other, but I'm not holding my breath.
Old article on the subject:
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/ed...rticle/2555869
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10-07-2015, 03:43 PM
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What do think now? Better call Sonny.
Just released:
"And now I find myself with my reputation tarnished, my schooling interrupted and my dream of helping the basketball team win a national championship being threatened. I want justice, and I want a return to my normal life."
Earlier:
"Sources told ESPN that Pierre has been suspended but is optimistic of returning to the team for its Dec. 22 game against Miami (Ohio)."
Does that really sound like a man that is wanting to leave? Schooling interrupted doesn't mean terminated. Dream....threatened doesn't mean abandoned.
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10-07-2015, 03:47 PM
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Come on people, haven't you ever seen a dyslectic HS gym before? Just saying...
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10-07-2015, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Beatty Town Coach
And yet, without Kavanaugh, 99% chance UD doesn't even make the NCAA Tourney in 2014, and thus does not make a run to the NCAA Regional Title Game, etc. Sorry Gazoo, but Kavs (and that's Mr. Kavanaugh to you peasant rollo(ver) and go back to being an academia follower), made that run possible. Sure many of you, like Archie Miller, at the beginning of 2013-14 season, attempted, in-correctly, to throw Kavs (#35) under the proverbial "he cannot play bus"; as it turns out, he saved the season, and the program from what was otherwise a serious NCAA Run drought of 30yrs. Archie misused Kavs for the first two months of that season; yanking him in the first 1-2 minutes of every game, solely because a post player from another team scored one basket, etc..
So, perhaps Kavs was not seen as the best player on the team, but without an experienced, relatively productive, big body filling and defending the lane, and providing reasonable offense, then that run never happens, and likely there would not have even been an NCAA tourney appearance. But don't think Pierre's absence wont be felt in much of the same way...it likely will. I would not be surprised to the Flyers at 6-6 after non-conference season ends. The non-conference slate is a reasonable "tall order".
The only way the Flyers avoid that is if Cooke and Big Steve are instantly ready. Otherwise, stay tuned for the moaning and groaning.
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Originally Posted by Beatty Town Coach
On a similar not, if UD had not falsely and erroneously accused and suspended Kavanaugh for crime he didn't commit; then he isn't even on the 2013-14 team, as he was supposed to gone and graduated. Instead, the administration and coaching, get to take credit for an NCAA Great Eight Run, that by all means, wouldn't even have existed, if they didn't sting Kavanaugh. Amazing!!!!!!
Coupled with the Pierre situation, a dangerous president is potentially in-place to suspend an experienced star player for their senior year, only to later say, hey look what a god job as administrators we are doing!!!????????????????????
They should be saying thank you Kavanaugh for dating and hooking up with the right wrong Trixie on campus, so that we can finally show the Big East President's how good are program really is..........GO FIGURE. and, GO FLYERS! Especially you star senior players who we will gladly throw under the bus, and accuse of a rape you didn't commit. Wow, what managerial technique...rollo probably lectures on this unique UD academic and administrative formula.
Next thing you know, you will see players like (i.e. Jordan Siebert) in videos with victim advocate; or, in this case the 20yr old officers of the UD CoC. Sick!!!!!!!!!!!!11
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You're kind of freaking out on us here, BTC. All I was saying is that Kav wasn't key to the team that would have been his senior year squad. DP is key to this year's team.
IF DP returned next year (HUGE "IF") we would have a monster squad, so yes, in the end it would be even better than if he played this year. I just don't think that's one of the options.
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10-07-2015, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo
You're kind of freaking out on us here, BTC.
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I'm nominating BTC for the open position of President - Rollo Fan Club.
I need someone to second the motion and it's a done deal.
__________________
I shaved my balls for this?
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10-07-2015, 04:28 PM
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I Am A Statistical God
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Originally Posted by Avid Flyer
Come on people, haven't you ever seen a dyslectic HS gym before? Just saying...
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Does Tom Gola Arena count?
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10-07-2015, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Avid Flyer
Come on people, haven't you ever seen a dyslectic HS gym before? Just saying...
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Actually, I found out that the picture was taken with a new iPhone 6S. Those new cameras are amazing!!
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10-07-2015, 05:53 PM
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Last edited by N2663R; 10-07-2015 at 05:55 PM..
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10-07-2015, 06:15 PM
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Possible outcomes of this situation…..
1. Pierre is reinstated and is eligible to play immediately.
This has virtually no chance of happening because it would amount to an admission of guilt for UD. The university would be essentially saying they were wrong and the process was unfair to Pierre. It would open them up to additional lawsuits.
2. Pierre does return on Dec. 22nd as was originally reported.
Again, I think this has almost no chance of occurring. This lawsuit will most likely be dragged out for months, and I can’t imagine UD allowing Pierre to play while he is engaged in a lawsuit with the university.
3. Pierre and UD agree to settle this lawsuit for an undisclosed amount and Pierre plays his senior year (ie next year) at another university.
DING….DING….DING….. My guess is this is exactly what will happen. (Please see Dez Wells..) Both UD and Pierre save face. UD doesn’t have to admit wrong doing. Pierre gets a nice chunk of $$.
What do we Flyer Fans win? Well, we win an all expenses round trip paid vacation to Disappointment Land on Missed Opportunities Airways.
What a huge lost opportunity for UD to finally climb into the national contender conversation. As an added bonus, I’m guessing this might finally send Archie out the door. Finally, we miss an opportunity to make another deep run in the tournament and put more pressure on the Big East expansion conversation.
And for what….because some 21 year old woman feels bad about cheating on her boyfriend….You’re an adult….take some responsibility for your own actions lady!
PS….UD knew about this situation for 5 months and held off informing UD fans until after season tickets and Florida packages were sold……
I’m so mad at UD right now that I hope Pierre fights the university until the bitter end and fleeces them for a cr@p load of $$$$. This is coming from a UD season ticket holder of 22 years and someone that gives to the athletic department annually.
We live in a world now where a young man’s future and reputation can be ruined solely based on the word of one person. No, evidence is required. You are guilty until proven innocent. For the rest of Pierre’s life, anytime someone Google’s his name the words “sexual assault” and “rape” will be linked to him. As for this young adult woman, she is allowed to move on with her life totally anonymous to the public. I find it pretty scary how easy it is to ruin a young man’s reputation in this day and age. The “Politically Correct/ Women’s rights” pendulum has swung way too far to the left. Where is the due process? Where is the justice? It's all cr@p!
UD you are just plain wrong about this situation just like Duke lacrosse and Virginia fraternity cases.
Last edited by Gem City; 10-07-2015 at 06:32 PM..
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10-07-2015, 06:25 PM
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Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan
OK, struggling to find a reason UD did this...
Could UD's hands be tied by Title IX Bullcrap? I have no idea, but find this part of the quote from the attorney interesting.
the University of Dayton subjected Dyshawn to fundamentally defective and unfair University disciplinary procedures orchestrated to appease a broken Department of Education policy. We will be challenging the University's handling of this matter in the near future.
Could this eventually end up as being more a challange to department of education policy, and not so much UD?
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I still stick to my original question / prediction from over 2 weeks ago. Before this is all said and done this will be more of a test of the "broken" policy in general, ie Title 9 and how all universitys handle cases such as this.
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10-07-2015, 06:28 PM
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And this from CBS Sports:
"Pierre's goal is simple: to re-join the men's basketball team and finish his education at Dayton."
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10-07-2015, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan
I still stick to my original question / prediction from over 2 weeks ago. Before this is all said and done this will be more of a test of the "broken" policy in general, ie Title 9 and how all universitys handle cases such as this.
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You are exactly right the real bad guy here is the federal government and title IX
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10-07-2015, 06:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Figgie123
Does Tom Gola Arena count?
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Actually they are the model for it.
Last edited by Avid Flyer; 10-07-2015 at 07:03 PM..
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10-07-2015, 07:27 PM
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Gem City wrote: Possible outcomes of this situation…..
1. Pierre is reinstated and is eligible to play immediately.
This has virtually no chance of happening because it would amount to an admission of guilt for UD. The university would be essentially saying they were wrong and the process was unfair to Pierre. It would open them up to additional lawsuits.
How is this an admission of guilt?? UD has a (Title IX) process in place. UD states “The University of Dayton’s processes are in compliance with U.S. Department of Education requirements. The University does not comment on pending litigation.” You can contest the Finding, you can contest the Punishment, but you will have a hard time contesting the process. The Finding and Punishment were decided by 3-5 trained community members and students, not UD. UD would like nothing better than to have a judge (quickly) decide that either the finding and or the punishment were inappropriate so EVERYBODY can move on.
What do we Flyer Fans win? Well, we win an all expenses round trip paid vacation to Disappointment Land on Missed Opportunities Airways.
This comment was funny
What a huge lost opportunity for UD to finally climb into the national contender conversation. As an added bonus, I’m guessing this might finally send Archie out the door. Finally, we miss an opportunity to make another deep run in the tournament and put more pressure on the Big East expansion conversation.
I'm sure AM is not happy about this, BUT, look at Zavier, Florida State, Rutgers, Penn State, Ohio State, etc, etc, etc. Kids get into big time trouble EVERYWHERE. Where is he going to go to avoid this, and would you really want to go to a program where "we take care of these things behind closed doors, wink, wink?"
PS….UD knew about this situation for 5 months and held off informing UD fans until after season tickets and Florida packages were sold……
Yes, but they did not know what the outcome was until the UHB met in September. They can't say "attention potential Florida Package Buyers, please be aware that one of the members of the team is facing a UHB hearing in September. We are not at liberty to say who and we are not at liberty to say what the offence is or what the possible outcome or consequences might be. Just so you know."
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10-07-2015, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo
I'm nominating BTC for the open position of President - Rollo Fan Club.
I need someone to second the motion and it's a done deal.
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I second
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10-07-2015, 09:38 PM
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Interesting post in the comments for the CBS story:
gruden3
my brother plays for this team... He says this is one of the nicest kids he's met and he still doesn't believe what happened
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Could just be someone claiming the Gruden name but Joey does have two brothers.
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10-07-2015, 09:48 PM
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Originally Posted by N2663R
How is this an admission of guilt?? UD has a (Title IX) process in place. UD states “The University of Dayton’s processes are in compliance with U.S. Department of Education requirements. The University does not comment on pending litigation.” You can contest the Finding, you can contest the Punishment, but you will have a hard time contesting the process. The Finding and Punishment were decided by 3-5 trained community members and students, not UD. UD would like nothing better than to have a judge (quickly) decide that either the finding and or the punishment were inappropriate so EVERYBODY can move on.
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UD can state that...but have they actually followed their own procedures? Having standards and procedures is one thing...following them is another.
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10-07-2015, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer
Just released:
"And now I find myself with my reputation tarnished, my schooling interrupted and my dream of helping the basketball team win a national championship being threatened. I want justice, and I want a return to my normal life."
Earlier:
"Sources told ESPN that Pierre has been suspended but is optimistic of returning to the team for its Dec. 22 game against Miami (Ohio)."
Does that really sound like a man that is wanting to leave? Schooling interrupted doesn't mean terminated. Dream....threatened doesn't mean abandoned.
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I'm giddy that DP is standing up for himself and suing UD. What a collection of complete ass clowns are running UD. I see the comments DP made as PR for himself (to likewise market himself) and steadfastly deny any wrongdoing ...as he should. He will not ever play for UD again- but I'm ok with it. UD ...talk about shooting yourself in the foot-repeatedly!
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10-07-2015, 10:33 PM
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I would hope UD would want to resolve this in a fair way rather than racking up huge legal bills and negative publicity. It seems this case would have the ability to be resolved quickly by those with authority at UD.
Instead, the initial statement released is disappointing and a bad sign. Everyone knows that what happened to DP is the wrong outcome, but instead UD wants to hide behind Title IX and its mandated procedures.
My hope is that the assigned judge orders UD, through a preliminary injunction, not to refuse DP from attending classes and enrolling at the university. That would seem to open up the opportunity of a settlement and would give UD the cover it apparently needs to do the right thing and stand up to the DOE if the DOE decides to investigate this later. Then UD can issue a statement clarifying that the action was taken because of the involvement of alcohol, not because of any other misconduct. Suspend DP for the exhibition and the first game, then move on.
Last edited by bigred; 10-07-2015 at 10:38 PM..
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10-07-2015, 10:44 PM
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they can suspend him after him graduates.
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10-07-2015, 10:45 PM
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Please people. UD does not want to "hide behind" title IX. UD does not want to kick out anyone, especially a talented basketball player who has helped raise the level of the program. UD was forced to make a tough choice because of circumstances that were not of their own making. It was born a lose-lose situation for UD.
Last edited by Fudd; 10-07-2015 at 10:47 PM..
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10-07-2015, 11:10 PM
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10-07-2015, 11:47 PM
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I second
Originally Posted by rollo
I'm nominating BTC for the open position of President - Rollo Fan Club.
I need someone to second the motion and it's a done deal.
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Bull****, you can be my wing man.
Okay, I second, and accept, but you cannot suspended me for any ole **** reason. No matter what SHE says. I want tenure; that way I can get everything wrong, and still keep my position of make-believe intellectual superiority. What a profession (how ironic) you have.
Rollo, are you sure you aren't the UD CoC adviser??????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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10-08-2015, 12:38 AM
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Couldn't read the whole report tonight, but what I was able to read was just appalling. The UM case was characterized by a near-complete lack of due process, and by University administrators (particularly Ms. Cowan) changing the evidence & testimony to match what must have been a pre-conceived notion of what "really" happened (and the truth be d@mned).
Also, coincidentally or not, I saw where Ms. Cowan was only at Michigan for a little over a year, and is now employed by the University of New Mexico. So, isn't that a crock of $hi+? She works at UM just long enough to totally ruin this kid's life, and then moves on to her next career stop before the kid's case can be settled. Unconscionable!
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Last edited by T-Bone 84; 10-08-2015 at 12:52 AM..
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10-08-2015, 03:40 AM
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Unfortunately, I can't see where DP's life will be returned to normal (at least in the short-term). If he resumes his college basketball career whether it be here or elsewhere, this cloud will no doubt follow him. You would have to be some kind of strong kid for this not to mentally rattle you. That said, I'd wonder how it would affect his game....
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10-08-2015, 06:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Buster Goode
Unfortunately, I can't see where DP's life will be returned to normal (at least in the short-term). If he resumes his college basketball career whether it be here or elsewhere, this cloud will no doubt follow him. You would have to be some kind of strong kid for this not to mentally rattle you. That said, I'd wonder how it would affect his game....
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I think he's mentally very strong (hence the lawsuit filing to CLEAR his name - this is put up or shut up time for UD hierarchy and "procedures") and I'd hate to be the first guy defending if he came back this year.
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10-08-2015, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo
I'm nominating BTC for the open position of President - Rollo Fan Club.
I need someone to second the motion and it's a done deal.
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I think you have it bass ackwards, I nominate rollo to be the official bag toter for BTC. BTC is a rock star!
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10-08-2015, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by oRed
I think you have it bass ackwards, I nominate rollo to be the official bag toter for BTC. BTC is a rock star!
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King > Rock Star
Plus, rock stars fade away...Kings only get stronger!
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10-08-2015, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer
And this from CBS Sports:
"Pierre's goal is simple: to re-join the men's basketball team and finish his education at Dayton."
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I don't mean to squash your hopes and dreams, but, practically speaking this is the way lawsuits are fashioned. Ask for something you know will not happen but appears to be fair and reasonable, thus allowing you to drag it out for a long time (lawyer $$) and ask for even more money as a settlement (because the more time that passes, the more impossible the request becomes, and thus the more "unfair").
"Pierre's goal is simple: sue for a truckload of money and punish UD for being a bunch of cowardly ninnies." Doesn't ring as true with a jury. Instead you ask for something that makes you appear to be a reasonable and innocent victim. The only way UD agrees to his demand is to totally back down, lose face, people get fired (they should), the federal government opens a new set of lawsuits (??), etc.
It's MORE messy to comply with his seemingly simple request. Thus, he virtually guarantees a big payout. Just my opinion.
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10-08-2015, 11:13 AM
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DP's immediate goals are to either get an immediate reinstatement to the U and the mens bball team, or get an immediate wavier to transfer and play at another U.
The NCAA has already been notified and are currently involved.
Ginsburg is not sitting on his arse. We will know by the weekend which way the wind blows.
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10-08-2015, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo
I don't mean to squash your hopes and dreams, but, practically speaking this is the way lawsuits are fashioned. Ask for something you know will not happen but appears to be fair and reasonable, thus allowing you to drag it out for a long time (lawyer $$) and ask for even more money as a settlement (because the more time that passes, the more impossible the request becomes, and thus the more "unfair").
"Pierre's goal is simple: sue for a truckload of money and punish UD for being a bunch of cowardly ninnies." Doesn't ring as true with a jury. Instead you ask for something that makes you appear to be a reasonable and innocent victim. The only way UD agrees to his demand is to totally back down, lose face, people get fired (they should), the federal government opens a new set of lawsuits (??), etc.
It's MORE messy to comply with his seemingly simple request. Thus, he virtually guarantees a big payout. Just my opinion.
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Yes. There are 3 threats of monetary satisfaction at the end of the suit.
If this goes to trial, those numbers will be presented.
And personally i don't think one of the 3 will be a small number. So it is in the best interest of the Univ. to settle this. So the way i read the suit is we want to be reinstated, get my life back, and help UD win a championship (Pierre speaking).
(if not, x, y, z will happen. However the xyx are not set out specifically, which i think is super smart of the lawyer).
In court,this case is a loser for the Univ. Too many incorrect things happened in the process of the interviews and facts leading up the UHB hearing. They 'd actually be smart to settle , or minimize the punishment to 3 games.
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10-08-2015, 12:24 PM
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I just wanted to point this out from the article....
They are starting to push back. In the past three years, men found responsible for sexual assault on campus have filed more than three dozen cases against schools. They argue that their due process rights have been violated and say they have been victims of gender discrimination under Title IX.
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Title IX, in and of itself, is not the problem. The ultimate irony is that Title IX is enabling the men who have sued on the grounds that their rights have been violated and that they have been discriminated against to win their cases. I blame the universities because I think the vast majority of them don't have the proper understanding of what Title IX is, who it protects, what it protects them from, how it protects them, and why it protects them. I mean....how ridiculous is it that a university jumps into action because of what they think Title IX is, but then ultimately ends up losing a lawsuit because they violated the Title IX rights of the person who was accused??
I kind of made this point earlier, but if a woman accuses a man of sexual misconduct and is immediately thought of as being a liar until she is able to prove herself truthful, and furthermore the procedures in place basically make it more difficult to prove she is being truthful, then she is being discriminated against, and this is a violation of Title IX.
But....
If a man being accused is automatically deamed guilty until proven innocent, and is furthermore prevented from proving their innocent, then they are being discriminated against and this violates Title IX. That's why so many are winning their lawsuits.
I'm staying out of this for obvious reasons, but did want to point that out.
Last edited by xubrew; 10-08-2015 at 12:28 PM..
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10-08-2015, 12:34 PM
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10-08-2015, 01:03 PM
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Really good article. Seems that we have a larger national problem at hand. A lot of those cases cited seem to line up with the way Pierre was treated. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
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10-08-2015, 01:28 PM
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The Athletic Director doubles as the Vice President and would obviously want Pierre reinstated....yet his boss, the new President has to save face by fighting the reinstatement. Add to that we have both the AD/VP and President being replaced, and I can see this mess only getting messier as old and new regimes have their say.
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10-08-2015, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by sw368407
Really good article. Seems that we have a larger national problem at hand. A lot of those cases cited seem to line up with the way Pierre was treated. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
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I believe it to be much more than a lot - more like most to nearly all. Unless there have been a lot of recent revisions the vast majority of the conduct codes have effective consent provisions. Nearly all say that consent in any previous act (not previous days but anything within the current encounter) is not consent for the next act. Some policies, particularly in east coast private schools require affirmative verbal consent. It's almost become get in writing.
Which is why the athletes receive the training they receive. It's almost a foregone conclusion this is the way these cases turn out unless you can prove consent.
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10-08-2015, 03:05 PM
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Gosh, this story just goes on and on and on...hard to keep up with all the posts.
So much for a boring off-season.
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10-08-2015, 03:18 PM
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Easily the most important and controversial subject on this basketball board in years. We have had some dufus bad actors in the program who didn't get keel hulled like Dyshawn, and he is one of the good guys.
The U needs to research the most graceful way out and take it and make it right for him.
There is nothing else worth reading re basketball until this is over. It's that important.
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