|
|
11-19-2020, 07:59 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Dallas
Posts: 14,788
Thanks: 10,086
Thanked 10,502 Times in 4,704 Posts
|
|
In the 2021 NBA Draft, with the 9th pick, .....
the New York Knicks select JALEN CRUTCHER from Dayton University !!!
|
11 UDPriders Offer Mad Props to San Diego Flyer For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
Bonziflyer (11-19-2020), ChampCar (11-19-2020), CvilleFlyer (11-19-2020), jack72 (11-19-2020), Lifelong Flyer Fan (11-19-2020), NJFlyr71 (11-19-2020), Radar (11-19-2020), rollo (11-19-2020), springborofan (11-19-2020), steverino015 (11-21-2020), TA111 (11-19-2020) |
11-19-2020, 09:48 AM
|
|
Colonel
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,461
Thanks: 423
Thanked 742 Times in 357 Posts
|
|
don't you mean 30th pick after Obi leads them to the best record in the NBA?
|
4 UDPriders Offer Mad Props to zmz723 For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-19-2020, 12:51 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Dallas
Posts: 14,788
Thanks: 10,086
Thanked 10,502 Times in 4,704 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by zmz723
don't you mean 30th pick after Obi leads them to the best record in the NBA?
|
No, Jalen would be gone by the 30th pick. Knicks have to trade up to #9
|
3 UDPriders Offer Mad Props to San Diego Flyer For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-19-2020, 05:39 PM
|
Colonel
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,650
Thanks: 1,818
Thanked 1,223 Times in 585 Posts
|
|
Chatman may even be in the top 60 next year after this coming season! After all, I think he and Crutcher may be the best guard tandem in college basketball. Chatman locked down the #1 pick Anthony Edwards in this years draft at Mauie to the tune of 2 for 10 shooting and 6 points in 28 minutes! I know I am getting ahead of myself but Stephen A. Smith has been yelling for guards, guards, guards.
My son is a UK graduate and he says Immanuel Quickley is very good. The Athletic today stated that Quickley is an intriguing prospect who surprised everyone in the draft by going so early. Myles Powell from Seton Hall is a very good shooting guard as well. I am officially a New York Knicks fan!
|
11-19-2020, 06:55 PM
|
|
Major General
|
|
Join Date: May 2014
Location: NJ Beach Livin'
Posts: 3,227
Thanks: 1,484
Thanked 1,912 Times in 1,082 Posts
|
|
Heh! Love the thread but but but ......
If this continues with a J and C being drafted having the 15th ranked recruiting class would be a great step backward.
Go Flyers!
|
11-19-2020, 09:43 PM
|
Lieutenant Colonel
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Texas
Posts: 852
Thanks: 539
Thanked 515 Times in 267 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by CvilleFlyer
Chatman may even be in the top 60 next year after this coming season! After all, I think he and Crutcher may be the best guard tandem in college basketball. Chatman locked down the #1 pick Anthony Edwards in this years draft at Mauie to the tune of 2 for 10 shooting and 6 points in 28 minutes! I know I am getting ahead of myself but Stephen A. Smith has been yelling for guards, guards, guards.
My son is a UK graduate and he says Immanuel Quickley is very good. The Athletic today stated that Quickley is an intriguing prospect who surprised everyone in the draft by going so early. Myles Powell from Seton Hall is a very good shooting guard as well. I am officially a New York Knicks fan!
|
I like Chatman but I’m willing to bet a drink we don’t hear his name on draft night from the commissioner
|
Mad Props to TX Flyer For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-20-2020, 08:17 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Dallas
Posts: 14,788
Thanks: 10,086
Thanked 10,502 Times in 4,704 Posts
|
|
Keeping it real..
The only way we get two drafted (and maybe even one), is if we go 29-2 again. After our spectacular season, Obi going at #8 was a bad joke. And he was deservedly in the headlines after every game.
|
11-20-2020, 02:32 PM
|
Colonel
|
|
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 1,521
Thanks: 125
Thanked 1,956 Times in 534 Posts
|
|
Obviously we all want Crutcher to get drafted, but the reality is that players his size rarely get drafted in the NBA.
This year the only 6'1" player drafted was Cassius Winston from Michigan State (53rd overall). He and Jalen have similar games (good pick-and-roll, good shooter, lack size) so that may be a fair comparison.
In the last five years, only 2 players 6'1" or shorter have gone in the first round (20th and 23rd overall). 8 others have gone in R2.
That means on average only 2 players 6'1" or shorter player per year get drafted. Some do make it as UFA (see Fred Van Fleet) but NBA teams rarely invest draft capital in players Jalen's size.
|
Mad Props to shapanud For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-21-2020, 09:23 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Bluffton, SC
Posts: 22,154
Thanks: 17,550
Thanked 10,124 Times in 5,860 Posts
|
|
Jalen named to Dick Vitale's fourth team pre-season.
UD did not make his Top40. Richmond is #29.
|
11-21-2020, 10:15 AM
|
Colonel
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,650
Thanks: 1,818
Thanked 1,223 Times in 585 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by jack72
Jalen named to Dick Vitale's fourth team pre-season.
UD did not make his Top40. Richmond is #29.
|
I wonder what team he predicted Obi Toppin on last year and if and where he had UD in his Top40!
|
11-21-2020, 12:27 PM
|
|
General
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,642
Thanks: 1,559
Thanked 4,578 Times in 2,405 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by shapanud
Obviously we all want Crutcher to get drafted, but the reality is that players his size rarely get drafted in the NBA.
This year the only 6'1" player drafted was Cassius Winston from Michigan State (53rd overall). He and Jalen have similar games (good pick-and-roll, good shooter, lack size) so that may be a fair comparison.
In the last five years, only 2 players 6'1" or shorter have gone in the first round (20th and 23rd overall). 8 others have gone in R2.
That means on average only 2 players 6'1" or shorter player per year get drafted. Some do make it as UFA (see Fred Van Fleet) but NBA teams rarely invest draft capital in players Jalen's size.
|
Yep. It's really going to be interesting and exciting to see what Jalen shows us in his senior season. But it would take a huge step up to be a 22 year old PG drafted in the 1st round of the NBA. I mean, 12 years ago, we had a guy named Brian Roberts who had to take the long route to the NBA, Jalen would have to surpass B-Rob by a lot to even be taken in the 2nd round.
|
11-21-2020, 04:49 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Dallas
Posts: 14,788
Thanks: 10,086
Thanked 10,502 Times in 4,704 Posts
|
|
We have to look closely at what Obi would have done without Jalen this season. Then the possibilities this year for Jalen start to crystallize. Jalen could dam near throw it anywhere and Obi would hang up there and snag and flush it. And that potential allowed Jalen many many uncontested teardrops and lane openings as well. The landscape is just not the same this season. The planets just don't line up the same.
|
11-21-2020, 04:56 PM
|
|
Brigadier General
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: greensboro, NC
Posts: 2,542
Thanks: 3,046
Thanked 1,086 Times in 640 Posts
|
|
it would make complete and total sense for
the Knicks to go after Jalen.... Jalen to Obi
is unstoppable....
They can make it so, we'll see
Go Flyers!
|
11-21-2020, 07:21 PM
|
Colonel
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Chicago suburbs
Posts: 1,173
Thanks: 1,649
Thanked 739 Times in 348 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer
. . . After our spectacular season, Obi going at #8 was a bad joke. . .
|
It seemed to me and possibly Obi, he is going exactly where he wanted to go.
(Even Barstool Sports loved the Knick pick)
|
11-22-2020, 01:44 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 13,583
Thanks: 1,835
Thanked 17,094 Times in 5,099 Posts
|
|
Think about this: Myles Powell, Markus Howard, and Devon Dotson went UNDRAFTED. Three of the most dynamic, explosive, unguardable backcourt players in the country that were on many postseason All-America teams.
Crutcher really has his work cut out for him to get drafted. Its tough to get drafted as a backcourt player unless you're 6-4+. The worry is defense and getting your shot off against the trees.
The NBA game is a fluid game anymore where the consummate Steve Nash or John Stockton point guard is a dying breed. Lebron James brings the ball up the court. James Harden is 6-5. Big dudes at all positions play in the NBA.
Rooting for JC but so much of the NBA is body type and projection. It half-way explains why Kostas was drafted despite much less on the resume'.
__________________
Hot shooting hides a multitude of sins.
Make everyone else's "one day" your "day one".
|
4 UDPriders Offer Mad Props to Chris R For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-22-2020, 08:37 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Dallas
Posts: 14,788
Thanks: 10,086
Thanked 10,502 Times in 4,704 Posts
|
|
Fingers crossed. Obi and Jalen need each other.
|
11-22-2020, 11:23 AM
|
|
Lieutenant General
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 4,417
Thanks: 65
Thanked 1,558 Times in 941 Posts
|
|
Crutcher has been a great player for us. He has no future in the NBA. He can’t play defense and is not big or strong enough to play there. Perhaps he will find work overseas.
Posted via Mobile Device
|
11-22-2020, 01:03 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Beavercreek
Posts: 3,941
Thanks: 4,069
Thanked 4,285 Times in 1,756 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by maddog07
Crutcher has been a great player for us. He has no future in the NBA. He can’t play defense and is not big or strong enough to play there. Perhaps he will find work overseas.
Posted via Mobile Device
|
I would not be so harsh on Jalen. His defense improved tremendously last year. Not a great defender but much better. I think that had to do with playing less minutes and having Rodney on the team.
The challenge for Jalen is what Chris described. The under 6'5" guard is getting rare and rarer. Mike Conley Jr. is an exception. Giannis at 6'11" plays like a point guard.
And, there are so many very good guards today. The A10 has lots of very, very good guards who won't sniff the NBA. The jump from college to NBA is huge especially guards.
Jalen is a very amazing player and has something unique. He could possibly, possibly land as a shooting guard because he has such a nice 3 point shot.
His chances to make the NBA are a long shot...
|
11-22-2020, 03:47 PM
|
|
Brigadier General
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: greensboro, NC
Posts: 2,542
Thanks: 3,046
Thanked 1,086 Times in 640 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by Chris R
Think about this: Myles Powell, Markus Howard, and Devon Dotson went UNDRAFTED. Three of the most dynamic, explosive, unguardable backcourt players in the country that were on many postseason All-America teams.
Crutcher really has his work cut out for him to get drafted. Its tough to get drafted as a backcourt player unless you're 6-4+. The worry is defense and getting your shot off against the trees.
The NBA game is a fluid game anymore where the consummate Steve Nash or John Stockton point guard is a dying breed. Lebron James brings the ball up the court. James Harden is 6-5. Big dudes at all positions play in the NBA.
Rooting for JC but so much of the NBA is body type and projection. It half-way explains why Kostas was drafted despite much less on the resume'.
|
Chris, think about this:
I don't think it matters whether he is drafted
or not... I hope so, however...
if I were with the Knicks and have done
my due diligence and watched tape of Flyer
games, I would have to be Mr McGoo
no to see how dynamic Jalen and Obi are..
if he is not drafted, could they not invite him...
either way, it seems to me if the Knicks
want Jalen, they can make it happen... Jalen
and Obi were unstoppable like no other two in
college basketball last year, period....
Go Flyers!
|
11-22-2020, 08:44 PM
|
|
General
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,642
Thanks: 1,559
Thanked 4,578 Times in 2,405 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by steverino015
Chris, think about this:
I don't think it matters whether he is drafted
or not... I hope so, however...
if I were with the Knicks and have done
my due diligence and watched tape of Flyer
games, I would have to be Mr McGoo
no to see how dynamic Jalen and Obi are..
if he is not drafted, could they not invite him...
either way, it seems to me if the Knicks
want Jalen, they can make it happen... Jalen
and Obi were unstoppable like no other two in
college basketball last year, period....
Go Flyers!
|
It doesn't work that way. It just doesn't. If it did, every NBA team taking a star offensive big man out of college would also go after the PG that fed him. Jalen Crutcher had chemistry with Obi because he was the guy that was assigned the job to have that chemistry. If there are better more NBA qualified PGs out there, they will develop chemistry with Obi also if they are on his team. You don't get to the NBA just because you developed chemistry with the NCAA player of the year, you have to carve out your own accomplishments whether you're feeding an Obi or a Matt Kavanaugh.
The NBA is whole other world and that's why very few college players translate to NBA players.
|
3 UDPriders Offer Mad Props to Smitty10 For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-23-2020, 10:16 AM
|
|
Brigadier General
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: greensboro, NC
Posts: 2,542
Thanks: 3,046
Thanked 1,086 Times in 640 Posts
|
|
it doesn't work that way, it just doesn't....
why not?
it wasn't just Obi that made Dayton the talk
of college basketball last year, and it was
more than just a guard feeding a star big man..
it takes something special to be the best
team in all of college basketball... I guess
I am saying, I will never ever sell the chemistry of
Jalen to Obi short. I would rather be wrong,
siding with it can happen. I will not budge
from this. something incredibly special happened
that goes beyond a pg to a star..
it was the best inside out combo,
better than all others..
yes, it can happen
there is one way to find out if it can
work that way.. find out by trying
Go Flyers!
|
11-23-2020, 11:09 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Dallas
Posts: 14,788
Thanks: 10,086
Thanked 10,502 Times in 4,704 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan
And, there are so many very good guards today. The A10 has lots of very, very good guards who won't sniff the NBA. The jump from college to NBA is huge especially guards.
|
There are two subjects we are addressing here. Will he get drafted, and/or will he play in the NBA.
I don't think he will be drafted, but the Brian Roberts template is still alive and possible.
There is Europe and the G-league (or whatever it is called this year).
Somewhere BRob is sitting on a beach with his millions and says hello.
Brian was small, didn't play good D, and actually was not initially a natural point guard.
Last edited by San Diego Flyer; 11-23-2020 at 11:11 AM..
|
Mad Props to San Diego Flyer For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-23-2020, 11:18 AM
|
|
General
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,642
Thanks: 1,559
Thanked 4,578 Times in 2,405 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by steverino015
it doesn't work that way, it just doesn't....
why not?
it wasn't just Obi that made Dayton the talk
of college basketball last year, and it was
more than just a guard feeding a star big man..
it takes something special to be the best
team in all of college basketball... I guess
I am saying, I will never ever sell the chemistry of
Jalen to Obi short. I would rather be wrong,
siding with it can happen. I will not budge
from this. something incredibly special happened
that goes beyond a pg to a star..
it was the best inside out combo,
better than all others..
yes, it can happen
there is one way to find out if it can
work that way.. find out by trying
Go Flyers!
|
Then why stop there? The Knicks should sign Ryan and Trey now too.
|
Mad Props to Smitty10 For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-23-2020, 12:05 PM
|
|
Lieutenant General
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 4,417
Thanks: 65
Thanked 1,558 Times in 941 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by Smitty10
Then why stop there? The Knicks should sign Ryan and Trey now too.
|
Don’t forget Matos then!
Posted via Mobile Device
|
11-23-2020, 12:15 PM
|
Captain
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 483
Thanks: 144
Thanked 377 Times in 205 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by maddog07
Don’t forget Matos then!
Posted via Mobile Device
|
And joey Gruden. Good to have a high energy bench; helps with the chemistry.
|
11-23-2020, 12:29 PM
|
Major General
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,785
Thanks: 401
Thanked 1,735 Times in 1,009 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer
There are two subjects we are addressing here. Will he get drafted, and/or will he play in the NBA.
I don't think he will be drafted, but the Brian Roberts template is still alive and possible.
There is Europe and the G-league (or whatever it is called this year).
Somewhere BRob is sitting on a beach with his millions and says hello.
Brian was small, didn't play good D, and actually was not initially a natural point guard.
|
Absolutely. If JC was an absolute monster athlete and/or was 3" taller than I could see him drafted but neither is there. Plenty of good offers overseas for JC will come and whatever happens after will be of his own accord, imo.
|
Mad Props to steve For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-23-2020, 12:53 PM
|
|
General
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,642
Thanks: 1,559
Thanked 4,578 Times in 2,405 Posts
|
|
One other thing. Is Jalen really a great PG? I think he's a good PG and a great hybrid. I think his stats jumped into 1st team A10 as much because of Rodney Chatman taking part of his PG responsibilities and allowing him to become more of a main offensive weapon as it did because of the better inside game the Flyers had. That's great, don't get me wrong, but I'm pretty sure the NBA isn't looking for that hybrid type player from a guy Jalen's size.
Compare that to two of Dayton's all time great PGs who carved out a nice NBA career and were both drafted. Johnny Davis and Negele Knight. Those guys handled all the PG responsibilities and were the main scoring threats at the same time.
Last edited by Smitty10; 11-23-2020 at 01:01 PM..
|
11-23-2020, 01:34 PM
|
|
Colonel
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,132
Thanks: 2,517
Thanked 1,325 Times in 444 Posts
|
|
No doubt Jalen is dominate at the collegiate level in a couple of areas... the pick-n-roll 2 man game, and shooting (he's nearing Brian Roberts territory in my mind).
Whether it translates to the NBA level remains to be seen, but he could very well have a professional career similar to Brob's - as he had a tough time defending at that level, but still found his niche.
|
Mad Props to Runnin' Rebel For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-23-2020, 02:47 PM
|
|
Brigadier General
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: greensboro, NC
Posts: 2,542
Thanks: 3,046
Thanked 1,086 Times in 640 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by Runnin' Rebel
No doubt Jalen is dominate at the collegiate level in a couple of areas... the pick-n-roll 2 man game, and shooting (he's nearing Brian Roberts territory in my mind).
Whether it translates to the NBA level remains to be seen, but he could very well have a professional career similar to Brob's - as he had a tough time defending at that level, but still found his niche.
|
best comment in my opinion...
a lot of it depends on how he
does this year, if his stock rises.
we'll see, I stand by my statement:
I would rather be wrong, knowing
it would be incredible odds..
than simply dismissing the idea,
it's already been a crazy year, yes?
Go Flyers!
|
11-23-2020, 02:50 PM
|
|
Brigadier General
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: greensboro, NC
Posts: 2,542
Thanks: 3,046
Thanked 1,086 Times in 640 Posts
|
|
Originally Posted by maddog07
Don’t forget Matos then!
Posted via Mobile Device
|
if this is the best you can do,
then it truly is a great time to be
a Flyer fan...)
Go Flyers!
|
11-23-2020, 04:13 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,775
Thanks: 1,174
Thanked 3,137 Times in 795 Posts
|
|
For those of you that don't have ESPN+ I suggest you spring for the extra cash. It will be useful when the season starts. This is from their listing of the top 25 players in the country.
12. Jalen Crutcher, Dayton Flyers
Crutcher has been a starter at Dayton since the December of his freshman year, and during that time, the one constant in his game has been his ability to record plenty of assists. Then, last season, the 6-foot-1 combo guard thrived alongside a certain national player of the year and shot 42% from beyond the arc. Obi Toppin is now a member of the New York Knicks, of course, but Crutcher is still a dangerous shooter and creator who shared leading scorer honors (24 points) with his more celebrated teammate in a key road win at Richmond last season.
|
3 UDPriders Offer Mad Props to John C. For This Totally Excellent Post:
|
|
11-23-2020, 07:29 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,775
Thanks: 1,174
Thanked 3,137 Times in 795 Posts
|
|
The Athletic released their preseason All-American teams but only had first and second teams. Jalen was one of five Honorable Mention listed so I guess you could say he made third team All-American.
|
|
Thread Tools |
|
Display Modes |
Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|