Recap on A-10 website - unreal

[dnutz77]

I just checked out the A-10 website to view the recap of the game and to see if there are any statements about the situation at the end of the game.

Much to my surprise, there was one VERY LOUD and VERY CLEAR statement. In the recap on ESPN, CBS Sports and all the other sites that uses the AP recap, has the following paragraph:

"Galloway, who beat the Flyers in the regular season by banking in a 3 in the closing seconds, CLEARED SOME SPACE AT THE TOP OF THE KEY WITH HIS LEFT FOREARM and nailed a 3 over Kyle Davis to put the Hawks up 69-67."

The A-10 site has the exact same article; HOWEVER, it is missing the statement about how Galloway CLEARED SOME SPACE AT THE TOP OF THE KEY WITH HIS LEFT FOREARM.

So, it reads ".....banking in a 3 in the closing seconds, nailed a 3 over Kyle Davis....."

I'm not sure why it bothers me, but it does. Why is our own conference afraid to include that statement in the recap? Guilt?

This makes me feel like the A-10 doesn't deserve what UD and it's fans bring to the table.

Thoughts?

[UD90]

Guilt and liability. http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-ylHWi_Jfcm...00/ENDGAME.gif

[T-Bone 84]

dnutz77, it bothers you, possibly, for much the same reason it bothers me. I don't know whether the person writing for the A10 (and thus making the official "A10 Statement") is trying to white-wash the no-call, or if they really don't think it was a foul, despite the concrete video evidence and prevalence of expert opinions at the networks saying it was a blown call/no-call.

Not to go political or anything, but it reminds me (in a much-less-important-in-the-grand-scheme-of-things way) of the current Administration's initial reaction to the Benghazi incident. No mention of "the push" by the A10. No mention of "planned attack" by the Administration. Attempted misdirection through media manipulation in both cases. But I digress.

Whether the A10 is trying to white-wash it or whether they're denying the evidence that is there for the whole world to see, the fact is that neither portrayal speaks well for the league. In the first case, they're duplicitous. In the other case, they're downright stupid/incompetent.

[dnutz77]

Originally Posted by T-Bone 84 dnutz77, it bothers you, possibly, for much the same reason it bothers me. I don't know whether the person writing for the A10 (and thus making the official "A10 Statement") is trying to white-wash the no-call, or if they really don't think it was a foul, despite the concrete video evidence and prevalence of expert opinions at the networks saying it was a blown call/no-call. Not to go political or anything, but it reminds me (in a much-less-important-in-the-grand-scheme-of-things way) of the current Administration's initial reaction to the Benghazi incident. No mention of "the push" by the A10. No mention of "planned attack" by the Administration. Attempted misdirection through media manipulation in both cases. But I digress. Whether the A10 is trying to white-wash it or whether they're denying the evidence that is there for the whole world to see, the fact is that neither portrayal speaks well for the league. In the first case, they're duplicitous. In the other case, they're downright stupid/incompetent.

T-Bone, that's just it. The A-10 used the AP wire write-up, but SOMEONE in the communications office made the decision to remove that statement. The entire rest of the write-up is EXACTLY the same.

Cowards.

[UD90]

The sad part is that it's one thing to not tell the whole story, but then to alter the truth is worse. Galloway's shot swished! The person who covered it didn't even watch it.

[T-Bone 84]

Originally Posted by dnutz77 T-Bone, that's just it. The A-10 used the AP wire write-up, but SOMEONE in the communications office made the decision to remove that statement. The entire rest of the write-up is EXACTLY the same. Cowards.

du*plic*i*ty 1. deceitfulness in speech or conduct: double-dealing.

And in looking this word up in my Webster's dictionary, I noticed that the page right before this one ends with the word "dung". Coincidence? I think not!

[CoffeeCan]

As much as I admire your Encyclopedia Brown sleuthing, the sun came up today. I say let's move on.

[dnutz77]

Originally Posted by CoffeeCan As much as I admire your Encyclopedia Brown sleuthing, the sun came up today. I say let's move on.

I'm going to play golf today and tomorrow. That will kill some time until the selection show tomorrow night. Maybe I'll win some cash as well to soften the blow.

[shocka43]

The A10 has already heard the voices from UD. From the tip top of UD all the way down to the peon fans....I witnessed it yesterday. McGlade should be ashamed of her conference. I have already made my voice known that if she allows any of the 3 ass clowns that officiated yesterdays game to step foot on an A10 court, she should fire herself.

[SeasonTicketFan]

Originally Posted by dnutz77 I just checked out the A-10 website to view the recap of the game and to see if there are any statements about the situation at the end of the game. Much to my surprise, there was one VERY LOUD and VERY CLEAR statement. In the recap on ESPN, CBS Sports and all the other sites that uses the AP recap, has the following paragraph: "Galloway, who beat the Flyers in the regular season by banking in a 3 in the closing seconds, CLEARED SOME SPACE AT THE TOP OF THE KEY WITH HIS LEFT FOREARM and nailed a 3 over Kyle Davis to put the Hawks up 69-67." The A-10 site has the exact same article; HOWEVER, it is missing the statement about how Galloway CLEARED SOME SPACE AT THE TOP OF THE KEY WITH HIS LEFT FOREARM. So, it reads ".....banking in a 3 in the closing seconds, nailed a 3 over Kyle Davis....." I'm not sure why it bothers me, but it does. Why is our own conference afraid to include that statement in the recap? Guilt? This makes me feel like the A-10 doesn't deserve what UD and it's fans bring to the table. Thoughts?

I agree move on, but there is a long term lingering problem.

The X UC fight created a bad reputation for how the A10 manages officiating. Officials work many leagues now, but coordination of crews is important for consistency. Reggie Greenwood selects officials and manages them.


A veteran college referee in Dayton told me the UC X fight was clearly a major major failure of the stripes and of the head of officiating for the A10. He said it never should have gotten that far. He said the A10 selected mediocre refs for that game and that started the chain of events.

The A10 is developing a rap for good teams and mediocre cheap officials.

So what is Reggie doing to upgrade the standards for referees? In tournaments, you have to fight every conference for refs, but this lack of consistency goes on all year long.

I watched the replay and saw one ref out of position. He was behind Galloway's back and thus unable to see the push. Can't see the other two.

You hate to see calls at the end change the outcome, but that was a push off foul during the other 39 minutes of the game.

Final thought. If you read comments from disgraced NBA ref Donaghy, his betting system was based on which refs were at the game. He had an incredible 80 percent betting success rate. His comments are telling, including protecting star players So if anyone else but Galloway, no brainier call. So refs do change game outcomes quite significantly.

It is what it is.

[ud69]

The whitewash of the AP article on the Atlantic-10 website screams of the embarrassment of the conference over what happened yesterday. This was not a modification for space. This was a modification for political expediency. It was deliberate, deceitful, and cowardly.

[FlyerGuyer]

Admission by omission...

[flyerfever]

Yes, good observation on the bench side official being out of position. I learned early during my baseball umpiring days, that position was everything. I knew the level of discourse that would take place on a close call went much better for me if I knew I had the proper angle on the play. The coach, player, manager could have their say, and agree or disagree. However, if I explained what I saw based on my positioning, more times than nought, the game and my relationship with everyone was enhanced.

[T-Bone 84]

Originally Posted by CoffeeCan As much as I admire your Encyclopedia Brown sleuthing, the sun came up today. I say let's move on.

While we do need to move on, let me throw some more "sleuthing" out there:

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
George Santayana, 1963-1952

For the sake of the players on all teams, the coaches, the fans, and the integrity of the Conference, the A10 can't continue to ignore/forget the repeated, documented incompetency of its' officiating crews.

[cobra8u]

Its time to pick up and move to the MVC and hopefully take STL with us and maybe Butler and DePaul who will never succeed in the BLeast

[SeasonTicketFan]

Originally Posted by flyerfever Yes, good observation on the bench side official being out of position. I learned early during my baseball umpiring days, that position was everything. I knew the level of discourse that would take place on a close call went much better for me if I knew I had the proper angle on the play. The coach, player, manager could have their say, and agree or disagree. However, if I explained what I saw based on my positioning, more times than nought, the game and my relationship with everyone was enhanced.

A coach told me something interesting a few years ago. He said EVERY coach should take an officiating class. It helps understand their perspective and how to train your players to not pick up fouls. It also helps you when you plead your cases with refs.

There was one high school coach in the Dayton area who did that. When he got on refs, it was because of positioning and coordination. They had no arguments because too often he was right. Calls can be judgmental, but when you are out of position, then you have a problem.

In this case, I can't see the other two refs in the video.

I have the biggest problem with calls made that are by the ref who is furthest away from the action. Often, not always it means the other two did not have a good view. That can especially happen inside where the tall bodies can block you.

[Alberto Strasse]

has an integrity problem in it's relationship with UD and all of the non-Philadelphia schools. The motto of the conference should be "The Atlantic Ten Where Philadelphia's interests are protected at all costs." Each referee should wear that emblem on their uniform.

[GoFlyer]

Not to go political or anything, but it reminds me (in a much-less-important-in-the-grand-scheme-of-things way) of the current Administration's initial reaction to the Benghazi incident. No mention of "the push" by the A10. No mention of "planned attack" by the Administration. Attempted misdirection through media manipulation in both cases. But I digress.



Yes. You do digress

[SeasonTicketFan]

Originally Posted by GoFlyer Not to go political or anything, but it reminds me (in a much-less-important-in-the-grand-scheme-of-things way) of the current Administration's initial reaction to the Benghazi incident. No mention of "the push" by the A10. No mention of "planned attack" by the Administration. Attempted misdirection through media manipulation in both cases. But I digress. Yes. You do digress

Way off topic. However, the common pattern often is to not acknowledge the problem. Everyone does that. You could have brought up GM in recent news. UD has done it share of denying of problems over the years. Look at how murky and non descript the Kav situation was.

A10 has developed a reputation with regards to officiating . More importantly, what are they going to do about it?

[longtimefan]

We should send Bernadette some more e-mails asking her why that phrase was left out of their story. I've slept on it and tried to look at it from all directions. I have tried to calm down and move on, BUT I AM STILL ****ED!!!

[UDGutter2]

This is what makes the A10 small time. The teams are great, the fans are great, the coaches, (aside from Crews) are great. Its like the conference looks around for refs who will work cheap because other conferences won't allow them to do games any more. I know of high school conferences that grade the officials during games, if the officials screw up too much, they are not asked to do another game in that conference. High schools do this, why not universities?

[ruechalgrin]

I am in utter disbelief that they did this. I am writing again to the commissioner and tweeting about it to ncaa sportswriters. When the A-10 does stuff like this, it reinforces the perception that we are a mickey mouse league.

[ruechalgrin]

Been tweeting the following:

@AP A-10 alters AP UD St. Joe's article deleting mention of Galloway creating space with arm http://tinyurl.com/qzkmx7v #integrity

[Glen Clark]

The same 'avoid controversy at all costs' mentality keeps any meaningful replays off the big screens at the Arena . . .
I know refs are human, and often overmatched by the speed and athleticism of the game and players, but they should still be held accountable when they screw up (and some of them screw up a lot).

___________________
Whether your glass is half empty or half full, you still have more to drink.

[udflyerhoops2]

During the broadcast, SVG mentioned that the replay was being shown on the big boards without edit. Causing no shortage of angry noise in the arena.

[SeasonTicketFan]

I hate to say this but if the situation was reversed, Vee forearms a defender with no call to win the game, UD would have eliminated any mention of a blown call in their announcements. UD behaves just like the A10.

I think trying to whitewash controversy lowers your credibility.

[ruechalgrin]

Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan I hate to say this but if the situation was reversed, Vee forearms a defender with no call to win the game, UD would have eliminated any mention of a blown call in their announcements. UD behaves just like the A10. I think trying to whitewash controversy lowers your credibility.

I don't think UD would edit 1/2 sentence off an AP article on its website, at least I hope not.

[longtimefan]

Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan I hate to say this but if the situation was reversed, Vee forearms a defender with no call to win the game, UD would have eliminated any mention of a blown call in their announcements. UD behaves just like the A10. I think trying to whitewash controversy lowers your credibility.

Not sure UD would do that, but this was not St Joe, it was the A-10!!! Bad comparison.

	St Joseph's ST. JOSEPH'S Founded by the Society of Jesus in 1851, Saint Joseph's University advances the professional and personal ambitions of men and women by providing a demanding, yet supportive educational experience. One of only 139 schools nationwide with a Phi Beta Kappa chapter and AACSB business school accreditation, Saint Joseph's is home to 4,200 full-time undergraduates and 3,100 graduate, part-time and doctoral candidates. Located in urban Philadelphia, SJU is a fellow member of the A10 Conference. Nickname is the Hawks. Athletic claim to fame is is the Hawk mascot, a university student on full scholarship who wears a Hawk uniform and flaps his wings continuously for an entire athletic event. School spirit slogan is "The Hawk Will Never Die."

[udflyerhoops2]

I don't think St. Joe's fans should do anything but what they're doing. If it were Vee or Sibert doing the same thing, I'd be smirking and laughing every time I thought about it because I'd know we just got over. I don't fault Galloway or their fans.

My frustrations are laid squarely on the refs for just not getting it right, that time.

The push off that Kav did WAS a foul. What Kanacevic was crying about made him look like a kid on an elementary school playground. He was pointing to his head saying that Kav had hit him with an elbow shiver and was hoping for a Technical also.

[ud69]

Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan I hate to say this but if the situation was reversed, Vee forearms a defender with no call to win the game, UD would have eliminated any mention of a blown call in their announcements. UD behaves just like the A10.

What makes you think that? Do you have any examples?

[College B-Ball Fan]

+1.....

[SeasonTicketFan]

Originally Posted by ud69 What makes you think that? Do you have any examples?

Most recent example?

I have been at a couple of functions in which the seniors and team are honored. UD admin people talked about Kav "taking last year off". If you were not aware of the situation, you would think he voluntarily redshirted last year. A more accurate description would be: Kav had to sit last year.

UD goes out of their way to preserve image...

[ud69]

Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan Most recent example? I have been at a couple of functions in which the seniors and team are honored. UD admin people talked about Kav "taking last year off". If you were not aware of the situation, you would think he voluntarily redshirted last year. A more accurate description would be: Kav had to sit last year. UD goes out of their way to preserve image...

I guess you could parse it your way. However, since he was not attending classes, "year off" seems more accurate than "sitting" - but we are kind of splitting hairs.

[SeasonTicketFan]

Originally Posted by ud69 I guess you could parse it your way. However, since he was not attending classes, "year off" seems more accurate than "sitting" - but we are kind of splitting hairs.

I don't think there is any splitting hairs. He was required to leave UD. The messages made it sound like he voluntarily took the year off. I think that is a significant difference.

[Lifelong Flyer Fan]

If the functions were to honor the team and seniors, I would think anyone included would know the situation. Don't see how that compares to an article on the conference website.

[Levelbest]

Originally Posted by ruechalgrin Been tweeting the following: @AP A-10 alters AP UD St. Joe's article deleting mention of Galloway creating space with arm http://tinyurl.com/qzkmx7v #integrity

Modify it slightly so they see the mention...

@AP - @atlantic10 alters AP UD St. Joe's article deleting mention of Galloway creating space with arm http://tinyurl.com/qzkmx7v #integrity

[Windy City Flyer]

I just looked at both articles. The ironic part is that they still reference "New York AP"
It's unbelievable that they would alter the article and still reference it as an AP article.

Here is an excerpt from the A10 Website

NEW YORK (AP) - Langston Galloway made a go-ahead 3 with 17.9 seconds left and finished with 31 points as St. Joseph's beat Dayton 70-67 in the quarterfinals of the Atlantic 10 Championship on Friday.

Fourth-seeded St. Joseph's (22-9) completed a three-game sweep of the Flyers (23-10) in a game matching teams hoping to land, though far from locks to receive, at-large NCAA tournament bids.

Matt Kavanaugh made a baseline jumper to give fifth-seeded Dayton a 67-66 lead with 40 seconds left.

Galloway, who beat the Flyers in the regular season by banking in a 3 in the closing seconds, nailed a 3 over Kyle Davis to put the Hawks (22-9) up 69-67.

Here is the actual excerpt from the AP

NEW YORK (AP) Langston Galloway made a go-ahead 3 with 17.9 seconds left and finished with 31 points as St. Joseph's beat Dayton 70-67 in the quarterfinals of the Atlantic 10 tournament on Friday.

Fourth-seeded St. Joseph's (22-9) completed a three-game sweep of the Flyers (23-10) in a game matching teams hoping to land, though far from locks to receive, at-large NCAA tournament bids.

Matt Kavanaugh made a baseline jumper to give fifth-seeded Dayton a 67-66 lead with 40 seconds left.

Galloway, who beat the Flyers in the regular season by banking in a 3 in the closing seconds, cleared some space at the top of the key with his left forearm and nailed a 3 over Kyle Davis to put the Hawks (22-9) up 69-67.


Although the officials may be the problem, the fact remains the A10 conference has decided to alter a story from the AP to avoid any attention to how it was being represented by the AP. I

[ruechalgrin]

Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan I don't think there is any splitting hairs. He was required to leave UD. The messages made it sound like he voluntarily took the year off. I think that is a significant difference.

The difference is the a-10 changed an article and deleted one phrase. If they wrote their own article or used another that did not mention the incident, all good. But they materially changed the article.

[Smitty10]

Okay, I've been trying to get over this injustice, and as tempting as was, was going to avoid sending the Commissioner a rant. But after seeing this I sent this:

Your site takes this article from ESPN: "Galloway, who beat the Flyers in the regular season by banking in a 3 in the closing seconds, CLEARED SOME SPACE AT THE TOP OF THE KEY WITH HIS LEFT FOREARM and nailed a 3 over Kyle Davis to put the Hawks up 69-67."

And take out the part that says "CLEARED SOME SPACE AT THE TOP OF THE KEY WITH HIS LEFT FOREARM."

Why instead of covering your ass, don't you say what the world knows, your incompetent Refs took the game away from Dayton with a Non-call. I hope the Flyers move to the Big East and get out of your half-assed conference.