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01-09-2013, 08:45 PM
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Reminds me of Huggy's press. Ride 'em, bump 'em, slap 'em, hand-check 'em, see how much you can get away with because the refs can't/won't call everything.
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01-09-2013, 08:46 PM
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kudos to the freshman, the rest of the guys look overmatched
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01-09-2013, 08:46 PM
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Major
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Benson
Where is his head these days. Totally inconsistent and awol at the worst times. Put him on the pine and let him think about effort
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01-09-2013, 08:46 PM
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Major General
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Seniors are Mentally Soft
KD and JB are not the strongest mentally when the going gets tough. This will show up a lot in conference play.
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01-09-2013, 08:47 PM
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Originally Posted by flyerfanatic86
Watching Benson play defense is painful.
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and offense. Dillard and Sanford have been awful as well.
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01-09-2013, 08:47 PM
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General
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In comes Dillard for VCU...
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01-09-2013, 08:47 PM
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Colonel
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These announcers are really making me dislike VCU. Nothing their team or coaches have done, just this Beavis & Butthead announcing.
We're down 10, but it's far from over. I don't think I've seen another team take so many bad shots like VCU does. We need to be smarter with the ball and stop panicking. Ball fakes would kill this over-agressive defense, yet I haven't seen any.
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01-09-2013, 08:48 PM
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Lieutenant General
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Well, I am sure the pressure came as a surprise to us.
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01-09-2013, 08:49 PM
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Flyers way too weak with the ball and too many guys shy away from the contact. VCU figured that out this half and is banging everyone.
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01-09-2013, 08:49 PM
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Originally Posted by toh2007
Webber is bodying our point guards up the court. It should be a foul every time.
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Bingo!
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01-09-2013, 08:50 PM
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Captain
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Benson is just weak mentally and physically. I expected more from him this year.
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01-09-2013, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by FlyerGuyer
Turnover, turnover, turnover, turnover, turnover, turnover, turnover......
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That's what I had for dessert and it was delicious!
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01-09-2013, 08:53 PM
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Sanford just needs to watch.
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01-09-2013, 08:54 PM
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Brigadier General
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We'd still be in this game if not for our free throw shooting.
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01-09-2013, 08:55 PM
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finally called a hand check
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01-09-2013, 08:56 PM
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General
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What's sad is that this was a winnable game. Our inconsistency is killing us this year. I had hoped the team would be jelling and maturing by now. No such luck.
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01-09-2013, 08:56 PM
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sanford and then Dillard miss the front end of one and ones. Both done mentally.
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01-09-2013, 08:57 PM
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Brigadier General
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This is really painful to watch.....they are spent....
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01-09-2013, 08:57 PM
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Colonel
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Originally Posted by Sea Bass
sanford and then Dillard miss the front end of one and ones. Both done mentally.
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I think it was more of having no legs than mental.
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01-09-2013, 08:58 PM
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General
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Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows
That's what I had for dessert and it was delicious!
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VCU seems to be enjoying ours.
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01-09-2013, 08:58 PM
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Major
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no point production from VS or JB (2 pts vs avg 12).
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01-09-2013, 08:58 PM
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General
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You can't go on the road and commit 25 turnovers and miss all these free throws. You offensive opportunities evaporate.
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01-09-2013, 08:58 PM
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absurd charging call on Dillard. It wasnt even close.
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01-09-2013, 08:59 PM
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Major General
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo
We'd still be in this game if not for our free throw shooting.
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You being sarcastic? We are 8-11
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01-09-2013, 08:59 PM
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General
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Here's hoping we finish on a good note and carry positive momentum into our next game against Butler
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01-09-2013, 08:59 PM
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Major
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foul shooting could kill us in league games
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01-09-2013, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by jpk4ud
I think it was more of having no legs than mental.
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Vee hasnt played that much. They don't look tired, it looks like the physicality of the play is in their head.
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01-09-2013, 09:00 PM
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General
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We need to double team the ball and take our chances.
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01-09-2013, 09:02 PM
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BTW, I doubt anyone beats VCU at home in league play.
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01-09-2013, 09:02 PM
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Brigadier General
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HAHA that was not goal tending. A-10 refs have to be the worst in the country.
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01-09-2013, 09:02 PM
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Major
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8 minutes without a bucket
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01-09-2013, 09:03 PM
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Colonel
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Last three baskets called off. sad.
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01-09-2013, 09:03 PM
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Sanford and Dillard ... 3 assists and 13 turnovers
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01-09-2013, 09:03 PM
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VCU has 28 points off Dayton turnovers-----end game.
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01-09-2013, 09:03 PM
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Academy Doolie
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Originally Posted by m21eagle45
You being sarcastic? We are 8-11
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We are 9-14, and since 2 misses were front end of 1and1's, it's the equivalent of 9-16.
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01-09-2013, 09:03 PM
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Brigadier General
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Not sure about these refs and announcers, but FTs and TOs killed us. This team is beatable. Different outcome next year at UD.
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01-09-2013, 09:03 PM
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General
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo
HAHA that was not goal tending. A-10 refs have to be the worst in the country.
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He tipped it when it was outside the cylinder.
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01-09-2013, 09:03 PM
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Brigadier General
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Originally Posted by m21eagle45
You being sarcastic? We are 8-11
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I typed that after we had missed the front end of two one and ones and the first of a two shot foul (so three in a row).
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01-09-2013, 09:04 PM
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Major General
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Originally Posted by 434
We are 9-14, and since 2 misses were front end of 1and1's, it's the equivalent of 9-16.
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It was 8-11. ESPN box score is WAY behind.
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01-09-2013, 09:05 PM
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Major
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25 TOs. a record?
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01-09-2013, 09:05 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Wow. Mugging is now not a foul in basketball. I'd love to play these guys at UD.
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01-09-2013, 09:05 PM
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Only one thing left for the gamblers. The spread was 11 right? Timeout at 70-60.
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01-09-2013, 09:06 PM
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General
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Benson didn't disapear alltogether...there he was with his 4th foul.
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01-09-2013, 09:07 PM
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Colonel
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DMO with a heck of a block them gets knocked down and no foul....more A10 fun
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01-09-2013, 09:08 PM
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So the guy trips DMO and no call
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01-09-2013, 09:08 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Proud of the effort tonight... Oh well, dominate them next year!
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01-09-2013, 09:11 PM
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General
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Originally Posted by lhsgolf19
Proud of the effort tonight... Oh well, dominate them next year!
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It was a strong effort, for sure. We just don't have the horses to take on a team like this on their home court. This means we must get a victory Saturday against Butler.
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01-09-2013, 09:11 PM
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Brigadier General
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Kenpom predicted 62-76
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01-09-2013, 09:12 PM
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Brigadier General
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer
Only one thing left for the gamblers. The spread was 11 right? Timeout at 70-60.
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Vegas always knows. That's why I don't bet. Ha
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01-09-2013, 09:12 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Originally Posted by TommyGola
It was a strong effort, for sure. We just don't have the horses to take on a team like this on their home court. This means we must get a victory Saturday against Butler.
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No doubt... with a VCU Butler start to the conference season, I would have been extremely happy with a 1-1 start... Rock the house on Saturday!!
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01-09-2013, 09:13 PM
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Colonel
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Learn from this game and get ready for Butler...it doesn't get any easer on Saturday
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01-09-2013, 09:13 PM
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VCU was pumped for this. 67% freethrow shooting team makes 19 of 21. Their floor pressure won out. Thought it was all that was advertised. Those defensive guards were tough.
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01-09-2013, 09:15 PM
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Best part of next year is that we won't have the VCU announcers.
Hard to win when VCU gets 30 points off our our 26 turnovers, if I heard that stat right.
Hope we pull it together in our house against Bulter Saturday. You don't get too many opportunities to go back-to-back with ranked teams, and we need to pick up a win Saturday.
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01-09-2013, 09:16 PM
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it's the pressure and the banging and shoving (hand checking). Too many Flyers don't like the contact. It is what we have seen all year. This team does not like the physical play.
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01-09-2013, 09:17 PM
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If we played defense half as hard as VCU we'd be 14-1.
__________________
I shaved my balls for this?
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01-09-2013, 09:18 PM
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Brigadier General
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Good news: Butler wins at St. Joes. Win Saturday looks better. Kenpom has us favored by 1. 68-67.
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01-09-2013, 09:20 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo
Why does our starting point guard have more trouble with the press than any player on the team?
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Possibly because he was being mauled on every possession as he was bringing the ball upcourt.
Maybe Arch can pull-out some old videos of Ruland, Mahorn, Laimbeer, etc., to show how you set a pick for your PG in the open court. Not that we have anyone with the bulk of those horses, but I'd think that JR or AG has enough of a body to lay a guy out when he's riding KD like a rented mule.
Hey, Weber - get a saddle!
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01-09-2013, 09:21 PM
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KenPom may have us favored but Butler is the most physical team the flyers will play all year. It will take their best effort to win on Saturday.
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01-09-2013, 09:22 PM
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Just off the Jet
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo
Why can't our stream look this good? Announcers are terrible though.
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Ditto. Announcers bad beyond belief, but quality of feed is so much superior.
Why is ours so bad by comparison? Anyone?
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01-09-2013, 09:22 PM
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Originally Posted by T-Bone 84
Possibly because he was being mauled on every possession as he was bringing the ball upcourt.
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teams all season have been banging Dillard and he does not like it. Can't say I blame him but teams now have a solid plan on how to limit his effectiveness.
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01-09-2013, 09:29 PM
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Colonel
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What does announcer quality have to do with UD's poor play?
They kicked our butt.
Not sure it'll change "next year" (Cub fans?)
Look for a W vs. Butler
We can put one good game together but not 2
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01-09-2013, 09:32 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Originally Posted by TA111
Wow. Mugging is now not a foul in basketball. I'd love to play these guys at UD.
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Nah - we'd get homered in our own gym. I've seen it happen all too often. But you're right - mugging is now not a foul in basketball. Retaliating against the mugger, however, is a foul.
Off-topic re this thread but on-topic re the difference between officiating today and back "in the day" - I saw a replay of the 1984 DePaul game a few years back ("The Shot" game). Don Criqui of NBC commented about a call that went against Dallas Comegys of DePaul, saying it was definitely a foul. And it was a foul - in 1984. Now, it'd be called "incidental contact". If the clowns of today would call all the fouls they should call, every game would wind-up as "managers vs. walk-ons".
Basketball back then required so much more finesse & skill. Now, it requires a good set of guns and a friendly whistle. I said it in another thread, and I'll say it here - not all change is "progress".
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01-09-2013, 09:34 PM
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and we are going to play a team in Butler that bangs harder than anyone. Better take their toughness pills on Saturday morning.
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01-09-2013, 09:36 PM
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Dillard flat out dribbles too much. He is inviting physical contact and traps. He needs to give the ball up, get it back, give it up. That said, those VCU guards were as good a pair as we will see on defense.
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01-09-2013, 09:40 PM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer
Dillard flat out dribbles too much. He is inviting physical contact and traps. He needs to give the ball up, get it back, give it up. That said, those VCU guards were as good a pair as we will see on defense.
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you are correct. last year he had more space because of CJ, JP, and LF. Without the shooters to space the defense he tends to overdribble. The Flyers need to rely on ball movement to open up lanes not the high ball screen that worked so well last year.
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01-09-2013, 09:42 PM
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Originally Posted by longtimefan
Reminds me of Huggy's press. Ride 'em, bump 'em, slap 'em, hand-check 'em, see how much you can get away with because the refs can't/won't call everything.
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I agree about Huggy's press, I've seen teams play like that. It's a very aggressive, in-your-face-the-entire-game style of defense. A lot of bumping, hand checking, slapping, etc. If the refs aren't calling the fouls, it's a very effective style of defense to play because it takes the other team out of its game/disrupts the opponents' rhythm on offense.
I've seen Pitino's Louisville team do that. In the game I watched, Louisville's entire starting lineup could probably have been fouled out by halftime if the refs had called all the fouls. It's tough, you have to adjust and play through the fouls and hope the refs start calling the fouls. You can't be intimidated by it. Maintain your composure, play your game, and play through the contact.
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01-09-2013, 10:04 PM
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It's tough to get 3 refs on the same page when it comes to contact, because there is so much of it these days. Much of the contact on both sides weren't called as fouls, but they were FELONIES.
One thing they did call tonight on everyone was traveling on the spin move even if it wasn't. You could tell early on they weren't buying any spin moves.
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01-09-2013, 10:07 PM
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General
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Originally Posted by Sea Bass
you are correct. last year he had more space because of CJ, JP, and LF. Without the shooters to space the defense he tends to overdribble. The Flyers need to rely on ball movement to open up lanes not the high ball screen that worked so well last year.
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unfortunately for good and bad this is who Dillard is. He usess the dribble to split defenders, create his shot or dish to others. He's not a typical pass move it around perimeter point guard.
And as you say we don't have the Paul Williams/Luke/CJ 3 to rely on to at least open things up.
Didn't see game, but how much of Khari and Dillard in together did we see. I think we need plenty of Khari at the 1. Let Dillard do some spot up. When he gets it going EARLY, his jumper is an adequate tool.
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01-09-2013, 10:53 PM
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Until Archie can demonstrate an ability to coach up defense, get used to things. Its been a season and a half of totally inept defense. We can't stop Tri County North HS.
I like some of the young guns. Everyone had issues tonight but Price and Pierre at least battled. I can forgive freshman mistakes from....freshmen!
We have to begin to cobble together some sort of defensive posture in this program however. Every team we play carves us up. Our footwork is subpar, switching subpar, anticipation subpar, the fouling is overwhelming, and we cant keep anyone out of the paint on the dribble drive.
If you want a good offense, start with a good defense. I dont want to be one-dimensionally defensively either. We need to be doing both. Right now, we are BG upside down. I dont see one better or worse than the other, but thats kind of the problem now isnt it.
We move on.
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01-09-2013, 11:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris R
Until Archie can demonstrate an ability to coach up defense, get used to things. Its been a season and a half of totally inept defense. We can't stop Tri County North HS.
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As a TCN graduate, you have no idea how awful Chris is saying Dayton is playing.
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01-09-2013, 11:05 PM
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Originally Posted by T-Bone 84
Possibly because he was being mauled on every possession as he was bringing the ball upcourt.
Maybe Arch can pull-out some old videos of Ruland, Mahorn, Laimbeer, etc., to show how you set a pick for your PG in the open court. Not that we have anyone with the bulk of those horses, but I'd think that JR or AG has enough of a body to lay a guy out when he's riding KD like a rented mule.
Hey, Weber - get a saddle!
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That happens against a good team that presses the entire game. They commit 5 fouls and only 1 gets called The refs will never call all the reach ins and bumps on the guards. It also caused us to rush.
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01-09-2013, 11:07 PM
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I have to say that I loved the game that Khari played tonight.
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01-10-2013, 03:14 AM
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No defence, no future.
Simple as that, Flyer fans. If you can't see it, get to an opthamologist fast.
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01-10-2013, 07:33 AM
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HAVOC...it works.
Did any of you notice how Price handchecked VCU's point guard like a veteran TSA Agent....and never got called for a foul.
The refs consistently allowed both sides to molest the opponent's guards...that was obvious. We didn't get homered. We got smothered by a team that knows how to play defense.
When Dillard realizes that you can pass around a press we'll be better off.
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Last edited by rollo; 01-10-2013 at 08:46 AM..
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01-10-2013, 08:41 AM
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I Am A Statistical God
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Originally Posted by VirgM
25 TOs. a record?
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The boxscore shows us ending with 26 turnovers for the night. Since 2000-01 season (ignoring team turnovers), that is tied as 2nd most turnovers in a game. Dec 23, 2003, vs Cincinnati, which UD lost, we had 28 turnovers. UD had 26 turnovers against Miami (Ohio) in Nov 2005 and lost, and in January of 2007 we had 26 against Richmond and won.
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01-10-2013, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo
When Dillard realizes that you can pass around a press we'll be better off.
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Tha't what I don't get. I still think Dillard dribbles too much but I can understand the need to do it on our offensive end. I don't undertand it on the other side of the court. Why only pass enough in order to let Dillard (or Vee of anyone else) bring the ball up vs intense 1 on 1 defensive pressure to then be doubled virtually every time the dribbler gets over the half court line? Just asking for turnovers. Why not pass it all the way up and beat the press that way?
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01-10-2013, 10:18 AM
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the player who looked to pass ahead most often last night was Price.
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01-10-2013, 01:36 PM
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Some perspective on the VCU floorgame
The VCU opponents average 22+ TO's against them. VCU averages 13+ steals. That may have been unsettling to UD, but VCU just showed what they do most of the time.
That said, we made a bunch of "oh no" passes last night to help the VCU cause.
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01-10-2013, 01:52 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer
The VCU opponents average 22+ TO's against them. VCU averages 13+ steals. That may have been unsettling to UD, but VCU just showed what they do most of the time.
That said, we made a bunch of "oh no" passes last night to help the VCU cause.
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Also, I don't know what the finally tally was but, as those obnoxious VCU announcers kept saying - we didn't score off their turnovers. They made their fair share of mistakes. We jsut didn't capitalize on them.
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