UDPride Discussion Forums    
     

Go Back   UDPride Discussion Forums > STEVEN E. YUHAS MEMORIAL LOUNGE > Off-Topic Gibberish

» Log in
User Name:

Password:

Not a member yet?
Register Now!
» Advertisement
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #101  
Old 01-26-2018, 01:30 PM
TA111 TA111 is offline
Major General
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 3,276
Thanks: 1,169
Thanked 1,953 Times in 1,012 Posts
TA111 has a reputation beyond reputeTA111 has a reputation beyond reputeTA111 has a reputation beyond reputeTA111 has a reputation beyond reputeTA111 has a reputation beyond reputeTA111 has a reputation beyond reputeTA111 has a reputation beyond reputeTA111 has a reputation beyond reputeTA111 has a reputation beyond reputeTA111 has a reputation beyond reputeTA111 has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by IAFlyer View Post
As someone who belongs to neither major party - and votes on a regular basis for neither major party, my viewpoint is that anything that comes from the R's is derided by the D's and vice versa. There is no longer any "middle ground" in today's environment.

This goes not only in DC, but in our local communities, on social media, etc.

I consider myself an equal opportunity skeptic of anyone in either major party.

I do not believe that the Republican party can simultaneously be the "Party of Family Values" and ignore the personal behavior of Trump. They don't go hand-in-hand. I honestly don't care as I never believed that slogan in the past, anyway. It merely set them up for resignation when they didn't live up to an impossible standard (see Newt Gingrich in the 90s).
You make some good points, but I am a substance over form person. Iíll take a loudmouth, sometimes jerk, who promotes and passes legislation that helps the country (ie, the tax reduction law, reduction of regulations) over a slick talking politician who doesnít understand basic economics and passes harmful laws(ie, Obamacare).
Reply With Quote
6 UDPriders Offer Mad Props to TA111 For This Totally Excellent Post:
cj (01-26-2018), ClaytonFlyerFan (01-26-2018), JimBo (01-26-2018), Mich Flyer (01-26-2018), rollo (01-26-2018), Showme Flyer (01-26-2018)
Advertisement
  #102  
Old 01-26-2018, 04:58 PM
Fudd Fudd is offline
Committed to this Web Site and Your Enjoyment!
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,266
Thanks: 2,266
Thanked 5,288 Times in 2,517 Posts
Fudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by IAFlyer View Post
As someone who belongs to neither major party - and votes on a regular basis for neither major party, my viewpoint is that anything that comes from the R's is derided by the D's and vice versa. There is no longer any "middle ground" in today's environment.

This goes not only in DC, but in our local communities, on social media, etc.

I consider myself an equal opportunity skeptic of anyone in either major party.

I do not believe that the Republican party can simultaneously be the "Party of Family Values" and ignore the personal behavior of Trump. They don't go hand-in-hand. I honestly don't care as I never believed that slogan in the past, anyway. It merely set them up for resignation when they didn't live up to an impossible standard (see Newt Gingrich in the 90s).
I've always said that the Democrats can get some big things that they want if they negotiate with Trump. DACA is an example. You just have to give away some things too. They have chosen the worst strategy in "resist". There are deals to be made with Trump.

Trump is not a hard line ideologue. He will compromise on sensible things. He is building enough clout with the right that he will be able to compromise and still have a happy base. Turning around the economy has given him a lot of clout.
Reply With Quote
2 UDPriders Offer Mad Props to Fudd For This Totally Excellent Post:
IAFlyer (01-26-2018), ud2 (01-26-2018)
  #103  
Old 01-26-2018, 05:36 PM
ud2's Avatar
ud2 ud2 is offline
Committed to this Web Site and Your Enjoyment!
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 10,912
Thanks: 3,843
Thanked 3,060 Times in 2,012 Posts
ud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond repute
I think if Trump pulls off this deal, this would be the biggest piece of bi-partisan legislation since I don't know when? Welfare reform in the 1990's under Clinton? Ocare was not bi-partisan. Medicare Part D, under GWB, seems less significant than this. This would be a really big deal I think.
Reply With Quote
  #104  
Old 01-26-2018, 05:57 PM
zmz723's Avatar
zmz723 zmz723 is offline
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 767
Thanks: 186
Thanked 245 Times in 119 Posts
zmz723 has a spectacular aura aboutzmz723 has a spectacular aura aboutzmz723 has a spectacular aura about
Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
I've always said that the Democrats can get some big things that they want if they negotiate with Trump. DACA is an example. You just have to give away some things too. They have chosen the worst strategy in "resist". There are deals to be made with Trump.

Trump is not a hard line ideologue. He will compromise on sensible things. He is building enough clout with the right that he will be able to compromise and still have a happy base. Turning around the economy has given him a lot of clout.
I agree, minus the last sentence. The economy was doing very well before he took office.
Reply With Quote
  #105  
Old 01-26-2018, 06:52 PM
UACFlyer UACFlyer is offline
Committed to this Web Site and Your Enjoyment!
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,836
Thanks: 3,072
Thanked 3,583 Times in 2,164 Posts
UACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond repute
Very well?

Originally Posted by zmz723 View Post
I agree, minus the last sentence. The economy was doing very well before he took office.
Not "very" well. "Well". Sub 2% GDP growth most certainly is not doing "very well?. Z if the economy was doing very well before the election Clinton would be president. In the list of issues of importance to voters "the economy" is always first except in times of national peril.

Trump had/has no special economic accomplishments or credentials whatsoever.....other than the fact that he's not Obama. And that's a biggie.
Reply With Quote
  #106  
Old 01-26-2018, 08:13 PM
Chris R's Avatar
Chris R Chris R is offline
Committed to this Web Site and Your Enjoyment!
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 10,384
Thanks: 1,061
Thanked 10,820 Times in 3,234 Posts
Chris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
I think if Trump pulls off this deal, this would be the biggest piece of bi-partisan legislation since I don't know when? Welfare reform in the 1990's under Clinton? Ocare was not bi-partisan. Medicare Part D, under GWB, seems less significant than this. This would be a really big deal I think.
I stand by my grand bargain:

GOP concedes:
- All 30M illegal trespassers granted permanent legal residence in the USA.
- Can get driver's licenses, attend public schools, hold jobs, pay taxes, serve in the military, use the social safety net services of Medicare/Medicaid, SNAP, WIC, etc.

DEMs concede:
- Border Security must come first (wall or whatever the litmus test is with a timetable) before the 30M illegals are granted permanent residence.
- No further illegal entry into the USA by any means once the border security step is established -- no exceptions. 100% deportation whether you are caught 1 day later or 20yrs later.
- The 30M existing illegal trespassers granted permanent legal residence cannot vote and never apply for US Citizenship.

Im my opinion this is by far the best deal both sides are ever going to see. The Dems win the compassion grounds, and the GOP get the border security and guarantee that the Dems motivations are not based on adding 30M votes to their election ballots.

Both sides would be stupid not to take the deal. They will never get anything close to it otherwise.
__________________

C. M. Rieman | Publisher | 937.361.4630 | Get the latest here:

Reply With Quote
  #107  
Old 01-26-2018, 08:22 PM
Fudd Fudd is offline
Committed to this Web Site and Your Enjoyment!
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,266
Thanks: 2,266
Thanked 5,288 Times in 2,517 Posts
Fudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond reputeFudd has a reputation beyond repute
Anyone who still cannot see how Trump is positively impacting the economy by focusing on common sense things that fuel capitalism and favor America is deep, deep in denial or is watching CNN and believing the fake news. We are headed for an economic boom of epic proportions, IMO.
Reply With Quote
  #108  
Old 01-26-2018, 09:50 PM
UACFlyer UACFlyer is offline
Committed to this Web Site and Your Enjoyment!
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,836
Thanks: 3,072
Thanked 3,583 Times in 2,164 Posts
UACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond reputeUACFlyer has a reputation beyond repute
Sounds good, but,...

Originally Posted by Chris R View Post
I stand by my grand bargain:

GOP concedes:
- All 30M illegal trespassers granted permanent legal residence in the USA.
- Can get driver's licenses, attend public schools, hold jobs, pay taxes, serve in the military, use the social safety net services of Medicare/Medicaid, SNAP, WIC, etc.

DEMs concede:
- Border Security must come first (wall or whatever the litmus test is with a timetable) before the 30M illegals are granted permanent residence.
- No further illegal entry into the USA by any means once the border security step is established -- no exceptions. 100% deportation whether you are caught 1 day later or 20yrs later.
- The 30M existing illegal trespassers granted permanent legal residence cannot vote and never apply for US Citizenship.

Im my opinion this is by far the best deal both sides are ever going to see. The Dems win the compassion grounds, and the GOP get the border security and guarantee that the Dems motivations are not based on adding 30M votes to their election ballots.

Both sides would be stupid not to take the deal. They will never get anything close to it otherwise.
..how did you ever come up with the 30 million figure? That would be close to 10% of the population. The exact number is not known....but 10-12 million is the figure I've heard the most.
Reply With Quote
  #109  
Old 01-26-2018, 09:54 PM
cralford's Avatar
cralford cralford is offline
Major
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 560
Thanks: 672
Thanked 248 Times in 139 Posts
cralford has a reputation beyond reputecralford has a reputation beyond reputecralford has a reputation beyond reputecralford has a reputation beyond reputecralford has a reputation beyond reputecralford has a reputation beyond reputecralford has a reputation beyond reputecralford has a reputation beyond reputecralford has a reputation beyond reputecralford has a reputation beyond reputecralford has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by IAFlyer View Post
I consider myself an equal opportunity skeptic of anyone in either major party.
And I consider that to be BS just from reading your current and previous posts.
Originally Posted by IAFlyer View Post
I do not believe that the Republican party can simultaneously be the "Party of Family Values" and ignore the personal behavior of Trump. They don't go hand-in-hand. I honestly don't care as I never believed that slogan in the past, anyway. It merely set them up for resignation when they didn't live up to an impossible standard (see Newt Gingrich in the 90s).
Which personal behavior are you speaking of? Are you speaking of calling a foreign country a ****hole? Are you speaking of the sudden onslaught of women that had sudden recall several weeks before the election for the presidency? I will state that there are some things that seem to be disturbing but there is nothing that I would send a man to prison over. I do not consider myself to be sanctimonious enough to condemn a man on hearsay.


Study your history and see what the Democrats proclaimed themselves to be during the times of President Kenedy(I have no proof of President Kennedy indiscretions), President Clinton, Senator Ted Kennedy. Did the Democratic party jump up and claim themselves to be the "Party of Unscrupulous Values" or did they portray themselves as a party that cares about human values and dignity? I seem to remember one representative leaving someone to die in a car crash. Left her submerged for 10 hours while waiting to sober up to pass a sobriety test before reporting the accident. He did find the time to call several friends to ask for their advice. Did not find one residence to ask for help. The outcry must have been enormous. I am sure the courthouse was packed with Democrats calling for justice. The heavily democratic population and the judicial system made sure he paid for his transgressions with a 2 month suspended sentence. He decided he had paid his debt to society and ran for the next election and won with a 62% winning margin of the votes.

Where IAFlyer is your outcry against these democrats that you treat so equally with the Republicans?

Please keep your skepticism to yourself. Your fairness is killing me.

Last edited by cralford; 01-27-2018 at 12:35 PM.. Reason: Punctuation last paragraph
Reply With Quote
Mad Props to cralford For This Totally Excellent Post:
JimBo (01-26-2018)
  #110  
Old 01-26-2018, 10:02 PM
ud2's Avatar
ud2 ud2 is offline
Committed to this Web Site and Your Enjoyment!
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 10,912
Thanks: 3,843
Thanked 3,060 Times in 2,012 Posts
ud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond repute
I do not like the "trust fund" for the $25 billion. Get the $25 billion up front, before any amnesty is given out.

Or give amnesty out on a staggered basis:

$9 billion in funding in Trump's 2nd year in exchange for amnesty for 600k
$8 billion in funding in Trump's 3rd year in exchange for amnesty for 600k
$8 billion in funding in Trump's 4th year in exchange for amnesty for 600k

Do not get suckered into a bait and switch, whereby 1.8 million are given amnesty, and then the full $25 billion never materializes.

Things change, the next Congress and/or POTUS may not honor the trust fund deal.

We have seen this movie before.
Reply With Quote
  #111  
Old 01-26-2018, 10:27 PM
Chris R's Avatar
Chris R Chris R is offline
Committed to this Web Site and Your Enjoyment!
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 10,384
Thanks: 1,061
Thanked 10,820 Times in 3,234 Posts
Chris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond reputeChris R has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
..how did you ever come up with the 30 million figure? That would be close to 10% of the population. The exact number is not known....but 10-12 million is the figure I've heard the most.
I dont trust the government's illegal immigration numbers any more than I trust the government's budget numbers. Whatever number they give me, I know reality is 250-300% worse when the smoke clears. These folks are not complete mathematical ignoramuses in the financial sector, but autistic savants when it comes to counting largely underground invisible people. Incompetence seeks the lowest level across the entire prairie.

But even using my 30M number, my deal stands. If reality is its 10-12M which I question, its an even better deal for the GOP. I dont think either side would go for it at any number however.

Both sides want 100% of everything and define compromise as "letting you live another day for giving me everything I want -- and thanking me for the benevolence."
__________________

C. M. Rieman | Publisher | 937.361.4630 | Get the latest here:

Reply With Quote
  #112  
Old 01-27-2018, 12:37 AM
ud2's Avatar
ud2 ud2 is offline
Committed to this Web Site and Your Enjoyment!
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 10,912
Thanks: 3,843
Thanked 3,060 Times in 2,012 Posts
ud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond reputeud2 has a reputation beyond repute
On the other hand, this article makes it sound like this plan has no chance of passing, neither side seems to like it. Who knows.


http://thehill.com/homenews/administ...-of-opposition
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.1

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:41 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertisement System V2.6 By   Branden

     
 
Copyright 1996-2012 UDPride.com. All Rights Reserved.