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  #1  
Old 02-03-2018, 06:30 PM
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UMass game

Didn't get to part of the first half. We got down a bit and ended the half down 7. I wasn't very positive at that point, but we played better in the second half.

1. Crutcher 40 minutes, 6-11, 8 assists, 1 TO. Those are outstanding numbers for anyone, let alone a frosh.
2. DD - 4 -18, including 1-8 from 3, 5 assists and 5 TOs, too many missed drives to the hoop. Really not a good game. If he pressures Pipkins more as ball is going into back court, no way he recovers and gets that shot off. I mean, total luck but still, we could have prevented.
3. Josh and Trey with mostly outstanding games. Only downside for Josh was 5-9 from FT. Too bad Trey fouled out. Svoboda was a huge dropoff. No scoring ability and not good defense.
4. Kostas and X non-factors. I wouldn't be surprised if he left and went and played in Greece. He's not getting much time here and certainly hasn't shown anything. Who knows though, maybe he comes back next year much improved. Let's start with the attitude.
5. Wonder if Crosby wishes he had stayed gone. Unless Crutcher gets in foul trouble again or gets injured, he won't likely see the floor much.
6. Is Jordan Davis hurt? He doesn't seem to be, but his scoring has really fallen off the table.

Probably biggest difference in game is UMass made 7 more 3s than we did. We had our chances. Crutcher had a good look, it just didn't drop. Then we freaking fall asleep on that inbound play with 2 seconds on the clock.

I had higher expectations for the team but at this point, expectations weren't aligned with reality, kind of like my golf game. This team has some good components, but the sum is not better than the individual parts. I don't know who else might come in next year, but I hope they can contribute right away, because we're going to need it.
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Old 02-03-2018, 06:34 PM
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The Dayton Program

that Archie Miller left has fallen on hard times much quicker than anyone would have imagined. The new coach has not found the words or inspiration to motivate this team to play competent defense. It will take several scholarships and considerable time to elevate the program to the level Dayton fans have become accustomed to.
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Old 02-03-2018, 06:39 PM
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Kostas seems like he's regressing right now. I'm not sure he'd get minutes in the top level of Greek basketball at this point. Disagree that he hasn't shown anything. Flashes have been there but he's more than raw than I think anyone realized. I hope he's patient and puts in the work.

X. Williams has to be hurt. I gotta think it comes out after the season his back injury is more serious than we realized.

Jordan Davis is another guy who's backsliding. Other than VCU it seems like its been a while since he had a good game
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Old 02-03-2018, 06:53 PM
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At 14:20 of the first half Crutcher got his first foul - a bit iffy as he was pushed from behind into Pipkins - but not a terrible call by the ref. Immediately following, however, Crutcher was playing body-up defense on Pipkins and got his second foul 15 seconds later at 14:05. The score at that moment was 14-12 UMass. One could see this foul coming from the git-go. Crutcher has to know he cannot pick up a second foul that quickly. He got suckered into trying to prove his manhood against Pipkins.

Grant brings Williams in to replace Crutcher - an obvious slight to Crosby. Offense goes south. Crosby comes in at 11:55 - offense is even worse. Crutcher finally comes back in at 7:42 and makes a layup at 7:24 to make the score 24-17. The only points we scored in the 7 minutes while Crutcher was sitting - a 3-pointer by Cunningham - not where he should be shooting if the offense is being run properly.

This may have been where the game was lost. Yes, one can point to several individual plays that affected the outcome. However, from an overall game perspective, this was - IMHOP - the difference.

Our bench is so woeful.

Last edited by ud69; 02-04-2018 at 02:00 PM..
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Old 02-03-2018, 07:12 PM
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There's a reason AG is looking at JUCOs, wings and PGs. I would be surprised if we didn't see a couple folks move on
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Old 02-03-2018, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
There's a reason AG is looking at JUCOs, wings and PGs. I would be surprised if we didn't see a couple folks move on
No doubt. We have one scholarship available at the moment. Top candidate to leave is Pierce. Next I believe at this point would be Crosby. Seems to be tension with him and Cunningham, he's getting little playing time vs a freshman PG. Another PG and SG as JUCO or grad transfer most likely. With Mikesell back and Toppin joining, and hopefully X's back is recovered, the 6-7 to 6-9 wing/forward is covered.
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Old 02-03-2018, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan View Post
Didn't get to part of the first half. We got down a bit and ended the half down 7. I wasn't very positive at that point, but we played better in the second half.

1. Crutcher 40 minutes, 6-11, 8 assists, 1 TO. Those are outstanding numbers for anyone, let alone a frosh.
2. DD - 4 -18, including 1-8 from 3, 5 assists and 5 TOs, too many missed drives to the hoop. Really not a good game. If he pressures Pipkins more as ball is going into back court, no way he recovers and gets that shot off. I mean, total luck but still, we could have prevented.
3. Josh and Trey with mostly outstanding games. Only downside for Josh was 5-9 from FT. Too bad Trey fouled out. Svoboda was a huge dropoff. No scoring ability and not good defense.
4. Kostas and X non-factors. I wouldn't be surprised if he left and went and played in Greece. He's not getting much time here and certainly hasn't shown anything. Who knows though, maybe he comes back next year much improved. Let's start with the attitude.
5. Wonder if Crosby wishes he had stayed gone. Unless Crutcher gets in foul trouble again or gets injured, he won't likely see the floor much.
6. Is Jordan Davis hurt? He doesn't seem to be, but his scoring has really fallen off the table.

Probably biggest difference in game is UMass made 7 more 3s than we did. We had our chances. Crutcher had a good look, it just didn't drop. Then we freaking fall asleep on that inbound play with 2 seconds on the clock.

I had higher expectations for the team but at this point, expectations weren't aligned with reality, kind of like my golf game. This team has some good components, but the sum is not better than the individual parts. I don't know who else might come in next year, but I hope they can contribute right away, because we're going to need it.
I recall some games this year at the Arena in which Kostas showed real signs of being a star. I think maybe he is discouraged with the lack of playing time. But when you cannot stay on the court or when you are lobbing up three-balls, there is a reason he is not getting court time. I could see three or four defections this year.
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Old 02-03-2018, 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by TommyGola View Post
I recall some games this year at the Arena in which Kostas showed real signs of being a star. I think maybe he is discouraged with the lack of playing time. But when you cannot stay on the court or when you are lobbing up three-balls, there is a reason he is not getting court time. I could see three or four defections this year.
Four may be a bit high, but on balance that would be a good thing. Ryan and Obi-Won could be positives and a few new faces has to be an improvement.
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Old 02-03-2018, 10:58 PM
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Strange game. With no pressure and about 40 secs left. Mass gets 10 sec, call. Trey passes to Crutcher and Crutcher isn't looking. Trey went to get it but would that be traveling if he picked it up. Crosby's first touch was an air ball from 5 feet. His next play was his famous one on five spin move for a travel. How would you like to ride the bench,(Kostas and XW) with MS being he go to sub. You can't sink much lower. Maybe they don't deserve to play. I assume the coach is sending a message. What message? I don't know.
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Old 02-04-2018, 12:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Alberto Strasse View Post
that Archie Miller left has fallen on hard times much quicker than anyone would have imagined. The new coach has not found the words or inspiration to motivate this team to play competent defense. It will take several scholarships and considerable time to elevate the program to the level Dayton fans have become accustomed to.
It is because AM left us with zero talent. And if anyone keeps saying we have talent, you are delusional. Nice bench hey? Let AG get HIS recruits in. If in 2-3 years its still this same cluster### of a season, then I'll be the first person
to applaud UD Scott!
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Old 02-04-2018, 04:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Donniex3Era View Post
It is because AM left us with zero talent. And if anyone keeps saying we have talent, you are delusional. Nice bench hey? Let AG get HIS recruits in. If in 2-3 years its still this same cluster### of a season, then I'll be the first person
to applaud UD Scott!
Josh Cunningham is zero talent
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Old 02-04-2018, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Donniex3Era View Post
It is because AM left us with zero talent. And if anyone keeps saying we have talent, you are delusional. Nice bench hey? Let AG get HIS recruits in. If in 2-3 years its still this same cluster### of a season, then I'll be the first person
to applaud UD Scott!
“Zero talent” is a bit of an exaggeration, but it’s no stretch to say the biggest reasons for our success over the past few seasons aren’t even at UD anymore. Add-in the injuries to Mikesell and Williams, and your returning core of proven talent is limited to 2 guys: Josh Cunningham and Darrell Davis. Trey has been a great and pleasant surprise in what’s essentially his first real season of college ball, but beyond that, we’ve had to rely on freshmen to fill the gaps. Not an enviable situation.

Now, I’m not going to give Anthony a total “pass” on developing players. In the first 4 years of the Archie era, that was one of his clear strengths. But these past 2 seasons, Archie seemed to be less focused on player development and more focused on making the NCAA. And that was good for both him and the University, but that also meant we had no one groomed to fill the roles that Scoochie, Kyle, and Charles handled for us the past 2 seasons (and I’m counting Josh as Kendall’s replacement here). Crosby is only marginally better now than when he first took the court in November of 2015. Darrell has generally played well for us this year, but you couldn’t have projected his current productivity last February. Trey wasn’t given a chance to develop on the court last year. And those were the players Archie left behind to handle the PG and wing positions this year. So, yeah, the guy who developed players like Oliver & Pierre, and found transfers like Sanford & Sibert to fill holes was largely “coaching for the moment” these past 2 seasons. And we’re seeing the effects of that now.
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Old 02-04-2018, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by T-Bone 84 View Post
“Zero talent” is a bit of an exaggeration, but it’s no stretch to say the biggest reasons for our success over the past few seasons aren’t even at UD anymore. Add-in the injuries to Mikesell and Williams, and your returning core of proven talent is limited to 2 guys: Josh Cunningham and Darrell Davis. Trey has been a great and pleasant surprise in what’s essentially his first real season of college ball, but beyond that, we’ve had to rely on freshmen to fill the gaps. Not an enviable situation.

Now, I’m not going to give Anthony a total “pass” on developing players. In the first 4 years of the Archie era, that was one of his clear strengths. But these past 2 seasons, Archie seemed to be less focused on player development and more focused on making the NCAA. And that was good for both him and the University, but that also meant we had no one groomed to fill the roles that Scoochie, Kyle, and Charles handled for us the past 2 seasons (and I’m counting Josh as Kendall’s replacement here). Crosby is only marginally better now than when he first took the court in November of 2015. Darrell has generally played well for us this year, but you couldn’t have projected his current productivity last February. Trey wasn’t given a chance to develop on the court last year. And those were the players Archie left behind to handle the PG and wing positions this year. So, yeah, the guy who developed players like Oliver & Pierre, and found transfers like Sanford & Sibert to fill holes was largely “coaching for the moment” these past 2 seasons. And we’re seeing the effects of that now.
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I don't think it's coaching in the moment but more missing on this current class of juniors. If he stuck around could Naz Carter, McKinley Wright and possible grad/transfers plugged those holes, who knows? Too much I think is made of Archie giving up or being bad a recruiter.

Landers in my opinion was a good find by Archie. He's a had a couple games that were duds in A10 play but I think there's a good argument he's turned a corner in conference play. Trey had a sports hernia last year, he very well could not have been healthy enough to contribute.

Crosby I don't think is a development issue, he's just not good enough. On paper he was a good recruit. Offer from Maryland, North Carolina brought him in for visit. Just a miss but he certainly was a promising prospect when he signed.

X Williams showed plenty of promise last year, this year who knows if it's injuries or what going on.

Mikesell has been hurt this year and from what the DDN has reported his hips significantly hampered his play last year.

Sam Miller is a knuckle head. Maybe he's not good, maybe he didn't work hard

The junior class had some misses in it and that's certainly on Archie. Not bringing in a transfer after Cunningham to help backfill some of these wholes is on him. To say he quit developing or recruiting isn't reality.
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Old 02-04-2018, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
I don't think it's coaching in the moment but more missing on this current class of juniors. If he stuck around could Naz Carter, McKinley Wright and possible grad/transfers plugged those holes, who knows? Too much I think is made of Archie giving up or being bad a recruiter.

Landers in my opinion was a good find by Archie. He's a had a couple games that were duds in A10 play but I think there's a good argument he's turned a corner in conference play. Trey had a sports hernia last year, he very well could not have been healthy enough to contribute.

Crosby I don't think is a development issue, he's just not good enough. On paper he was a good recruit. Offer from Maryland, North Carolina brought him in for visit. Just a miss but he certainly was a promising prospect when he signed.

X Williams showed plenty of promise last year, this year who knows if it's injuries or what going on.

Mikesell has been hurt this year and from what the DDN has reported his hips significantly hampered his play last year.

Sam Miller is a knuckle head. Maybe he's not good, maybe he didn't work hard

The junior class had some misses in it and that's certainly on Archie. Not bringing in a transfer after Cunningham to help backfill some of these wholes is on him. To say he quit developing or recruiting isn't reality.
I agree that if Archie had not left, this would have been the step back/reload year many were prepared for as opposed to the disaster it has become.
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Old 02-04-2018, 10:26 AM
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Darrell Davis missed two layups in 2OT that could've helped or possibly won it. Like it or not, with UMass doubling Josh, he was who had to win the game and he couldn't.
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Old 02-04-2018, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by CE80 View Post
I agree that if Archie had not left, this would have been the step back/reload year many were prepared for as opposed to the disaster it has become.
Oh, the same Archie Miller that is now 12-12 at Indiana. He is having the same issues that AG is experiencing with a depleted roster and implementing a new system. For those that have obviously forgotten, last years senior class set the record for most wins in UD history. Currently, we have two freshmen and a sophomore in the starting lineup. Junior Ryan Mikesell is red-shirting from hip surgery and Junior Xeyrius Williams is battling through a back problem. Our bench? We have Svoboda (Freshman), Kostas (Freshman), Crosby (Junior), and Pierce (Freshman). Also, our other Freshman (Toppin) in ineligible. 10-12 record? Yeah, that's about right.
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Old 02-04-2018, 01:49 PM
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I am the biggest theorist on our lack of talent, but goodnight can we stop with the Archie blame. He recruited Steve, who would have been a junior. He also recruited the best freshman in the PAC12, and another PAC freshman at Washington, who is a good player. Miller and Mikesell were both to play this year. Archie had decent talent lined up. Things did not work out for us.
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Old 02-04-2018, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Monster Man View Post
Oh, the same Archie Miller that is now 12-12 at Indiana. He is having the same issues that AG is experiencing with a depleted roster and implementing a new system. For those that have obviously forgotten, last years senior class set the record for most wins in UD history. Currently, we have two freshmen and a sophomore in the starting lineup. Junior Ryan Mikesell is red-shirting from hip surgery and Junior Xeyrius Williams is battling through a back problem. Our bench? We have Svoboda (Freshman), Kostas (Freshman), Crosby (Junior), and Pierce (Freshman). Also, our other Freshman (Toppin) in ineligible. 10-12 record? Yeah, that's about right.
Archie had his system and recruiting class in place which would have put him two giant steps ahead of Grant. His attention in the spring could have been focused on bringing in a grad transfer or two and not re-recruiting the freshman like Grant needed to do. It really doesn't matter, but I think a step bask/reload year is a fair characterization of what we would have seen with Archie.
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