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  #301  
Old 12-05-2018, 06:29 PM
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Gazoo: I agree with you. Staying in college one more year would have given him a chance to play significant minutes, for one on one coaching and time to bulk up slowly. He is now in a position where he has to immediately show talent and results to impress the NBA and Mavs. Based on talented kids coming out of college and from Europe every year, I am not optimistic about his chances. I have always felt he made a mistake.
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  #302  
Old 12-05-2018, 08:38 PM
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Again, Kostas hated school. He was not staying and could not.
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  #303  
Old 12-06-2018, 09:26 AM
TheDuke2003 TheDuke2003 is offline
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Kostas will have a solid career playing in some mid tier Euro league.
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  #304  
Old 12-06-2018, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
Again, Kostas hated school. He was not staying and could not.
One of two important points that seem to be missed or ignored. The other being that the NBA is pouring money and support into the G-League.

This isn't the World League, the USBL or even the old D-League. The Mavs have a vested interest in Kostas succeeding. Maybe he is getting no nutritional or skills training. For some reason, I doubt it.

And to build on your point, all other things being equal, if he had come in and been a severe behavioral issue many would have said good riddance. I'm not sure anyone actually SAYS that but you get the point. The kid didn't want to be in school... any school.

He is pretty much exactly the type of kid that has driven the changes in the G-League. If the new model is to work it will be because it works for kids like Kostas. It seems like most wish him well even if they disagree with the decision which is the way it should be. The "new" G-League is going to have an impact on the game. Hopefully, it isn't something we need to deal with too often.
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  #305  
Old 12-06-2018, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
FWIW, Kostas is putting up very pedestrian numbers in the G-League.

https://stats.gleague.nba.com/player/1628961/

Thru 12 games he's averaging 9.1 pts and 6.3 rbs and 2 blocks with a +/- of -2.
Not sure if I would say pedestrian. Considering what he put up in college I think those numbers are pretty good for him in his first year at that level.
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  #306  
Old 12-06-2018, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
Not sure if I would say pedestrian. Considering what he put up in college I think those numbers are pretty good for him in his first year at that level.
I understand what you're implying, but if you take a few minutes to compare his stats to others who weren't drafted and those who were, 'pedestrian' is actually a compliment.
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  #307  
Old 12-06-2018, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
I understand what you're implying, but if you take a few minutes to compare his stats to others who weren't drafted and those who were, 'pedestrian' is actually a compliment.
I get what you are saying too but I gotta believe the Mavs see upside in him that may take a little while so they probably didn't expect huge numbers right away...plus they know what his last name is and we all know they are hoping lightning strikes twice!
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  #308  
Old 12-06-2018, 11:53 AM
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what were his brothers stats the first two years after he was drafted?
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  #309  
Old 12-06-2018, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by steverino015 View Post
what were his brothers stats the first two years after he was drafted?
FWIW, Giannis turns 24 today.

as a 19 year old rookie, he averaged 6.8 pts and 4.4 rbs, starting 23 games

as a 20 year old, he averaged 12.7/6.7 and started 71 of 81 games.

Kostas turned 21 on Nov 20th...2 weeks ago.

At 22, Giannis was voted a started in the NBA All-Star game.
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  #310  
Old 12-06-2018, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Bucketnight View Post
One of two important points that seem to be missed or ignored. The other being that the NBA is pouring money and support into the G-League.

This isn't the World League, the USBL or even the old D-League. The Mavs have a vested interest in Kostas succeeding. Maybe he is getting no nutritional or skills training. For some reason, I doubt it.

And to build on your point, all other things being equal, if he had come in and been a severe behavioral issue many would have said good riddance. I'm not sure anyone actually SAYS that but you get the point. The kid didn't want to be in school... any school.

He is pretty much exactly the type of kid that has driven the changes in the G-League. If the new model is to work it will be because it works for kids like Kostas. It seems like most wish him well even if they disagree with the decision which is the way it should be. The "new" G-League is going to have an impact on the game. Hopefully, it isn't something we need to deal with too often.
Totally get your point. And I don't want to be at work, I just want to make millions of $$. Can I? Nope.

KA didn't want to be in school. He made his choice. If he had a little more "want" regardless of how much he enjoyed school he would have, in my opinion, been better served. What he wants has very little to do with the equation. It's not like he would have flunked out when surrounded by the number of advisors he would have.

So, yeah, suck it up and go to class or go to Oregon / North Carolina.
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  #311  
Old 12-06-2018, 02:34 PM
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Kastas = Cardale

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  #312  
Old 12-06-2018, 04:28 PM
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And yet Cardale stayed in school when he could have (and probably should have) gone pro.
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  #313  
Old 12-06-2018, 10:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
Totally get your point. And I don't want to be at work, I just want to make millions of $$. Can I? Nope.

KA didn't want to be in school. He made his choice. If he had a little more "want" regardless of how much he enjoyed school he would have, in my opinion, been better served. What he wants has very little to do with the equation. It's not like he would have flunked out when surrounded by the number of advisors he would have.

So, yeah, suck it up and go to class or go to Oregon / North Carolina.
The major difference in your (and my) situations compared to Kostas is that there wasn't a multi-billion dollar industry developing it's own support system as an alternative route. The investment the NBA is making is making in a minor league feeder system now means that a kid's wants do now matter.

Of course the route won't be open to most kids. Many, and I hope most, of the kids that do have that alternative as a legitimate route will prefer the exposure, rivalries, life experience and education that comes with playing in college. The vast majority of kids are in the same position they have always been. The G-League won't be an option so they will need to go to school to play at a school regardless of want. Kostas had a legitimate alternative and took it. How legitimate is yet to be seen. A lot will have to do with the kid and more than likely the NBA organization affiliated with a kid's G-League team.

Football was alluded to in a few posts. Obviously a completely different animal.
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  #314  
Old 12-07-2018, 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Bucketnight View Post
The major difference in your (and my) situations compared to Kostas is that there wasn't a multi-billion dollar industry developing it's own support system as an alternative route. The investment the NBA is making is making in a minor league feeder system now means that a kid's wants do now matter.

Of course the route won't be open to most kids. Many, and I hope most, of the kids that do have that alternative as a legitimate route will prefer the exposure, rivalries, life experience and education that comes with playing in college. The vast majority of kids are in the same position they have always been. The G-League won't be an option so they will need to go to school to play at a school regardless of want. Kostas had a legitimate alternative and took it. How legitimate is yet to be seen. A lot will have to do with the kid and more than likely the NBA organization affiliated with a kid's G-League team.

Football was alluded to in a few posts. Obviously a completely different animal.
I think the basic difference in assumptions here is this:

Option 1: go to the D league because you don't want to go to school, sign a 2-way contract, make a few hundred thousand $ for a couple years (risking injury), then you're left with the optionality of either multi-million $ NBA contract or Europe.

Option 2: stay in school for 1 more year and earn nothing (risking injury), but then instead of being drafted last in the 2nd round you get drafted in the first round with multi-million $ guaranteed contract, then you're left with the optionality of either making it in the NBA from the start (more likely if guaranteed contract--they hate sending you down at that point), D league (risk of injury), or Europe.

I'm not saying I'm right that he'd be a first round pick. But it is my assumption. Racking up big numbers against the A10 and highlight reel plays that raise his profile means he's no longer just the younger brother, he's the younger brother on SportsCenter every night.

If you assume he's equally likely to get the big contract by going another year of college or a year of D league, then go to the D league. I'm assuming he's got a better chance of getting a big payout by staying a year.

So if you want to argue the assumption that's totally fine. I very well may be wrong. But if you take my assumption as a given, he made the wrong choice. And if I take your assumption as a given (I'm putting words in your mouth) then he made the right choice. I think this keeps getting confused in this discussion.
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  #315  
Old 12-07-2018, 07:31 PM
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See Bryce Love, Stanford running back. Last year, second in the Heisman, projected as a first round pick. He decided to stay in school, but he is an excellent student, who is going to med school at some point. Love definitely wants to play pro football. This year hurt most of the year, and had a poor season. Will he get drafted? Maybe, with so many rounds, but he lost some huge bucks.
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Old 12-07-2018, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
If you assume he's equally likely to get the big contract by going another year of college or a year of D league, then go to the D league. I'm assuming he's got a better chance of getting a big payout by staying a year.

So if you want to argue the assumption that's totally fine. I very well may be wrong. But if you take my assumption as a given, he made the wrong choice. And if I take your assumption as a given (I'm putting words in your mouth) then he made the right choice. I think this keeps getting confused in this discussion.
You KNOW what happens when we assume!

FWIW, I actually think there are huge holes in both our assumptions. It is a huge leap of faith to believe Kostas would have made the leap to being one of the 20-25 non-European players taken in the 1st round. We can't be sure how he would have fit or if he would have gone to class enough to stay eligible. On the other hand, it is taking a leap of faith to believe that a kid without the motivation to embrace the college experience will have the motivation and maturity to grind out the path to get beyond the G-League. A kid with money and at this point unknown structure could be a very bad mix. He has a great opportunity but it will be up to him.

Now on to more important things. This is the first year that Great Lakes Christmas Ale has been distributed to NE Florida. It is (relatively) cold outside so I need to take advantage.
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