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  #201  
Old 06-17-2018, 10:47 AM
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Jonathan Givony

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42 percent of the players in the NBA this season were second round picks or undrafted.
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  #202  
Old 06-17-2018, 12:12 PM
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Nice in-depth article on KA.



http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/c...aft_night_call:


The next Antetokounmpo: Kostas awaits his draft-night call
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  #203  
Old 06-18-2018, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Jonathan Givony

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42 percent of the players in the NBA this season were second round picks or undrafted.

I understand your point, but: 100% of players who made catastrophically poor decisions continue to be outside the NBA for their entire careers.
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  #204  
Old 06-18-2018, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Jonathan Givony

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42 percent of the players in the NBA this season were second round picks or undrafted.
You can spin this the other way too. Piecing together a few different data sources, for this years draft I found:

77 Underclassmen declared (with an agent)
11 International Players
84 "Notable" seniors. Obviously there are a lot more than 84, but Draft Express listed the guys they felt were relevant to the draft discussion.

Meaning that 142 of the 172 draft eligible players will be 2nd round or undrafted.

That would mean that 82% of the eligble players make up 42% of the league. Flipped the other way, 18% of the players (1st round picks) make up 58 % of the league.
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  #205  
Old 06-18-2018, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
I understand your point, but: 100% of players who made catastrophically poor decisions continue to be outside the NBA for their entire careers.
I'm sure that's correct. I also do not think Kostas is one of those that made a catastrophically poor decision.
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  #206  
Old 06-18-2018, 03:52 PM
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Wow. All this discussion about the Kostas and the NBA draft. I may actually watch it this year.......Nah.
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  #207  
Old 06-18-2018, 04:05 PM
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Draft Watch Party, College Station Texas, PM for the address. Be there or be square!

FYI, we will only be watching the last half of the 2nd round, B.B.A.L.I. (bring beer and leave it).
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  #208  
Old 06-19-2018, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by MNFats View Post
You can spin this the other way too. Piecing together a few different data sources, for this years draft I found:

77 Underclassmen declared (with an agent)
11 International Players
84 "Notable" seniors. Obviously there are a lot more than 84, but Draft Express listed the guys they felt were relevant to the draft discussion.

Meaning that 142 of the 172 draft eligible players will be 2nd round or undrafted.

That would mean that 82% of the eligble players make up 42% of the league. Flipped the other way, 18% of the players (1st round picks) make up 58 % of the league.

I love facts.
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  #209  
Old 06-21-2018, 09:48 AM
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ESPN Analytics

Underrated prospects according to the ESPN Analytics model.

De'Anthony Melton | G | USC

Keita Bates-Diop | PF | Ohio State

Kostas Antetokounmpo | SF | Dayton

Overrated by the model:

Lonnie Walker IV | G | Miami

Elie Okobo | PG | France

Aaron Holiday | PG | UCLA
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  #210  
Old 06-21-2018, 10:16 AM
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Wink They plot thickens.

Originally Posted by Justin View Post
Bleacher Report updated theirs. Kostas to Charlotte at 55

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...-begin#slide15
Charlotte just announced they will trade Dwight Howard to the Nets for a player and picks.

THEY ACQUIRED THE 45TH PICK WHICH GIVES THEM TWO SECOND ROUND PICKS TONIGHT----45 AND 55.

Hmmmmm.
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  #211  
Old 06-21-2018, 10:52 AM
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Probably dumped Howard and his double double average for the year in the NBA to get our prima dona and his career 58 fg's. He's well rested.
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  #212  
Old 06-21-2018, 11:17 AM
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Charlotte just traded a head case for a #45 pick which makes their #55 pick a virtual throw-away. It's a perfect storm to possibly pick Kostas which will make your day, along with many others.
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  #213  
Old 06-21-2018, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
Charlotte just traded a head case for a #45 pick which makes their #55 pick a virtual throw-away. It's a perfect storm to possibly pick Kostas which will make your day, along with many others.
So, are you upgrading your previous 50/50 odds? What kind of odds are you giving this now?
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  #214  
Old 06-21-2018, 12:42 PM
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https://www.cbssports.com/college-ba...hursday-night/


Interesting take from Matt Norlander's 2 round mock released this afternoon:


57: Thunder


Kostas:



At this point, I can't see him falling out of the second round. Reports have him testing well, so much to the point that he shut down his workouts. That probably means his camp thinks a team is picking him no matter what.
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  #215  
Old 06-21-2018, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
So, are you upgrading your previous 50/50 odds? What kind of odds are you giving this now?
If I was a betting man, I would say 70-30 he gets picked.
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  #216  
Old 06-21-2018, 02:18 PM
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https://www.daytondailynews.com/spor...lkrphGwqyobbL/

Good (meaning accurate) comments from Kane and Cathrall on Kostas.

From what I have heard school just wasn't "his thing" and there are probably a number of reasons for that. One might be that the educational system in Greece is/was the lowest rated in Europe (according to sources I found when he was redshirted).Then there is the language barrier, sometimes you don't like something at which you aren't good or at least adequate.
From the quotes (in another article) by a "former staffer, we now know that Archie brought him here on a 2/3 year plan and that is all the time Kostas planned on staying. There was never an intention of getting a degree. Nor did Kostas grow up watching college basketball and dream of playing in the NCAA tournament.

He must not have burned all his bridges at Dayton or he wouldn't have been here last week working the basketball camp.
I hope his name is called tonight (I think it will be) and hope he makes it.

Last edited by Lifelong Flyer Fan; 06-21-2018 at 02:29 PM..
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  #217  
Old 06-22-2018, 12:14 AM
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Kostas was picked 60th by Philadelphia Sixers. The last pick in the draft.
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  #218  
Old 06-22-2018, 12:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Buckleyma View Post
Kostas was picked 60th by Philadelphia Sixers. The last pick in the draft.
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The Dallas Mavericks got the rights to the pick so he is headed to Texas to play with Luka Doncic and Dirk. This is nothing but a positive for UD. Being the last pick of the draft is actually kind of fun; may end up being discussed a little more than if he was the 55th pick.

Go Flyers. Good luck to Kostas.
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  #219  
Old 06-22-2018, 08:09 AM
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selection video
https://twitter.com/twitter/statuses...11182101561344
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  #220  
Old 06-22-2018, 08:51 AM
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Dallas News: Mavs select Giannis' brother Kostas Antetokounmpo with final pick in NBA draft

https://sportsday.dallasnews.com/dal...pick-nba-draft

How would you grade the Mavs' picking Kostas Antetokounmpo with the 60th pick in the draft?
A 42.8% (113 votes)


B 24.24% (64 votes)


C 16.67% (44 votes)


D 8.33% (22 votes)


F 7.95% (21 votes)



Total Votes: 264
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  #221  
Old 06-22-2018, 08:59 AM
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Close to home! Only a 2.5 drive for me to see Kostas if he gets some playing time! Super excited, congrats Kostas!
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Old 06-22-2018, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Lifelong Flyer Fan View Post
selection video
https://twitter.com/twitter/statuses...11182101561344
Summed up perfectly:

" . . . but what you're hoping for . . ."

" . . . if he puts it all together, who knows what could happen."
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Old 06-22-2018, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Justin View Post
Close to home! Only a 2.5 drive for me to see Kostas if he gets some playing time! Super excited, congrats Kostas!

Are you close to retirement, or is there a job transfer in your future anywhere in the next 10 years?
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Old 06-22-2018, 09:08 AM
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In case you're keeping score -

UD players drafted - 1
X players drafted - 0
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  #225  
Old 06-22-2018, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
With really no more promise than Devin Searcy, Kostas has the name and the pedigree to make scouts look twice and think about what's possible. All things being equal Kostas would have no more chance at an NBA camp than Devin. But that is not the case.

I wouldn't put money on it either way. It will be interesting. I could see the Mavericks or Sacramento taking a chance in the second round because they have a history of making some of the worst picks in the league.
Bump.
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  #226  
Old 06-22-2018, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Widget View Post
I'd be willing to bet a 16 ounce Old Milwaukee that kostas gets drafted.
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  #227  
Old 06-22-2018, 03:02 PM
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XU seed: 1

I'll trade. Where do I sign?
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Old 06-22-2018, 03:52 PM
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Working at Texas A&M now, hopefully he sees some time off the bench (or G-league call up).

Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
Are you close to retirement, or is there a job transfer in your future anywhere in the next 10 years?
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Old 06-22-2018, 04:18 PM
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It sure looks good seeing that Dayton jersey on Kostas. Especially on the Mavs website.

https://www.mavs.com/mavericks-acqui...antetokounmpo/

Kostas will likely spend his development days with the Mavs G-League team, the Frisco, Texas, Legends.

The Legends play a short 20 minutes from my home. If he is getting minutes (without fouling out since they have 6 fouls/game lol) I'll be at a lot of their games with my Flyer garb on.

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Old 06-22-2018, 06:16 PM
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Since I live in the D/FW area, I might have to go see a Mavs pre-season game if he's still on the roster.
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Old 06-22-2018, 07:37 PM
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Originally Posted by N2663R View Post
UD players drafted - 1
X players drafted - 0
Iím in the AK should have stayed one more year boat, but this post alone might sway me to the AK is in the NBA bandwagon
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Old 07-13-2018, 08:32 PM
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Kostas did in fact sign a two way contract with the Mavs per Marc Stein.

https://mobile.twitter.com/TheSteinL...27998232715264

Marc Stein
@TheSteinLine
The Mavericks have signed No. 60 overall pick Kostas Antetokounmpo to a two-way contract
8:25 PM ∑ Jul 13, 2018
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  #233  
Old 07-14-2018, 10:21 AM
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I've heard the term many times. But not exactly certain what it means.

What is a two way contract?
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Old 07-14-2018, 10:33 AM
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DDN: Mavericks excited about potential of former Dayton forward Antetokounmpo

https://www.mydaytondailynews.com/sp...vGvnnCCEztPsN/
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Old 07-14-2018, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Flyer 86 View Post
I've heard the term many times. But not exactly certain what it means.

What is a two way contract?
From the DDN article:

"The two-way contracts came to the NBA last season. Charles Cooke signed one a year ago with the New Orleans Pelicans. Teams can keep two two-way players on the roster. The contracts allow them to split time between the NBA and the G-League."
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Old 07-14-2018, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Flyer 86 View Post
I've heard the term many times. But not exactly certain what it means.

What is a two way contract?
This article is from last year but has a good explanation: https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2017/7/18/15985262/nba-two-way-contract-2017-summer-league-agents-worried-about-them

Here are the specific details for the new two-way contract:

They will act as a 16th and 17th roster spot for NBA teams beginning next season (2017-18).
The player can spend up to 45 days with the NBA team that signs him, although no time is guaranteed.
The rest of the playerís contract must be spent in the G-League, either for the teamís affiliate or anotherís if the team he signs with doesnít have a G-League affiliate yet. For the 2017-18 season, the G-League will represent 26 of the NBAís 30 teams.
The playerís pay comes on a tiered salary system, which can last one or two seasons. While in the G-League, the player will make $75,000. Itís a significant increase from the current pay structure for G-Leaguers, who cannot make more than $26,000 with a one-way G-League deal.
When in the NBA, a player with a two-way contract will accrue a day of service and make money consistent with an NBA rookie minimum, which is about $816,000 next season. If a player spends 45 days in the NBA, he could make around $204,000.
In total, a two-way player who spends the maximum amount of time in the NBA would make $279,000.
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  #237  
Old 07-14-2018, 11:34 AM
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Not bad for Kostas considering his output at Dayton. Just goes to show you how "potential" is rewarded in the NBA, not to mention the famous accomplished older brother...
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Old 07-14-2018, 04:25 PM
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Kostas' contract!!

I'm amazed. No not because he got a real contract for two years, but because the kudos aren't rolling in. Not since Hillary have so many fans been wrong (admittedly a very small minority).

There is a new bird on the endangered list world-wide---the CROW. .

Next small group of Kostas detractors to fall will be in this class:

"Mark my words, he will never play a minute of NBA basketball". I paraphrase because I didn't bother to look it up. (my guess is maddog07).
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Old 07-14-2018, 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted by longtimefan67 View Post
Not bad for Kostas considering his output at Dayton. Just goes to show you how "potential" is rewarded in the NBA, not to mention the famous accomplished older brother...
What does he have to accomplish before you stop giving credit to his brother? His brother was not out on the court with him during the Summer League...
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  #240  
Old 07-14-2018, 04:45 PM
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I don't know that this is all that hard to understand. He didn't like college, just wanted to play basketball. Had a coaching change happen underneath him where he wasn't on the same page as his coach. Showed flashes of promise from time to time but was likely weighed down by everything else, including the death of his father. Now he's getting the opportunity to do what he really wants, without all of the baggage of college, and will just continue to improve if he works hard and especially when he puts on some more muscle.
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Old 07-14-2018, 06:09 PM
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Congratulations to Kostas, I am truly happy for him.

The Antekounbros (the name they coined) were all in attendance last night for the final summer league game of the Mavs. They are a tight, tight group. I think it is rather exceptional they way they all pull for one another. https://twitter.com/DwainPrice/statu...29043478396928

Take a look at the Mav's twitter video they posted of Kostas welcoming him. The Dayton uniform and arena floor look really good to me. https://twitter.com/dallasmavs/statu...29926282891264

and SDF, get your Dayton gear ready to attend his games!
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Old 07-14-2018, 07:07 PM
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I wish Kostas had played another year at Dayton ó I think he would have blossomed this year. Failing that, I wish heíd completed the academic year. But neither of those things happened. But he WAS at UD most of two years. He showed flashes of brilliance on the court, and he never said a bad word about his teammates, coaching staff or the university. He posted a gracious farewell to Flyer fans, and he even returned to help out at one of the summer camps. We could have done far worse than with this kid, who by the way still wears Dayton apparel. He was drafted, which shines a positive light on UD, and now he has a chance to make his NBA dream come true. Iíve never understood why anyone would cast him in such a negative light or take potshots at his character. Itís fine to be disappointed that his Flyer days are over, but itís also fine to take pride in a kid with NBA potential who will always be affiliated with the University of Dayton. In my book, thatís a good thing.
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Old 07-14-2018, 07:24 PM
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Coach Grant mentioned that Kostas much better towards the end of the season. He was off campus in the summer, had an injury that took him out of most of preseason. Then his father died. He had to learn a new system, Grant vs Miller and then he had to figure out his role, talents etc.... That was a lot at once, especially for a young raw talent.

It was clear at first that his defense was awful, especially his footwork. He could not play man to man defense, but he could block shots. His outside shot, especially three point shooting needed a lot work. His ball handling was weak. He also had maturity issues such as against Duquesne. A lot of development work was needed, but he was long, quick and could jump. He had the potential

As the season progressed, he became a better player and showed that he could very good if he worked on his game and bought into team role. I was hoping he would stay one more year, but now academics won’t get in the way of NBA development. At UD, you must attend classes.
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Old 07-14-2018, 07:58 PM
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Originally Posted by longtimefan67 View Post
Not bad for Kostas considering his output at Dayton. Just goes to show you how "potential" is rewarded in the NBA, not to mention the famous accomplished older brother...
Actually I firmly believe you are correct in terms of being the 60th pick. But we are on to step two now, and you get contracts based on performance unless you are Austin Rivers and your dad is the coach.

Mavs brass were impressed, calling Kostas a Rim Runner with outstanding athleticism. In other words can cover the whole NBA floor. Donnie Nelson and Rick Carlisle know a thing or two. Had to cut player "B" they like to sign Kostas, while hoping that player "B" makes it through waivers so they can get him back. You don't take that risk for player "A" because you know he won't make it through waivers.

Tells me Kostas would be a low 50 pick already if they were re-drafting today even if his name was Jones.
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Old 07-15-2018, 01:05 AM
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Cool

Originally Posted by The Fly View Post
I wish Kostas had played another year at Dayton ó I think he would have blossomed this year. Failing that, I wish heíd completed the academic year. But neither of those things happened. But he WAS at UD most of two years. He showed flashes of brilliance on the court, and he never said a bad word about his teammates, coaching staff or the university. He posted a gracious farewell to Flyer fans, and he even returned to help out at one of the summer camps. We could have done far worse than with this kid, who by the way still wears Dayton apparel. He was drafted, which shines a positive light on UD, and now he has a chance to make his NBA dream come true. Iíve never understood why anyone would cast him in such a negative light or take potshots at his character. Itís fine to be disappointed that his Flyer days are over, but itís also fine to take pride in a kid with NBA potential who will always be affiliated with the University of Dayton. In my book, thatís a good thing.
Well said. Based on many fan opinions, Kostas stole more lunch money than Buddy Revell. Ive never seen Kostas talk poorly about UD the school, the basketball program, the fans, or his experience in Dayton. He still wears UD apparel. So there seems to be zero animosity on his part about his two seasons here. He had to like it enough to tolerate it and sit out a season -- and a coaching change -- in order to play one full freshman season.

Fans are fickle. For the better part of two decades on UDPride the narrative was, "I pray for the day we start getting into the 'difficult position' of having our players leave early for the NBA. Its a problem I welcome with open arms." We finally get a player drafted in the NBA after playing just one frosh season (like Kentucky or Duke draftees) and the kid is a selfish, self-absorbed knob who used Dayton and didnt care about anybody other than himself. I wonder if Kentucky fans say the same thing about their 2-3 early entrant every year? Or show gratitude that the kids went to Kentucky and not a competitor school, and made the program better for having been there at all.

Are Arizona fans dragging Deandre Ayton over the coals for hanging around Tucson for just one season like a selfish d-bag?

Whether Kostas becomes Greek Freak 2.0 in the NBA, lives in the D League, or spends a career in Europe, UD is better for having had an NBA draftee -- the first since Negele Knight which is a lifetime ago. Its not about whether Kostas is the best player at UD since Negele to justify his draft card. The NBA doesnt draft on those metrics. If they did Scoochie and Sibert would have been drafted.

Sure we would have liked him to come back. We would have liked LaDontae Henton sticking around too. A kid's #1 priority is looking out for themselves. When times change, you change with the times and capitalize on your options. Coaches certainly do.
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Old 07-15-2018, 07:09 PM
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And Speaking of Henton, where is this kid playing these days.

Is he overseas or in the G League?

Stud scorer at a pretty high level D1 school. It's rough "making it in N b of A!
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Old 07-17-2018, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Chris R View Post
Fans are fickle. For the better part of two decades on UDPride the narrative was, "I pray for the day we start getting into the 'difficult position' of having our players leave early for the NBA. Its a problem I welcome with open arms." We finally get a player drafted in the NBA after playing just one frosh season (like Kentucky or Duke draftees) and the kid is a selfish, self-absorbed knob who used Dayton and didnt care about anybody other than himself. I wonder if Kentucky fans say the same thing about their 2-3 early entrant every year? Or show gratitude that the kids went to Kentucky and not a competitor school, and made the program better for having been there at all.

Are Arizona fans dragging Deandre Ayton over the coals for hanging around Tucson for just one season like a selfish d-bag?

I don't think Kentucky fans begrudge their one-and-done first round picks. Not at all. But I'll bet the guys who play 5 minutes a game and then leave when they're entirely un-ready, and then don't even sign a big contract, are considered pretty big schmucks.



I think Kostas is a pretty big schmuck. I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Fans are upset that we invested so much time in him and then before he could really contribute he made (what was perceived to be) a really dumb decision.



So we got little out of it, and he appears to have gotten little out of it. And we're all supposed to cheer?
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Old 07-17-2018, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
I don't think Kentucky fans begrudge their one-and-done first round picks. Not at all. But I'll bet the guys who play 5 minutes a game and then leave when they're entirely un-ready, and then don't even sign a big contract, are considered pretty big schmucks.
As the son of two UK graduates who spend their winter travelling the country following the team from game to game, I can tell you that they have no bad feelings towards any of their early entrants. Even a guy like Daniel Orton who really needed more time - and screwed himself by leaving when he did - gets support from UK fans. They still wish him the best and hope he succeeds.

If you transfer out of UK - that's a different story. And if you leave to coach the Celtics and then end up coaching Louisville - well let's just say that gentleman is lucky he never found himself alone in an alley with my mother. She's not a violent person, but man he would have gotten a talkin' to.
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Old 07-17-2018, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
So we got little out of it, and he appears to have gotten little out of it. And we're all supposed to cheer?
Short answer: If you are a Flyer fan - then yes.

Long Answer: I still don't have a clear understanding of what he did wrong (other than not finishing class). In terms of leaving early - he ended up with an NBA contract (albeit a 2-Way - which we would celebrate all night if his name was Scoochie). If you offered each of our current players a 2-way contract with an NBA team if they left right now, I feel very confident some of them would take you up on that. Yes - he needs time to develop. His options were to either do that in Dayton for free (plus going to class) or get paid to develop under the supervision of an NBA team. I really can't find fault in either choice depending on the player.

If 5 years from now he's playing in Greece we can all look back and talk about the "what-ifs". But so far all he's done is do everything his "fans" say he can't.

He won't get drafted. He won't get a contract. Check and check.

He's a former Flyer who is trying to make his dreams come true. And so far he's doing that. I cannot understand why a fan of the Dayton Flyers wouldn't want that for him and celebrate progress towards those goals.
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Old 07-17-2018, 01:13 PM
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Can't put a value on the aspect of the Summer League announcers mentioning drafted out of Dayton and when "School: Dayton" is splatted on the screen. Recruits do pay attention. By hook or crook (yes, I'm old), rival schools can no longer say UD does not get players drafted. Personally I wish Kostas would have stayed one more year, progressed and had been a 2019 first round pick. The return on his decision to leave and be a second rounder will not be realized for a couple of years, but I feel the program is definitely getting some value out of it now.
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Old 07-17-2018, 03:29 PM
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Since I do not know Kostas personally, I defer to the opinions of his team mates who know him far better than any posters.

Here is what Josh Cunningham had to say to a few "fans" who criticized (not a strong enough word) Kostas on social media.
@JoshMCunningham
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If you a real Dayton fan you would congratulate @Kostas_ante13 not talk about what he should have done or he is not ready. His dreams just came true tonight. Y’all should be
happy for him and his family.
9:37 PM - 21 Jun 2018

That was followed by Trey Landers
Replying to @JoshMCunningham
Facts if you ain’t got nothing good to say then don’t say nothing at all !! We family so if you talk about him then has offensive to US period !

And those tweets were retweeted by most of the returning players that I saw. If you read the recent DDN article about Trey, you know it started with recounting draft night... he and Kostas were calling each other at the same time Kostas' name was called.
Even if you don't care for Kostas, if you are a Dayton fan, respect the current players and let up on the criticism of their friend. My 2 cents.
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Old 07-17-2018, 03:33 PM
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a bit off topic but, How great is this!! 2 Flyers with the Mavs

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  #253  
Old 07-17-2018, 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted by MNFats View Post
Short answer: If you are a Flyer fan - then yes.

He won't get drafted. He won't get a contract. Check and check.
.
Don't forget "he will never play a minute in the NBA" --anonymous.

Since he just signed a contract with a 45 day call up clause, the odds of the above being checked just went up significantly.
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Old 07-18-2018, 12:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post

I think Kostas is a pretty big schmuck. I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Fans are upset that we invested so much time in him and then before he could really contribute he made (what was perceived to be) a really dumb decision.

So we got little out of it, and he appears to have gotten little out of it. And we're all supposed to cheer?
When you cut thru the crap, your argument is you won't root for him because he HURT YOUR FEELINGS?!!!!

I guess I get it. You invested a lot of time in him and he spurned you. He's told you... it's not you; it's him. Unacceptable! You invested some of the best years of your life in him.

As you work thru the stages of grief, you will know you hit acceptance when you realize the NBA draft was one of the very few highlights of the UD season.
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Old 07-18-2018, 09:40 AM
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In my part of the world, LSU keeps football recruits flowing through the door because they put guys into the pros regardless if they're winning championships. High visibility guys at that. If not, it's a tougher sell for recruits. It's not everything for all players but at a minimum they're all dreaming of achieving that goal. Kostas getting drafted is a plus for both parties. Hope the young man succeeds, even if I didn't think it was a smart choice for him personally . Good luck Kostas!
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Old 07-18-2018, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Bucketnight View Post
When you cut thru the crap, your argument is you won't root for him because he HURT YOUR FEELINGS?!!!!

I guess I get it. You invested a lot of time in him and he spurned you. He's told you... it's not you; it's him. Unacceptable! You invested some of the best years of your life in him.

As you work thru the stages of grief, you will know you hit acceptance when you realize the NBA draft was one of the very few highlights of the UD season.
Yep...If one is really bothered and upset by what pimple-faced, string bean teenagers who can probably barely wake up in the morning without assistance do, then that person has serious serious issues. "Said" player owes ZILCH/NOTTA/NOTHING/NILL to one fan/person anywhere (outside of family) unless that butt-hurt fan got a little to frisky in sending lunch money to that player and had ulterior motives all along.

Every single kid who plays sports at some point in grade school, HS and/or college has aspirations of playing a pro sport and getting paid.

The ones who really either get better or have potential to get better are dreaming of this as 18-22 year olds....God love these pro sports GM's, owners, etc. who see something in these kids to help them realize their dreams...
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Old 07-19-2018, 05:29 AM
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Originally Posted by MNFats View Post
Short answer: If you are a Flyer fan - then yes.

Long Answer: I still don't have a clear understanding of what he did wrong (other than not finishing class). In terms of leaving early - he ended up with an NBA contract (albeit a 2-Way - which we would celebrate all night if his name was Scoochie). If you offered each of our current players a 2-way contract with an NBA team if they left right now, I feel very confident some of them would take you up on that. Yes - he needs time to develop. His options were to either do that in Dayton for free (plus going to class) or get paid to develop under the supervision of an NBA team. I really can't find fault in either choice depending on the player.

If 5 years from now he's playing in Greece we can all look back and talk about the "what-ifs". But so far all he's done is do everything his "fans" say he can't.

He won't get drafted. He won't get a contract. Check and check.

He's a former Flyer who is trying to make his dreams come true. And so far he's doing that. I cannot understand why a fan of the Dayton Flyers wouldn't want that for him and celebrate progress towards those goals.
Originally Posted by Lifelong Flyer Fan View Post
Since I do not know Kostas personally, I defer to the opinions of his team mates who know him far better than any posters.

Here is what Josh Cunningham had to say to a few "fans" who criticized (not a strong enough word) Kostas on social media.
@JoshMCunningham
Follow Follow @JoshMCunningham
If you a real Dayton fan you would congratulate @Kostas_ante13 not talk about what he should have done or he is not ready. His dreams just came true tonight. Yíall should be
happy for him and his family.
9:37 PM - 21 Jun 2018

That was followed by Trey Landers
Replying to @JoshMCunningham
Facts if you ainít got nothing good to say then donít say nothing at all !! We family so if you talk about him then has offensive to US period !

And those tweets were retweeted by most of the returning players that I saw. If you read the recent DDN article about Trey, you know it started with recounting draft night... he and Kostas were calling each other at the same time Kostas' name was called.
Even if you don't care for Kostas, if you are a Dayton fan, respect the current players and let up on the criticism of their friend. My 2 cents.
Originally Posted by Bucketnight View Post
When you cut thru the crap, your argument is you won't root for him because he HURT YOUR FEELINGS?!!!!

I guess I get it. You invested a lot of time in him and he spurned you. He's told you... it's not you; it's him. Unacceptable! You invested some of the best years of your life in him.

As you work thru the stages of grief, you will know you hit acceptance when you realize the NBA draft was one of the very few highlights of the UD season.
Originally Posted by steve View Post
Yep...If one is really bothered and upset by what pimple-faced, string bean teenagers who can probably barely wake up in the morning without assistance do, then that person has serious serious issues. "Said" player owes ZILCH/NOTTA/NOTHING/NILL to one fan/person anywhere (outside of family) unless that butt-hurt fan got a little to frisky in sending lunch money to that player and had ulterior motives all along.

Every single kid who plays sports at some point in grade school, HS and/or college has aspirations of playing a pro sport and getting paid.

The ones who really either get better or have potential to get better are dreaming of this as 18-22 year olds....God love these pro sports GM's, owners, etc. who see something in these kids to help them realize their dreams...

In summary,??


I'm not rooting against him. And since he's already screwed up (IMO) and wasted his best opportunity by going too early, the only thing left is to hope for the best for him. But no, I won't cheer for dumb decision making.



(AND BY THE WAY, YES, I COULD BE WRONG AND MAYBE IT WAS NOT A DUMB DECISION.)



Let's change it around a bit, shall we? Trump destroys {trade agreement X}, thus permanently and significantly damaging our relationship with {country Y}. What's done is done, eh? Like Kostas declaring early, let's just cheer for the best now! Go USA!! Methinks that's not how you would react. Same here. Bad decision making is bad decision making, and yes I'd like it to work out now that we're here, but I don't have to be happy about how we got here do I? Same with Kostas. It's honestly none of my business because it's his life, but, I don't have to be happy about the decision process. . . but since we're here, sure, good luck Kostas.



No, sorry Steve and bucketnight, I'm not an emotional person. I'm logical. Dumb is dumb, pimple faced or not. Hurt my feelings? Who da fa' is talking about feelings? Nice strawman argument chief.



You know what's even better than being able to say we got some guy drafted (with the last overall pick of the NBA draft into a 2-way contract)? That we got a guy drafted in the top 10. You shot your wad early my friend. You're too happy that you finally got some action and now it's over before it started. So yeah, sure, someone got drafted. If that's all you wanted in life, ya got it.
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Old 07-19-2018, 08:15 AM
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Another thread that has seemingly run it's course, it's now about the members of this forum rather than the original topic. Good luck Kostas, hope it works out for you.
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Old 07-19-2018, 09:28 AM
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Its all a calculated risk. He broke his foot or ďdamagedĒ something last summer - that may have factored into his decision to leave. I donít begrudge him for leaving but if i had a brother in the NBA - thereís no question that if he had stayed another year he would have had a significant chance in a 2nd year to improve his stock to a first round position. Wish him the best but no more than i wish the best for Svoboda. I am way more concerned about this years program and advancement than how he does as a #60.
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Old 07-19-2018, 10:00 AM
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The guy hated school. Can we quit beating the dead horse of "he should have stayed."
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Old 07-19-2018, 11:53 AM
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Interesting fact. Kostas was being courted by Florida. He wouldn't have stayed there either. The studying part of college would not have been on his agenda no matter where he went.

And the reaction from a program of their level would have been, "meh". Movin' on.

But we have to hold a grudge. Where is Trent Meachum anyway?
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Old 07-19-2018, 12:16 PM
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Old 07-19-2018, 12:27 PM
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Trent Meacham plays in France, has played in Europe for 9 years. He and his wife are expecting their 3rd child. Courtesy of instagram. By the way he and Chris Wright (among other former Flyers) "follow" each other. Yep the fans carry grudges, the players move on.
Kostas didn't decide to" take his talents" to another university, though, so I still don't get reaction of some.
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  #264  
Old 07-19-2018, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
You know what's even better than being able to say we got some guy drafted (with the last overall pick of the NBA draft into a 2-way contract)? That we got a guy drafted in the top 10. You shot your wad early my friend. You're too happy that you finally got some action and now it's over before it started. So yeah, sure, someone got drafted. If that's all you wanted in life, ya got it.
You are assuming that getting drafted was his endgame. If so - you're right it was dumb.

But that's not the case - his endgame is a lucrative NBA career. He wasn't going to be a top 10 pick a year from now. Maybe mid to late first at best. If that's the case, he may have made a brilliant decision.

Think about it this way:
He comes back to UD, improves his stock, and gets picked 20th overall. We all celebrate our genius because we were right and coming back was the right decision. Based on the rookie salary scale he gets locked into a 3-4 year contract that will make him an RFA going into the 2023 season and he will have pocketed roughly $9.5M. Not a bad deal.

Now let's come back to reality. Let's say he can make similar progressions with the Mavericks/G-League. He now enters next season as an UFA with projected 1st round value. Those guys aren't getting 4 year/$9.5M contracts. As an UFA with first round value he can get much more than that.

Davis Bertrans, after averaging 5ppg last season just got $7M a year. Amir Johnson averaged 7ppg last year and is 31. He just got $11M. That's more than Kostas would make in 4 years as a late first round pick. The list goes on - and in theory, if Kostas improves he's more valuable than any of them.

Maybe it all crashes and burns. And maybe he ends up looking like a genius because he signs a multiyear contract as an UFA a year from now. Time will tell, but for now, feel free to join the rest of us as we cheer for him and hope he realizes his dreams.

*EDIT - Two way contracts can be one or two years - I have not heard what Kostas signed, but it's typically 1 year. Even if it is a 2 year - the argument is the same that in two years, he can potentially make significantly more.

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Old 07-19-2018, 02:40 PM
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I read where it is a two year contract. So he makes $75k / season. Plus his salary recalculates if he is called up. For each day he is on the NBA roster his pay is prorated based on the $800k rookies minimum. In a perfect world for Kostas, he could make over a Mil on the contract.
Not likely to happen, but he has incentives if he suddenly blows up.
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Old 07-19-2018, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
I read where it is a two year contract. So he makes $75k / season. Plus his salary recalculates if he is called up. For each day he is on the NBA roster his pay is prorated based on the $800k rookies minimum. In a perfect world for Kostas, he could make over a Mil on the contract.
Not likely to happen, but he has incentives if he suddenly blows up.
It can be either. Cooke's two-way deal last year was one year.
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Old 07-19-2018, 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by MNFats View Post
It can be either. Cooke's two-way deal last year was one year.
To be clear, I read where Kostas got a two year contract.
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  #268  
Old 07-20-2018, 03:12 AM
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Originally Posted by MNFats View Post
You are assuming that getting drafted was his endgame. If so - you're right it was dumb.

But that's not the case - his endgame is a lucrative NBA career. He wasn't going to be a top 10 pick a year from now.
That's what I was assuming? Where did I say that? I missed it. Steve said he just wanted to be able to say we got someone drafted.

And if he could be a top 60 pick by showing absolutely nothing in college, I definitely think he could have been a top 10 pick by showing 30 minutes per game and 3 blocks. With Chris Wright highlights and a certain name on his jersey, teams would have really jumped on him.

But hey, if ifs ands buts we're candy and nuts..
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Old 08-08-2018, 05:42 PM
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Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere yet:

The NCAA announced a rule change Wednesday that will allow players to return to school if they declare for the NBA draft but are not selected.

The new rule states that players who participate in the NBA combine can return "as long as they notify their athletics director of their intent by 5 p.m. the Monday after the draft."

That will replace the current rule, which permits players to maintain eligibility if they withdraw from the draft 10 days after the NBA combine.

Although a return to school would be "pending future action from the NBA and the National Basketball Players Association," it would take much of the risk out of declaring for the draft.

Currently, players who remain in the draft and are not selected are forced to pursue other professional options such as the G League or playing in Europe if an NBA team doesn't sign them.

In addition to that rule change, high school players can take more official visits to colleges, and elite high school recruits are also permitted to hire agents to help them "make informed decisions about going pro."

Last month, NBA Commissioner Adam Silver said the league is likely to change its age-eligibility rule.

Players must be one year removed from high school to enter the draft, which has created the one-and-done landscape in college basketball, with top players attending college for one year before making the leap to the NBA.

It is expected the NBA will change its age rule in time for the 2021 NBA draft, although that hasn't officially been announced.
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Old 08-09-2018, 09:18 AM
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ESPN calls the changes cosmetic.
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-bas...-investigation
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Old 08-09-2018, 09:53 AM
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Does this mean that a player who declares for the draft is essentially holding one of your scholarships hostage until he sees if he gets drafted and whether he wants to return?
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Old 08-09-2018, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
Does this mean that a player who declares for the draft is essentially holding one of your scholarships hostage until he sees if he gets drafted and whether he wants to return?
Exactly, but the school has the option of filling his scholarship and letting him become a free agent.
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  #273  
Old 08-10-2018, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
Exactly, but the school has the option of filling his scholarship and letting him become a free agent.

More likely I think is that the school trades up. When player #1 decides to return, and now you have 14 scholarships, player #14 is the odd man out.
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Old 08-10-2018, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
More likely I think is that the school trades up. When player #1 decides to return, and now you have 14 scholarships, player #14 is the odd man out.
There is no security for a kid when a scholarship is given and they officially sign?
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
There is no security for a kid when a scholarship is given and they officially sign?

"Here's the deal son, I'm not going to play you 1 minute this year, and next year ain't looking good either. I think it's time you looked for another school."


Magically, a scholarship just opened up right after the draft.
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Old 08-10-2018, 06:06 PM
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"That's ok Coach, I'm happy to help out on the scout team for practice and finish my education at UD. Wait, mom wants to talk to you."

Gulp.
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