Getting to know Archie

JimBo · #1 03-30-2014, 03:16 PM

As many here will I'm sure remember, I was pretty down on Archie and this team back during conference play. I was about as down as I've ever been on the Flyers. It wasn't only the losses, but I think I still had a little mistrust of Archie. I think it took him a while to give us a chance to get to know who he is. I just wasn't sure if he really embraced the university or the Flyer tradition.

This great run they just went on not only gave us lasting memories on the court, but it allowed Archie to come out of his shell, so to speak. I loved his interviews. I finally feel like I know him. It's obvious now how much he loves this program and how hard of a worker he is. I just never got that before. Maybe I wasn't listening enough, who knows, but I'm glad I finally got to see what he's all about and I'm glad he's the leader of Flyer basketball.

This team has a lot to be proud of, and I'm so happy that I was wrong.

CE80 · #2 03-30-2014, 03:24 PM

A lesson for many (myself included) to learn and remember, don't judge anyone unless you really are in a position to do so. It applies to many situations in life but for sports, unless you are in the locker room and huddle, you really don't diddly.

TA111 · #3 03-30-2014, 03:46 PM

Not only what CE80 said, but you can't judge a team or coach by a couple of games. You need to look at the big picture and look at the program over the course of a couple years.

ud2 · #4 03-30-2014, 04:02 PM

Originally Posted by TA111

Not only what CE80 said, but you can't judge a team or coach by a couple of games. You need to look at the big picture and look at the program over the course of a couple years.

I agree, WAY TOO MANY people on here wanted to run AM out of town earlier this year. Bobber was like a broken record: "everybody get used to this, AM will get his 5 years no matter what...over and over and over...rinse and repeat...rinse and repeat...rinse and repeat."

jack72 · #5 03-30-2014, 04:19 PM

Very interesting that Wabler was renegotiating Archie's contract when a bunch of us were trashing both of them. Proves one thing, they get paid the big bucks and we say whatever we can think of on the spot. How smart do both of them look now?

ud2 · #6 03-30-2014, 04:54 PM

Originally Posted by jack72

Very interesting that Wabler was renegotiating Archie's contract when a bunch of us were trashing both of them. Proves one thing, they get paid the big bucks and we say whatever we can think of on the spot. How smart do both of them look now?

I agree, Wabler looks like an absolute genius right now, and AM may have earned a spot for UD in the NBE with UD's performance this year. Had UD not done so well this year, then maybe the NBE would be considering a different school right now.

steve · #7 03-30-2014, 05:05 PM

It will be interesting what goes on the next couple weeks. Contracts don't mean squat and this contract was signed in Feb. when AM wanted security. There will be some schools making calls to AM very soon. I'd imagine the contract he just signed will be ripped up probably tomorrow and new numbers will be dotting the paper...

ortez52 · #8 03-30-2014, 05:19 PM

Heard Wabler say on a national show on Sirus that they would match any offer made and that his assitants would be rewarded to , I think they know something is going on and are going to do anything they can so this will be a program changing year

steve · #9 03-30-2014, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by ortez52

Heard Wabler say on a national show on Sirus that they would match any offer made and that his assitants would be rewarded to , I think they know something is going on and are going to do anything they can so this will be a program changing year

Good deal. Glad to hear that.

ud2 · #10 03-30-2014, 05:33 PM

Originally Posted by ortez52

Heard Wabler say on a national show on Sirus that they would match any offer made and that his assitants would be rewarded to , I think they know something is going on and are going to do anything they can so this will be a program changing year

Do you remember what show this was? Do you have a link? This is a VERY big deal IMO.

uddave · #11 03-30-2014, 06:25 PM

Originally Posted by steve

It will be interesting what goes on the next couple weeks. Contracts don't mean squat and this contract was signed in Feb. when AM wanted security. There will be some schools making calls to AM very soon. I'd imagine the contract he just signed will be ripped up probably tomorrow and new numbers will be dotting the paper...

This is correct. College basketball coaches generally have at least a 4 year contract. Could you imagine trying to recruit players when they aren't even sure that their coach will be there all 4 years?

Archie is going to get offers. No doubt about it. We will see if he wants to remain with Dayton, or wants to head out. If he takes off many of our players do too, and our program will be in shambles again.

ortez52 · #12 03-30-2014, 06:39 PM

Think it was on Tim Brandos OR COLLEGE SPORTS INSIDER ON sirus channel 91

steve · #13 03-30-2014, 06:42 PM

Originally Posted by uddave

This is correct. College basketball coaches generally have at least a 4 year contract. Could you imagine trying to recruit players when they aren't even sure that their coach will be there all 4 years?

Archie is going to get offers. No doubt about it. We will see if he wants to remain with Dayton, or wants to head out. If he takes off many of our players do too, and our program will be in shambles again.

Yes but I was strictly talking $$$$. I had heard his new deal was for 700k a year but not exactly sure what that covers. Teams could easily come at him for twice that plus more.

FlyingArrow · #14 03-30-2014, 07:36 PM

Originally Posted by uddave

Archie is going to get offers. No doubt about it. We will see if he wants to remain with Dayton, or wants to head out. If he takes off many of our players do too, and our program will be in shambles again.

Hopefully he sees the advantage of being at a basketball school and being in a basketball town. In any case, I expect he has a dream job in mind and is willing to wait until it opens up.

If he leaves and one of the assistants steps up, we may not be in shambles at all. That's the Xavier model and it has worked for them.

longtimefan · #15 03-30-2014, 07:46 PM

I don't see Archie leaving immediately for a "mid-level" BCS program. I would think he will follow what Sean did, and get UD to the point where he will get top offers.

Viperstick · #16 03-30-2014, 07:51 PM

...and so it begins.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebask...h-new-contract

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcspor...archie-miller/

Wake Forest & Marquette. That's like the two heifers sitting at the end of the bar at 1:49AM. Archie's already with a hottie.

EDIT: Mike Montgomery maybe retiring from Cal? That's like the thinner, bespectacled, socially awkward friend of the other two.

AC91 · #17 03-30-2014, 08:01 PM

Originally Posted by Viperstick

...and so it begins.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebask...h-new-contract

Wake Forest & Marquette. That's like the two heifers sitting at the end of the bar at 1:49AM.

Ifg Archie can negotiate more money from UD by talking to these 2 schools then good for him. But I will say it again, if he left for either one of these two I would be disappointed in him. I understand the perceived stature, but no way IMHO those are any better opportunities than UD is right now for him. he is still in the middle of building things up at UD the way he wants, why would he want to start over?

Lifelong Flyer Fan · #18 03-30-2014, 08:29 PM

When Archie spoke at the arena today, he sounded like he is, or is becoming, a "UD guy". I can't quite put my finger on it, but I have a gut feeling he is not looking to leave anytime soon and is starting to smell the roses in Dayton. His comments made it clear that he feels appreciated personally and likes the way the team is embraced by the fans and community. Said it's better than any place else he has been.

FlyerinChicago · #19 03-30-2014, 08:30 PM

Archie has emphatically stated he isn't going anywhere. He wants to build the program to the likes of a Butler or Marquette or Georgetown. Will he leave in 3-5 years if he attains that goal? Possibly, but keep in mind, the money will be there from Dayton if that's the situation.

Also, I have a strong feeling the UD is about to land a windfall of money from alumni across the country. Those who don't usually contribute, will be sending donations with their "new-found pride" in their university. I myself have stated I won't donate until I see on court success. Time to belly up to the bar.

ruechalgrin · #20 03-30-2014, 08:43 PM

Archie's compensation in his recently signed contract will be renegotiated. Dayton wants to treat him fairly. If it was at $700k a year, he probably just doubled it to $1.5M a year. We should match any offer even if we have to pay $2-2.5M a year. I don't see him gong to Marquette, Cal, or Wake Forest like Purnell and Gregory. He wants for a top 10 job (Marquette is best job and probably top 20/30 job). His mentors are Sean who waited for Arizona and Thad who waited for Ohio State.

And I hope I am right :-)
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UD62 · #21 03-30-2014, 08:51 PM

Originally Posted by FlyerinChicago

Archie has emphatically stated he isn't going anywhere. He wants to build the program to the likes of a Butler or Marquette or Georgetown. Will he leave in 3-5 years if he attains that goal? Possibly, but keep in mind, the money will be there from Dayton if that's the situation.

Also, I have a strong feeling the UD is about to land a windfall of money from alumni across the country. Those who don't usually contribute, will be sending donations with their "new-found pride" in their university. I myself have stated I won't donate until I see on court success. Time to belly up to the bar.

And the alumni are the key. Here in Florida, USF is looking for a coach, and having trouble finding one. They are waving 1.2m at prospective coaches. This from a team and program that can't do squat. Believe we will have to go higher than 700k. And believe we should. If we want to play with the big boys we are going to have to pay at least close to what the big boys pay. We are at a crossroads program wise. TW was wise extending AM's contract while almost everyone on the boards were looking for a lynch rope. Trust TW will do the right thing. This could be more important than the way UD mishandled the transition to conference play over 25 years ago(mistakes we are still trying to recover from). Going to be an interesting off season.

ud2 · #22 03-30-2014, 09:11 PM

Originally Posted by ruechalgrin

Archie's compensation in his recently signed contract will be renegotiated. Dayton wants to treat him fairly. If it was at $700k a year, he probably just doubled it to $1.5M a year. We should match any offer even if we have to pay $2-2.5M a year. I don't see him gong to Marquette, Cal, or Wake Forest like Purnell and Gregory. He wants for a top 10 job (Marquette is best job and probably top 20/30 job). His mentors are Sean who waited for Arizona and Thad who waited for Ohio State.

And I hope I am right :-)
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Thad didn't really wait long, he was at X for 3 years, and he was at Butler for 1 year.

And Sean was only at X for 5 years.

A coach doesn't stay hot/desirable for forever, it seems like the wolf/the axe is always at the door/you are always only 2 or 3 bad seasons away from maybe getting fired. Offers can start to dry up after 1 or 2 bad years.

Sean had 3 good years at X after the first 2 were a little rocky, X won 4 games in 4 days in the A10 tourney at the end of year 2.

shapanud · #23 03-30-2014, 09:24 PM

If Archie were offered a Ohio State/Arizona level job and took it, I would have no problem with that. Those are both Top 15 level jobs in the country and UD just can't match the money or prestige of a Top 15 job. If he took a Marquette/BC/Wake Forest level job, I would be surprised and disappointed.

I think he will follow in the Matta/Sean line and be a "one move" coach. UD won't be his last job, but he will only leave UD for a job he thinks he can consistently compete for a national title at.

Avid Flyer · #24 03-30-2014, 09:33 PM

Originally Posted by jack72

Very interesting that Wabler was renegotiating Archie's contract when a bunch of us were trashing both of them. Proves one thing, they get paid the big bucks and we say whatever we can think of on the spot. How smart do both of them look now?

Incredibly smart move to instill confidence in Archie and the staff during a tumultuous period. I would have to think that someone talked with the players, staff etc to get a perspective on what was going on inside. since they keep everything close to the vest we (I) were expecting the worse; a repeat of BG's last year, when in fact the team was tight as in togetherness.

ruechalgrin · #25 03-30-2014, 10:12 PM

Originally Posted by ud2

Thad didn't really wait long, he was at X for 3 years, and he was at Butler for 1 year.

And Sean was only at X for 5 years.

A coach doesn't stay hot/desirable for forever, it seems like the wolf/the axe is always at the door/you are always only 2 or 3 bad seasons away from maybe getting fired. Offers can start to dry up after 1 or 2 bad years.

Sean had 3 good years at X after the first 2 were a little rocky, X won 4 games in 4 days in the A10 tourney at the end of year 2.

Good points. I just don't see Wake or BC anywhere near top 15 jobs, much less top 30. Probably top 50 just because ACC.

Cal could be attractive to Archie because PAC 12 with his brother and I being biased, living in the Bay Area is pretty nice (but expensive). Again, I just don't see him jumping for a 30-50 job which is CAL.

On the other hand, Marquette is borderline. They have men's basketball expenses in the top 10 of all teams (yes you read that right) and were paying Buzz $2.5M a year + every perk imaginable including private plane at his disposal for recruiting, etc. This is not a top 15 job, but a 15-30 job so this is the only one that worries me.

Again hope I am right on this one :-)

ruechalgrin · #26 03-30-2014, 10:14 PM

Originally Posted by Avid Flyer

Incredibly smart move to instill confidence in Archie and the staff during a tumultuous period. I would have to think that someone talked with the players, staff etc to get a perspective on what was going on inside. since they keep everything close to the vest we (I) were expecting the worse; a repeat of BG's last year, when in fact the team was tight as in togetherness.

I have questioned whether TW and the administration had a plan to take UD to the next level and I have much more confidence now. Excellent decision in December and January -- it also demonstrated to Archie his boss' commitment to him which is huge.

Now we just need to show Archie and his assistants the money ...

ud2 · #27 03-30-2014, 11:06 PM

Originally Posted by ruechalgrin

Good points. I just don't see Wake or BC anywhere near top 15 jobs, much less top 30. Probably top 50 just because ACC.

Cal could be attractive to Archie because PAC 12 with his brother and I being biased, living in the Bay Area is pretty nice (but expensive). Again, I just don't see him jumping for a 30-50 job which is CAL.

On the other hand, Marquette is borderline. They have men's basketball expenses in the top 10 of all teams (yes you read that right) and were paying Buzz $2.5M a year + every perk imaginable including private plane at his disposal for recruiting, etc. This is not a top 15 job, but a 15-30 job so this is the only one that worries me.

Again hope I am right on this one :-)

I agree about Marquette.

Where do you rank the UD job nationally?

Wake could be an attractive job IMO. The ACC is a brutal league though.

THirt · #28 03-30-2014, 11:26 PM

Originally Posted by ud2

Do you remember what show this was? Do you have a link? This is a VERY big deal IMO.

Pretty sure this is the interview in question. Hope this link works: http://m.soundcloud.com/siriusxmsports/dayton-ad-tim-wabler-talks

I don't think money is an issue at all for UD and Miller. Facilities are top notch, crowds are quite literally the best in college basketball, and we are coming off a great run. No offense to these fine schools, but UD isn't Florida Gulf Coast or Bradley, making a sweet 16 run but not having all the other good stuff that UD has. I'm under no illusion that we are a top 20 job, but I could argue top 35 easily. There's not much reason to leave unless some other better job opens up. As another thought, it would be pretty awful if Archie left before Sibert's senior year here.
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frisco flyer · #29 03-30-2014, 11:36 PM

Not many in the top20 would extend your contract in the middle of a 1-5 run to start conference play. There's something to be said for that when AM weighs his options.

Tony T 71 · #30 03-30-2014, 11:54 PM

Where did the $700,000 number come from? I don't recall the details of the contract being given.

I would bet that with incentives his contract is $1.2-1.5 million. IMHO

ud2 · #31 03-31-2014, 12:13 AM

Originally Posted by Viperstick

...and so it begins.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebask...h-new-contract

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcspor...archie-miller/

Wake Forest & Marquette. That's like the two heifers sitting at the end of the bar at 1:49AM. Archie's already with a hottie.

EDIT: Mike Montgomery maybe retiring from Cal? That's like the thinner, bespectacled, socially awkward friend of the other two.

Crap, I didn't realize that these schools had officially expressed interest in AM, I thought all this talk on this thread was just speculation.

Now I AM nervous.

ud2 · #32 03-31-2014, 12:31 AM

Originally Posted by FlyerinChicago

Archie has emphatically stated he isn't going anywhere. He wants to build the program to the likes of a Butler or Marquette or Georgetown. Will he leave in 3-5 years if he attains that goal? Possibly, but keep in mind, the money will be there from Dayton if that's the situation.

I wouldn't put too much value into coaches saying that they are staying put, I've seen this movie before. Matta said he wasn't interested in the OSU job, and then he accepted the job a short time later, and Sean initially turned down Arizona, only to take the job a day or 2 later.

I wish I hadn't read Viperstick's post now.

Tony T 71 · #33 03-31-2014, 12:33 AM

No way he is leaving.

FlyingArrow · #34 03-31-2014, 12:35 AM

Originally Posted by ud2

I wouldn't put too much value into coaches saying that they are staying put, I've seen this movie before. Matta said he wasn't interested in the OSU job, and then he accepted the job a short time later, and Sean initially turned down Arizona, only to take the job a day or 2 later.

I wish I hadn't read Viperstick's post now.

Thankfully, Wake Forest and Marquette are not OSU and Arizona. So it really comes down to how much Archie likes it in Dayton and how many dollar signs each school can throw around.

Viperstick · #35 03-31-2014, 12:44 AM

If Wabs only upped Archie to $700K, we're well behind not only the NCAA writ large arms race, but the A-10 arms race as well.

Tommy P is pulling down 700Gs at lowly Fordham...

http://nypost.com/2010/03/24/hofstra...ketball-coach/

ud2 · #36 03-31-2014, 12:52 AM

Skip Prosser left X to take the Wake job, I definitely consider Wake a threat to take AM.

Darn it, I really don't want AM to leave already.

DARN IT! I hope these schools hire somebody else, and I hope they quit contacting AM and keep their hands off our coach!

ud2 · #37 03-31-2014, 08:55 AM

Originally Posted by Viperstick

...and so it begins.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebask...h-new-contract

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcspor...archie-miller/

Wake Forest & Marquette. That's like the two heifers sitting at the end of the bar at 1:49AM. Archie's already with a hottie.

EDIT: Mike Montgomery maybe retiring from Cal? That's like the thinner, bespectacled, socially awkward friend of the other two.

Hopefully Marquette ends up hiring Tennessee coach Martin or ex-UCLA coach Howland.

anthonycharles · #38 03-31-2014, 09:57 PM

Originally Posted by ud2

Skip Prosser left X to take the Wake job, I definitely consider Wake a threat to take AM.

Darn it, I really don't want AM to leave already.

DARN IT! I hope these schools hire somebody else, and I hope they quit contacting AM and keep their hands off our coach!

That was off the Tim Duncan years, when Wake had a name to it. They don't anymore. Jeff Bzdelik was a good coach, did well at Air Force, which is very very hard to do and started the turnaround at Colorado, which is now a good program. That is very hard to do as well, considering the toxic relationship these days between the academics and athletics in Boulder. Bzdelik could coach. He failed miserably at Wake. I would stay far away from that job, especially now with Syracuse & Pitt in the fold and Louisville joining.