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Old 02-16-2019, 08:17 PM
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Crutcher’s modus operandi

First off, don’t get me wrong. I think Jalen Crutcher is an excellent point guard. We’d be lost without him, and the fact he played through those second-half cramps speaks to his heart and his desire.

That said, he seems to play with no urgency ... well, until things get urgent. His first half-play tonight was lackadaisical to say the least. I realize VCU worked hard to keep the ball out of his hands, but I’m not so sure Jalen worked just as hard to get open. As a result, Obi (or Mikesell) must have brought the ball upcourt a half-dozen times. It delayed us getting into our half-court sets. Worse, it forced Obi into too many dribbling excursions and subsequent turnovers.

This wasn’t the first time Jalen flipped the switch late in a game. My question is, why wait? He’s often caught dribbling us into late shot clock desperation heaves, and he seems too reluctant to take what the defense gives him — meaning dribble-drive opportunities. He’s capable of creating his own shot, though I know he doesn’t finish well with contact (too slight of build, perhaps).

Anyway, his second-half heroics notwithstanding, this is one area where Grant has little recourse. You can try to light Crutcher’s a$$ on fire, but if it doesn’t work, there’s no answer. AG will have the option of bringing in Chatman next year, but for now we’re stuck with Jalen’s Jeckyll-Hyde performance. But when he’s meek rather than beast, this team suffers.

Just my way of saying, “Come on Jalen, we need that sense of urgency from the get-go.”
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:10 PM
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I noticed in the 2nd half that UD had Jordan Davis bring the ball up. The guy covering Jalen was all over him when he did.
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows View Post
I noticed in the 2nd half that UD had Jordan Davis bring the ball up. The guy covering Jalen was all over him when he did.
I noticed this as well. I think this may have been by design or conceded by UD, at least until the under 4 minute mark. Jalen was working so hard to get the ball up the court against the pressure, that I think they maybe did this and/or accepted this in an effort to keep his legs as fresh as possible during that stretch.
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:24 PM
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We aren’t stuck with anything when it comes to Jalen. He’s a great point guard and his calm demeanor despite the circumstances in the game, the refs etc he doesn’t get rattled. That’s an asset.

The team in general plays differently in the first half than the second out of necessity. I’m sure we’ll see a different Jalen and team pace next year.
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:26 PM
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100 % right. Didnt see star sheet but jaken prob woulda played 36 or 37 minutes without injury.

Without looking I'll guess he played 33 to 35 minutes tonight
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Flyer 86 View Post
100 % right. Didnt see star sheet but jaken prob woulda played 36 or 37 minutes without injury.

Without looking I'll guess he played 33 to 35 minutes tonight
Crutcher played 38 minutes. The only time he left the floor was when he cramped up.
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:37 PM
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Just wow!
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:40 PM
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Great great game by Ryan. And the blocks. Just stellar.

Great second halves by Jalen and Obi. But their rebounding just goes to show you how much Landers was missed!

We continue to need more from JD AND JOSH. Therefore likely why we are in the NIT and not the big tourney.
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:59 PM
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Missed most of the game but one thing I realize a few times each game is he holds the offense up with all the dribbling. One possession in particular he never passed it and ended up forcing a shot towards end of shot clock. Need him to facilitate and good ball movement
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:59 PM
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I can't believe it.
All the "up town coaches" can come on here and criticize any
Flyer they want.......sickening.....those kids played there a*s off
today against one of the best defenses in the country and all the
glass half full Flyer Faithful ? fans can do is criticize.

Thanks to each and every young man who walked on the floor today for
a great effort.
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Old 02-16-2019, 10:21 PM
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Originally Posted by The Fly View Post
First off, don’t get me wrong. I think Jalen Crutcher is an excellent point guard. We’d be lost without him, and the fact he played through those second-half cramps speaks to his heart and his desire.

That said, he seems to play with no urgency ... well, until things get urgent. His first half-play tonight was lackadaisical to say the least. I realize VCU worked hard to keep the ball out of his hands, but I’m not so sure Jalen worked just as hard to get open. As a result, Obi (or Mikesell) must have brought the ball upcourt a half-dozen times. It delayed us getting into our half-court sets. Worse, it forced Obi into too many dribbling excursions and subsequent turnovers.

This wasn’t the first time Jalen flipped the switch late in a game. My question is, why wait? He’s often caught dribbling us into late shot clock desperation heaves, and he seems too reluctant to take what the defense gives him — meaning dribble-drive opportunities. He’s capable of creating his own shot, though I know he doesn’t finish well with contact (too slight of build, perhaps).

Anyway, his second-half heroics notwithstanding, this is one area where Grant has little recourse. You can try to light Crutcher’s a$$ on fire, but if it doesn’t work, there’s no answer. AG will have the option of bringing in Chatman next year, but for now we’re stuck with Jalen’s Jeckyll-Hyde performance. But when he’s meek rather than beast, this team suffers.

Just my way of saying, “Come on Jalen, we need that sense of urgency from the get-go.”
he will be a 2 guard next year. where he belongs
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Old 02-16-2019, 10:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Piqua Flyer '66 View Post
I can't believe it.
All the "up town coaches" can come on here and criticize any
Flyer they want.......sickening.....those kids played there a*s off
today against one of the best defenses in the country and all the
glass half full Flyer Faithful ? fans can do is criticize.

Thanks to each and every young man who walked on the floor today for
a great effort.
Agree, save the criticism for the paid pros. This team is very short handed. Yes the “amazing 7” a few years ago achieved an almost unbelievable result but that was the exception not the norm. I can see the progress of this program and it headed in the right direction.
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Old 02-16-2019, 10:48 PM
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I think other coaches have been pressuring Crutcher all the way down the court all game long because he is so instrumental to our offense, and they want to force him to pace himself.

It's the Brian Roberts treatment.

Our whole team had to pace themselves with our injury situation today, but opposing coaches have focused on Crutcher all year long, IMO.

VCU is very good team, and our two biggest weaknesses were displayed today. Our lack of depth as a team and our marginal physical presence were both costly for us. I think we had to play and stick with that bad zone due to our depth issues. We are much better in man-to-man, IMO.

Next year, we should have the horses at all positions to change the landscape of a game like this.
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Old 02-16-2019, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Donniex3Era View Post
he will be a 2 guard next year. where he belongs
Doubt it
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Old 02-16-2019, 11:17 PM
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Hats off to Ryan without his play we would of tanked big time.

To much dribbling not enough passing. Davis needs to understand that if you drive at a big, with a big wingspan it is not going to end well.

No passing back to shooters.

Grant needed to call a time out before Obi took that last and one free throw. Obi was also cramping up.

We should have won!
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Old 02-17-2019, 10:11 AM
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Agreed on Mikesell. Probably one of his best efforts as a Flyer - very determinedbut under control.

Not sure we had any timeouts left at that point? Burnt two early in half when down.
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Old 02-17-2019, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Piqua Flyer '66 View Post
I can't believe it.
All the "up town coaches" can come on here and criticize any
Flyer they want.......sickening.....those kids played there a*s off
today against one of the best defenses in the country and all the
glass half full Flyer Faithful ? fans can do is criticize.

Thanks to each and every young man who walked on the floor today for
a great effort.
Thanks Chris for giving me the opportunity to criticize kids getting a fre educations and stipend.
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Old 02-17-2019, 12:49 PM
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I wonder how much of the aggressiveness is by design from AG. The 2nd half it seemed like the offense picked up the pace and the team had to be aggressive to get back in the game.

As far as standing around on offense I think some of that is a result of what's going on around him. If Obi/Josh/the post option is taken away, I don't think the other guys out there aren't great in the half court offense. I think he could be waiting for something to open up in the post. Mikesell seems like he's better off kick outs or a couple passes versus tossing the ball to him and waiting for him to make a play

Also, I wonder if people were maybe less aggressive on screens than maybe they normally would be knowing they can't foul out. I saw a couple where it seemed like guys were shying away from contacting
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Old 02-17-2019, 04:06 PM
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TX Flyer......criticize all you want. Does not make you correct. The Flyers are who they are. I can't imagine where we'd be without Crutcher. How about John Crosby out there getting his lunch eaten.

GO FLYERS!
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Old 02-17-2019, 04:12 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
I wonder how much of the aggressiveness is by design from AG. The 2nd half it seemed like the offense picked up the pace and the team had to be aggressive to get back in the game.

As far as standing around on offense I think some of that is a result of what's going on around him. If Obi/Josh/the post option is taken away, I don't think the other guys out there aren't great in the half court offense. I think he could be waiting for something to open up in the post. Mikesell seems like he's better off kick outs or a couple passes versus tossing the ball to him and waiting for him to make a play

Also, I wonder if people were maybe less aggressive on screens than maybe they normally would be knowing they can't foul out. I saw a couple where it seemed like guys were shying away from contacting
There’s absolutely no doubt about it. They have to play less aggressively due to only having 6 players available. Can you imagine if Obi and Josh both got in foul trouble in the first half? You will see a completely different look next season when we are 10-11 deep.
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Old 02-17-2019, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
Doubt it
why doubt it with who we have coming in next year? Or, at a minimum, he'll get plenty of rotation and rest in and out at PG
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Old 02-17-2019, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Donniex3Era View Post
why doubt it with who we have coming in next year? Or, at a minimum, he'll get plenty of rotation and rest in and out at PG
It's just my opinion but I think AG really likes Crutcher at point and I don't see him moving off the point much. I see Chatman playing more 2 or 3 than Crutcher.
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Old 02-17-2019, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
It's just my opinion but I think AG really likes Crutcher at point and I don't see him moving off the point much. I see Chatman playing more 2 or 3 than Crutcher.
Look at Crutcher's Asst/TO ratio. He is a premier pg. Can't hurt having 2 great pg's, but he is playing his natural position now.
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Old 02-17-2019, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
Look at Crutcher's Asst/TO ratio. He is a premier pg. Can't hurt having 2 great pg's, but he is playing his natural position now.
Agreed!
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Old 02-17-2019, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by TX Flyer View Post
Thanks Chris for giving me the opportunity to criticize kids getting a fre educations and stipend.
Well I’m sure the would give it all back for a cut of the gate! Don’t try to justify your posts because they get a education.
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Old 02-17-2019, 07:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Flyer2 View Post
Well I’m sure the would give it all back for a cut of the gate! Don’t try to justify your posts because they get a education.
I’d take a cut and stop posting. I’d also have taken a free ride and nba like equipment/facilities to play basketball.

But honestly, I don’t need to justify anything. I stated a fact whether anyone likes it or not. They also don’t have to play at UD, or any college, if they don’t agree with the free education.
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Old 02-17-2019, 11:58 PM
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I believe AG likes Crutcher and has a lot of confidence in him when the ball is in his hands.

During a timeout during lates stages of the VCU game after Crutcher’s three and the place going crazy, AG stood next to Crutcher the entire time in the huddle with his huge right hand on the back of his neck in a calming fatherly figure way. Looked like a definite connection.
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Old 02-18-2019, 08:07 AM
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I agree with original idea, something is not right with urgency, energy, rhythm. But I think the idea is misplaced when directed at Jalen. Actually, I think it is more the other starters. Obviously Coach Grant wanted Jalen to bring the ball up in a controlled manner, to limit turnovers. Grant chose to not attack the pressure. That decision certainly hand ties Jalen. And it sents the wrong energy level with THIS team. But it is a fundamental basketball approach and decision.

Who forced offense against VCU? To start the game, Mikesell is the only answer. Obi later. Jalen could setup up offense all day long, but who is going to capitalize?

Just feels like we spend too much time managing the game. Staying out of foul trouble and keeping it close until late. Minimizes the risk, but also takes away any chance to build momentum and confidence. The sum is not greater than the parts...
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Old 02-18-2019, 08:12 AM
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I've been hard on crutcher in the GDTs but sometimes I need to realize he's basically playing the entire game. He just can't go 100% on defense and sometimes needs to catch his breath on offense.
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Old 02-18-2019, 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
Look at Crutcher's Asst/TO ratio. He is a premier pg. Can't hurt having 2 great pg's, but he is playing his natural position now.
Premier? Exactly how many big game wins has he orchestrated in almost two years?
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Old 02-18-2019, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by maddog07 View Post
Premier? Exactly how many big game wins has he orchestrated in almost two years?
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C'mon Fudd, you've got to think before you use such subjective adjectives. Otherwise, it's like a cattle call for the trolls and nay-sayers out here.
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Old 02-18-2019, 10:21 AM
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Crutcher is half way through his soph year and playing at a high level. Besides Grant loves the kid and our vote is worthless. Grant is a smart guy. He will play whatever performs next year. If that is is Crutcher and someone else as interchangeable drill bits at point and shooting guard, he will do it. None of us have watched these transfers play and practice, yet we are experts on their skills and playing time.
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Old 02-18-2019, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
Look at Crutcher's Asst/TO ratio. He is a premier pg. Can't hurt having 2 great pg's, but he is playing his natural position now.
Like Crutcher a ton but he is not a premier PG...yet, and maybe he never gets there. There's far more than the assist to TO ratio......The kid is tough as hell and is very good but to be premier there's alot of things he needs to do and/or do better. I'll not say our HC offensive woes we see every game are totally his fault but he's got alot to do with it..Standing around dribbling with the shot clock dwindling is part the offensive sets and part him....I'm sure some of his deficiencies are because he has to play 38-40 mpg which is almost impossible..

Crutcher is not a very quick PG nor a great handler of the ball and many of the angles he takes coming off high ball screens are not crisp and precise at all. He gets bumped off his spot quite a bit as he's not physically where he needs to be just yet. While he's got a nice floater when he does decide to take the ball inside the paint I'd like to see him split the double teams better, get into the paint and shoot the jumper....Maybe that will come..

I'd like to see him get minutes at the 2 next year, as well......We should be okay with giving him a blow there with both Cohill a year more developed and Chatman..
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Old 02-18-2019, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows View Post
I noticed in the 2nd half that UD had Jordan Davis bring the ball up. The guy covering Jalen was all over him when he did.

Do we ever say "they're all over Cunningham, let's post up Jordan Davis instead." It's your job as a PG. Go get the ball, at least once it crosses half court. I can't believe more teams don't go all-out on pressure to wear out Crutcher, and dare anyone else to dribble the ball up. It's generally a fiasco.


Now, it's true that Crutcher needs a break sometimes so it's easier to just let Davis bring it up once in a while. We're kind of stuck there. But Crutcher does this sometimes when it's not necessary, like out of a timeout when he should be fresh.



Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
I wonder how much of the aggressiveness is by design from AG. The 2nd half it seemed like the offense picked up the pace and the team had to be aggressive to get back in the game.
We were down 12 at the half. The lead reached 20 within 90 seconds. Then the lead waffled around 18-22 points until the 13:00 mark. I don't think they came out of the locker room with a new plan to pick up the pace.



And I don't think AG was in the huddle at the 13:00 mark saying "OK guys, we got 'em right where we want 'em, great job following the game plan, now let's start playing hard." I think they just played badly.
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Old 02-18-2019, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
Do we ever say "they're all over Cunningham, let's post up Jordan Davis instead." It's your job as a PG. Go get the ball, at least once it crosses half court. I can't believe more teams don't go all-out on pressure to wear out Crutcher, and dare anyone else to dribble the ball up. It's generally a fiasco.


Now, it's true that Crutcher needs a break sometimes so it's easier to just let Davis bring it up once in a while. We're kind of stuck there. But Crutcher does this sometimes when it's not necessary, like out of a timeout when he should be fresh.




We were down 12 at the half. The lead reached 20 within 90 seconds. Then the lead waffled around 18-22 points until the 13:00 mark. I don't think they came out of the locker room with a new plan to pick up the pace.



And I don't think AG was in the huddle at the 13:00 mark saying "OK guys, we got 'em right where we want 'em, great job following the game plan, now let's start playing hard." I think they just played badly.
Legit question by OSU. In fact, how do you think UD got back into the game? CAG turned up full court pressure and they got some TO's that led to easy buckets. A 22 point lead is only 5-6 positions from getting pretty hairy for the team leading .... Obviously, UD was playing much harder by design, seeing actual results in cutting down the lead from 18 to 9 in just 3 minutes which amped up the crowd again....That gave them the fuel they needed to make this a game but it didn't just happen because they realized they were playing bad...
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Old 02-18-2019, 02:04 PM
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I think several things are true.

1). Jalen Crutcher is a very good point guard and I for one am very glad he is a Flyer.

2). Jalen Crutcher is a 19-20 year old kid who makes mistakes, dribbling the shot clock down to 5 seconds and launching a three is one of the mistakes he makes 3 or 4 possessions per game (or at least it seems that way).

3). People criticize players, coaches, AD's, etc... on message boards. I would guess criticism is at least 50% of the content on any given board. However, criticism doesn't equal hatred or regret that a guy is on the team. In other words you can criticize someone without being in favor of their benching, firing, imprisonment, whatever.

4). This is high level D-I basketball, not rec league. It is OK for fans to expect great play and effort and to point it out when it doesn't appear to be there. As someone else said, posting it doesn't make it true (or false); and

5). Jalen Crutcher, Anthony Grant and the other players and coaches literally could not care less about what is written on this board (at least they shouldn't care).
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  #37  
Old 02-18-2019, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by steve View Post
but it didn't just happen because they realized they were playing bad...
I agree, I also don't think they just had a lightbulb come on where someone said "oh, wait, guys, I've got it! We're playing bad!" And then the game turned around. Realizing you're playing bad doesn't mean you start playing well.

I'm saying if AG or anyone else had a game plan to conserve energy and then flip the switch late in the game for a heroic comback, I would offer that the 18:30 mark of the second half when we got down 20 would have been the time to go for it. It seems unlikely that the explanation is that they were simply conserving their energy another 5 minutes and then telling the guys to start playing hard. More likely, we were playing like crap.

There's a reason 20+ point deficits are rarely overcome. VCU scored 3 points in 10 minutes. We're not 3-points-in-10-minutes better than VCU. If VCU hits a couple bad shots we never get it within 10 and everyone just remembers the game as a laugher.
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Old 02-18-2019, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
Do we ever say "they're all over Cunningham, let's post up Jordan Davis instead." It's your job as a PG. Go get the ball, at least once it crosses half court. I can't believe more teams don't go all-out on pressure to wear out Crutcher, and dare anyone else to dribble the ball up. It's generally a fiasco.


Now, it's true that Crutcher needs a break sometimes so it's easier to just let Davis bring it up once in a while. We're kind of stuck there. But Crutcher does this sometimes when it's not necessary, like out of a timeout when he should be fresh.




We were down 12 at the half. The lead reached 20 within 90 seconds. Then the lead waffled around 18-22 points until the 13:00 mark. I don't think they came out of the locker room with a new plan to pick up the pace.



And I don't think AG was in the huddle at the 13:00 mark saying "OK guys, we got 'em right where we want 'em, great job following the game plan, now let's start playing hard." I think they just played badly.
I don't think it was not playing hard versus more picking up the pace of the offense. It seemed like the tempo was higher to me in the 2nd half in than the first
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Old 02-18-2019, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
I agree, I also don't think they just had a lightbulb come on where someone said "oh, wait, guys, I've got it! We're playing bad!" And then the game turned around. Realizing you're playing bad doesn't mean you start playing well.

I'm saying if AG or anyone else had a game plan to conserve energy and then flip the switch late in the game for a heroic comback, I would offer that the 18:30 mark of the second half when we got down 20 would have been the time to go for it. It seems unlikely that the explanation is that they were simply conserving their energy another 5 minutes and then telling the guys to start playing hard. More likely, we were playing like crap.

There's a reason 20+ point deficits are rarely overcome. VCU scored 3 points in 10 minutes. We're not 3-points-in-10-minutes better than VCU. If VCU hits a couple bad shots we never get it within 10 and everyone just remembers the game as a laugher.
I don't think it's about conserving energy but based on Tempo stats from Kenpom and watching the games, AG likes to play a slower, deliberate offense. Right now Dayton is 323 out of 353. Going back to Alabama his teams were slow too

The 2nd half with that kind of deficit I think he knew that they had to push the pace to have any chance of coming back. It's like running the 2 minute drill in football
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Old 02-18-2019, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
I don't think it was not playing hard versus more picking up the pace of the offense. It seemed like the tempo was higher to me in the 2nd half in than the first

We took 6 more shots in the 2nd half than the first. We had 8 fewer TOs in the second half. We had 6 more FT's in the 2nd half, but we had 7 more offensive rebounds. VCU had only 4 more TO's in the second half. The pace was about about the same I think.


I think we might have moved the ball better and what looked like playing with more tempo was just moving the ball on offense better. You know, playing better.
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Old 02-18-2019, 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
We took 6 more shots in the 2nd half than the first. We had 8 fewer TOs in the second half. We had 6 more FT's in the 2nd half, but we had 7 more offensive rebounds. VCU had only 4 more TO's in the second half. The pace was about about the same I think.


I think we might have moved the ball better and what looked like playing with more tempo was just moving the ball on offense better. You know, playing better.
I don't think there's any question tempo debate aside we played better in the 2nd half. Execution in all phases of the game was better in the 2nd but it looked like to me that were playing faster especially until the last couple minutes of the game

I can't find the break down on fast break points by half but my recollection is that we got most of those 17 points in the 2nd half. I don't think they were working as deeply into the shot clock the second half as the first
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Old 02-18-2019, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Flyers98 View Post

2). Jalen Crutcher is a 19-20 year old kid who makes mistakes, dribbling the shot clock down to 5 seconds and launching a three is one of the mistakes he makes 3 or 4 possessions per game (or at least it seems that way).
I don't really hold that against Crutcher most of the time. If Obi/Josh are taken away down low by the defense, he's the only perimeter guy who can make any kind of play attacking the basket and he's the best shooter right now

I like Trey, Ryan and Davis but I don't think they're doing him any favors most of the time
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Old 02-18-2019, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Flyers98 View Post
I think several things are true.

1). Jalen Crutcher is a very good point guard and I for one am very glad he is a Flyer.

2). Jalen Crutcher is a 19-20 year old kid who makes mistakes, dribbling the shot clock down to 5 seconds and launching a three is one of the mistakes he makes 3 or 4 possessions per game (or at least it seems that way).

3). People criticize players, coaches, AD's, etc... on message boards. I would guess criticism is at least 50% of the content on any given board. However, criticism doesn't equal hatred or regret that a guy is on the team. In other words you can criticize someone without being in favor of their benching, firing, imprisonment, whatever.

4). This is high level D-I basketball, not rec league. It is OK for fans to expect great play and effort and to point it out when it doesn't appear to be there. As someone else said, posting it doesn't make it true (or false); and

5). Jalen Crutcher, Anthony Grant and the other players and coaches literally could not care less about what is written on this board (at least they shouldn't care).
Wow, someone in this thread using common sense and applying it to a lot of our opinions. Imagine if half the board would take off their ud glasses and see what this team really is.
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Old 02-18-2019, 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted by TX Flyer View Post
Wow, someone in this thread using common sense and applying it to a lot of our opinions. Imagine if half the board would take off their ud glasses and see what this team really is.
I think they came up with a name for that, it is non-UD fans, and I think it is closer to 95% than 50%.
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Old 02-18-2019, 04:36 PM
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From the 18:04 mark of the second until the 4:50 mark when an Obi dunk took the lead for the Flyers, UD outscored the Rams 31-8

http://www.blackburnreview.com/2019/...n-from-behind/

That validates the idea UD was playing at a faster pace in the 2nd half
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Old 02-18-2019, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
From the 18:04 mark of the second until the 4:50 mark when an Obi dunk took the lead for the Flyers, UD outscored the Rams 31-8

http://www.blackburnreview.com/2019/...n-from-behind/

That validates the idea UD was playing at a faster pace in the 2nd half
Define "faster".

I believe what you're actually describing is "more efficient". If you take 29 seconds to score on every possession but never miss a shot, you could score a lot of points. If you shoot every 5 seconds but miss 90% of your shots you can be fast, but not score much.

So if we scored 31 points, it implies we scored 31 points, nothing more. Maybe we played faster, but I think we had about the same number of possessions in both halves, we just wasted less of them on TO's and made some 3's in the second half.

Unless proven otherwise.
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Old 02-19-2019, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
From the 18:04 mark of the second until the 4:50 mark when an Obi dunk took the lead for the Flyers, UD outscored the Rams 31-8

http://www.blackburnreview.com/2019/...n-from-behind/

That validates the idea UD was playing at a faster pace in the 2nd half
Yes, during that time frame, UD outscored VCU 31-8. In that same time frame in the first half, VCU outscored UD 31-18. So, where's the difference?

In the first half, UD was 8-13 from 2 pt range, 0-4 from 3pt range, and 2-4 from the charity stripe, for 18 points. They also had 6 turnovers.

In the second half, UD was 7-12 from 2pt range, 4-7 from 3pt range, and 5-7 from the FT line. They only had 1 turnover though.

NCAA's efficiency line states field goal attempts minus offensive rebounds plus turnovers plus just under half of a free throw attempt (.475) is how to calculate possessions.

So, first half, 17 shots from the floor, 2 offensive rebounds, 6 turnovers and the 4 free throw attempts turns into 22.9 possessions. In the second half, 19 shots, 2 offensive rebounds, 1 turnover and 7 free throws equates to 21.325 possessions. So, UD had less possessions in the 2nd half.

What about VCU? First half possessions = 23.95, second half possessions 18.9. Less possessions.

It looks like better shooting and less turnovers for UD, while worse shooting and more turnovers by VCU is the cause, and not a faster tempo.

Possessions from 18:03 to 4:50 in both halves
Dayton
Code:

 half_num | to_s | orebs |  2p  | 3p  | ft  | pts |  poss  
----------+------+-------+------+-----+-----+-----+--------
        1 |    6 |     2 | 8-13 | 0-4 | 2-4 |  18 |   22.9
        2 |    1 |     2 | 7-12 | 4-7 | 5-7 |  31 | 21.325
VCU
Code:

 half_num | to_s | orebs |  2p  |  3p  | ft  | pts | poss  
----------+------+-------+------+------+-----+-----+-------
        1 |    2 |     2 | 9-12 | 4-11 | 1-2 |  31 | 23.95
        2 |    8 |     4 | 2-7  | 0-6  | 4-4 |   8 |  18.9
Stats provided by Figstats.
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Old 02-19-2019, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Figgie123 View Post
Yes, during that time frame, UD outscored VCU 31-8. In that same time frame in the first half, VCU outscored UD 31-18. So, where's the difference?

In the first half, UD was 8-13 from 2 pt range, 0-4 from 3pt range, and 2-4 from the charity stripe, for 18 points. They also had 6 turnovers.

In the second half, UD was 7-12 from 2pt range, 4-7 from 3pt range, and 5-7 from the FT line. They only had 1 turnover though.

NCAA's efficiency line states field goal attempts minus offensive rebounds plus turnovers plus just under half of a free throw attempt (.475) is how to calculate possessions.

So, first half, 17 shots from the floor, 2 offensive rebounds, 6 turnovers and the 4 free throw attempts turns into 22.9 possessions. In the second half, 19 shots, 2 offensive rebounds, 1 turnover and 7 free throws equates to 21.325 possessions. So, UD had less possessions in the 2nd half.

What about VCU? First half possessions = 23.95, second half possessions 18.9. Less possessions.

It looks like better shooting and less turnovers for UD, while worse shooting and more turnovers by VCU is the cause, and not a faster tempo.

Possessions from 18:03 to 4:50 in both halves
Dayton
Code:

 half_num | to_s | orebs |  2p  | 3p  | ft  | pts |  poss  
----------+------+-------+------+-----+-----+-----+--------
        1 |    6 |     2 | 8-13 | 0-4 | 2-4 |  18 |   22.9
        2 |    1 |     2 | 7-12 | 4-7 | 5-7 |  31 | 21.325
VCU
Code:

 half_num | to_s | orebs |  2p  |  3p  | ft  | pts | poss  
----------+------+-------+------+------+-----+-----+-------
        1 |    2 |     2 | 9-12 | 4-11 | 1-2 |  31 | 23.95
        2 |    8 |     4 | 2-7  | 0-6  | 4-4 |   8 |  18.9
Stats provided by Figstats.
Love the analytics, as a math/statistics guy.

I think Gazoo hits the main point, though. It depends on one's definition of "faster", or up tempo.

You can "speed up" the game without going up tempo, depending on your definition of each.

Those suggesting that UD went up tempo or played faster might just be equating it to the fact that we applied a lot of full court pressure in the 2nd half in an effort to "speed up" the game/VCU, resulting in turnovers and some easy baskets off of the turnovers.
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Old 02-19-2019, 01:07 PM
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Figgie do you have a break down on fast break points by half?
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Old 02-19-2019, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Figgie do you have a break down on fast break points by half?
Play by play shows 6 points in the first half, 8 in the second half for UD, and 6 and 6 for VCU.
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Old 02-19-2019, 10:03 PM
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I like Crutcher’s modus operandi: drive the length of the court, sweet dish to Josh Cunningham with 3 seconds left - Josh is fouled, makes a free throw, wins the game.

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Old 02-19-2019, 10:46 PM
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Crutcher's speed and tempo was much better tonight. Our offense was great with crisp passing. Grant had a superb plan on offense and defense until our guys stopped executing on defense. And excepting Landers, who never executed anything but a bunch of moaning (getting old).
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Old 02-20-2019, 01:16 PM
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[QUOTE=Glen Clark;575754]I like Crutcher’s modus operandi: drive the length of the court, sweet dish to Josh Cunningham with 3 seconds left - Josh is fouled, makes a free throw, wins the game. [QUOTE]

I love Crutcher, but I was sooo afraid that he was going to pull up and shoot another 28 footer to try to win the game himself. The announcers were screaming to keep feeding Josh.
Hopefully we learned what penetration and dishing can do to finish off a win.
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Old 02-20-2019, 01:50 PM
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Crutcher split their double nicely with one mission and that was to get to the hoop. I feared he would flip a left-hander off the board but, again, he grew up quite a bit last night from a maturity and awareness standpoint we've really not seen.

Would have been easy to also fire up a 20 footer but he knew he was not shooting well last night and, more importantly, he knew who was shooting well..
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Old 02-20-2019, 02:05 PM
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Talking

Originally Posted by steve View Post
I feared he would flip a left-hander off the board
Won't happen. He can't finish in traffic with his left hand. If he could finish left, we would have had an "and 1" with 8:33 to go in the game, but he tried to flip it up with his right and it got blocked as he was getting fouled.
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Old 02-20-2019, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by MrFlyerFanatic View Post
Won't happen. He can't finish in traffic with his left hand. If he could finish left, we would have had an "and 1" with 8:33 to go in the game, but he tried to flip it up with his right and it got blocked as he was getting fouled.
I didn't say he could finish as in making the hoop or even having a decent look at it but the defense was forcing him that way and the body does strange things with all that pressure on him with 3-4 seconds to go...Again, the kid had a terrible offensive game but grew up big-time last night with his recognition of the hot hand on the last play of the game..
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Old 02-20-2019, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by MrFlyerFanatic View Post
Won't happen. He can't finish in traffic with his left hand. If he could finish left, we would have had an "and 1" with 8:33 to go in the game, but he tried to flip it up with his right and it got blocked as he was getting fouled.
For the record, he did have a left-handed AND 1 finish in the second half last night.
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Old 02-20-2019, 03:46 PM
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I love Jalen Crutcher. Love him.

But he was driving me batty during the VCU game by letting the defender take him out of the flow. Shake your defender and go get the bleeping basketball. Too many times he didn't even try and just pointed to another payer to pass it to.

He looked so sluggish that I wondered aloud if he had a touch of the flu. The fact that he had cramps at the end kinda lines up with that.

My guess is he was conserving energy because he knew he couldn't go at the pace he wanted for a full 40. Turns out he was right.

On one hand, I get not going full-tilt if you know you're playing 40. On the other hand, if he's going to be that passive, why not get some real rest on the bench?
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