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03-11-2017, 08:03 AM
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Davidson loss observations
Notes from Pittsburgh.
Biggest loss was Bruce Sucher. Still can't believe it.
To the game and a number of random thoughts.
Good UD crowd. Good venue.
This is the winningest class in UD history. They just had two bad games. Let us not negate all the great accomplishments because of two games. Over the years, they have won a lot of games by finishing strong in the last four minute or even two minute segment. How many times have they been losing with less than two minutes. Rhode Island win was not that long ago. Yesterday, they could not finish.
Archie and staff as well as fans are baffled why this team can't get out of the gate. This has happened all year. They seem tentative and unsure of themselves in the first half too often.
The GW loss was easier to understand. Davidson is good, but should have won the game.
The game plan early seemed to be pound the ball inside and draw fouls. They tried to go on one one too much to achieve that. They did not draw enough fouls and did not finish. Some shots easy, some just awkward. Pollard and Cunningham especially. Second half, they got to the basket easier with more ball movement.
On defense, the game plan was stop Aldridge Pollard did a very job on him. When Mikesell came in, Davidson immediately pounded it in to Aldridge. Archie yanked Ryan right away.
Gibbs just went off. Cooke covered him and did an OK job. His long arms bothered Gibbs, but Charles was in foul trouble. Gibbs seemed to handle Kyle. Baffling that two of the best defensive players in the A10 had such rough games.
The help defense was not there either. Davidson set a ton of screens for Gibbs. Not many for Aldridge.
Chris R mentions that Davidson exploits the over aggressiveness on D, but I saw the team burned on a lot of straight up man D as well. Davidson set a number of plays for Gibbs, but he created a lot as well.
Rebounding continues to be problematic. One sequence in the second half saw Davidson get two rebounds before scoring on a Gibbs 3
The stats that stood out the most were losing the rebounding numbers and the lack of foul shots attempted. They did not do a good job of drawing fouls.
The other odd stat was blocked shots. Davidson was taller inside, but not that tall. We seemed to let their height bother us as if we could not jump and protect.
Bad omen in the first half. Davidson built the lead and rested Gibbs. That rest made a difference as his legs were strong during the last two minutes of the game.
Terrible first half. Different team second half.
Darryl suffered another injury, perhaps concussion. I saw the ref tell Archie that a legal pick was set. If so, lack of communications was a culprit. It was near mid court and I missed the play.
Gibbs and the UD bench got into it. Tom Ostrom and Gibbs were going at it hard. Gibbs should have been it with a T for the mask throwing. Davidson coach was street fight mad and had to be restrained. Long time since I have seen a coach that angry
I thought we were going to win the game if we made a stop at two minutes. We were up 3. Looks like we rotated over to stop Gibbs and the player from Iceland nailed an open 3. That was the play of the game. It energized Davidson. Down the stretch, the player from Iceland made some winning plays.
Gibbs made two amazing shots after that.
Sophomore class worries me. Crosby and Mikesell played only a couple of minutes. No Sam Miller at all. Williams played well . Four years ago this current senior class contributed much more down the stretch as freshman than this sophomore class has done down the stretch. When they are in the game, the other teams exploit them. Mikesell on D is the most obvious. My wife said he needs to learn how to play D this summer.
Few years ago,St. Louis played all seniors and then paid the price the next year. Lots of work to be done in offseason. But first NCAA.
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03-11-2017, 08:15 AM
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Good review. The question is - Will we bounce back to win our first round game? I listened to Archie at the end of game. He said these guys "play better with their back against the wall. The last two games, for whatever reason, they didn't come out with that edge. He hopes the NCAA lose and out mentality gives them that edge back."
Bob McKillop is a heck of a coach with a court named after him. Two all-A10 offensive players went off on us. No shame, but agree we should of won.
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03-11-2017, 08:15 AM
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Nice observations for those of us who couldn't attend. Thanks
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03-11-2017, 10:12 AM
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I had to watch the first half with no sound due to being on a conference call. It was easy to see the one-on-one playmaking attempts vs passing. You can't make the extra pass if you don't make passes at all.
The other thing that was quite noticeable to me on offense was that nobody was setting any screens. There was off-ball movement but no picks. None out top where it's normally very visible. But none in the paint either. I had to keep checking to make sure Davidson wasn't playing zone.
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03-11-2017, 02:19 PM
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Davidson 1H versus Rhody
61% 2pts (56% versus Dayton)
25% 3pts (37% versus Dayton)
83% FT (92% versus Dayton)
+2 possessions (-6 versus Dayton)
So Dayton played equal to or better defense than Rhody 1H.
But Rhody shooting 75% from 3 (Dayton 44% from 3); 50% from 2 (Dayton 42% from 2); and 100% from FT (Dayton 50% from FT).
Announcers lauding Rhody defense, not the case. Rhode is shooting lights-out in 1H.
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03-11-2017, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by ruechalgrin
Davidson 1H versus Rhody
61% 2pts (56% versus Dayton)
25% 3pts (37% versus Dayton)
83% FT (92% versus Dayton)
+2 possessions (-6 versus Dayton)
So Dayton played equal to or better defense than Rhody 1H.
But Rhody shooting 75% from 3 (Dayton 44% from 3); 50% from 2 (Dayton 42% from 2); and 100% from FT (Dayton 50% from FT).
Announcers lauding Rhody defense, not the case. Rhode is shooting lights-out in 1H.
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I can appreciate this, but RI shut down Gibbs in the first half. Gibbs didn't even take a shot in the first 10 minutes and finally scored with 9 mins in the half. He finished with 6 points. I think 2 were FThrows. I don't know what they did with Aldridge, but they played great D on Gibbs.
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03-11-2017, 03:08 PM
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Rhode Island played like an NCAA team...and a good one. Great defense from the start. Glad we played Davidson. RI would have embarrassed Dayton the way they played (Both RI and Dayton).
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03-11-2017, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by steve snyder
Rhode Island played like an NCAA team...and a good one. Great defense from the start. Glad we played Davidson. RI would have embarrassed Dayton the way they played (Both RI and Dayton).
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UD would have played a different game against Rhode Island. Davidson was sky high to beat UD and had nothing on defense in the tank against Rhode Island.
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03-11-2017, 09:45 PM
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Great players take over games. Hats off to Gibbs. We have done it to
others.
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03-11-2017, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer
Great players take over games. Hats off to Gibbs. We have done it to
others.
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Great players obviously can take over a game and win it.
Pleas tell me the last time a UD player has done so to refresh my memory.
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03-11-2017, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by C-time
Great players obviously can take over a game and win it.
Pleas tell me the last time a UD player has done so to refresh my memory.
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Ironically, the OT win at Davidson was just such a game. Scoochie scored the first 11 of UD's points in OT. Even if no other UD player had scored in OT, Davidson scored a mere 8 points, total, in the OT, so it was Scoochie 11, all other Flyers 4, the entire Davidson roster 8 in those 5 minutes that now seem like they were a year ago.
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03-11-2017, 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted by T-Bone 84
Ironically, the OT win at Davidson was just such a game. Scoochie scored the first 11 of UD's points in OT. Even if no other UD player had scored in OT, Davidson scored a mere 8 points, total, in the OT, so it was Scoochie 11, all other Flyers 4, the entire Davidson roster 8 in those 5 minutes that now seem like they were a year ago.
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I'll concede that Scoochie took over in that overtime, but when is the last time UD has had a player take over an entire game. I honestly can't remember when it happened or who did it. "True Team" is overrated sometimes.
*** And yes I mean the whole "True Team" thing is overrated. It would be nice to have that one player who can take over a game.
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03-11-2017, 11:08 PM
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Originally Posted by C-time
I'll concede that Scoochie took over in that overtime, but when is the last time UD has had a player take over an entire game. I honestly can't remember when it happened or who did it. "True Team" is overrated sometimes.
*** And yes I mean the whole "True Team" thing is overrated. It would be nice to have that one player who can take over a game.
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The problem with one player taking over a game is that it does not produce long term winning results. Gibbs took over yesterday and then the team was blown out today. Davidson was in the middle of the A10 this year, not the top.
When Phil Jackson took over the Bulls, he had to convince Michael Jordan to get the other players more involved. The more team oriented approach resulted in championships.
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03-12-2017, 12:06 AM
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It's totally cool that different players have made the difference at the end of close games
(Scoochie in that overtime, Pollard to get us there, Xeyrius in a different game, Cooke another time)
but it is hard to keep watching UD dig itself out of a hole.
Time for TRUE team to pull it all together ! Xeyriously.
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03-12-2017, 10:37 AM
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When your team is built on one or two players (taking over), when they do not you get mixed results, when those players are off. See Bonnie and Richmond and Davidson and Mason.
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03-12-2017, 11:00 AM
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I should probably clarify that part of my dislike of the whole "True Team" thing is simply the promotion and public use of it. I simply think it's a corny saying that goes right with all of those silly motivational sayings your high school coach tried to use on you. You all remember coaches pulling out those Together Everyone Achieves More or Refuse to Lose t-shirts.
I realize that sharing the ball and having a balanced team probably leads to more team success, but I'd still like to have that one guy on my team that can go get buckets when everybody else is struggling.
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03-12-2017, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by C-time
I realize that sharing the ball and having a balanced team probably leads to more team success, but I'd still like to have that one guy on my team that can go get buckets when everybody else is struggling.
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I think Archie envisioned that being Cooke.
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03-12-2017, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer
I think Archie envisioned that being Cooke.
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I agree which is why I think a lot of people here criticize Cooke for forcing shots, but I think Archie is calling plays for him and telling him to try to score.
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03-12-2017, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer
I think Archie envisioned that being Cooke.
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IMO it's actually the opposite. Arch wants goods shots in the context of the offense. At times Cooke freelances too much. It frustrates guys like SS who have played in this style for 4 years, and have seen how DO and DP played for the extra pass. For example it allows SS to get the ball so he can penetrate and score off the dribble or rotating the ball leads to Cooke getting a 3 pointer in the rhythm of the office. Our biggest challenges is the lack of inside presence. W/O JC at full strength we lack that back to the basket player that we need. It's tough. I think he likes the transition offense that Cooke brings. The same holds to for DD.
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03-12-2017, 12:12 PM
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General
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Originally Posted by jack72
When your team is built on one or two players (taking over), when they do not you get mixed results, when those players are off. See Bonnie and Richmond and Davidson and Mason.
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Yep, it's no coincidence that Dayton, VCU and RI are the best 3 teams in the A10, all 3 have many weapons. I know that the very, very top teams in the country sometimes have that type of player, but that's because most of the time that's the type of basketball program those players choose to go to. They also have great players around them but it's a whole different level. In the A10, you have what, 140+ scholarship players and you can only name 4(3%) that fit that description.
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03-12-2017, 12:24 PM
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In my mind, the biggest play of the game was the 3 hit by the player from Iceland. UD focused on Gibbs and left him wide open. If he misses and UD rebounds, this game most likely turns out with a better ending.
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03-12-2017, 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted by C-time
I agree which is why I think a lot of people here criticize Cooke for forcing shots, but I think Archie is calling plays for him and telling him to try to score.
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CC has definitely not played like a pre season POTY candidate or even a 2nd team player. He simply has to have more 18-21 point scoring games and be that " go to" player that Archie expects him to be.
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