Trice to Michigan State

Flyer71 · #1 08-04-2010, 08:31 PM

Posters on Flyerhoops say Trice to the Spartans. I didn't see that coming.

lhsgolf19 · #2 08-04-2010, 08:43 PM

Originally Posted by Flyer71

Posters on Flyerhoops say Trice to the Spartans. I didn't see that coming.

that was me... draymond green posted it on his twitter, then Jeff Goodman confirmed it... spartan fans are not sure if its a preferred walk-on or straight full ride, but it looks to be a full ride, which is extremely surprising.

anthonycharles · #3 08-04-2010, 08:44 PM

Wow...I don't follow recruiting all that much, but...wow.

FlyerFanatic08 · #4 08-04-2010, 09:23 PM

i knew trice was good, but MSU good? i think i read hes on the same AAU team as a recent 5 star recruit who also committed to MSU

lilrudy4787 · #5 08-05-2010, 08:29 AM

Is anyone else surprised or think it is a coincidence that this happened right after UD filled their recruiting class?

San Diego Flyer · #6 08-05-2010, 08:36 AM

We simply didn't need another guard after KD committed. That should have been the clincher.

The Fat Tuna · #7 08-05-2010, 08:47 AM

I follow Michigan State recruiting, and I have never once heard his name mentioned as a possible target, really really surprised.

steve · #8 08-05-2010, 08:52 AM

They wany his AAU teammate really really bad.

cj · #9 08-05-2010, 09:02 AM

If Trice gets any significant playing time I would be surprised. He may be gone after 1 or 2 years looking for some playing time somewhere else.

BallgameJohnny · #10 08-05-2010, 09:08 AM

MSU boards are shocked and dismayed they gave him a scholarship and are hoping dawson is worth it.

San Diego Flyer · #11 08-05-2010, 09:46 AM

I can't believe Izzo would make this move without a strong endorsement from BG since Trice is right in UD's backyard. Had we not gotten KD, I would wager that Trice would have been a high target for a guard spot.

I defer to anyone's judgement as to how good the prospect really is.

Fudd · #12 08-05-2010, 09:56 AM

I have heard only positive things about the Trice family, and I hope that Travis is a big success at MSU.

The Fat Tuna · #13 08-05-2010, 10:01 AM

I have heard he is a nice guy, but they have a McDonald's AA freshman point guard coming in this year. I just don't see him getting a ton of time, but who knows.

Atlantic 10 · #14 08-05-2010, 10:04 AM

Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer

I can't believe Izzo would make this move without a strong endorsement from BG since Trice is right in UD's backyard. Had we not gotten KD, I would wager that Trice would have been a high target for a guard spot.

I defer to anyone's judgement as to how good the prospect really is.

Agree, when we got KD that was it for Trice

Medford · #15 08-05-2010, 10:13 AM

I'm not writing Travis off just yet in terms of playing time at MSU. He's ranked higher in ESPN's ranking that Chris Johnson was IIRC, and how many B10 schools would like to have Chris on their roster right now? All of them probably. However, if he does decide to transfer at some point, with the transfer season, that would put him 2 years behind Staten and could make UD an attractive place to transfer to as they'll be in need of a PG in a couple of seasons.

But w/ that said, I hope he succeeds, and I hope the plans are already in the works for a home & home w/ MSU in a few seasons when Payne & Trice are both on the roster and Izzo wants to get them a game back in their hometown.

springborofan · #16 08-05-2010, 11:06 AM

Trice is a 3 point specialist. I doubt he'll ever start for MSU but I believe he'll fill a role for them. He and Luke are different in size but their role's will be similar.

My understanding is that the kid works hard so I always want to give compliments to a kid that works...good luck to him.

Chris R · #17 08-05-2010, 11:57 AM

Travis Walton ended up succeeding in izzos system. So too will trice.
Posted via Mobile Device

ClaytonFlyerFan · #18 08-05-2010, 01:42 PM

Originally Posted by BallgameJohnny

MSU boards are shocked and dismayed they gave him a scholarship and are hoping dawson is worth it.

You mean to tell me that on the MSU boards the fans think they are smarter than the coach too? I thought that only happened here.

I guess multiple final 4 trips for Izzo is still not good enough to please some.

BallgameJohnny · #19 08-05-2010, 02:09 PM

I guess I should clarify. Their message boards are pretty good at tracking the recruiting process, prospects, timelines, etc. This kid was not on their radar. After viewing film's they are not estatic about it, but of course they trust Izzo.

San Diego Flyer · #20 08-05-2010, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan

You mean to tell me that on the MSU boards the fans think they are smarter than the coach too? I thought that only happened here.
.

MSU fans were definitely smarter when they initiated a movement to convince TI not to go to the Cleveland Cavs.

What a shipwreck that would have been for the Izzo's.

UD Sam · #21 08-06-2010, 03:37 AM

Interesting story of the sequence of events surrounding Trice's verbal to MSU:

Tuesday: Trice received a phone call from Minnesota coach, Tubby Smith with a recruiting pitch...Trice met with BG who encouraged him to go to prep school for a year then come to UD on scholarship the following year....Trice received offer from Izzo.

Wednesday: Dayton got a commitment from Henton. Later that day Trice verballed to MSU.

"Trice, a 6-foot, 164-pound incoming senior, huddled with Flyers coach Brian Gregory on Tuesday, Aug. 3. Trice said that for him to join the Flyers, he was encouraged to spend a year at a prep school, then accept a scholarship to UD."

“(Dayton was) there to the end,” Trice said. (Gregory) told me they needed big, and he talked to us about options ... going to prep school. They were looking for a different route to get me there. I respect that.”

http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/high-school-sports/wayne/trice-ud-there-to-the-end-among-options-847170.html

JJPAS · #22 08-06-2010, 07:36 AM

The day Travis Trice committed to MSU ESPN was giving him a grade of 85. The day after it went up to an 88. Just another reason not to take these ratings seriously.

San Diego Flyer · #23 08-06-2010, 08:56 AM

Originally Posted by JJPAS

The day Travis Trice committed to MSU ESPN was giving him a grade of 85. The day after it went up to an 88. Just another reason not to take these ratings seriously.

My first thought on that subject was, "Right on". But think about it a little deeper. When the ratings people scrape and scratch for info on a prospect, they often come up short of credible testimonials. When a recruiting machine like MSU and Tom Izzo offer, there is a reinforcement that the kid may be undervalued on their charts.

3 points on the b-ball Richter scale is chump change, but the notion that a valued recruiting machine endorsed the lad and he might be a tad better than our evalulation shows, is not unfathomable.

That said, I agree that the rating services in general are faced with a very subjective mission and there is a bias that rears its head when the kid finally chooses a school.

Hobopotamus1 · #24 08-06-2010, 06:13 PM

I really do hope things go well for Trice, but if he finds himself not getting enough PT, you would have to say that UD would be the top place for him to tranfer.

For BG to even suggest for him to go to prep school shows that he wanted to come here. He could be a Flyer before it is all said and done.

ud69 · #25 08-06-2010, 06:29 PM

I've still got my eye on Geron Johnson for 2011 or 2012. He is a stud. Going JC this coming year. He has some issues to overcome (academic and personal) but he is heads above Trice.

Atlantic 10 · #26 08-06-2010, 10:18 PM

Originally Posted by ud69

i've still got my eye on geron johnson for 2011 or 2012. He is a stud. Going jc this coming year. He has some issues to overcome (academic and personal) but he is heads above trice.

2012 ;]

BallgameJohnny · #27 08-09-2010, 11:21 AM

You need to get out and check the recruiting circuits, there are better players without the baggage of Johnson.

ClaytonFlyerFan · #28 08-09-2010, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by BallgameJohnny

You need to get out and check the recruiting circuits, there are better players without the baggage of Johnson.

But do the better players have any interest in our Flyers?

If Johnson keeps his nose clean next two years, I say give him a chance. We all have to grow up at some point in our life, and hopefully he has learned his lesson, put academics high on his priority list, and keeps his nose clean.

In BG we trust.

FlyerAlum1 · #29 08-09-2010, 12:21 PM

Originally Posted by Atlantic 10

2012 ;]

Geron will definitely be 2012.

Young kid with some problems = no big deal (IMO). Young people make mistakes all of the time. Additionally, I have it on good authority that Geron is a solid kid that was exposed to the wrong things around certain people. I think a change of scenary will do him quite well.

Geron was in ESPN's top 100 by the season's end. The kid is a supremely talented athlete that would be an asset to UD on the court. The big question is whether or not he will be an asset off the court. He has two years to answer this question, so let's not sell him short just yet...

The Fat Tuna · #30 08-09-2010, 12:33 PM

Originally Posted by Chris R

Travis Walton ended up succeeding in izzos system. So too will trice.
Posted via Mobile Device

I don't see the correlation. Walton succeeded at State because he played lock down defense and was big and strong.

According to reports, Trice wasn't on Izzo's radar until he watched a couple AAU games where he was recruiting Branden Dawson, a 5 star commit to MSU. Izzo just saw him at AAU games. I am not saying I have a better eye for talent than Izzo, but I was very surprised.

UDBrian · #31 08-09-2010, 01:14 PM

Originally Posted by BallgameJohnny

You need to get out and check the recruiting circuits, there are better players without the baggage of Johnson.

I am assuming you have seen Geron play. I was impressed. He is very athletic but what sets him apart is that he has GREAT VISION and passing ability in the half court. He could play point guard in the half court, I haven't seen him bringing the ball up full court

rollo · #32 08-09-2010, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by FlyerAlum1

Geron will definitely be 2012.

Young kid with some problems = no big deal (IMO). Young people make mistakes all of the time.

Where do you draw the line between a 'mistake' and a 'crime'? If this perp didn't play basketball, 99.9% of us would consider him a thug and a fool.

To me, a mistake is dribbling off your foot, 4-putting, typing 'to' instead of 'too' and spilling your milk. Making the decision to steal, beat or rob someone of something they worked, saved and bought for themselves is anything but a mistake....it's an attitude. One I don't care to see at UD. My hope is that UD moves on....

BTW...if I were the NCAA Czar, my first edict would be to ban any athlete from D1 athletic scholarships if they commited a violent crime or felony. No questions asked. You want to clean up sports?....make it clear that you will be held responsible for your actions beginning in HS.

BTW II...as NCAA Czar, I would also try to ban all athletic scholarships. You want to go to college? Study first, sports 2nd. It wouldn't work due to the bleeding hearts of this country, but it would send a message that hasn't been spoken since the 40's when Harvard, Yale and the Military Acadamies were consistently in the top 20.

BTW III...if I were the UD Czar, any student convicted of a felony would be immediately discharged from the University, no questions asked.

daytonflyers · #33 08-09-2010, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by rollo

Where do you draw the line between a 'mistake' and a 'crime'? If this perp didn't play basketball, 99.9% of us would consider him a thug and a fool.

To me, a mistake is dribbling off your foot, 4-putting, typing 'to' instead of 'too' and spilling your milk. Making the decision to steal, beat or rob someone of something they worked, saved and bought for themselves is anything but a mistake....it's an attitude. One I don't care to see at UD. My hope is that UD moves on....

BTW...if I were the NCAA Czar, my first edict would be to ban any athlete from D1 athletic scholarships if they commited a violent crime or felony. No questions asked. You want to clean up sports?....make it clear that you will be held responsible for you actions beginning in HS.

BTW II...as NCAA Czar, I would also try to ban all athletic scholarships. You want to go to college? Study first, sports 2nd. It wouldn't work due to the bleeding hearts of this country, but it would send a message that hasn't been spoken since the 40's when Harvard, Yale and the Military Acadamies were consistently in the top 20.

BTW III...if I were the UD Czar, any student convicted of a felony would be immediately discharged from the University, no questions asked.

Thank god you arent the Czar of anything, Rollo. And thank god our actual leaders aren't as confused as you. No more scholarships for athletics? Rollo, what then do we do about the countless high school students who arent intelligent enough for full scholarships (me, almost assuredly you, and almost everyone else i know), would like to go to college, but dont have parents that can pay for to go to college?

Would London Warren have gotten to go to college under your rules? How about Chris Johnson, Chris Wright, and Josh Benson. All seem like good kids right? But since they don't come from money, arent naturally intellectually brilliant, and either dont have enough information or cant reasonably take out loans to fund their entire education. But I'm sure I deserve my UD degree more than those guys do...

rollo · #34 08-09-2010, 02:45 PM

We'll never know the answer to your questions because athletes today weren't raised with the understanding that academics count. And as long as kids grow up believing that sports trump brains, we'll continue to see athletes act like fools because they know that everyone will demand they be given 100 chances....as opposed to the non-athletic classmates who will get none.

Now that's fair!!

As for London....he could have gone to college if his grades were good. If not, then he could attend a junior college or take his game to any number of minor leagues that would develop to accomodate those who only want to play sports.

My question to you is this: Why do you believe that athletes can't/shouldn't be expected to excel in the classroom, too? Are sports and grades mutually exclusive?

As for the rest of us who didn't get accepted to Harvard, Notre Dame or West Point, there are thousands of colleges available to all of us depending on our level of accomplishment in high school. Just because someone gets rejected at UD doesn't mean they're sentenced to dig ditches the rest of their lives. They just have to apply elsewhere until they get accepted to a school to their liking. And when they get accepted, they can still play basketball/football/golf etc... That's not hard to understand.

ud69 · #35 08-09-2010, 02:52 PM

I would support the elimination of athletic scholarships. Make the aid need based - like Pell grants. However, I am not naive enough to believe it will happen. If these athletes spent as much time in the library studying as they put into honing their athletic skills, they would have no problem in virtually any university in the country.

ClaytonFlyerFan · #36 08-09-2010, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by rollo

BTW...if I were the NCAA Czar, my first edict would be to ban any athlete from D1 athletic scholarships if they commited a violent crime or felony. No questions asked. You want to clean up sports?....make it clear that you will be held responsible for you actions beginning in HS.

BTW II...as NCAA Czar, I would also try to ban all athletic scholarships. You want to go to college? Study first, sports 2nd. It wouldn't work due to the bleeding hearts of this country, but it would send a message that hasn't been spoken since the 40's when Harvard, Yale and the Military Acadamies were consistently in the top 20.

BTW III...if I were the UD Czar, any student convicted of a felony would be immediately discharged from the University, no questions asked.

Rollo,

I think your BTW I above is way out there. Thank god your not the NCAA Zar. I admit, I used to think more like what you put here, but after meeting and working with a few younger kids, some from single parent homes, some who were not afforded the luxuries I had growing up, and some who basically never stood a chance early on thanks to the idiots who bred randomly and then became parents, I have come to find the good and potential in our kids today. Someone has to reach out, help separate them from the bad elements in their lives, and show them the right way.

Not every decision I made at 15 or 16 years old was a wise one. Fortunately, I had the right mentors in my life to help me grow up a bit faster than some of my fellow students.

Without naming or talking about any particular potential student athlete, or situation, I have no problems in BG and the University of Dayton taking a chance on some of these kids. BG, staff, and team mates can become the mentors that are needed, the new friends with a solid head on their shoulders, the leader the kids need.

At the age many of these kids get in trouble, banning from future NCAA participation a few years down the road is not the answer. The participation and leaders these kids will be around, when given their second chance, in many cases might be the difference between becoming a burden on our society, or a productive member.

SideshowBob · #37 08-09-2010, 03:03 PM

Originally Posted by rollo

Where do you draw the line between a 'mistake' and a 'crime'? If this perp didn't play basketball, 99.9% of us would consider him a thug and a fool.

To me, a mistake is dribbling off your foot, 4-putting, typing 'to' instead of 'too' and spilling your milk. Making the decision to steal, beat or rob someone of something they worked, saved and bought for themselves is anything but a mistake....it's an attitude. One I don't care to see at UD. My hope is that UD moves on....

BTW...if I were the NCAA Czar, my first edict would be to ban any athlete from D1 athletic scholarships if they commited a violent crime or felony. No questions asked. You want to clean up sports?....make it clear that you will be held responsible for you actions beginning in HS.

BTW II...as NCAA Czar, I would also try to ban all athletic scholarships. You want to go to college? Study first, sports 2nd. It wouldn't work due to the bleeding hearts of this country, but it would send a message that hasn't been spoken since the 40's when Harvard, Yale and the Military Acadamies were consistently in the top 20.

BTW III...if I were the UD Czar, any student convicted of a felony would be immediately discharged from the University, no questions asked.

I have a very good friend who was caught breaking and entering to steal something with a group of friends when he was younger. I think he was considered a juvenile at the time. Now he is a well respected judge! I always felt that he was good at heart, but born into a bad situation surrounded by bad influences. He slowly worked his way to a place where he was in a very positive situation. I know that there are not nearly as many success stories as there are complete disappointments when you talk about juveniles caught doing this type of thing, but I know that you can't write them all off. That is why I say you have to look below the surface at each personal situation of this nature. I don't know anything of Jeron's situation or character, but I am careful not to make the same generalities that Rollo does. Some people have the guts to turn their lives around.

rollo · #38 08-09-2010, 03:09 PM

I spent a couple years in the Big Brother program mentoring a boy who's mom was a dope smoking pain in the ass...4 boys, all different dads. Chaos daily if not hourly. When I was involved (2+ years, 3-5 days a week) his grades were all A's and B's, because he knew the only way to do fun things with me was to do well in school first. When the government found them a free 4-bedroom townhouse in Vandalia, they moved and he ended up flunking out of school. In fact, my 'little brother' killed his mom 7 years after we split when she flew into a rage after he forgot to get her a Wendy's double cheeseburger after a basketball game and he snapped. After the years af abuse he experienced, I wasn't the least bit shocked.

I also spent a year in a program called Building Bridges where we I tutored the less fortunate on the east side weekly. The 3rd grade girl I tutored live with her mom, grandpa and two brothers, one of whom was 15 and on the run from the law (carjacking). I would bring her a can of coke every day and only let her have it after she finished her math homework. Once I left she would run to the East Dayton Boys Center to drink it because if she stayed at her cockroach infested home, her mom would drink it. She protected that coke like you or I would protect our kids....because it was all she had. Literally. She later killed her 13 year old best friend in an fight over whether or not she was pregnant by her 19 year old boyfriend.

In both cases, the problem wasn't the intellegence of the kids, they had that, but the lack of discipline and expectations from anyone in their lives. Had they been exposed to either by anyone in authority, is there any doubt their lives - and others - would be different?

My point is simple...the sooner kids realize that their future is a funtion of books read not newspaper headlines made, they'll actually have one, which is why I believe that any desire to have a future in sports be rooted in an education, not vise versa.

Peace!

SideshowBob · #39 08-09-2010, 03:59 PM

I have completely different standards for those who enact violence on helpless drinking fountains. If I was Czar, I'd say, "Ban them all".

Peace out.

Furio · #40 08-09-2010, 04:38 PM

Non Scholarship college basketball.
We already have that. It is called Division 3.
Nobody supports it.

rollo · #41 08-09-2010, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by daytonflyers

Would London Warren have gotten to go to college under your rules? How about Chris Johnson, Chris Wright, and Josh Benson. All seem like good kids right? But since they don't come from money, arent naturally intellectually brilliant, ...

Wow! Are you calling these guys stupid just because they're basketball players? Really? There's a name for people who prejudge others based on their ohhhh, never mind.

Glen Clark · #42 08-09-2010, 06:24 PM

. . . except:

daytonflyers · #43 08-09-2010, 07:02 PM

Originally Posted by rollo

Wow! Are you calling these guys stupid just because they're basketball players? Really? There's a name for people who prejudge others based on their ohhhh, never mind.

HA! Did you notice elsewhere I put myself in the same category as someone who isnt smart enough to get a full academic scholarship? I'm not calling them stupid because their basketball players. I'm saying that if full scholarships were not given for athletics it is unlikely that all of these guys would have graduated from college.

ManhattanFlyer · #44 08-09-2010, 07:16 PM

Originally Posted by daytonflyers

HA! Did you notice elsewhere I put myself in the same category as someone who isnt smart enough to get a full academic scholarship? I'm not calling them stupid because their basketball players. I'm saying that if full scholarships were not given for athletics it is unlikely that all of these guys would have graduated from college.

Why do you think it's unlikely for all of those guys to graduate from college without an athletic scholarship?

UD Sam · #45 08-09-2010, 07:23 PM

Originally Posted by rollo

Wow! Are you calling these guys stupid just because they're basketball players? Really? There's a name for people who prejudge others based on their ohhhh, never mind.

Rollo, dayton flyers mentioned that the players he referred to aren't intellectually brilliant; therefore, they wouldn't receive a full academic scholarshp. That is way different than saying they are stupid!

ManhattanFlyer · #46 08-09-2010, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by UD Sam

Rollo, dayton flyers mentioned that the players he referred to aren't intellectually brilliant; therefore, they wouldn't receive a full academic scholarshp. That is way different than saying they are stupid!

1) How does daytonflyers know the intellectual ability of any of these guys?

2) He said not all of them would graduate from college.

rollo · #47 08-09-2010, 08:25 PM

Originally Posted by daytonflyers

HA! Did you notice elsewhere I put myself in the same category as someone who isnt smart enough to get a full academic scholarship? I'm not calling them stupid because their basketball players. I'm saying that if full scholarships were not given for athletics it is unlikely that all of these guys would have graduated from college.

Show me a minority HS student with a 3.0 gpa in prep courses and I'll show you a student who will be drowned in scholarships. I've had a few black students whose scholarships earned exceeded their college tuition, room and board and food by $10K including one who bought herself a Jaguar after her junior year at UD with the scholarship spare change.

Colleges actively recruit more minorities for academic scholarships than athletic scholarships. Why this isn't pounded into their heads from 1st grade thru 12th by teachers and administrators is nothing short of irresponsible.

Where there's a will, there's a way. If London's dream as a 10-year old was to attend Florida State, he could have done it regardless of athletic ability. Same with every other student in this country. The 2010 graduating class at the high school in my community received $3.2m in academic scholarships compared to 1 given for athletics.

Brains are worth more than brawn! Did I just say that????

AdamtheFlyer · #48 08-09-2010, 08:41 PM

Quite possibly the most ignorant, embarrassing string of posts I have ever seen on this site. I'd rather read about some old Uncle Rico type bragging about beating kids in 21, trying to relive some glory days he never had.

xubrew · #49 08-09-2010, 09:05 PM

BTW...if I were the NCAA Czar, my first edict would be to ban any athlete from D1 athletic scholarships if they commited a violent crime or felony. No questions asked. You want to clean up sports?....make it clear that you will be held responsible for your actions beginning in HS.

BTW II...as NCAA Czar, I would also try to ban all athletic scholarships. You want to go to college? Study first, sports 2nd. It wouldn't work due to the bleeding hearts of this country, but it would send a message that hasn't been spoken since the 40's when Harvard, Yale and the Military Acadamies were consistently in the top 20.

i'd say that pretty much covers it...

rollo · #50 08-09-2010, 09:56 PM

Looks like the negative reppers are out in force tonite.

Somehow I missed the memo.

UDBrian · #51 08-09-2010, 10:23 PM

People do change. I understand where Rollo is coming from concerning making mistakes but often the people we hang out with goad us into making bad decisions. Part of the reason they do that is because they don't want us to do any better than they are doing.

If Geron is hanging out with different types of people then it probably means that he has made a change for the better.

Who said (or something similar) "If you want to know what you are really like look at your friends"

daytonflyers · #52 08-10-2010, 06:26 AM

Originally Posted by ManhattanFlyer

Why do you think it's unlikely for all of those guys to graduate from college without an athletic scholarship?

You also asked, "how do I know the intellectual capacity of these guys?"

I really don't want to go down this road, but I "think its unlikely" that all four of the players mentioned would graduate college because I do know a little bit about them more than that they are basketball players. I dont know their SAT scores, but I know that they all came from inner city high schools and inner city neighborhoods. In this country, that makes it far less likely that you will go to college. I have also seen them play and speak enough to make some sorts of judgments on whether they are full-academic-scholarship material. Since I only know one guy who did get a full scholarship, and he was a freaking genius, I don't think I am slighting London by saying he isnt intellectually brilliant enough for a full academic scholarship.

I am certainly not saying they dont have the mental capacity to graduate from college (they are proving that wrong as we speak). And, might 1 or 2 of them have graduated through scholarships, etc? Of course. But all 4 of them would not. I'd be willing to bet on it, unfortunately.

daytonflyers · #53 08-10-2010, 06:42 AM

Originally Posted by rollo

Show me a minority HS student with a 3.0 gpa in prep courses and I'll show you a student who will be drowned in scholarships. I've had a few black students whose scholarships earned exceeded their college tuition, room and board and food by $10K including one who bought herself a Jaguar after her junior year at UD with the scholarship spare change.

Colleges actively recruit more minorities for academic scholarships than athletic scholarships. Why this isn't pounded into their heads from 1st grade thru 12th by teachers and administrators is nothing short of irresponsible.

Where there's a will, there's a way. If London's dream as a 10-year old was to attend Florida State, he could have done it regardless of athletic ability. Same with every other student in this country. The 2010 graduating class at the high school in my community received $3.2m in academic scholarships compared to 1 given for athletics.

Brains are worth more than brawn! Did I just say that????

Now who is getting racial Rollo? First, not sure when (or if) you went to college, but I would venture to guess the applicant pool is a bit larger now for those scholarships, and a 3.0 at Dunbar isn't going to get you any full rides unless you have something else compelling to go with it. But that's just a guess.

The fundamental flaw with your logic is your paragraph about London. You want 10-year-old London to start acting like a 30-year-old, recognize his future goals and how important his 6th grade Life Science class is to those future goals, and start busting his butt right then and forever after to attain those goals. He was 10! I have no idea what London's mother was telling him at that age, but I know my parents treated education as far and away the most important thing in the world. I didn't take school (for the most part) seriously because I wanted to or because I was planning for my future, I did it because I knew my mom wanted to see my report card and was going to make sure my homework was done. Generally (no longer referring to LW), inner city parents do a far worse job of drilling the importance of education into their kids' heads, probably because education was not a very important part of their lives or their childhood.

And, of course, there is the extraordinary person that makes it despite poverty and bad role models -- who decides at age 10 he wants to be a doctor and does it. But that is the extraordinary person. I didn't have to do that. I'm guessing you didn't either. So why punish kids who are unable to meet this high standard but still have lots of positives to bring to the table?

A lot is made of how we shouldn't tell kids that "athletics are a way out of poverty." The argument is that such a small percentage of kids go on to become professional athletes. However, a larger percentage of kids get athletic scholarships to college and can then get better jobs. And still a greater percentage were able to learn the importance of teamwork and hard work while getting exercise instead of roaming the streets and causing trouble. In these ways, I think athletics are a way out of poverty.

Curley-G · #54 08-10-2010, 08:53 AM

BallgameJohnny · #55 08-10-2010, 08:59 AM

Obviously you didn't read and understand what Rollo posted. Oh, yeah thats right you are stupid, excuse me, not intellectually brilliant.

He isn't asking London to do this at age ten, he was saying if academics were pushed on him harder at age 10, and basketball wasn't shown as the only way.

God **** some of you are some ignorant bastiges.

And believe me Geron Johnson is still hanging with the same crew, playing ball with the same bad influences in the summer, and had the same high school coach who cares nothing for academics and only about winning.

SCFlyer · #56 08-10-2010, 09:27 AM

Originally Posted by rollo

I spent a couple years in the Big Brother program mentoring a boy who's mom was a dope smoking pain in the ass...4 boys, all different dads. Chaos daily if not hourly. When I was involved (2+ years, 3-5 days a week) his grades were all A's and B's, because he knew the only way to do fun things with me was to do well in school first. When the government found them a free 4-bedroom townhouse in Vandalia, they moved and he ended up flunking out of school. In fact, my 'little brother' killed his mom 7 years after we split when she flew into a rage after he forgot to get her a Wendy's double cheeseburger after a basketball game and he snapped. After the years af abuse he experienced, I wasn't the least bit shocked.

I also spent a year in a program called Building Bridges where we I tutored the less fortunate on the east side weekly. The 3rd grade girl I tutored live with her mom, grandpa and two brothers, one of whom was 15 and on the run from the law (carjacking). I would bring her a can of coke every day and only let her have it after she finished her math homework. Once I left she would run to the East Dayton Boys Center to drink it because if she stayed at her cockroach infested home, her mom would drink it. She protected that coke like you or I would protect our kids....because it was all she had. Literally. She later killed her 13 year old best friend in an fight over whether or not she was pregnant by her 19 year old boyfriend.

In both cases, the problem wasn't the intellegence of the kids, they had that, but the lack of discipline and expectations from anyone in their lives. Had they been exposed to either by anyone in authority, is there any doubt their lives - and others - would be different?

My point is simple...the sooner kids realize that their future is a funtion of books read not newspaper headlines made, they'll actually have one, which is why I believe that any desire to have a future in sports be rooted in an education, not vise versa.

Peace!

I think it's interesting that even with the countless hours (2+ years, 3-5 days a week) you had to influence this young man, he still turned into someone who killed his own mother. It's a shame that even with all the time you spent with him, you weren't able to send him down a better path. And then to think that you spent "every day" with a girl for a year, and that she also went on to kill someone just a few short years later.

Those are really sad stories. I feel like that kind of thing would haunt me, especially if it has happened twice.

FlyerAlum1 · #57 08-10-2010, 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by rollo

Show me a minority HS student with a 3.0 gpa in prep courses and I'll show you a student who will be drowned in scholarships. I've had a few black students whose scholarships earned exceeded their college tuition, room and board and food by $10K including one who bought herself a Jaguar after her junior year at UD with the scholarship spare change.

Colleges actively recruit more minorities for academic scholarships than athletic scholarships. Why this isn't pounded into their heads from 1st grade thru 12th by teachers and administrators is nothing short of irresponsible.

Where there's a will, there's a way. If London's dream as a 10-year old was to attend Florida State, he could have done it regardless of athletic ability. Same with every other student in this country. The 2010 graduating class at the high school in my community received $3.2m in academic scholarships compared to 1 given for athletics.

Brains are worth more than brawn! Did I just say that????

Believe it or not, this post is actually one of the few accurate posts you put into this thread. Technically, most of your posts are opinions, so they cannot be factually inaccurate, but this is the only post citing facts and truisms, albeit somewhat exaggerated. Did I just contradict myself?

ManhattanFlyer · #58 08-10-2010, 12:11 PM

Originally Posted by daytonflyers

You also asked, "how do I know the intellectual capacity of these guys?"

I really don't want to go down this road, but I "think its unlikely" that all four of the players mentioned would graduate college because I do know a little bit about them more than that they are basketball players. I dont know their SAT scores, but I know that they all came from inner city high schools and inner city neighborhoods. In this country, that makes it far less likely that you will go to college. I have also seen them play and speak enough to make some sorts of judgments on whether they are full-academic-scholarship material. Since I only know one guy who did get a full scholarship, and he was a freaking genius, I don't think I am slighting London by saying he isnt intellectually brilliant enough for a full academic scholarship.

I am certainly not saying they dont have the mental capacity to graduate from college (they are proving that wrong as we speak). And, might 1 or 2 of them have graduated through scholarships, etc? Of course. But all 4 of them would not. I'd be willing to bet on it, unfortunately.

You're changing what you said - you said graduate from college, not receive a full scholarship to UD. So you've heard them speak and play basketball, and that's enough to know they wouldn't graduate from college?

FlyerAlum1 · #59 08-10-2010, 12:22 PM

Originally Posted by ManhattanFlyer

You're changing what you said - you said graduate from college, not receive a full scholarship to UD. So you've heard them speak and play basketball, and that's enough to know they wouldn't graduate from college?

Depends on the major.

rollo · #60 08-10-2010, 12:51 PM

Originally Posted by FlyerAlum1

Technically, most of your posts are opinions, so they cannot be factually inaccurate,

Fact: I was in the Big Bro program
Fact: I volunteered at Building Bridges
Fact: My little bro killed his mom
Fact: The girl I tutored killed her best friend
Fact: Colleges recruit monorities all over the country
Fact: More scholarship money is given for academic accomplishments than athletic
Fact: Minorites overwhelmongly feel their only path out of their plight is athletics (and in many cases, the Lottery, which I also believe should be axed) which is why so many of them give up on themselves
Fact: The negative reppers came out of the woodwork
Opinion: I personally wouldn't lose a second of sleep if athletic scholarships were phased out and replaced solely by academic scholarships and if I were the NCAA czar, would do it overnight.

daytonflyers · #61 08-10-2010, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by ManhattanFlyer

You're changing what you said - you said graduate from college, not receive a full scholarship to UD. So you've heard them speak and play basketball, and that's enough to know they wouldn't graduate from college?

No, I'm not changing what I said. I said not all of them would graduate from college, and I stand by that. The reason they wouldn't all graduate, in my opinion, is because at least 1 of them wouldnt ever go to college, not because any of them weren't smart enough to graduate if they did go.

Glen Clark · #62 08-10-2010, 06:12 PM

I think I need a beer . . .

John R · #63 08-10-2010, 06:26 PM

Originally Posted by Glen Clark

I think I need a beer . . .

some Esther Price Candy?

UD62 · #64 08-10-2010, 07:39 PM

I think I'm getting an Excedrin headache

Flyer2 · #65 08-11-2010, 12:58 AM

Originally Posted by rollo

Fact: I was in the Big Bro program
Fact: I volunteered at Building Bridges
Fact: My little bro killed his mom
Fact: The girl I tutored killed her best friend
Fact: Colleges recruit monorities all over the country
Fact: More scholarship money is given for academic accomplishments than athletic
Fact: Minorites overwhelmongly feel their only path out of their plight is athletics (and in many cases, the Lottery, which I also believe should be axed) which is why so many of them give up on themselves
Fact: The negative reppers came out of the woodwork
Opinion: I personally wouldn't lose a second of sleep if athletic scholarships were phased out and replaced solely by academic scholarships and if I were the NCAA czar, would do it overnight.

I thought this was the Trice to Michigan State thread that now has turned into an attack on those students who receive athletic scholarships.

Rollo start your own thread of what is wrong in life, athletics, NCAA, etc. How can anything be done now that we have the majority of mentally challenged voters who voted for King O'Bama.

And with a "tongue in cheek" please don't tutor any more students in order to keep the murder rate down.

Now back to the regularly scheduled program.

DallasFlyer · #66 08-11-2010, 01:04 AM

Originally Posted by Medford

if he does decide to transfer at some point, with the transfer season, that would put him 2 years behind Staten and could make UD an attractive place to transfer to as they'll be in need of a PG in a couple of seasons.

I think we are beyond hoping for transfers who couldn't cut it with the big boys (assuming that would be the reason for a Trice to UD transfer). Brian Gregory is bringing elite talent in. If Trice's career is similar to Mickey Perry's -- unable to manage much playing time in the big 10 -- is that who you want to bring in?

I hope Trice succeeds at MSU. If he can't get on the court in East Lansing, I'm not so sure he will get on the court at UD. Suggesting he would play here is selling UD short.

xubrew · #67 08-11-2010, 10:06 AM

Opinion: I personally wouldn't lose a second of sleep if athletic scholarships were phased out and replaced solely by academic scholarships and if I were the NCAA czar, would do it overnight.

well, take some comfort in this....

div1 caliber athletes who are capable of earning an academic scholarship are wanted by virtually everyone. why?? because they can be added to the roster without burning up an athletic scholarship. for basketball, it's like being able to have fourteen scholarships instead of just thirteen. so, earning an academic scholarship as a student athlete opens up virtually every door in the country, even the top notch programs. EVERYBODY wants them.

Medford · #68 08-11-2010, 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by DallasFlyer

I think we are beyond hoping for transfers who couldn't cut it with the big boys (assuming that would be the reason for a Trice to UD transfer). Brian Gregory is bringing elite talent in. If Trice's career is similar to Mickey Perry's -- unable to manage much playing time in the big 10 -- is that who you want to bring in?

I hope Trice succeeds at MSU. If he can't get on the court in East Lansing, I'm not so sure he will get on the court at UD. Suggesting he would play here is selling UD short.

Where did I say he won't get playing time? In fact I said "I'm not writing Travis off just yet in terms of playing time at MSU. He's ranked higher in ESPN's ranking that Chris Johnson was IIRC, and how many B10 schools would like to have Chris on their roster right now? All of them probably." Sounds like I have pretty open mind on the amount of playing time he'll get (I honestly have no idea where he fits in from a minutes standpoint).

Kids transfer for all kinds of reason. Perhaps he gets homesick, or perhaps after a season he realized he just doesn't care for the state of Michigan and wants to get out, or perhaps there's an illness in the family and he feels like he needs to be closer to home to help out, or perhaps his girlfriend wants him closer to home, or perhaps he decided one day he just can't take wearing green, or perhaps he runs into grade issues and wants a fresh start, or perhaps MSU recruits an uber talented NBA lottery pick a year after him and he realizes that guy is going to get 30 minutes starting and if he wants to showcase his talents for NBA scouts more than 10 minutes a night, starting at UD for 2 seasons after Juwaan moves on fits right in.

UD has 2 PGs on scholarship that have transferred from MVC schools for varying reasons, certainly UD isn't above considerring a transfer from a B10 school if it fits into their plans. Its not like BG wasn't interested in the kid, sounds like if Dilliard didn't come here, BG would have gone after Trice pretty hard. Hell, I didn't even say I was hoping he would transfer. I wished the kid luck and hope he does well. The only thing I hoped is that UD is on the phone w/ MSU trying to get a home & home to get Trice & Payne a game in their hometown. Not because I really care about seeing either play particularly, but b/c MSU has done that in the past (Wright State) and any time you can get an MSU type on the home schedule that is a good thing.

longtimefan · #69 08-11-2010, 03:18 PM

Originally Posted by xubrew

well, take some comfort in this....

div1 caliber athletes who are capable of earning an academic scholarship are wanted by virtually everyone. why?? because they can be added to the roster without burning up an athletic scholarship. for basketball, it's like being able to have fourteen scholarships instead of just thirteen. so, earning an academic scholarship as a student athlete opens up virtually every door in the country, even the top notch programs. EVERYBODY wants them.

I thought a "recruitable" DI athlete could not be given an academic scholarship in lieu of an athletic scholarship in order to exceed the allowable number of 13 players on scholarship. I know it used to be that way. Has it changed?

Atlantic 10 · #70 08-11-2010, 03:46 PM

Originally Posted by longtimefan

I thought a "recruitable" DI athlete could not be given an academic scholarship in lieu of an athletic scholarship in order to exceed the allowable number of 13 players on scholarship. I know it used to be that way. Has it changed?

If that was the case Kurt would have been on a Academic one for his grades, can not do

longtimefan · #71 08-11-2010, 04:16 PM

Originally Posted by longtimefan

I thought a "recruitable" DI athlete could not be given an academic scholarship in lieu of an athletic scholarship in order to exceed the allowable number of 13 players on scholarship. I know it used to be that way. Has it changed?

Originally Posted by Atlantic 10

If that was the case Kurt would have been on a Academic one for his grades, can not do

By the way you wrote your reply, I wasn't sure if you are agreeing with me or disagreeing. I assume you are agreeing with me that brew is incorrect.

San Diego Flyer · #72 08-11-2010, 04:35 PM

My impression has been that a team could have a player on academic scholarship as one of the allotted 13, thereby saving the Athletic Department one player's worth of budget money, as opposed to adding a 14th scholarship player to the roster.

Need some help on that one.

ManhattanFlyer · #73 08-11-2010, 04:40 PM

Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer

My impression has been that a team could have a player on academic scholarship as one of the allotted 13, thereby saving the Athletic Department one player's worth of budget money, as opposed to adding a 14th scholarship player to the roster.

Need some help on that one.

That was my understanding as well - that an athlete could have an academic scholarship, but he/she would still "count" as a scholarship athlete. It's just a question of where the funds came from - the academic scholarship fund or the athletic fund. Though I'm totally unsure of that and open to correction.

Flyer2 · #74 08-11-2010, 06:55 PM

I was sitting next to Nick Staffords parents at the Red/Blue game and somehow it came up that he was on an academic scholarship.

Atlantic 10 · #75 08-11-2010, 08:20 PM

Originally Posted by longtimefan

By the way you wrote your reply, I wasn't sure if you are agreeing with me or disagreeing. I assume you are agreeing with me that brew is incorrect.

It is counted one of the 13 :]

Chris R · #76 08-12-2010, 01:30 AM

If you are recruited to the university for your athletic talent, you must be counted in the athletic scholarship pool, not the academic pool. Doesnt matter if you had a perfect score on the SATs. If you received basketball recruiting letters, correspondence, went to camps, etc, and were selling your athletic wares, you are considered a scholarship athlete just like the Derrick Rose bonehead.

The only way around this conundrum to 'save' a scholly is if you choose to pay your own way. Guys like Greg Kohls were never recruited to UD as athletes but matriculated to the basketball program as an afterthought, so they can live off academic rides all 4-5 years, even if they end up turning into the Naismith winner.

xubrew · #77 08-12-2010, 03:25 AM

Originally Posted by longtimefan

I thought a "recruitable" DI athlete could not be given an academic scholarship in lieu of an athletic scholarship in order to exceed the allowable number of 13 players on scholarship. I know it used to be that way. Has it changed?

that is right. i was wrong. it is now my understanding that a "recruitable" player is anyone that the university persued during any point of the recruiting process. so, to not be counted as one of the thirteen, the player had to come to you without being courted in any way, shape, or form.

rollo · #78 03-29-2015, 06:52 PM

Royal bump #2...

rollo · #79 03-29-2015, 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by UD Sam

Interesting story of the sequence of events surrounding Trice's verbal to MSU:

Tuesday: Trice received a phone call from Minnesota coach, Tubby Smith with a recruiting pitch...Trice met with BG who encouraged him to go to prep school for a year then come to UD on scholarship the following year....Trice received offer from Izzo.

Wednesday: Dayton got a commitment from Henton. Later that day Trice verballed to MSU.

"Trice, a 6-foot, 164-pound incoming senior, huddled with Flyers coach Brian Gregory on Tuesday, Aug. 3. Trice said that for him to join the Flyers, he was encouraged to spend a year at a prep school, then accept a scholarship to UD."

“(Dayton was) there to the end,” Trice said. (Gregory) told me they needed big, and he talked to us about options ... going to prep school. They were looking for a different route to get me there. I respect that.”

http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/high-school-sports/wayne/trice-ud-there-to-the-end-among-options-847170.html

Read this...SMH!