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  #1  
Old 11-12-2018, 08:37 PM
Hyde Park Flyer Hyde Park Flyer is offline
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Thoughts on Coppin game

I don't get to many games since wifey and I chase our kids all over the place watching hockey. One of the posts I always look forward to is someone's thoughts on a game post. I know that it was a lopsided affair, but I was hoping for some objective as possible analysis of the Coppin game. Thoughts?
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Old 11-13-2018, 12:05 AM
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OK, I'll try. Coppin State was one of the worst college teams I've ever seen. They had many unforced turnovers. I think 14 in the first half. It was a great team to play, if your best player is injured. Toppin continues to look like a very mobile and talented big man. Davis is taking the ball to the hoop more than last year. Crutcher seems more relaxed and comfortable. Defensive switching is better than last year and Mikesell looks healthy.

Real answers or questions will come after Bahamas' tourney.
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Old 11-13-2018, 03:52 AM
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The Butler game will be very informative. They have a lot of beef. I watched a little of their game last night. I feel like we are fairly talented, but lack depth and the physical stature a true center this year. I curios to see us match up against a physically strong team like the Bulldogs.
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Old 11-13-2018, 08:33 AM
Hyde Park Flyer Hyde Park Flyer is offline
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I'm anxious for Obi to play against a tough di front court. I'm curious to see if Grant will go big with Obi, Josh, and Mikesell. Trey is important to this team, but I hope that we see a lot of Crutcher, Jordan, Mikesell, Obi, and Josh.
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Old 11-13-2018, 09:45 AM
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Mikesell is a solid player who will be important to the team’s success this year but he is not better than Landers in any aspect of the game (with the exception of three point shooting). Even though he is two inches taller, if the concern is bodying up a bigger more physical team I don’t think more Mikesell is the best option.
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Old 11-13-2018, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Flyers98 View Post
Mikesell is a solid player who will be important to the teamís success this year but he is not better than Landers in any aspect of the game (with the exception of three point shooting). Even though he is two inches taller, if the concern is bodying up a bigger more physical team I donít think more Mikesell is the best option.
Iíll play devilís advocate for a minute. Mikesell probably has the highest b-ball IQ on the team and seems to know where to be. I agree that Trey is ten times the athlete but when you watch the movement and positioning of the players Mikesell is very good.
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Old 11-13-2018, 09:55 AM
TheDuke2003 TheDuke2003 is offline
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When Josh is back Mikesell is going to become the 6th man. Getting minutes at both the 3 and the 4 depending on the opponent and their rotation. Against the likes of North Florida and Coppin State Mikesell can guard the 4, but when we start facing teams with larger and more athletic 4's than Ryan, then I think we'll see him get more minutes spelling Trey.

The rotation looks pretty set with the Crutcher, Davis, Landers, Cunningham, and Toppin starting, Cohill getting minutes at the 1 and 2, Matos getting minutes at the 2 and 3, and Mikesell getting minutes at the 3 and 4. I could see us going with a small lineup of Crutcher, Davis, Matos, Landers, and one of Josh/Toppin some of the time too.
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Old 11-13-2018, 09:56 AM
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I think Landers is probably the best on ball defender on the team. You are correct about Ryan’s “basketball IQ” but being in the right position is only part of the equation.
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Old 11-13-2018, 09:57 AM
TheDuke2003 TheDuke2003 is offline
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Originally Posted by TA111 View Post
Iíll play devilís advocate for a minute. Mikesell probably has the highest b-ball IQ on the team and seems to know where to be. I agree that Trey is ten times the athlete but when you watch the movement and positioning of the players Mikesell is very good.
I won't argue with a bit of that, but I think that will work best as the situational sixth man rather than as a stalwart in the starting lineup. The team needs Landers energy and leadership on the floor, and I don't think they mess with his role or minutes.
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Old 11-13-2018, 10:59 AM
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All I know is that if I need to send someone out to go bang bodies, Trey is at the top of my list. The dude is built like a brick ####house, and he seems to truly enjoy physical play. I'm not sure that can be said about anyone else on the team.

If I had to guess, we see a lot of him against Butler and our other "beefy" opponents this year.
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Old 11-13-2018, 12:24 PM
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I don't think it's unreasonable for Grant to start freshman Obi on the bench, sub him in for Ryan at about the 3-4 minute mark after the game has settled in, and sub Ryan back in for Josh (sliding Obi over to the 5) after a couple more minutes. And Trey is just a beast of a man so I'm going to play him all 40 minutes.

Obi has had a couple of very good games to start the year but 1 barely counts above a rec league game and the other team lacked any real threat to his height and reach. Let's not crown him a starter just yet, but who knows what's going on in practice, maybe he's fully solidified there already.
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Old 11-13-2018, 02:57 PM
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coppin was bad offensively but were actually pretty good playing defense in the half court. Their transition defense was not very good,
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
I don't think it's unreasonable for Grant to start freshman Obi on the bench, sub him in for Ryan at about the 3-4 minute mark after the game has settled in, and sub Ryan back in for Josh (sliding Obi over to the 5) after a couple more minutes. And Trey is just a beast of a man so I'm going to play him all 40 minutes.

Obi has had a couple of very good games to start the year but 1 barely counts above a rec league game and the other team lacked any real threat to his height and reach. Let's not crown him a starter just yet, but who knows what's going on in practice, maybe he's fully solidified there already.
This caveat should apply to everyone on the team. I saw that North Florida beat a DIII team by 50 the other night. I am sure if you looked only at that game, a bunch of their players might have impressed you, yet we know better. I will be really interested to see how good Obi really is, (and Mikesell, and Jordan Davis as a driver, etc...).
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Old 11-14-2018, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Flyers98 View Post
This caveat should apply to everyone on the team. I saw that North Florida beat a DIII team by 50 the other night. I am sure if you looked only at that game, a bunch of their players might have impressed you, yet we know better. I will be really interested to see how good Obi really is, (and Mikesell, and Jordan Davis as a driver, etc...).
While I don't think Obi is a 18 ppg player, I think in a starting role he could settle into a 11 ppg and 6-7 rpg line, which i'd be thrilled with in a redshirt freshman. Why I think he may be a starter is that he has the one thing pretty much no one else on the team does. Size. Tallest active player, and while Mikesell might be the next tallest, his game isn't banging down low. I could see Obi being the 6th man given his youth, but I think there is a better than 50% chance they want that size in there to start the game. Not to mention for the tip off. I expect both Mikesell and Obi to play 20+ minutes a night regardless.
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Old 11-14-2018, 09:35 AM
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Old 11-14-2018, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by TheDuke2003 View Post
While I don't think Obi is a 18 ppg player, I think in a starting role he could settle into a 11 ppg and 6-7 rpg line, which i'd be thrilled with in a redshirt freshman. Why I think he may be a starter is that he has the one thing pretty much no one else on the team does. Size. Tallest active player, and while Mikesell might be the next tallest, his game isn't banging down low. I could see Obi being the 6th man given his youth, but I think there is a better than 50% chance they want that size in there to start the game. Not to mention for the tip off. I expect both Mikesell and Obi to play 20+ minutes a night regardless.
The problem is if Obi starts, who sits. Cunningham, Mikesell, Landers? As I always say, it is about minutes and not who starts. Obi has size, and is long, can jump and has very good hands. Cunningham and Mikesell are not even close. If he keeps progressing, he must play 30-35 minutes, but long way to go.
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Old 11-14-2018, 12:49 PM
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I canít see Obi relegated to non-starter status. Thatís not how you reward your leading scorer. My guess is Cunningham comes off the bench the next couple of games, with Grant playing the ďweíre-taking-it-slow-to-get-him-healthyĒ card. But eventually, you have to think the new energy guy off the bench will be either Landers or Mikesell. Iím guessing Landers, but Iíd probably lean to Mikesell as our sixth. Trey is quicker, better defensively and has the athleticism and muscle to negate Ryanís height advantage. All things considered, itís one of those ďproblemsĒ that is good to have. Itís spelled d-e-p-t-h.
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Old 11-14-2018, 01:40 PM
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I think I'd start Cunningham, Toppin, Landers, JD, Crutcher. See how Cunningham and Toppin play together. Toppin is a good passer, so hopefully they can easily co-exist in the post.

Mikesell does alot of things well, is a glue guy and it may turn out he's gotta start. Either way he's gonna play alot of minutes. But I'd at least try Obi and Josh together as their ceilings as players and a tandem is higher.
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Old 11-14-2018, 02:26 PM
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Landers is not coming off of the bench. He has earned Grant's trust and will be a starter for his duration here unless he does something character wise to change that.
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Old 11-14-2018, 02:29 PM
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Old 11-15-2018, 12:32 AM
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Someone has to be a 6th man. Who is going to slide into that role?

It ain't Cunningham. It ain't Trey. You have two potential league honor winners in the future. Cunningham is preseason first team. He isn't coming off the bench. Trey is in the top 30 in the conference in scoring and 4th in rebounding. I think he gets some defensive honors once the season is over.

You have Obi, top 10 in scoring and 23rd in rebounding. Tied for first in the league in FG%. Mikesell is top 15 in rebounding and scoring.

Start all 4 plus Jalen and bring Davis off the bench. Trey can play the 2 and I would rather have a defensive minded team getting out in transition to start the game than a better three point shooting team. Bring Davis in off of the bench once the perimeter loosens up and ride the hot lineups based on matchups. If you are running a 5 or 4 out, who cares who your 2 is.

Good problem to have.
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Old 11-15-2018, 12:38 AM
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Trey Landers

is not a high percentage shooter. The rest of his game is solid but he cannot shoot the rock anywhere near as well as Mikesell.
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Old 11-15-2018, 04:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Alberto Strasse View Post
is not a high percentage shooter. The rest of his game is solid but he cannot shoot the rock anywhere near as well as Mikesell.
The only things that Trey loses out to in comparison to Mikesell is perimeter shooting and maybe passing.

I think the term "solid" is selling Trey short in terms of his defense, rebounding, athleticism, leadership on the floor, aggression on offense, ability to get out on the break, etc.

Mikesell will get his. He can shoot and is very smart. I would rather see both of them on the floor together versus Davis.

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Old 11-15-2018, 09:18 AM
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Who ever becomes "first off the bench" need only look to Vee Sanford for an example. After starting the previous year, Vee became sixth man as a senior. He was a team player, lead by example and was the man called upon to take the winning shot in the first round game of the NCAA E8 year.
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Old 11-15-2018, 09:22 AM
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Even if Mikesell becomes the sixth man, I think he's playing 25+ minutes a night. That's probably true whomever becomes the sixth man. Off the cuff guess on minutes played (200 total):

Crutcher: 35
Cunningham: 34
Landers: 34
Mikesell: 25
Davis: 25
Toppin: 25
Cohill: 12
Matos: 10

I think Matos loses out on the minutes most if Mikesell continues his stellar play. Mikesell, Davis, Topping, and Cunningham could be +/- 5 minutes on any given night depending on foul trouble, game flow, nagging injury, etc... Crutcher and Landers are going to play a looooooot of minutes this year.
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Old 11-15-2018, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by The Fly View Post
I canít see Obi relegated to non-starter status. Thatís not how you reward your leading scorer. My guess is Cunningham comes off the bench the next couple of games, with Grant playing the ďweíre-taking-it-slow-to-get-him-healthyĒ card. But eventually, you have to think the new energy guy off the bench will be either Landers or Mikesell. Iím guessing Landers, but Iíd probably lean to Mikesell as our sixth. Trey is quicker, better defensively and has the athleticism and muscle to negate Ryanís height advantage. All things considered, itís one of those ďproblemsĒ that is good to have. Itís spelled d-e-p-t-h.
Hard to see how you don't start your Senior Captain preseason All Conference player. He can accomplish the "slow go" by limiting his minutes.
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  #27  
Old 11-15-2018, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by shocka43 View Post
The only things that Trey loses out to in comparison to Mikesell is perimeter shooting and maybe passing.

I think the term "solid" is selling Trey short in terms of his defense, rebounding, athleticism, leadership on the floor, aggression on offense, ability to get out on the break, etc.

Mikesell will get his. He can shoot and is very smart. I would rather see both of them on the floor together versus Davis.
Hmmm. Mikesell played two full seasons with Dayton and shot .333 from 3pt both seasons (30/90). He really has not shown to be a better 3pt shooter than Trey. Maybe this season is the one where Ryan really picks up his game from 3pt, and he is off to a good start.

Landers in his only full season last year shot .352 (19/54).

I could be wrong on this, but I also recall that Ryan started his first season with several red-hot games from 3pt, then cooled off considerably.
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  #28  
Old 11-15-2018, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
Hmmm. Mikesell played two full seasons with Dayton and shot .333 from 3pt both seasons (30/90). He really has not shown to be a better 3pt shooter than Trey. Maybe this season is the one where Ryan really picks up his game from 3pt, and he is off to a good start.

Landers in his only full season last year shot .352 (19/54).

I could be wrong on this, but I also recall that Ryan started his first season with several red-hot games from 3pt, then cooled off considerably.
You may have missed the part where Ryan was playing his 2nd year with 2 bad hips and admitted he couldnít elevate and get into his shots. I think what you are seeing now is where his shot really is, since he appears to have fully recovered.
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Old 11-15-2018, 06:01 PM
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I love Ryan Mikesell, but..

I did not miss that point at all. How could we, it's been newsworthy for 2 years. But if it bothered him that much, why wouldn't he stop shooting from long distance? Facts are facts.

I'm proud of the way he has addressed the hips issue. But a player is hurting the team if he continues to play hurt and chuck threes while in pain.
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