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  #1  
Old 03-02-2017, 02:15 PM
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Dayton to AAC?

https://tmgcollegesports.com/2017/03...upgrade-hoops/

Considering UConn has been quite publicly linked to moving out of the AAC, and this sounds like CUSA waiting to happen, not sure if this would make any sense.

A new AAC with us, Wichita, and VCU would have these teams:

Dayton
VCU
Wichita State
UConn
Memphis
Cincinnati
SMU
Houston
Temple
Tulsa
ECU
South Florida
Central Florida
Tulane

Seems highly unstable to me, kinda like the Great Midwest or the Metro.
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Old 03-02-2017, 02:17 PM
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No thanks.
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  #3  
Old 03-02-2017, 02:30 PM
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Lose these schools:
Tulsa
ECU
South Florida
Central Florida
Tulane
And I'd be interested.
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Old 03-02-2017, 02:39 PM
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Hmm, adding Wichita and VCU with us to that group would make an interesting league with Cincy , UConn, Temple, Houston, Memphis, and SMU. I like where we are, but this is worth a sniff. If they can insulate the basketball from the football thing, this could be interesting.
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  #5  
Old 03-02-2017, 02:42 PM
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Where would UConn go if they left the AAC?
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  #6  
Old 03-02-2017, 02:44 PM
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Rumor is Big East wants them. Of course, they have long been rumored to a P5 conference, but that doesn't seem to be happening. Further rumor seems to be this is an attempt to appease UConn into staying in the American.
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Old 03-02-2017, 02:54 PM
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Of course we should all realize that as the program gains additional notice (i.e. League champs, NCAAt invites, maybe a run or two in the tourney) we can expect some rumors (at least) from a conference looking for new members. A select conference may/will entertain looking at us.

Maybe not the BE since they seem inclined to avoid us ... but other potential conference affiliations can happen.
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  #8  
Old 03-02-2017, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by priceg75 View Post
Rumor is Big East wants them. Of course, they have long been rumored to a P5 conference, but that doesn't seem to be happening. Further rumor seems to be this is an attempt to appease UConn into staying in the American.
I hear there is nothing to this rumor.
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  #9  
Old 03-02-2017, 03:08 PM
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Dayton, VCU, Wichita State, UConn, Memphis, Cincinnati, SMU, Houston, Temple

The top part of the conference is significantly higher profile than the A10. Those would be some awfully good home games at the arena. The bottom of the conference would be no worse than the bottom of the A10.

Sure there is risk that UConn and maybe UC get poached. Even without them, its roughly on par with the A10 (minus Dayton and VCU). If something could be negotiated where we wouldn't be terribly disadvantaged as second class citizens, I'd do it.
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  #10  
Old 03-02-2017, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by priceg75 View Post
https://tmgcollegesports.com/2017/03...upgrade-hoops/

Considering UConn has been quite publicly linked to moving out of the AAC, and this sounds like CUSA waiting to happen, not sure if this would make any sense.

A new AAC with us, Wichita, and VCU would have these teams:

Dayton
VCU
Wichita State
UConn
Memphis
Cincinnati
SMU
Houston
Temple
Tulsa
ECU
South Florida
Central Florida
Tulane

Seems highly unstable to me, kinda like the Great Midwest or the Metro.
BEOB

Big East or bust
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  #11  
Old 03-02-2017, 03:12 PM
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BREAKING NEWS:
The grass on the other side of the fence is no greener than the grass on this side!
Winning is all that really matters
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  #12  
Old 03-02-2017, 03:27 PM
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Does playing the Cinncinnatis, U conns, memphis, SMU, and Temples of the world instead of the Fordhams, Dusquesne, and GW's increase our chances of Archie staying here longer?

I would even go so far as to say add St. Louis to the list of teams we want to be in a conference with, as I believe they are on the right track, and bring good facilities and a good TV market to the table.
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  #13  
Old 03-02-2017, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan View Post
Does playing the Cinncinnatis, U conns, memphis, SMU, and Temples of the world instead of the Fordhams, Dusquesne, and GW's increase our chances of Archie staying here longer?

I would even go so far as to say add St. Louis to the list of teams we want to be in a conference with, as I believe they are on the right track, and bring good facilities and a good TV market to the table.
That's a great question to ask. I want Dayton be wherever Archie wants to be Dayton's head coach.
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  #14  
Old 03-02-2017, 03:38 PM
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If VCU and another good A-10 team or two left we would almost have to go. Wouldn't be much left in the A-10. Kind of like when we were worried what would happen if VCU and St Louis went to the BE. The only thing that would bother me is football. We saw how screwed up the Big East was with a mix of football and basketball-only schools.
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  #15  
Old 03-02-2017, 04:19 PM
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A bunch of large public football schools help UD how?? I think this is a terrible idea. And screw Cincinnati and Memphis, they abandoned us once already in the mid 90s.

Last edited by UD94; 03-02-2017 at 04:29 PM..
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  #16  
Old 03-02-2017, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by UD94 View Post
A bunch of large public football schools help UD how?? I think this is a terrible idea. And screw Cincinnati and Memphis, they abandoned us once already in the mid 90s.
Can you blame them?
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  #17  
Old 03-02-2017, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by TerryK_67 View Post
BREAKING NEWS:
The grass on the other side of the fence is no greener than the grass on this side!
Winning is all that really matters
True, but I'd rather be in a conference where a 16-2 record and league titles gets us something better than a potential 8 seed
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Old 03-02-2017, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
True, but I'd rather be in a conference where a 16-2 record and league titles gets us something better than a potential 8 seed
Usually it would in the A10, but no teams did very well in the OOC. We certainly missed a few opportunities for quality wins ourselves. I think URI has the best victory with a win over Cincy... an AAC team.

A10 is not a good league this year. Too many opportunities to fall without a lot of opportunities to rise to offset those (see URI). I think the team in the AAC are in the same situation this year. Two teams that rise up and a bubble team. Some cherry picking to make a stronger conference should not be off the table.

The AAC is really scattered though, it would be wise to split it into some geographic regions somehow to improve travel if they expanded.
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Old 03-02-2017, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by NorthwestFlyer View Post
Can you blame them?
You know, when you stop to think about your question, No I do not blame them. We sucked
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  #20  
Old 03-02-2017, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan View Post
You know, when you stop to think about your question, No I do not blame them. We sucked
"Sucked" if you're being polite...
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  #21  
Old 03-02-2017, 05:58 PM
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And one other thing...

Originally Posted by longtimefan View Post
If VCU and another good A-10 team or two left we would almost have to go. Wouldn't be much left in the A-10. Kind of like when we were worried what would happen if VCU and St Louis went to the BE. The only thing that would bother me is football. We saw how screwed up the Big East was with a mix of football and basketball-only schools.
The schools that make the AAC appear attractive, UC, UConn et al, want out of the AAC so badly it's indescribable.....and will jump if hey ever get a chance.
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Old 03-02-2017, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
True, but I'd rather be in a conference where a 16-2 record and league titles gets us something better than a potential 8 seed
Agree 100%.

First a disclaimer. EVERYONE loves the Flyers here. And EVERYONE wants them to win. So leave the "just win" BS at the door. We all want them to win. What we need to figure out is how to win MORE in March.

Winning the NCAA tournament is the ultimate goal. Hell, Final Four is a great start to that.
We get there by getting good seeding.
We get that by either running the table like Gonzaga, or by losing a handful in a great conference.
Outright conference titles are nice, but who won the outright title in the Mountain West last year? I am sure they are proud. But I would much rather be 2017 Butler than 2016 San Diego State

SDSU incidentally won the Mountain West regular season at 23-8 only to lose to Fresno State in the conference final. Hello NIT.

Everyone here scratches their head as to why we are an 8 seed, and look how bad these other teams are. Common denominator on 95% of these teams? They are in a better conference.

Winning is nice. But the tournament is better. Butler isnt winning the Big East. But they are a three seed and that is better than winning the A10 and getting an 8. How we advance is by getting good seeds. By being in a better conference. And keeping AM.
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  #23  
Old 03-02-2017, 07:31 PM
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FYI...Leave the A10 now and forfeit approx $10 million from NCAA Units. Butler and X left almost $20 behind. Stay and dominate.
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Old 03-02-2017, 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
The schools that make the AAC appear attractive, UC, UConn et al, want out of the AAC so badly it's indescribable.....and will jump if hey ever get a chance.
Yeah, I've got mixed feelings. I'd love to join the NBE. But everything else seems like a big risk, including staying in the A10 and having a VCU leave on us. I'm thinking maybe there will be some more reshuffling of the other conferences and then maybe our proper place will be more obvious. I like the idea of this rivalry with VCU becoming bigger and having us joined at the hip where we could both go to another conference together. I don't think they'd be as big of jerks about it that Xavier is.
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Old 03-02-2017, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by PalmBeachFlyer View Post
FYI...Leave the A10 now and forfeit approx $10 million from NCAA Units. Butler and X left almost $20 behind. Stay and dominate.
Got news for you. The only way we leave for greener pastures is to leave when we're a hot commodity. Leaving money on the table will just have to be a negative that we'll have to accept. If we wait until we don't have all that NCAA money coming, we could find ourselves back to being left out like when we remained independent.
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Old 03-02-2017, 07:53 PM
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Unless we're going to the NBE, we shouldn't go anywhere. Richmond,St. Bonnie and Joe's, GW and Rhode are great rivalries
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Old 03-02-2017, 07:57 PM
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If it is a money choice, then the AAC seems like a better chance. In 2016 the basketball fund paid the A10 $11.7 million, the AAC received $24.5 million, but the gap seems to be closing as the AAC and A10 are both actually on a downward trend and the AAC is still receiving the Big E revenues. But there seems to be a better chance at more $$ in the AAC from the basketball fund (I assume eventually that will equate to $.50 beers at the games so it matters). On top of that, I believe they have a contract with ESPN, so most of those games show up on a more common channel, so one would expect more TV revenues. Cash doesn't seem like a good reason for the A10, although I believe the A10 does have one of the best sharing programs with teams that earned the credits, and the conference is making efforts to increase TV revenues, etc.

In the scenario mentioned above, I like the pier teams way better in an expanded AAC (UD, WSU, and VCU), but only if Cincy, UConn, and Memphis are staying. It is the instability of the conference, followed by the broad geography and football affiliation that gives me pause.
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Old 03-02-2017, 08:18 PM
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Generally I hate the idea of UD being a red-headed stepchild in a football conference, especially one that all the good schools want out of.

There is a scenario where I'd possibly support it:


American Basketball Conference (ABC)

UConn
Cincinnati
Dayton
VCU
UMass
Temple
URI
Memphis
Saint Louis

American Football Conference (AFC) ( yes, I know that name is taken)

SMU
Houston
Tulsa
ECU
South Florida
Central Florida
Tulane

Non-football:
Wichita State
TBD

Football-only affiliate members:
UConn
Cincinnati
Temple
Memphis
Navy

2 conferences of 9 teams each, 16 game double round robin. Play 2 or 4 or 6 from the other conference per year in a scheduling arrangement setup. 7 non- football members give them some power. UMass gets a scheduling arrangement in football to help them out. Wichita possibly has a football home if they ever go FBS.

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Old 03-02-2017, 08:33 PM
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i heard Cincinnati is already pushing to have us kept from any future conference plans as show of Queen City solidarity.
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Old 03-02-2017, 08:34 PM
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Wichita St seems pretty interested in getting out of the Missouri Valley. I wonder if they'd have interest in the A10 or vice versa
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Old 03-02-2017, 08:53 PM
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I know there are a lot of big-east-or-busters out there. Ya'll are nuts if you don't think UD would do this. The AAC plus a few choice selections would be a far better conference than a depleted A10.
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Old 03-02-2017, 10:47 PM
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For the record I'm not a big fan of UD moving to the BE but those that want it to happen should be doing their level best to make a move to the AAC appear imminent. This is the kind of catalyst needed to compel the BE to act.

With that said, I love the situation we have in the A10 and I'm in no hurry for us to move anywhere.
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Old 03-02-2017, 11:42 PM
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All of this conference shuffling is a big pain to have to think about. Maybe just try to add Wichita to the A10, they do not have football of any type. I do not trust Cincy and UConn.

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Old 03-03-2017, 12:38 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
All of this conference shuffling is a big pain to have to think about. Maybe just try to add Wichita to the A10, they do not have football of any type. I do not trust Cincy and UConn.
http://csnbbs.com/thread-810867.html


Other than 1 guy, UC fans have been our biggest supporters on the AAC message board. Many have spoken VERY highly of us and defended us in their debate.
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Old 03-03-2017, 07:11 AM
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UD just needs to do what is best for UD. Whatever decisions made need to come with stability, not just the feel good in the loins because we are in a conference with some bigger names.

Right now, there is stability in the A10 and we have been pretty successful as of late. Granted, I think we get hit from a seeding standpoint in the tournament, but no one did anything OOC...so I think we are where we should be.

If the trend of being at the top of the A10 when it counts, continues, then good things will eventually happen. We all know that UD missed the BE boat. We missed it because we were treading water for a certain period of time.
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Old 03-03-2017, 08:11 AM
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Stay in the A-10. Basketball is cyclical. There are teams in our league that are very young and have up and coming stars. I think like SLU, SJU and SBU. URI. Richmond and Davidson always have competitive programs. We are losing four senior starters (I include KD even if he did not start all the time) - SS, KD, KP and CC. Things can change very fast.
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Old 03-03-2017, 08:26 AM
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I don't see any move whose future is brighter(maybe the NBE). As said above, stay in the A10.
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Old 03-03-2017, 09:05 AM
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Dayton is not moving to the AAC, almost zero chance.
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Old 03-03-2017, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by ruechalgrin View Post
Dayton is not moving to the AAC, almost zero chance.
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Agree. All of the top teams would move if a better conference would have them. I like bringing the SHOCKERS into the A10. It matches Ted Kissel's expansion strategy: Bring in a team that brings in a bid.
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Old 03-03-2017, 11:09 AM
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I suppose if some of the AAC teams want us to consider us for the AAC, it may be time to get us on a home and home. Same could be said for Wichita State, it looks like they need us more that we need them for the strength of schedule thing.
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Old 03-03-2017, 03:39 PM
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What does everyone think of being in an AAC with no UC, no UConn, no Memphis, no SMU, no Houston?

Because those five will jump ship as soon as the ACC, SEC or Big12 come knocking.
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Old 03-03-2017, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by UDDoug View Post
What does everyone think of being in an AAC with no UC, no UConn, no Memphis, no SMU, no Houston?

Because those five will jump ship as soon as the ACC, SEC or Big12 come knocking.
This would give us the opportunity to do something similar to what some on here have suggested, get a bunch of good "mid-majors" and start a new conference. If we were in the AAC with VCU and Wichita State, that would be a great start. We could perhaps replace the teams you mentioned with several of the best teams from the A-10 and/or MVC (or elsewhere). I would think a conference with Dayton, VCU, and Wichita State would be very attractive to some very good "mid-majors." We could end up with a very good conference without the A-10 bottom dwellers, something we all would like. (I realize the remaining AAC football schools could throw a wrench into this scenario. Or they could form their own conference with some Conference USA schools.)

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Old 03-03-2017, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by UDDoug View Post
What does everyone think of being in an AAC with no UC, no UConn, no Memphis, no SMU, no Houston?

Because those five will jump ship as soon as the ACC, SEC or Big12 come knocking.
I do not think the ACC or SEC is going to pluck schools from the AAC. The only hope for those schools is the Big12 and that is if the Big12 isn't raided by the SEC, ACC, and BIG10. The Big12 just signed a new TV deal and I do not believe will be looking to expand anytime soon.
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Old 03-03-2017, 04:59 PM
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It's complicated....

Originally Posted by m21eagle45 View Post
I do not think the ACC or SEC is going to pluck schools from the AAC. The only hope for those schools is the Big12 and that is if the Big12 isn't raided by the SEC, ACC, and BIG10. The Big12 just signed a new TV deal and I do not believe will be looking to expand anytime soon.
A few thoughts:

1. It's complicated.

2. There's a lot more to it than athletics. The Big 10 didn't go after Rutgers and Maryland because of their athletics programs.

3. It's very complicated.

4. The Big 12 (with 10 schools) could expand to the East by adding four AAC schools....a move having a motivation similar to the Big 10s. But, there's a catch. Texas and Oklahoma call the shots in the Big 12...and those two schools know that the Big 10, SEC and ACC would jump at the chance to add either one. The other 8 Big 12 schools understand that. So, as long as UT and OU are content the Big 12 will remain as is.

5. It's really very, very complicated.

6. Recall, there was a time when UD thought it was a great idea to join the Great Midwest conference...the beginning of an embarrassing disaster for us.
It took a long time and much pain to recover from the GMW debacle....and we own the A10 plenty for applying the life support treatment needed at the time.

7. A10 schools like SLU, URI, SJU and a few others really want to have very good men's BB programs and are investing accordingly. They will have good teams. A few others, well known to all, are not investing sufficiently. I think the best chance for UD is to act like the conference leader....teaming with a few other like-minded schools to pressure the laggards to shape up. UD jumping ship would be a dreadful loss for the A10. That being the case, UD with the support of a few others would seem to have leverage....leverage to move the conference in a direction beneficial to UD.

I have no idea what Neil is doing along those lines...perhaps Chris does. Also, it's unlikely that any of us really appreciate the inner dynamics/politics that accompany conference membership....nor do we appreciate the role of the commissioner.

My bottom line is that UD's best position remains in a strengthened A10. There are good schools in the A10 with solid athletics programs. Understandably, some years are better than others. I don't understand why a conference has to live with members that refuse to invest at a level required to have a top-tier program, e.g., FU, LU to name just two. Is having a member in NYC so important that FU can do/or not do what ever it wants? I'd be very interested if Chris would discuss issues like this with Neil. I'm sure there is much we don't understand.

Just opinions...uninformed opinions at that. (Did I mention I think it's complicated?)
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Old 03-03-2017, 05:55 PM
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If UConn, Memphis rebound & VCU, Wichita St join with the AAC has a much better potential than the A10. I would think recruiting would pick up squaring off against UConn, UC, Memphis, Wichita, etc & too 50 wins would be more plentiful. Peak potential this could be a very good conference. ECU, Tulane are there but a much stronger too & middle

Who knows what the future holds with expansion but the Big12 wanted to expand & didn't because no program was worth it in the AAC

Improving the A10 is nice but we can't make UMass fire Kellogg or ensure they hire a good coach. Duquesne on paper hired a guy in Ferry who turned a program around & went to the tourney. Not sure what anyone in the A10 can do to fix programs like those

The A10 shackles us with Duquesne H/H in conference, waited till this year to have us play VCU H/H & had us playing Fordham H/H in 14-15 when we almost got left out of the tourney

It'd be nice to have the chance to play UC to get another top 50 win versus avoid a bad loss late in conference play
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Old 03-03-2017, 07:10 PM
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The Big East lesson...

Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
If UConn, Memphis rebound & VCU, Wichita St join with the AAC has a much better potential than the A10. I would think recruiting would pick up squaring off against UConn, UC, Memphis, Wichita, etc & too 50 wins would be more plentiful. Peak potential this could be a very good conference. ECU, Tulane are there but a much stronger too & middle

Who knows what the future holds with expansion but the Big12 wanted to expand & didn't because no program was worth it in the AAC

Improving the A10 is nice but we can't make UMass fire Kellogg or ensure they hire a good coach. Duquesne on paper hired a guy in Ferry who turned a program around & went to the tourney. Not sure what anyone in the A10 can do to fix programs like those

The A10 shackles us with Duquesne H/H in conference, waited till this year to have us play VCU H/H & had us playing Fordham H/H in 14-15 when we almost got left out of the tourney

It'd be nice to have the chance to play UC to get another top 50 win versus avoid a bad loss late in conference play
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The incompatibility of big-time FB with BB-only schools is what killed the Big East. The hybrid old BE model proved to be not viable. Why would anyone want to get within a mile of that again?

A week ago I attended a large meeting re UConn FB hosted by the AD and featuring UConn's new/old FB coach, Randy Edsell. The investment in FBS FB is enormous.....can't be understood, really, starting from a Dayton-style BB centric point of view. Absolutely, positively, UD has got to stay away from any involvement with FBS FB schools. It can kill you! Their fundamental interests are entirely different from ours.
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Old 03-03-2017, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
The incompatibility of big-time FB with BB-only schools is what killed the Big East. The hybrid old BE model proved to be not viable. Why would anyone want to get within a mile of that again?

A week ago I attended a large meeting re UConn FB hosted by the AD and featuring UConn's new/old FB coach, Randy Edsell. The investment in FBS FB is enormous.....can't be understood, really, starting from a Dayton-style BB centric point of view. Absolutely, positively, UD has got to stay away from any involvement with FBS FB schools. It can kill you! Their fundamental interests are entirely different from ours.
I think the difference this time is that's there would be 1-3 basketball schools vs 7 & the basketball schools would be the ones joining understanding the arrangement. The C7 were unhappy with basketball dead weight being added with ECU, Tulane, etc. the dynamic then & now would be different. They were unhappy with the direction of the conference whereas if we joined it'd be because we wanted to be a part of it.

Their interests are different but that wouldn't preclude a mutually beneficial relationship.

We've got one one FBS school in UMass & has Temple & the A10 found a way to make those relationships work.

If UMass leaves for a football league, VCU joins this league or the BE expands again & we get left out the University needs to be proactive so the Flyers aren't stuck in a situation like Wichita
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Old 03-03-2017, 08:08 PM
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Sorry...

Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
I think the difference this time is that's there would be 1-3 basketball schools vs 7 & the basketball schools would be the ones joining understanding the arrangement. The C7 were unhappy with basketball dead weight being added with ECU, Tulane, etc. the dynamic then & now would be different. They were unhappy with the direction of the conference whereas if we joined it'd be because we wanted to be a part of it.

Their interests are different but that wouldn't preclude a mutually beneficial relationship.

We've got one one FBS school in UMass & has Temple & the A10 found a way to make those relationships work.

If UMass leaves for a football league, VCU joins this league or the BE expands again & we get left out the University needs to be proactive so the Flyers aren't stuck in a situation like Wichita
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A single FB school in a BB conference like the UMass and Temple examples worked. But a conference with roughly equal number of FB and BB-only schools is what did not work for the old BE. That lesson has been learned.
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  #49  
Old 03-03-2017, 08:29 PM
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Originally Posted by UDDoug View Post
What does everyone think of being in an AAC with no UC, no UConn, no Memphis, no SMU, no Houston?

Because those five will jump ship as soon as the ACC, SEC or Big12 come knocking.
I think it sucks. At least, with the A-10, we have some degree of commonality (Catholicism) with many of the members, and they're in markets (Philly, NYC, Pittsburgh) that have historically had major connections to UD. 2 lower-tier Florida schools, a lower-tier Louisiana school, a lower-tier Carolina school, and a competitive but not outstanding Oklahoma school is what you're left with after UC, Memphis, UConn, Houston, et al leave for a conference that offers football. In the immortal words of Cosmo Kramer, "I'm out!"
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Old 03-03-2017, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
A single FB school in a BB conference like the UMass and Temple examples worked. But a conference with roughly equal number of FB and BB-only schools is what did not work for the old BE. That lesson has been learned.
But how did that turn out for the basketball-only schools? Pretty darn well!
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Old 03-03-2017, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
The incompatibility of big-time FB with BB-only schools is what killed the Big East. The hybrid old BE model proved to be not viable. Why would anyone want to get within a mile of that again?

A week ago I attended a large meeting re UConn FB hosted by the AD and featuring UConn's new/old FB coach, Randy Edsell. The investment in FBS FB is enormous.....can't be understood, really, starting from a Dayton-style BB centric point of view. Absolutely, positively, UD has got to stay away from any involvement with FBS FB schools. It can kill you! Their fundamental interests are entirely different from ours.
Agreed. Sounds like the AAC wants to be the new, old Big East v2.0 with the hybrid model. Only with less prestige and worse geography. No way this thing lasts as UConn and Cincy will jump at the first opportunity and we'll be left holding the bag. We're best sticking it out in the A10 and looking to work to make the league better while waiting for the call from the Big East (which may or may not ever come, but that's the only jump we should make).
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Old 03-03-2017, 10:03 PM
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http://www.cbssports.com/college-bas...ic-conference/

CBS Sports has since learned that while the issue hasn’t reached the presidential level in the American, there are discussions at least at the AD level.
Wichita State is being evaluated as an upgrade for the 11-team basketball league. There is no decision among concerned parties as yet. There is no timeline on the next move, never mind a date of the school’s entry.
That same source said VCU and Dayton were not in the mix.
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Old 03-03-2017, 11:15 PM
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That's true...

Originally Posted by longtimefan View Post
But how did that turn out for the basketball-only schools? Pretty darn well!
It did turn out well. But luck had a little to do with it. The reigning national champ, VU, dodged not a bullet but a cannon ball. VU trustees had approved spending tens of millions for the Cats to step up to FBS FB in the old BE. Fortunately, before a dollar had been spent the league collapsed. I'll bet there are people at VU who thank God every day for saving them from that one.

If Fox makes enough money to justify continuation of the TV contract the new BE started with things will have turned out mighty well for the BB schools of the old BE. For at least some of the FB schools....not so much.
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Old 03-04-2017, 08:17 AM
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The American and A10 have been ranked about the same in the RPI year in and year out, so there would be nothing to gain in the conference unless VCU and Wichita both jump.
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Old 03-04-2017, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
A few thoughts:

. Is having a member in NYC so important that FU can do/or not do what ever it wants?

Just opinions...uninformed opinions at that. (Did I mention I think it's complicated?)
Do we get Schoochie out of the Bronx without Fordham in the conference?

Maybe. But it's complicated.
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Old 03-04-2017, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by NorthwestFlyer View Post
I suppose if some of the AAC teams want us to consider us for the AAC, it may be time to get us on a home and home. Same could be said for Wichita State, it looks like they need us more that we need them for the strength of schedule thing.
Cincy, Witchita St, Uconn, and SMU have all recently been uninterested in home and home series.
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Old 03-04-2017, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by ruechalgrin View Post
Cincy, Witchita St, Uconn, and SMU have all recently been uninterested in home and home series.

Wichita State is funny. They go to the Final Four once and now they think they're too good to play Dayton. Problem is, they are always on the Bubble due to their atrocious SOS. Heck, even a loss to Dayton would have helped their SOS and RPI the past few seasons. LOL
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Old 03-04-2017, 03:32 PM
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Keep trying

Originally Posted by ruechalgrin View Post
Cincy, Witchita St, Uconn, and SMU have all recently been uninterested in home and home series.
The State of CT is in such dire financial straights that I think if we suggested one game at the Arena....a buy game,....UConn would accept.

Only kidding. But for many years we couldn't get the UConn women...and now we have a three game series. UConn men could use the RPI boost....Calhoun is gone....there is a new AD in place and a relatively new coach. Keep after them....why not a three game deal like the women? The UConn men played in Columbus this year...why not Dayton?
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Old 03-04-2017, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by AQUDXU View Post
Do we get Schoochie out of the Bronx without Fordham in the conference?

Maybe. But it's complicated.
Good call. If Scoochie has any little brothers, they can stay.
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Old 03-08-2017, 08:17 AM
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Old 03-08-2017, 09:11 AM
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OSU Flyer, can you repost what you said? For some strange reason, it did not get posted.
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Old 03-08-2017, 09:22 AM
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Should Dayton end up in the AAC we could then fill our non con schedule with top teams from the A-10 and Fordham for our alum base out there. Guess we'd have to include Duquesne too for our alums. So essentially we'd keep many of the top tier teams from the A-10 for our non con.

I don't get a warm feeling about the AAC but guess we could forge some good rivalries, Cincy already built in.
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Old 03-08-2017, 09:42 AM
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Cincinnati will conference hop within 5 years, same with UConn, and Houston.
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Old 03-08-2017, 09:47 AM
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Why are we even having this conversation? UD to the AAC is as likely as Duke to the A10.
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Old 03-08-2017, 09:56 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Why are we even having this conversation? UD to the AAC is as likely as Duke to the A10.
I can't find the article where I read it, but the AAC commish yesterday said they were not adding non-football members. So that puts an end to that.
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Old 03-08-2017, 10:03 AM
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Originally Posted by m21eagle45 View Post
I can't find the article where I read it, but the AAC commish yesterday said they were not adding non-football members. So that puts an end to that.
Find that article and let's close this thread!
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Old 03-08-2017, 10:08 AM
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I think it makes more sense for UD to skip over the AAC and go straight to the NBA. We couldn't be any worse than the Lakers or Nets.

Should I start a new thread?
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Old 03-08-2017, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by m21eagle45 View Post
I can't find the article where I read it, but the AAC commish yesterday said they were not adding non-football members. So that puts an end to that.
The ACC said the same thing before adding Notre Dame. I am not going to guarantee that it is going to happen but the memo is deny, deny, deny until it is official. I would not be surprised if Wichita State is added before the Summer ends.
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Old 03-08-2017, 10:19 AM
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Wow, I just read Duke is joining the A-10. It was on the internet, so it has to be true.
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Old 03-08-2017, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan View Post
Wow, I just read Duke is joining the A-10. It was on the internet, so it has to be true.

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Old 03-08-2017, 10:55 AM
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"we're not under any circumstances going back to big east model having basketball only schools" @American_Conf comish Aresco on expansion


Mike Aresco the AAC commish was was SiriusXM's College Sports channel when the host asked him about rumors of Wichita, VCU, Dayton


I heard him and seemed pretty sincere and said they didn't want to revisit the problems the Big East had


Maybe this an opening to get Wichita into the A10?
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Old 03-08-2017, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post

Maybe this an opening to get Wichita into the A10?
Pretty please? Even if we just go to 15 that's fine. Play everyone once and two teams twice, four teams twice, or 6 teams twice, depending on how many games you desire.
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Old 03-08-2017, 11:32 AM
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Wich St has delusions of football. They're not a good fit geographically either.
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Old 03-08-2017, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Whacker View Post
Wich St has delusions of football. They're not a good fit geographically either.
One of the articles posted here said the football push at WSU has waned quite a bit lately.
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Old 03-08-2017, 11:44 AM
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Notre Dame is not your typical non football member. Plus they play 5 or 6 ACC football games every year.
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  #76  
Old 03-08-2017, 11:53 AM
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Reading posts from fans on their site and others, there is a fair bit of love for the A-10. Some see it as a step up, some not so much,but if the football proponents at WSU are losing steam, and the AAC sticks to it's word of no BB only schools, the A-10 is a possibility, far from a sure thing, but not out of the conversation either.
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Old 03-08-2017, 01:01 PM
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Wichita, KS is 440 miles from St. Louis and almost 800 miles to Dayton. To UMass?

These are not battalions on a Risk board. The impact to STUDENT athletes would be immeasurable for Wichita players at all levels. Rick Majerus complained about this when St. Louis joined the A10. Where/when does the madness stop?
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Old 03-08-2017, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by springborofan View Post
Wichita, KS is 440 miles from St. Louis and almost 800 miles to Dayton. To UMass?

These are not battalions on a Risk board. The impact to STUDENT athletes would be immeasurable for Wichita players at all levels. Rick Majerus complained about this when St. Louis joined the A10. Where/when does the madness stop?
Wichita to UConn?
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Old 03-09-2017, 03:51 PM
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Looks like there may soon be a UD connection in the AAC.

http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/bulls/...ps-job/2315763
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Old 03-10-2017, 11:25 AM
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I can think of a few A10 teams I'd trade for WS...
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Old 03-12-2017, 04:14 PM
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Nothing screams "big time" like a half-full arena in Hartford for a conference tournament title game.
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Old 03-12-2017, 04:20 PM
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No desire to be in a temporary conference until the next football realignment. Also - the geographic footprint is terrible. Houston -> Orlando -> Hartford -> Dallas -> Memphis -> Carolina. Travel not easy.
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Old 03-12-2017, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by UD90 View Post
No desire to be in a temporary conference until the next football realignment. Also - the geographic footprint is terrible. Houston -> Orlando -> Hartford -> Dallas -> Memphis -> Carolina. Travel not easy.
Those places are probably easier to get to than Olean...
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Old 03-12-2017, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by DallasFlyer View Post
Those places are probably easier to get to than Olean...
Good point. Don't get me wrong - I love a few of those places (especially Dallas) 2 hour direct flight. It's just spread out and focused on the next football realignment.
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Old 03-12-2017, 07:24 PM
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Lots of disadvantages, but, if Wichita State and VCU went (which apparently won't happen), it would be worth looking into.
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Old 03-23-2017, 01:32 PM
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Interesting article on Wichita St to the AAC. Conference is considering it and will vote on it in the near future.

They are not looking at any schools other than Wichita St.

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/s...state-shockers
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Old 03-23-2017, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by MNFats View Post
Interesting article on Wichita St to the AAC. Conference is considering it and will vote on it in the near future.

They are not looking at any schools other than Wichita St.

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/s...state-shockers
I have been reading a lot about this on the Wichita State board. It surprises me that the Shockers are so interested. I know they want out of the MVC, but the AAC seems like a poor fit. The AAC goes from Connecticut, to Florida, to Texas - and points in between. All the other AAC members have football. If they ever get the chance, both UConn and UC would jump to get out of the AAC. Seems like the A-10 would be a much better fit.
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Old 03-23-2017, 04:31 PM
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They would be an extreme outlier in the A10 - SLU isn't really all that close (400 miles) and St louis is a pretty good distance from everyone else. I'll assume the charter everything in basketball, so no bid deal, but it would affect all their other programs. In the AAC, they're relatively close to the texas schools, Tulsa isn't too far away either. The conference may be spread out further, but overall travel is probably less for them in the AAC, so that makes sense.

Plus, if they keep their current status and the AAC fails for football reasons to keep some of the top schools, I'm sure the A10 would still welcome them.
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Old 03-23-2017, 05:20 PM
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If Wichita is leaving the Valley for another conference, I don't think the distance is that big of a deal either way.

Wichita to the A-10...

Amherst MA: 1,555 miles
Philadelphia PA: 1,318 miles
Richmond VA: 1,261 miles
Pittsburgh PA: 1,034 miles
Dayton OH: 791 miles
St Louis MO: 441 miles

Wichita to the AAC...

Storrs CT: 1,537 miles
Philadelphia PA: 1,318 miles
Greenville NC: 1,346 miles
Orlando FL: 1,399 miles
New Orleans LA: 866 miles
Memphis TN: 576 miles
Tulsa OK: 175 miles

Consider the WCC.

Spokane-San Diego: 1,375 miles
Portland-LA: 965 miles
Provo-San Jose: 810 miles

If Wichita State jumps, it's going to be for the perception they are upgrading their basketball prospects. Distance to league schools is far down the ladder of priorities.
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Old 03-23-2017, 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Viperstick View Post
If Wichita is leaving the Valley for another conference, I don't think the distance is that big of a deal either way.

Wichita to the A-10...

Amherst MA: 1,555 miles
Philadelphia PA: 1,318 miles
Richmond VA: 1,261 miles
Pittsburgh PA: 1,034 miles
Dayton OH: 791 miles
St Louis MO: 441 miles

Wichita to the AAC...

Storrs CT: 1,537 miles
Philadelphia PA: 1,318 miles
Greenville NC: 1,346 miles
Orlando FL: 1,399 miles
New Orleans LA: 866 miles
Memphis TN: 576 miles
Tulsa OK: 175 miles

Consider the WCC.

Spokane-San Diego: 1,375 miles
Portland-LA: 965 miles
Provo-San Jose: 810 miles

If Wichita State jumps, it's going to be for the perception they are upgrading their basketball prospects. Distance to league schools is far down the ladder of priorities.
Especially if you are flying by charter. We are talking a few minutes difference. Now for the lesser sports, it is all about plane connections and number of flights.
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Old 03-24-2017, 09:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Viperstick View Post
If Wichita is leaving the Valley for another conference, I don't think the distance is that big of a deal either way.

Wichita to the A-10...

Amherst MA: 1,555 miles
Philadelphia PA: 1,318 miles
Richmond VA: 1,261 miles
Pittsburgh PA: 1,034 miles
Dayton OH: 791 miles
St Louis MO: 441 miles

Wichita to the AAC...

Storrs CT: 1,537 miles
Philadelphia PA: 1,318 miles
Greenville NC: 1,346 miles
Orlando FL: 1,399 miles
New Orleans LA: 866 miles
Memphis TN: 576 miles
Tulsa OK: 175 miles

Consider the WCC.

Spokane-San Diego: 1,375 miles
Portland-LA: 965 miles
Provo-San Jose: 810 miles

If Wichita State jumps, it's going to be for the perception they are upgrading their basketball prospects. Distance to league schools is far down the ladder of priorities.
This has nothing to do with distance to the schools this is about exposure and perception. Although these MVC has some solid history in the Bball you play in cities like

Terre Haute, IN
Cedar Falls IA
Springfield MO
Evansville IN
Peoria IL

Compare that to the AAC or A10 and the difference is huge. I think WSu has aspirations bigger than the Valley. Is there risk joining in AAU yes but there's also risk staying in the Valley
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Old 03-24-2017, 09:36 AM
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It seems pretty clear to me that the A10 brass wants no part of Wichita State or any other Midwestern school for expansion. After the Butler and Xavier defections there was ample opportunity to add them but the conference instead took Eastern choices that don't hold a candle to Wichita State in any category. Location at this point seems to be more important than adding the best basketball programs. There is no reason whatsoever why the A10 couldn't add WSU and UNI right now. We played at 16 before. I'd prefer that schedule anyway.
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Old 03-24-2017, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by hawkoooo View Post
It seems pretty clear to me that the A10 brass wants no part of Wichita State or any other Midwestern school for expansion. After the Butler and Xavier defections there was ample opportunity to add them but the conference instead took Eastern choices that don't hold a candle to Wichita State in any category. Location at this point seems to be more important than adding the best basketball programs. There is no reason whatsoever why the A10 couldn't add WSU and UNI right now. We played at 16 before. I'd prefer that schedule anyway.
If that true, its a shame. I'd assume it would stem from the A10 thinking Dayton might leave and the A10 doesn't want to be stuck with an outlier out west.

Seems like a self fulfilling prophecy going on. A10 won't add the best available teams because it thinks Dayton and maybe SLU might leave. The desire for Dayton to leave increases because A10 won't add the best available teams...
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Old 03-24-2017, 10:24 AM
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The A10's media deal is pitiful. Essentially, they get about half the money per school as what teams in the Missouri Valley currently make. I know the schools in the MVC were getting just under $700k a year prior to the new deal they signed in 2015. I'm assuming they make at least as much per school as they were making before, if not more, and they're also getting more exposure.

The fourteen A10 schools share $500k per year, and the exposure of the league is rather ridiculous given how good a lot of teams in the league typically are, and given the markets that the league is in. One of my biggest frustrations with the A10 back when Xavier was in the conference was its TV deal. Or, lack thereof.

By going to the AAC, Wichita State will likely be making at least three times the money that the entire Atlantic Ten conference makes put together off of the TV deal. And, they'll get more exposure. For that reason alone UD should STRONGLY consider a move to the AAC if it presents itself, which it might.
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Old 03-24-2017, 10:27 AM
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BTW xubrew, congrats on the win last night and into the E-8.

(I think I just threw up a little bit)
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:34 AM
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Thinking only about men's BB....

Mixing of FB and BB schools has been proven to be a mistake...a big one. Think old Big East. The interests of FBS FB schools and non-FB schools are fundamentally different. That creates a serious problem.

To be successful the interests of conference members should be fundamentally similar. This is not a hard concept to grasp.

I cannot understand why a school like WSU would even consider FB...knowing in advance the bottomless money pit that FBS FB is. Quite a few schools in Power 5 conferences are losing their shirts on FBS FB....but as legacy members they are trapped....can't get out because of the impact on all other athletics programs.

The A10 is a very good fit for UD. What the conference needs is a BB upgrade by way of a new school or two, pressure on laggard members and a much better TV deal. Of course, the latter comes from elevating BB.

Our AD is no dummy and BB is uniquely important to UD. That being the case I suppose there is much we don't know/understand about the A10 specifically and conference affiliation generally. Chris is well connected with UD and Neil; I'm sure he has or can get better insight re this matter.
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
Mixing of FB and BB schools has been proven to be a mistake...a big one. Think old Big East. The interests of FBS FB schools and non-FB schools are fundamentally different. That creates a serious problem.

To be successful the interests of conference members should be fundamentally similar. This is not a hard concept to grasp.

I cannot understand why a school like WSU would even consider FB...knowing in advance the bottomless money pit that FBS FB is. Quite a few schools in Power 5 conferences are losing their shirts on FBS FB....but as legacy members they are trapped....can't get out because of the impact on all other athletics programs.

The A10 is a very good fit for UD. What the conference needs is a BB upgrade by way of a new school or two, pressure on laggard members and a much better TV deal. Of course, the latter comes from elevating BB.

Our AD is no dummy and BB is uniquely important to UD. That being the case I suppose there is much we don't know/understand about the A10 specifically and conference affiliation generally. Chris is well connected with UD and Neil; I'm sure he has or can get better insight re this matter.
It sounds like what you are saying is we need the A10 to be more like the Big East...or we can hope that the invite to the BE is still in play.
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:51 AM
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The football thing worries me, but honestly if the AAC was going to take three basketball-only schools and two of those three were going to be Wichita State and VCU, then I think Dayton would have to go. Because at the end of the day, I just don't trust anyone in the A10 besides VCU to be a basketball power year in and year out.
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Old 03-24-2017, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
Mixing of FB and BB schools has been proven to be a mistake...a big one. Think old Big East. The interests of FBS FB schools and non-FB schools are fundamentally different. That creates a serious problem.

To be successful the interests of conference members should be fundamentally similar. This is not a hard concept to grasp.

I cannot understand why a school like WSU would even consider FB...knowing in advance the bottomless money pit that FBS FB is. Quite a few schools in Power 5 conferences are losing their shirts on FBS FB....but as legacy members they are trapped....can't get out because of the impact on all other athletics programs.

The A10 is a very good fit for UD. What the conference needs is a BB upgrade by way of a new school or two, pressure on laggard members and a much better TV deal. Of course, the latter comes from elevating BB.

Our AD is no dummy and BB is uniquely important to UD. That being the case I suppose there is much we don't know/understand about the A10 specifically and conference affiliation generally. Chris is well connected with UD and Neil; I'm sure he has or can get better insight re this matter.
The difference between the Old Big East, and the New AAC is that in the Old Big East, was a 50/50 split with the basketball and football schools. Here, the 1 (possibly 3) basketball schools being added would go in knowing that they are second fiddle to football. The difference is though, these schools would be fine with that with the big increase in money they would be getting by joining the league.
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Old 03-24-2017, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by xubrew View Post
By going to the AAC, Wichita State will likely be making at least three times the money that the entire Atlantic Ten conference makes put together off of the TV deal. And, they'll get more exposure. For that reason alone UD should STRONGLY consider a move to the AAC if it presents itself, which it might.
What about UC and UConn leaving someday? Is it still a good deal?
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