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  #201  
Old 05-21-2019, 07:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post
Delaware Joe. He's no Pennsylvanian.

Trump, at raucous Pennsylvania rally, slams Scranton-born Biden: 'He deserted you'.
His family moved from PA to DE when Biden was 10. I don’t think he had any say in the matter.

GTFU Trump
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  #202  
Old 05-21-2019, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows View Post
His family moved from PA to DE when Biden was 10. I don’t think he had any say in the matterPosted via Mobile Device
Some Pennsylvanian. When Joe Biden visited Scranton, he made jokes about having permission to hug and touch people, but the women were not laughing. Mr. Touchy Feelie I believe. Strange though that Biden does align with Trump in that Biden voted for a fence and took a stance against sanctuary cities. Glad he likes Trump's policies. But maybe now he is "devolving."

Last edited by Mich Flyer; 05-21-2019 at 09:42 AM..
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  #203  
Old 05-21-2019, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
I have a hard time imagining Biden holding a lead in the Democratic nomination process once the debates begin. I think he is horrible in that format, and a poor politician overall. I think that Buttigieg will take the lead on him once people get to compare candidates and talk policy.
We will see, Biden IMO is very charming and likeable.

I think that a lot of people, including myself, have very little familiarity with any of the other 19 or so candidates other than Bernie. It has been about 12 years, 2008, since the Dems really had an open, fair competition for the nomination. I mean, let's face it, 2016 was not very competitive, it seemed like Hillary had no serious challengers. Bernie never had a fair chance. So, a lot has changed in 12 years, and there are a lot of new faces. This could be a very unpredictable race.
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  #204  
Old 05-21-2019, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
We will see, Biden IMO is very charming and likeable.


Yeah, he's a real charmer. I'm guessing if he wasn't the VP with secret service surrounding him, these two guys would have kicked his ass.
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  #205  
Old 05-21-2019, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
We will see, Biden IMO is very charming and likeable.

I think that a lot of people, including myself, have very little familiarity with any of the other 19 or so candidates other than Bernie. It has been about 12 years, 2008, since the Dems really had an open, fair competition for the nomination. I mean, let's face it, 2016 was not very competitive, it seemed like Hillary had no serious challengers. Bernie never had a fair chance. So, a lot has changed in 12 years, and there are a lot of new faces. This could be a very unpredictable race.
Biden is likable, but so squirrely on issues. He is scatter-brained and confused when it comes to talking about policy. He is not being challenged on that stuff now. He will be by other candidates in the debates.
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  #206  
Old 05-21-2019, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
Biden is likable, but so squirrely on issues. He is scatter-brained and confused when it comes to talking about policy. He is not being challenged on that stuff now. He will be by other candidates in the debates.
Because he has no platform. He is evolving. It's whatever works.
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  #207  
Old 05-21-2019, 12:55 PM
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Biden is just not very smart. However, neither party cares at times about the intelligence of the candidate. The Repubs have McCain/Palin as exhibit A.

Biden appears to be either totally naive about China, or he, and his son, are a bit in bed with them. Very scary, but most Dems care more about abortion and climate change than the economy or China.

How do voters have any confidence in guys like Biden or Sanders, who have been around for 70 years and accomplished nothing but getting elected?
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  #208  
Old 05-21-2019, 01:26 PM
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https://kprcradio.iheart.com/feature...ns-rental-car/

If this were Don Jr. or Eric can you imagine how this would have been reported.
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  #209  
Old 05-21-2019, 01:50 PM
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Anything can happen

2016 showed that the unexpected can happen....and there is lots of time.

Having said that, I think Pete Buttigieg is a guy to be reckoned with. He is smart, well educated, knowledgeable, can articulate his positions on any issue, self assured.....he's young!....likely to do very well in debates. Brett Hume summed up Buttigieg's positives very well last night on Fox news.

He has much going for him. His position on issues is another matter entirely, of course But, as predicted by Hume, the way he handles himself in the debates could be the deciding factor. And there is no reason at this point to think that he won't do very well.

Imagine, 37 year old Pete against 73 year old Donald. Wow!
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  #210  
Old 05-21-2019, 02:31 PM
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Peter Buttigieg...I can only imagine how many nicknames Trump could make out of that name.
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  #211  
Old 05-21-2019, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
2016 showed that the unexpected can happen....and there is lots of time.

Having said that, I think Pete Buttigieg is a guy to be reckoned with. He is smart, well educated, knowledgeable, can articulate his positions on any issue, self assured.....he's young!....likely to do very well in debates. Brett Hume summed up Buttigieg's positives very well last night on Fox news.

He has much going for him. His position on issues is another matter entirely, of course But, as predicted by Hume, the way he handles himself in the debates could be the deciding factor. And there is no reason at this point to think that he won't do very well.

Imagine, 37 year old Pete against 73 year old Donald. Wow!
He’s 37, but looks 16. The debates with him and Biden should be interesting. Will he call Biden “grandpa”?
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  #212  
Old 05-21-2019, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by TA111 View Post
He’s 37, but looks 16. The debates with him and Biden should be interesting. Will he call Biden “grandpa”?
Buttigieg's already Alfred E. Newman. Rollo's comments about what he will be called do not sound particularly complimentary.
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  #213  
Old 05-21-2019, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by cj View Post
https://kprcradio.iheart.com/feature...ns-rental-car/

If this were Don Jr. or Eric can you imagine how this would have been reported.
So it was national news when the Bush twins were busted for under age drinking, yet this is the first this story is being reported.

F every single reporter or staff writer for their liberal bias. I trust none of them
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  #214  
Old 05-21-2019, 06:45 PM
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Right, but,...

Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Peter Buttigieg...I can only imagine how many nicknames Trump could make out of that name.
Originally Posted by TA111 View Post
He’s 37, but looks 16. The debates with him and Biden should be interesting. Will he call Biden “grandpa”?
Trump would have t be careful with his choice of nicknames.

Debates involving Buttigieg will be interesting whether with Biden or Trump.

I'm not talking about Buttigieg's positions on issues. As I said, that's a different matter. But, to pick up again on Brett Hume's observations, Buttigieg is very impressive on his feet. In my opinion, neither Biden or Trump are used to going one-on-one with a guy like Buttigieg. Rather than his youth becoming the issue, it's more likely that the age of Biden and/or Trump would become the issue. Those two are not likely to be a debate match for the likes of Pete Butigieg.

I'm not familiar enough with his position on issues to have an opinion.

One last word on the impression Buttigieg creates on his feet: If it should turn out to be Trump vs Buttigieg, it's no "never-Trumpers" or "Trump-no-matter-what" guys that will determine the outcome. Rather, it's those in or near the middle that will determine the winner.

The next 12 months or so are going to be a real floor show.
_________
I should clarify: Hume was speaking of Buttigieg's poise and political savy...performance on his feet, etc. In that regard Hume said PG was by far the most impressive Dem candidate. But, Hume also said that Buttigieg holds views on some issues that are far removed from those of main stream voters. I should have added that.

Last edited by UACFlyer; 05-21-2019 at 09:12 PM..
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  #215  
Old 05-21-2019, 07:16 PM
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Radical Buttigieg

Buttigieg approves abortion even up to birth. Not in the mainstream. Not a nice person. Jackie Speyer, CA Congresswoman today in front of the Supreme Court celebrated her abortion, and all the demonstrators cheered. What have we become as a country?
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  #216  
Old 05-21-2019, 07:46 PM
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Abortion!

Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post
Buttigieg approves abortion even up to birth. Not in the mainstream. Not a nice person. Jackie Speyer, CA Congresswoman today in front of the Supreme Court celebrated her abortion, and all the demonstrators cheered. What have we become as a country?
Abortion is not one of my hot button issues. But there are no hotter issues for many voters.

The views re abortion can be extreme, ranging from no abortion, ever,...to abortion at any time up to birth. In my opinion, extreme positions are rarely if ever in the best interests of the Country, no matter the issue. Abortion is not an exception, in my personal opinion.
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  #217  
Old 05-22-2019, 01:05 AM
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You folks keep saying how dumb Biden is.

Let's see: 2 term VP, multi-term Senator, holds a 25 point lead currently.

For somebody that is supposedly so stupid, he is doing/has done pretty well.

I wish that I was that stupid!
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  #218  
Old 05-22-2019, 01:28 AM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
Abortion is not one of my hot button issues. But there are no hotter issues for many voters.

The views re abortion can be extreme, ranging from no abortion, ever,...to abortion at any time up to birth. In my opinion, extreme positions are rarely if ever in the best interests of the Country, no matter the issue. Abortion is not an exception, in my personal opinion.
Here is the problem....Democrats aren't even focused on the core tenets of their philosophy.

Mark my words. The overwhelming majority of democratic candidates will roll into the debates hem hawing around about their issues but will focus on Trump. Whoever gets the nomination will do the same. No foundation. No principles. No basis for arguments other than Trump is a bad man and he needs to be stopped.

I keep hearing republican states passing strict abortion laws. What are democrats saying or doing to put up a fight? They aren't...they are too worried about tax returns. Dems are focused on impeachment. They are wanting to try the Russian investigation over again because they weren't happy with the outcome. Trump isn't getting impeached because dems aren't getting 67 senate votes.

Democrats are all diversion and zero action. If Trump rolls into debates with some moderate opinions on conservative topics, his supporters are going to still vote for him. If he rolls moderate...the independents will side with him.

What are democrats legislating right now other than attempting to overthrow Trump?
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  #219  
Old 05-22-2019, 02:15 AM
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Originally Posted by shocka43 View Post
What are democrats legislating right now other than attempting to overthrow Trump?
Exactly, since taking over the House, they have attempted zero serious legislation. They need to get off the "get Trump" stuff and try to accomplish something substantive.

The get Trump stuff is not working, his approval rating is holding steady. People respect trying to do what is right for the country, they do not respect a win-at-all-costs approach.
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Old 05-22-2019, 05:15 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
Exactly, since taking over the House, they have attempted zero serious legislation. They need to get off the "get Trump" stuff and try to accomplish something substantive.

The get Trump stuff is not working, his approval rating is holding steady. People respect trying to do what is right for the country, they do not respect a win-at-all-costs approach.
Unfortunately the democratic reality is that they don't want to do anything productive. Their consumer base has nothing productive to do other than see that the GOP is out of office and keep moving with a progressive agenda. Right now, 50% of the country is standing in their way.

Bad news for the democrats...the further left they keep going, the more and more are heading to the middle to vote closet right or simply move right.
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Old 05-22-2019, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
You folks keep saying how dumb Biden is.

Let's see: 2 term VP, multi-term Senator, holds a 25 point lead currently.

For somebody that is supposedly so stupid, he is doing/has done pretty well.

I wish that I was that stupid!
So what has he accomplished? Getting elected is is it. What was his major legislation as a senator? What vice president, in that role, has ever had a major impact on this nation, or any impact?
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  #222  
Old 05-22-2019, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
So what has he accomplished? Getting elected is is it. What was his major legislation as a senator? What vice president, in that role, has ever had a major impact on this nation, or any impact?
… or what has he accomplished that is worthwhile?
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  #223  
Old 05-22-2019, 09:45 AM
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Buttigeig of South Bend

Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
I'm not familiar enough with his position on issues to have an opinion.

But, Hume also said that Buttigieg holds views on some issues that are far removed from those of main stream voters. I should have added that.
He has not impressed the black population of South Bend.
‘I ain’t ever seen the dude’ – residents of South Bend’s poor neighborhoods say Democratic presidential hopeful Pete Buttigieg left them behind.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/04/22/sout...em-behind.html
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Old 05-25-2019, 01:53 PM
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Pope Likened Abortion to Hiring a Hit Man

Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
The views re abortion can be extreme, ranging from no abortion, ever,...to abortion at any time up to birth. In my opinion, extreme positions are rarely if ever in the best interests of the Country, no matter the issue. Abortion is not an exception, in my personal opinion.
Pope Francis on Saturday likened abortion to hiring a hitman and said the procedure can never be condoned, even if the unborn child is gravely sick or likely to die.

UAC - are you saying the Pope is an extremist?

https://www.foxnews.com/world/pope-f...bortion-hitman
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  #225  
Old 05-25-2019, 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post
Pope Francis on Saturday likened abortion to hiring a hitman and said the procedure can never be condoned, even if the unborn child is gravely sick or likely to die.

UAC - are you saying the Pope is an extremist?

https://www.foxnews.com/world/pope-f...bortion-hitman
I will say that I think the Pope's opinion as you've explained it is an extreme position.

I suppose I would define an "extremist" as a person whose views tend to the extreme no matter the subject, e.g., those either to the very far left or very far right.

Certainly possible for a person to hold an extreme position on a particular issue without having extreme views generally.
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Old 05-25-2019, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
I will say that I think the Pope's opinion as you've explained it is an extreme position.

I suppose I would define an "extremist" as a person whose views tend to the extreme no matter the subject, e.g., those either to the very far left or very far right.

Certainly possible for a person to hold an extreme position on a particular issue without having extreme views generally.
I take it then that you do not place much value in an unborn child if you favor abortion before the middle, say before 4 and a half months. Well before four and a half months there is a heart beat and developed body parts. Perhaps before the middle you favor abortion for the body parts.

Last edited by Mich Flyer; 05-25-2019 at 07:04 PM..
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Old 05-25-2019, 07:03 PM
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You may "take it".... but you'd be wrong.

Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post
I take it then that you do not place much value in an unborn child, except maybe harvesting for body parts.
I do not happen to believe that human life begins at the moment of conception. Deciding when the fetus becomes an "unborn child" I believe is a difficult issue.

I'm guessing from your "tone" that it is not a difficult question for you.

Without attempting to answer the question, in my opinion extreme positions are that human life begins at conception and therefore abortion is never permitted (the Pope's position?, and a women has the right to abort at any time.

I shouldn't wade in any more than that.....I have a few really hot button issues. Abortion is not one of them.
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Old 05-25-2019, 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
I do not happen to believe that human life begins at the moment of conception. Deciding when the fetus becomes an "unborn child" I believe is a difficult issue.
Science has proven it is human life at conception and it is developing. The word fetus means little baby.

American College of Pediatricians:

At fertilization, the human being emerges as a whole, genetically distinct, individuated zygotic living human organism, a member of the species H o m o sapiens, needing only the proper environment in order to grow and develop. The difference between the individual in its adult stage and in its zygotic stage is one of form, not nature. This statement focuses on the scientific evidence of when an individual human life begins.

https://www.acpeds.org/the-college-s...an-life-begins

Last edited by Mich Flyer; 05-25-2019 at 07:13 PM..
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Old 05-25-2019, 07:41 PM
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Why is having a heartbeat not clear evidence of being alive if not having a heartbeat is clear evidence you're dead? And by clear I dont mean over a period of 5 minutes.

When was the last time you heard someone say, "yeah he hasnt had a heartbeat in days -- but he's doing great."
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Old 05-25-2019, 07:41 PM
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A opinion piece

Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post
Science has proven it is human life at conception and it is developing. The word fetus means little baby.

American College of Pediatricians:

At fertilization, the human being emerges as a whole, genetically distinct, individuated zygotic living human organism, a member of the species H o m o sapiens, needing only the proper environment in order to grow and develop. The difference between the individual in its adult stage and in its zygotic stage is one of form, not nature. This statement focuses on the scientific evidence of when an individual human life begins.

https://www.acpeds.org/the-college-s...an-life-begins
Mich, I said I won't wade in further on the sensitive abortion issue. And I won't.

But I will comment on the article you quoted and included in your post...the piece in the publication by the American College of Pediatricians.

A little background first. My profession was science. I was a research scientist for a very long time; and I published dozens of scientific articles during my career. I understand science and I know how scientists write. Reading the article you posted made me a bit suspicious.

That prompted me to look into the background of the American College of Pediatricians. If you haven't I suggest you do.

The unauthored ACP article you quoted is an opinion piece....nothing more. It "proves" nothing re beginning of human life.
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Old 05-25-2019, 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
The unauthored ACP article you quoted is an opinion piece....nothing more. It "proves" nothing re beginning of human life.
UAC - it is not unauthored. See: Original author: Fred de Miranda, MD, March 2004
Updated: Dr. Patricia Lee June, MD, March 2017. It was put out by the American Pediatricians.

Here are further scientific studies stating human life begins at conception.

https://www.princeton.edu/~prolife/a...yoquotes2.html

Are you running away from science or afraid to deal with the issue?

Last edited by Mich Flyer; 05-25-2019 at 08:19 PM..
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Old 05-25-2019, 08:27 PM
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Then UAC should not be a global warming believer because science is not based on consensus. Where do you stand on MMGW?
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Old 05-25-2019, 09:00 PM
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A complex issue

Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post
UAC - it is not unauthored. See: Original author: Fred de Miranda, MD, March 2004
Updated: Dr. Patricia Lee June, MD, March 2017. It was put out by the American Pediatricians.

Here are further scientific studies stating human life begins at conception.

https://www.princeton.edu/~prolife/a...yoquotes2.html

Are you running away from science or afraid to deal with the issue?
Mich, I'm not running away from science, my profession.

Re the string of articles you provided, biological life and human life are two different things. Chris, raised the issue of fetal heartbeat. Some think that when a heartbeat can be detected human life exists. Probably you disagree with that since a heartbeat doesn't happen at conception.

Re the American College of Pediatricians, from what I can determine that organization is a small activist organization of a few hundred members, in contrast to the American Academy of Pediatrics membership of well over 50,000. Just the way the opinion piece was written made me suspicious.

I repeat, the article you posted is an opinion piece. I don't mean that in a disparaging way. The authors are entitled to their opinion. But opinion it is....science cannot prove when human life begins. Indeed, even defining human life has its controversies.
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Old 05-25-2019, 09:14 PM
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cj you're teasing

Originally Posted by cj View Post
Then UAC should not be a global warming believer because science is not based on consensus. Where do you stand on MMGW?
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Indeed, science is not based on "consensus". Not that it matters, but there is no consensus among scientists re the matter of global warming. Stating that such consensus exists is a deception.

It so happens that atmospheric science was one of my specialties.

As you know, there are two separate issues: Is climate changing, specifically warming. And is the change caused by human activity.

Re the former, the climate is always changing and does appear to be warming. The extent to which man is responsible is far less certain...and more important. I have attended lectures by the world's leading authorities on both sides of the issue. Frankly, both positions were presented very effectively and persuasively.

I have a very close personal friend that is a real expert on the subject, a guy I trust to be free of any bias or conflict of interest. He has studied the issue for many years. His position? The climate is warming. Man's contribution is highly uncertain and possibly none at all.

Unfortunately there is a cult-like belief that only fools, irresponsible or stupid people, Republicans, etc, could possibly doubt that we are doomed by global warming. Anyone appearing certain about any aspect of the matter should be ignored.

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  #235  
Old 05-25-2019, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
Re the string of articles you provided, biological life and human life are two different things. Chris, raised the issue of fetal heartbeat. Some think that when a heartbeat can be detected human life exists. Probably you disagree with that since a heartbeat doesn't happen at conception.
I can agree that if there is a heartbeat, there is for sure a life that has that heartbeat.

As far as life at conception - it is life from humans, human life. It is not life from animals. And that life scientifically has the genetic structure of humans. It is human in form and will develop further to its full potential - that is - if it is not snuffed out prior to birth. The life is alive.

Some of the world’s most prominent scientists and physicians testified to a U.S. Senate committee that human life begins at conception:

A United States Senate Judiciary Subcommittee invited experts to testify on the question of when life begins. All of the quotes from the following experts come directly from the official government record of their testimony.1 Click on the link below to read.

https://naapc.org/why-life-begins-at-conception/
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Old 05-25-2019, 09:48 PM
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Opinion

Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post
I can agree that if there is a heartbeat, there is for sure a life that has that heartbeat.

As far as life at conception - it is life from humans, human life. It is not life from animals. And that life scientifically has the genetic structure of humans. It is human in form and will develop further to its full potential - that is - if it is not snuffed out prior to birth. The life is alive.

Some of the world’s most prominent scientists and physicians testified to a U.S. Senate committee that human life begins at conception:

A United States Senate Judiciary Subcommittee invited experts to testify on the question of when life begins. All of the quotes from the following experts come directly from the official government record of their testimony.1 Click on the link below to read.

https://naapc.org/why-life-begins-at-conception/
Mich, I respect your opinion. And I respect the "opinions" of the prominent scientists you referred to. But I am sure that a group of scientists just as prominent can be found to express a different view. Certainly an organization devoted to the rights of pre-born children is not expected to have an unbiased view.

When human life as we know it begins cannot be proven. It will always be a matter of opinion with opposing expect views on both sides of the issue.

I am not expressing an opinion other than this: "Abortion never" and "abortion anytime" are extreme positions re a very complex issue.
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Old 05-25-2019, 10:31 PM
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[QUOTE=UACFlyer;586267]When human life as we know it begins cannot be proven. It will always be a matter of opinion with opposing expect views on both sides of the issue.[/QUOTE/]

What does as we know it mean? I disagree. It is very evident when human life begins, and I think it can be proven. You did not prove that it is not human life at conception. You had no answer to the fact that the genetic makeup of a human is present at conception, and all potential life is present to develop into an adult human. It sound like you have no opinion when human life begins. Can you at least say there human life at birth? Can that life then be snuffed out like the Governor of Virginia proposed? Do you think there is life before birth that can be proven? Or are you going to say I just don't know. You are very vague, UAC. Do you think Dr. Carson operating for 18 hours on preborns was not an operation on a human life?

1. Jeremiah 1:5: “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations.”
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Old 05-25-2019, 11:28 PM
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The question is: unborn child or not.

Twenty years ago a case brought to trial dealt with a husband slapping his few weeks pregnant wife who was hysterical and out of control. Neighbor convinces the wife she was assaulted then press charged. Prosecutor learning of wife's state adds charges of assault of an unborn child.

On day one of trial just before opening remarks a medical report was submitted showing wife/mother had an abortion earlier that morning. Assault of an unborn child was then dropped.

So it's an unborn child and grevious crime for the husband/father but okay for the wife/mother to kill it.
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Old 05-25-2019, 11:35 PM
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My position

[QUOTE=Mich Flyer;586269]
Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
When human life as we know it begins cannot be proven. It will always be a matter of opinion with opposing expect views on both sides of the issue.[/QUOTE/]

What does as we know it mean? I disagree. It is very evident when human life begins, and I think it can be proven. You did not prove that it is not human life at conception. You had no answer to the fact that the genetic makeup of a human is present at conception, and all potential life is present to develop into an adult human. It sound like you have no opinion when human life begins. Can you at least say there human life at birth? Can that life then be snuffed out like the Governor of Virginia proposed? Do you think there is life before birth that can be proven? Or are you going to say I just don't know. You are very vague, UAC. Do you think Dr. Carson operating for 18 hours on preborns was not an operation on a human life?

1. Jeremiah 1:5: “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations.”
Mich, early in this discussion I said I was not going to wade in re the matter of abortion. I thought that was pretty clear. That does not mean I have no opinion of when life begins. Your view is perfectly clear. I'm fine with that.
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Old 05-26-2019, 06:48 AM
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[QUOTE=UACFlyer;586271]
Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post

Mich, early in this discussion I said I was not going to wade in re the matter of abortion. I thought that was pretty clear. That does not mean I have no opinion of when life begins. Your view is perfectly clear. I'm fine with that.
UAC - your view is vague enough for me to understand where you are coming from - somewhere in the "non-extreme" middle as you would like me to believe - like brain waves - not heartbeat. Although, you know, Ohio passed the 6-week non-abortion bill, no abortion after heartbeat. Other states are also passing this ban. There is a realization that there is life before birth.
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Old 05-26-2019, 07:52 AM
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Agree

[QUOTE=Mich Flyer;586273]
Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post

UAC - your view is vague enough for me to understand where you are coming from - somewhere in the "non-extreme" middle as you would like me to believe - like brain waves - not heartbeat. Although, you know, Ohio passed the 6-week non-abortion bill, no abortion after heartbeat. Other states are also passing this ban. There is a realization that there is life before birth.
Agree...but not beginning at conception.
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Old 05-26-2019, 12:16 PM
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Let the People of the Individual States Decide

[QUOTE=UACFlyer;586275]
Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post

Agree...but not beginning at conception.
While you say not at conception, you offer no proof to support your supposition. And it's way before the "middle" that you were proposing. Alabama passed a bill that life begins at conception. The Heartbeat Bills are worded so that there can be a challenge to the Supreme Court's approval of abortion in Roe vs Wade. It is a challenge to overturn it. There is a better chance of overturning Roe vs Wade with the Heartbeat Bills than with the Alabama bill. And the states know this and are reacting accordingly. And then each state can act to the will of its people. It isn't they are saying life does not begin at conception. It is you.
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Old 05-26-2019, 02:05 PM
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Proof

[QUOTE=Mich Flyer;586288]
Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post

While you say not at conception, you offer no proof to support your supposition. And it's way before the "middle" that you were proposing. Alabama passed a bill that life begins at conception. The Heartbeat Bills are worded so that there can be a challenge to the Supreme Court's approval of abortion in Roe vs Wade. It is a challenge to overturn it. There is a better chance of overturning Roe vs Wade with the Heartbeat Bills than with the Alabama bill. And the states know this and are reacting accordingly. And then each state can act to the will of its people. It isn't they are saying life does not begin at conception. It is you.
Mich, there can be no proof as to whether "person hood" begins at conception, or not. There are opinions largely based on religious grounds. Please don't respond with scientific "proof". I know what constitutes scientific
proof and scientific opinion.

In contrast, at later stages of pregnancy the unborn baby can exist outside the womb. We know that. It would be hard to argue that a "person" doesn't exist at that point. At earlier times there is a heartbeat; but the unborn could not survive outside the womb. In my opinion....opinion....that's when the matter starts to get tricky. Not to you, I understand that. And I respect your view.
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Old 05-26-2019, 02:39 PM
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Conventional newborns are 100% dependent and cannot survive outside the womb either. They will be dead within hours unless there is intervention. If that's the litmus test, 98% of us were not born "persons". Whats the difference if you're born at 6 months or 9 months? Either way you have no chance to live unless those around you choose to keep you alive.
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Old 05-26-2019, 02:58 PM
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True

Originally Posted by Chris R View Post
Conventional newborns are 100% dependent and cannot survive outside the womb either. They will be dead within hours unless there is intervention. If that's the litmus test, 98% of us were not born "persons". Whats the difference if you're born at 6 months or 9 months? Either way you have no chance to live unless those around you choose to keep you alive.
True enough. But there is a point during the nine months when survival as a person is not possible no matter the amount of intervention. Is that not right? I realize that there is no exact time after conception at which survival is not possible....depends on each case. But I suspect that there is a time that does not vary significantly from one case to another.

What is that time, on average? Four months, five, six? Probably less than six. At what month, typically is a heart beat detected?
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Old 06-12-2019, 09:39 AM
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Biden had quite a turnout at his Iowa rally - 85 people. Shows quite an enthusiasm for his campaign.
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Old 06-12-2019, 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
True enough. But there is a point during the nine months when survival as a person is not possible no matter the amount of intervention. Is that not right? I realize that there is no exact time after conception at which survival is not possible....depends on each case. But I suspect that there is a time that does not vary significantly from one case to another.

What is that time, on average? Four months, five, six? Probably less than six. At what month, typically is a heart beat detected?
While there is no exact time, the earliest surviving premature baby was 21 weeks.
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Old 06-12-2019, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
What is that time, on average? Four months, five, six? Probably less than six. At what month, typically is a heart beat detected?
Science as you like says less than two months: A fetal heartbeat may first be detected by a vaginal ultrasound as early as 5 1/2 to 6 weeks after gestation. That's when a fetal pole, the first visible sign of a developing embryo, can sometimes be seen. But between 6 1/2 to 7 weeks after gestation, a heartbeat can be better assessed.
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Old 06-12-2019, 04:08 PM
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Trump’s Own Polling Data Shows He’s in Deep Trouble. Here’s How He Reportedly Tried to Bury It.

https://www.motherjones.com/politics...ies-own-polls/
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Old 06-13-2019, 09:15 AM
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Rolling Stone, "Again, pundits were right that Trump on the surface was a preposterous bet to win the nomination, given that 57 percent of Republicans disapproved of him in the summer of 2015.

But he won anyway..."

Polls mean little 18 months from the election. Hell, they meant little the day of the election.
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Old 06-14-2019, 04:06 PM
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Kyle Griffin
‏@kylegriffin1


ABC News says that it has the data from Trump's first internal reelection campaign poll. It found:

Biden leading Trump by 16 in Pennsylvania
Biden leading Trump by 10 in Wisconsin
Biden leading Trump by 7 in Florida
Trump leading Biden by 2 in Texas


https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/pres...ry?id=63718268
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Old 06-14-2019, 05:44 PM
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You keep right on relying on those polls, glad dems are still incapable of learning from past failures.
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Old 06-14-2019, 06:06 PM
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And in other breaking news Dewey defeats Truman.
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  #254  
Old 06-16-2019, 01:59 PM
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When in doubt, shoot the messenger!

Trump fires his pollsters after campaign leaks show him losing in 11 battleground states

https://www.rawstory.com/2019/06/tru...ground-states/

NBC reported on Sunday that the firings came after someone leaked polls that indicated Trump is losing to Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden in 11 battleground states.
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Old 06-17-2019, 05:46 PM
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Overturn Roe vs Wade

Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post
Science as you like says less than two months: A fetal heartbeat may first be detected by a vaginal ultrasound as early as 5 1/2 to 6 weeks after gestation. That's when a fetal pole, the first visible sign of a developing embryo, can sometimes be seen. But between 6 1/2 to 7 weeks after gestation, a heartbeat can be better assessed.
UAC - Bring it to the States.
In a concurring opinion in a Supreme Court case announced Monday, Justice Clarence Thomas issued a lengthy call for his colleagues to overturn "demonstrably erroneous decisions" even if they have been upheld for decades -- prompting legal observers to say Thomas was laying the groundwork to overturn the seminal 1973 case Roe v. Wade, which established a constitutional right to abortion.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/cla...de-speculation

Martin Luther King Jr.'s niece rebukes Gillibrand on abortion: 'Civil rights begin in the womb'

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/mar...in-in-the-womb
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  #256  
Old 06-18-2019, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows View Post
When in doubt, shoot the messenger!

Trump fires his pollsters after campaign leaks show him losing in 11 battleground states

https://www.rawstory.com/2019/06/tru...ground-states/

NBC reported on Sunday that the firings came after someone leaked polls that indicated Trump is losing to Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden in 11 battleground states.
LOL. Keep believing the fake polls. Just like how your side had Hillary winning easily in 2016.

There is absolutely no way Biden can beat Trump without egregious voter fraud.
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Old 06-18-2019, 11:47 AM
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Maybe my favorite post of all time on this site is when Swampy declared the 2016 election "over" about 3 months out from election day.

I think that Paul Ryan pulled support about the same time...…

Glorious.

UAC, do you think that Trump is going to run for re-election in 2020 or gracefully bow out?

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Old 06-18-2019, 01:03 PM
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Smile The Grand List of Glorius Demoncrat Candidates

are just Biden their time for now.
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Old 06-21-2019, 09:00 AM
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This ones going to play well with the leftists. https://hotair.com/archives/2019/06/...le-jaywalking/
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Old 06-21-2019, 10:47 PM
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Health Care

If the Democrats care about public health so much, why are they not doing anything about the homeless in the Democrat cities of Los Angeles, Portland, Seattle, Chicago, Baltimore, etc.? Why are the Democrats ignoring the illegals coming in who have diseases that can spread to the general population? I thought the Democrats cared about health care. Why then are they doing nothing?
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Old 06-22-2019, 03:01 AM
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New Campaign Slogans Emerge

From the Trump Kickoff comes "Keep America Great" and from the questions being asked about the Biden campaign comes " Make America Apologize Again". Now there is a difference in visions for the U.S.A.
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Old 06-22-2019, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post
If the Democrats care about public health so much, why are they not doing anything about the homeless in the Democrat cities of Los Angeles, Portland, Seattle, Chicago, Baltimore, etc.? Why are the Democrats ignoring the illegals coming in who have diseases that can spread to the general population? I thought the Democrats cared about health care. Why then are they doing nothing?

By “health care,” they mean abortion, providing safe heroin needles, and providing a safe public sidewalk to defecate on. LOL

https://mobile.twitter.com/MileyCyru...27919577096200
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Old 07-01-2019, 11:16 AM
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So a friend of mine sent me a quick email observing that there were no American flags on display during NBC's televised debates. I did a google image search and based on those results, he was right. There were stars and there were stripes, but no flags. Interesting.
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Old 07-01-2019, 01:22 PM
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When your policies are more aligned with Venezuela than the US it’s not hard to understand why there were no US flags.
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Old 07-02-2019, 02:51 AM
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Race is tightening up, Biden only up 5 over Harris in new CNN national poll.
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Old 07-02-2019, 06:31 PM
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Worst Run Cities

2019’s Best- & Worst-Run Cities in America

Guess which two were about the worst - the two Democrat cities of San Francisco and Washington DC,

https://wallethub.com/edu/best-run-cities/22869/
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Old 07-02-2019, 09:12 PM
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https://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2...american-left/

How true is this.
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Old 07-03-2019, 01:01 AM
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Biden lead down to 2 over Harris per Quinnipiac, it is unbelievable how quickly his huge lead vanished.
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Old 07-09-2019, 02:47 AM
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This could be interesting.

Billionaire Tom Steyer has reportedly entered the race.

He is reportedly worth around $1.6 billion.


https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/to...mpaign=newsmax

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Old 07-09-2019, 06:27 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
Biden lead down to 2 over Harris per Quinnipiac, it is unbelievable how quickly his huge lead vanished.
To me, it is not surprising at all. Candidates have had to defend nothing up until this point. It's like the first two minutes of a basketball game. No patterns have been established to lead the public in any direction. Candidates have been able to say almost anything without being held to account and support their positions with facts.
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Old 07-09-2019, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
This could be interesting.

Billionaire Tom Steyer has reportedly entered the race.

He is reportedly worth around $1.6 billion.


https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/to...mpaign=newsmax
Nan Whaley is declaring on Friday and Swampy on Monday (they are pooling their money). Dan Curran is still undecided . . . .

Last edited by N2663R; 07-09-2019 at 11:01 AM..
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Old 07-09-2019, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
To me, it is not surprising at all. Candidates have had to defend nothing up until this point. It's like the first two minutes of a basketball game. No patterns have been established to lead the public in any direction. Candidates have been able to say almost anything without being held to account and support their positions with facts.
Correct, there has been no scrutiny of these candidates. There is no where to go but down for them as more and more hear their radical ideas.
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Old 07-09-2019, 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by N2663R View Post
Nan Whaley is declaring on Friday and Swampy on Monday (they are pooling their money). Dan Curran is still undecided . . . .
If the race was between Nan Whaley and Swimpy, I would vote for Swimpy. That woman is just bat **** crazy. Then I am moving to Mexico, unless Mexico builds a wall to keep us out
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  #274  
Old 07-11-2019, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan View Post
If the race was between Nan Whaley and Swimpy, I would vote for Swimpy. That woman is just bat **** crazy. Then I am moving to Mexico, unless Mexico builds a wall to keep us out
Congressman Mike Turner demanded an apology from Dayton Mayor Nan Whaley Tuesday over comments she made in the Dayton Daily News saying he didn’t ask for federal assistance after the Memorial Day tornadoes.

Turner says he asked federal government for FEMA support from day 1. Whaley says Turner never reached out to help city after tornadoes.

https://www.daytondailynews.com/news...fcEl30HYHdiiK/
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  #275  
Old 07-11-2019, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Mich Flyer View Post
Congressman Mike Turner demanded an apology from Dayton Mayor Nan Whaley Tuesday over comments she made in the Dayton Daily News saying he didn’t ask for federal assistance after the Memorial Day tornadoes.

Turner says he asked federal government for FEMA support from day 1. Whaley says Turner never reached out to help city after tornadoes.

https://www.daytondailynews.com/news...fcEl30HYHdiiK/
Now you see why your neighbor Swimpy gets my vote
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Old 07-12-2019, 03:35 AM
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"The intention of my statement was that as many of us worked in bipartisan partnership, Congressman Turner did not contact myself or the City administration.”
Were her fingers broken? Why would the mayor of the city wait on phone calls....from anyone...during a disaster? Why didnt she call Mike Turner herself if she expected a conversation with Mike Turner needed to happen? Im sure she has speed dial to his office or even his personal cell phone since she's....wait for it....the MAYOR OF DAYTON. And...Mike Turner used to also be...wait for it....the MAYOR OF DAYTON.

How dare Whaley choose to be derelict in her duty and purposely neglect to call her Congressperson that represents her district when she wants to have a conversation. Do any of you wait around twiddling thumbs when you feel you need to have a conversation with someone -- hoping they will read your mind and call on your behalf? Or do you not bother waiting and pick up the phone and just make the phone call yourself?

This changes the entire context now that Whaley expected to have a conversation with Turner and chose not to instigate one. Is she a mayor or a wall decoration? Im not suggesting it wouldnt have been a good idea for Turner to communicate with Whaley should he have felt the need or even just reassurance, but it was Whaley who was lamenting the fact that things broke down in the bi-partisanship because she didnt get a communication from Turner at the place and time she expected it. If thats not her job as mayor, nothing is. As mayor during a tornado disaster, if you want or expect something -- you dont wait until someone offers it. You take your message to whomever it needs to be taken to and flat out demand that it be considered or done. You are the foot soldier on the ground -- not the Congressperson. You arent getting paid to wait for anybody or anything when it comes to channels of communication.
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  #277  
Old 07-12-2019, 08:13 AM
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Amy Klobuchar is proposing enhanced benefits for seniors, including more social security, alzheimer's coverage, and cheaper drug costs. She would pay for it by eliminating the tax benefits for trusts
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Old 07-30-2019, 09:35 AM
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Biden only up 2 over Trump in a new poll, quite a bump for Trump.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ep...iden-6247.html
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Old 07-30-2019, 09:53 AM
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Particularly after the polling debacle in 2016 I don’t listen to any pollster. It’s almost impossible for them to get accurate data in the cell phone world we live in. As we saw in 2016 many conservatives just don’t answer poll questions. The pollsters reluctantly called this the “hidden” vote. It’s not really “hidden” it’s just that they’re not polling these folks.
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Old 07-30-2019, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by TA111 View Post
Particularly after the polling debacle in 2016 I don’t listen to any pollster. It’s almost impossible for them to get accurate data in the cell phone world we live in. As we saw in 2016 many conservatives just don’t answer poll questions. The pollsters reluctantly called this the “hidden” vote. It’s not really “hidden” it’s just that they’re not polling these folks.
I think they are still fairly accurate on a macro level (country as a whole). They lose significant accuracy on the micro level (state/local).
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Old 07-30-2019, 10:18 AM
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Part of what is misleading is that we don't use the popular national vote to elect a president. A republican can lose by 40% in California, but it results in a finite number of electoral votes lost. A Democrat can lose by 40% in Texas and the same is true. Electoral votes are what we count.
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  #282  
Old 07-30-2019, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
Part of what is misleading is that we don't use the popular national vote to elect a president. A republican can lose by 40% in California, but it results in a finite number of electoral votes lost. A Democrat can lose by 40% in Texas and the same is true. Electoral votes are what we count.
Correct. This is what makes them inaccurate in predicting a Presidential winner. They can accurately project popular vote, but that is meaningless in the grand scheme of a presidential election.
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  #283  
Old 07-30-2019, 03:29 PM
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To ask people whether they intend to vote has a bunch of false positives. How many people will say they don't intend to vote?

Secondly, to put a known, Trump, up against a person, who may be someone's second or third or fourth choice, is totally inaccurate.

Way too early to believe any poll. They are as accurate as pre-season Super Bowl odds.
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Old 07-30-2019, 03:58 PM
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I think Presidential race polls become significant after the first few Presidential debates. The vetting of the Democratic candidates past, policy positions and character will not take place until then. It will be the first time that someone really challenges "free everything" and the actual policy positions of the Democratic candidate and it gets contrasted against Trump policy.

Last edited by Fudd; 07-30-2019 at 04:35 PM..
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  #285  
Old 07-30-2019, 04:04 PM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
Way too early to believe any poll. They are as accurate as pre-season Super Bowl odds.
Or pre-season all-conference teams, or pre-season Player of the Year, or (my personal favorite) pre-season Freshman of the Year.
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  #286  
Old 07-30-2019, 04:08 PM
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Not only polls, but what about the Nobel Peace Prize?
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Old 07-31-2019, 07:53 AM
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Someone please explain to me why there wasn’t an American Flag on the dem debate stage, nor a flag pin on any of the debaters. Does the Flag trigger these people or their constituents?
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  #288  
Old 07-31-2019, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by TA111 View Post
Someone please explain to me why there wasn’t an American Flag on the dem debate stage, nor a flag pin on any of the debaters. Does the Flag trigger these people or their constituents?
Don't want to offend the far left wack jobs.
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  #289  
Old 07-31-2019, 12:57 PM
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Mueller.

There, I used a word that not a single CNN moderator or candidate used last night after pushing the bogus collusion story for 3 years.
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  #290  
Old 08-02-2019, 10:07 AM
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To those of you out there who have indicated a strong dislike of Trump and his policies, are any of the Democratic candidates appealing to you?

Are you warming up to Joe Biden, Kamala Harris, Cory Booker, Bernie Sanders or Elizabeth Warren? Do you have another who you prefer?
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Old 08-02-2019, 03:21 PM
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Early Forecast

Tulsi Gabbard really exposed Kamala Harris in the most recent debate, and it might be difficult for Harris to shake that “prosecutor” image. Many Democrats do not like police and prosecutor types.

Joe Biden, for reasons posted elsewhere in this thread, has his own significant hurdles, and he’s had major brain surgery and will be 78 on Inauguration Day. Joe Biden of 10 years ago would have a strong shot at the nomination, but I think the Joe Biden of 2019 will struggle.

That leaves Bernie and Warren, who are basically splitting the “progressive” vote right now. Warren is younger and more polished than Bernie, so I’m going to try and call it way early: Elizabeth Warren is your 2020 Democratic nominee for President (unless a surprise like Michelle Obama or someone jumps into the race).

People say Warren is an East Coast progressive elite type who can’t relate to people in the Midwest and South, but keep in mind she grew up in a blue collar Methodist family in Oklahoma. I think she can probably relate to Heartland folks better than someone like Hillary. She has also shown a fiery, combative side that Democrats want to see against Trump. I’m also not sure the Pocahontas thing will hurt her too much because her family told her that they had Native American heritage and she can just say she was proud of that. I doubt that would be a deciding or even important factor in someone’s vote: “Well, I like Elizabeth Warren, but she thought she was Native American so I can’t vote for her.”
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Old 08-02-2019, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by FlyerGuyer View Post
Tulsi Gabbard really exposed Kamala Harris in the most recent debate, and it might be difficult for Harris to shake that “prosecutor” image. Many Democrats do not like police and prosecutor types.

Joe Biden, for reasons posted elsewhere in this thread, has his own significant hurdles, and he’s had major brain surgery and will be 78 on Inauguration Day. Joe Biden of 10 years ago would have a strong shot at the nomination, but I think the Joe Biden of 2019 will struggle.

That leaves Bernie and Warren, who are basically splitting the “progressive” vote right now. Warren is younger and more polished than Bernie, so I’m going to try and call it way early: Elizabeth Warren is your 2020 Democratic nominee for President (unless a surprise like Michelle Obama or someone jumps into the race).

People say Warren is an East Coast progressive elite type who can’t relate to people in the Midwest and South, but keep in mind she grew up in a blue collar Methodist family in Oklahoma. I think she can probably relate to Heartland folks better than someone like Hillary. She has also shown a fiery, combative side that Democrats want to see against Trump. I’m also not sure the Pocahontas thing will hurt her too much because her family told her that they had Native American heritage and she can just say she was proud of that. I doubt that would be a deciding or even important factor in someone’s vote: “Well, I like Elizabeth Warren, but she thought she was Native American so I can’t vote for her.”
The thing about the native American heritage debacle is that it was used to further her educational opportunities and career opportunities, from what I understand.
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Old 08-02-2019, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Fudd View Post
The thing about the native American heritage debacle is that it was used to further her educational opportunities and career opportunities, from what I understand.

True, I’m just not sure how much that will hurt her. It might, but she could just spin it like she was a blue collar girl from Oklahoma (dad died when she was young) who was told she has Native American heritage and was up against a “man’s world” back then. So even if she “cheated” a little, perhaps some people might not hold it against her much (although some will, of course).

In a weird way, it might actually help her in the current climate of Democrats and the media obsessed with calling Trump and Republicans racist. Whenever Warren is labeled “Pocahontas,” they can just say: “See, just another race-based and sexist attack!”
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Old 08-02-2019, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by FlyerGuyer View Post
True, I’m just not sure how much that will hurt her. It might, but she could just spin it like she was a blue collar girl from Oklahoma (dad died when she was young) who was told she has Native American heritage and was up against a “man’s world” back then. So even if she “cheated” a little, perhaps some people might not hold it against her much (although some will, of course).

In a weird way, it might actually help her in the current climate of Democrats and the media obsessed with calling Trump and Republicans racist. Whenever Warren is labeled “Pocahontas,” they can just say: “See, just another race-based and sexist attack!”
How can it be race based when she isn’t Native American? In addition, she has already ticked off the Native Americans after that DNA stunt. She’s a joke.
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Old 08-02-2019, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by FlyerGuyer View Post
Tulsi Gabbard really exposed Kamala Harris in the most recent debate, and it might be difficult for Harris to shake that “prosecutor” image. Many Democrats do not like police and prosecutor types.

Joe Biden, for reasons posted elsewhere in this thread, has his own significant hurdles, and he’s had major brain surgery and will be 78 on Inauguration Day. Joe Biden of 10 years ago would have a strong shot at the nomination, but I think the Joe Biden of 2019 will struggle.

That leaves Bernie and Warren, who are basically splitting the “progressive” vote right now. Warren is younger and more polished than Bernie, so I’m going to try and call it way early: Elizabeth Warren is your 2020 Democratic nominee for President (unless a surprise like Michelle Obama or someone jumps into the race).

People say Warren is an East Coast progressive elite type who can’t relate to people in the Midwest and South, but keep in mind she grew up in a blue collar Methodist family in Oklahoma. I think she can probably relate to Heartland folks better than someone like Hillary. She has also shown a fiery, combative side that Democrats want to see against Trump. I’m also not sure the Pocahontas thing will hurt her too much because her family told her that they had Native American heritage and she can just say she was proud of that. I doubt that would be a deciding or even important factor in someone’s vote: “Well, I like Elizabeth Warren, but she thought she was Native American so I can’t vote for her.”
She’s a full blown socialist. You think demolishing private health insurance, open borders, giving free healthcare to illegals, etc.. is going to play well in most of the country? I refer you back to George McGovern.
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  #296  
Old 08-02-2019, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by TA111 View Post
She’s a full blown socialist. You think demolishing private health insurance, open borders, giving free healthcare to illegals, etc.. is going to play well in most of the country? I refer you back to George McGovern.

Well, I’m trying to be objective in this analysis, so yes, I do think it will play well in the Democratic primary, which is how the nomination is won. The only major candidate who arguably isn’t considerably “socialist” is maybe Biden, and I’ve already outlined why I think he will not get the nomination. We have a long way to go, but at this point I don’t think any of the Democrats will beat Trump except maybe Gabbard, who is hated by the DNC so she won’t get the nomination—at least not this time.

However, you have to understand that there is a large portion of the country that absolutely despises Trump and would vote for anyone against him, so I think a McGovern-style landslide defeat is unlikely in the current climate. We’re not in 1972 anymore, Toto...
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Old 08-02-2019, 06:21 PM
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Originally Posted by TA111 View Post
How can it be race based when she isn’t Native America?

Yes, but you know it will be spun that way when she is attacked on that basis. Also, keep in mind that there are millions of people in the country who think differently than you do, they just don’t post on this board (except for maybe Drain the Swampy)...
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  #298  
Old 08-03-2019, 08:33 AM
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I do not like Warren even a little bit, but I admit she is one of the smarter people running for the Dems, and that is why she has a good shot. The mental midgets like Biden and Sanders will fade later.

Still waiting for someone to ask Bernie, "If you have all these ideas and are a leader, why have you not implemented some meaningful things in all those years in Congress?"
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Mad Props to jack72 For This Totally Excellent Post:
FlyerGuyer (08-03-2019)
  #299  
Old 08-03-2019, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by FlyerGuyer View Post
Well, I’m trying to be objective in this analysis, so yes, I do think it will play well in the Democratic primary, which is how the nomination is won. The only major candidate who arguably isn’t considerably “socialist” is maybe Biden, and I’ve already outlined why I think he will not get the nomination. We have a long way to go, but at this point I don’t think any of the Democrats will beat Trump except maybe Gabbard, who is hated by the DNC so she won’t get the nomination—at least not this time.

However, you have to understand that there is a large portion of the country that absolutely despises Trump and would vote for anyone against him, so I think a McGovern-style landslide defeat is unlikely in the current climate. We’re not in 1972 anymore, Toto...
I certainly hope she is the nominee. Her far left base, while very vocal, are a very small sliver of the electorate.
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  #300  
Old 08-03-2019, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by FlyerGuyer View Post
Well, I’m trying to be objective in this analysis, so yes, I do think it will play well in the Democratic primary, which is how the nomination is won. The only major candidate who arguably isn’t considerably “socialist” is maybe Biden, and I’ve already outlined why I think he will not get the nomination. We have a long way to go, but at this point I don’t think any of the Democrats will beat Trump except maybe Gabbard, who is hated by the DNC so she won’t get the nomination—at least not this time.

However, you have to understand that there is a large portion of the country that absolutely despises Trump and would vote for anyone against him, so I think a McGovern-style landslide defeat is unlikely in the current climate. We’re not in 1972 anymore, Toto...
I'm fascinated by the whole situation. The extremely vocal far left socialist portion of the party loves the Bernies and the Warrens. That is where much of the radical leftist media is as well. They seem to be dominating the chatter about the debates.

But where would the UAC's of the world go if Warren or Bernie or a similar radical was chosen to be the Democratic nominee? Is the dislike of Trump enough to drive that kind of voter to be a Socialist?
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