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View Poll Results: The shot goes in 1/2 second after the halftime horn...what's your call???
It's good, count the basket! Good lord, it's a 3rd grad game! 9 40.91%
Wave it off...after the buzzer is after the buzzer...apologize and move on. 13 59.09%
Voters: 22. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old 01-22-2019, 02:21 PM
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You Make the Call - count the basket or not?

Since IAFlyer posted a YMtC, I'll post one too. It happened this weekend and I got an earful of BOOOOOOOs for my call!

3rd grade boys....the score is Blue 16, White 4 with just a few seconds left in the 2nd qtr. White throws the ball in and a kid chucks up a 3-pointer (4.....3......2....) and he missed everything. White teammate catches the ball (...1.....HORN!...), shoots and (clearly after the horn goes off) scores! Or did he???

Rollo the Royal Ref has the call and doesn't hesitate! And the fans start BOOOOing like I just cost My Flyers a win against _avier.

The reaction was so strong that I had to go to the scorers table and explain my call to the coaches and scorekeepers.

What call would you make????

I'll explain my call at 2:30 Wednesday.
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  #2  
Old 01-22-2019, 02:56 PM
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Everyone knows that most refs are not really blind, but most are deaf. What horn? The basket is good.
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  #3  
Old 01-22-2019, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
White teammate catches the ball (...1.....HORN!...), shoots and (clearly after the horn goes off) scores! Or did he???
My vote is predicated on what you wrote. So start with the assumption that the ball was still in his hand after the horn, not some scenario where you're trying to say the ball left his hand but had not gone through the hoop.

Not everyone gets a trophy. If you'd like to score, kid, shoot it before the horn goes off. You'd have 10 teary-eyed kids on the other team screaming about it being unfair just to play to the crowd.

It's not about you, Enrico Pelazzo.
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Old 01-22-2019, 03:17 PM
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If the ball is in his hands when the clock hits 0.0 then no shot.
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Old 01-22-2019, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
My vote is predicated on what you wrote.
I see where I may have mislead the masses...my narrative is 100% correct. The horn went off before the kid let go of the shot. The actual poll question implies the shot may have been released before the horn...it wasn't.

The order was: missed shot....catch...horn...shot (GOOD?!?!)
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Old 01-22-2019, 03:32 PM
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If it were me the basket is GOOD!
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Old 01-22-2019, 03:45 PM
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Should the rules change because they are 3rd graders?
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Old 01-22-2019, 04:00 PM
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Clearly go to the monitors.... you should went into the stands to talk to some angry mother that had it recorded on their phone. Then you can show them on video how they don't now the rules.

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Old 01-22-2019, 04:21 PM
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I'd vote for option B, but I wouldn't apologize. Happened to my kid's 2nd grade team. Wife had the video and all. Ball was still on his fingers as the clock hit 0 on what would have been a game winning 3 point heave at the buzzer in overtime. As a parent I can't believe he called it off as close as it was (arms were even already fully extended), but as a basketball fan I have to admit it was the right call. We lost by 3 in the 2nd OT.
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Old 01-22-2019, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
I see where I may have mislead the masses...my narrative is 100% correct. The horn went off before the kid let go of the shot. The actual poll question implies the shot may have been released before the horn...it wasn't.

The order was: missed shot....catch...horn...shot (GOOD?!?!)
I have been in enough local gyms to know at times the horn and clock are not synced. My guess is you had a visual on the clock, which in your opinion had not hit zero when it left the kids hand.

Or your getting soft (snowflake cough cough) in your old age and handing out participation trophies to every kid who makes a basket
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Old 01-22-2019, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by MikeFlyer View Post
Should the rules change because they are 3rd graders?
Are you being facious? Have you ever seen a 3rd grade basketball game? Or any other sporting event?
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Old 01-22-2019, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by MikeFlyer View Post
Should the rules change because they are 3rd graders?
The rules don't change, but the interpretation by the good officials does.

I have coached 3rd on up. The good officials consistently use the game to teach. If you called every traveling, carry, double dribble, pulled pivot, etc...it would be even worse to watch and nothing would get accomplished. I will say that at the 2-3 grade you would see a violation of some sorts half of all possessions. Let alone kids toes hitting the stripe on free throws.

As the kids get older, so does the officials interpretation of calls. As it should. And in our division, coaches understand this. Yes, we may complain at times, but try to quickly remind ourselves these are young kids and VERY rarely does the quality of officiating have an impact on the outcome of these games.

I can imagine in this case, with the losing team getting shellacked and the inability for kids to score at this age, you can count the bucket and move on and many parents, and coaches would understand. Unfortunately, if it is called as it should...no shot...Rollo still gets an earful either way. I can't remember the order of importance...but as the kids get older it is red light on scoreboard, clock, horn...something like that...may have it wrong. Tournament formats are hard on officials with games typically having a briefcase clock on a scorers table versus one on the wall. You almost have to go with the horn as you can't watch play on the court and view the clock.

At these ages, parents need to realize they are spectators during the hour long games. Not coaches, not officials, not parents (unless your kid gets hurt). Be a spectator during the game, coach and parent your kid after the game...and address issues with coaches at the appropriate time.

College officials have the luxury of the blowing of the whistle electronically stopping the clock and being able to activate it with a switch on their belt. They also have the luxury of backboard lights, multiple horns, multiple clocks, etc...Youth officials...good luck with a scoreboard working at times.

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Old 01-23-2019, 07:10 AM
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Since the question is: "what call would you make?" the answer is easy...basket is good!

Good refs take into account time and situation...
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Old 01-23-2019, 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Are you being facious? Have you ever seen a 3rd grade basketball game? Or any other sporting event?
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I'll assume you mean factious. No I don't watch 3rd graders. I am old, seen and played lots of sports, rules are rules.
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Old 01-23-2019, 10:48 AM
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If you allow the basket to count, you harm Blue's defensive efficiency numbers and therefore their NET. It could affect their seeding in the CYO tournament. It could be the difference between going to the First Four at Corpus Christi or playing closer to home at Holy Angels on the second weekend.
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Old 01-23-2019, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by MikeFlyer View Post
I'll assume you mean factious. No I don't watch 3rd graders. I am old, seen and played lots of sports, rules are rules.
Actually I meant 'facetious' because I thought you were joking.

My call will be explained at 2:30 after the poll closes.
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Old 01-23-2019, 02:38 PM
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Final Poll: 13 say wave it off; 9 say count it.

I royally applaud the 9 UDPriders who have a heart, soul and understanding of the entire role an official has when reffing a game.

I'm not going to lecture the masses here, I'm only going to say what I've told any number of CYO parents as they scream at me for not calling a dragged foot (travel) or missed dribble (double dribble or palming) in a blow-out game; "Only a complete *sshole would call that".

FWIW, the white coach was very appreciative of the break and the blue coach laughed at the parents who boo'd me and completely agreed with the call. As I told him, that may be the 'only basket he's scored all year' or it may be the 'only basket his grandparents will see' him make. With everyone in total agreement, the 2nd half went great, Blue won by a lot and some kid - as a White parent told me - was going to get ice cream from his parents for the ride home. (shouldn't I get some, too???)

(FWIW, if the basket would have been a difference maker, I'd have waved it off. )

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Old 01-23-2019, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Final Poll: 13 say wave it off; 9 say count it.

I royally applaud the 9 UDPriders who have a heart, soul and understanding of the entire role an official has when reffing a game.

I'm not going to lecture the masses here, I'm only going to say what I've told any number of CYO parents as they scream at me for not calling a dragged foot (travel) or missed dribble (double dribble or palming) in a blow-out game; "Only a complete *sshole would call that".

FWIW, the white coach was very appreciative of the break and the blue coach laughed at the parents who boo'd me and completely agreed with the call. As I told him, that may be the 'only basket he's scored all year' or it may be the 'only basket his grandparents will see' him make. With everyone in total agreement, the 2nd half went great, Blue won by a lot and some kid - as a White parent told me - was going to get ice cream from his parents for the ride home. (shouldn't I get some, too???)

(FWIW, if the basket would have been a difference maker, I'd have waved it off. )

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A kindler, gentler Rollo?
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Old 01-23-2019, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Radar View Post
A kindler, gentler Rollo?
Rollo, MAGA!
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