Fordham Game Thread - Page 3

moville · #**201** 01-14-2009, 10:03 PM

I'm wondering . . . in the 40 some-odd years I've been following the Flyers . . . how many years have they taken off my life because of games like this? I can certainly tell you that the bottle of Canadian Club that was half full at half time is about a quarter-full now.

Yeah, I know, a win's a win . . . but something's gotta be wrong if we can't beat these guys at home by more than one point and really should have lost. Somebodies got their heads up their rectums . . . including the guys in the suits on the sidelines.

For god's sakes, let your players work up a sweat before you take them out. You gotta be out there for 15 minutes to get a feel for the flow of the game. They are not 50 years old. They are 19, 20 and 21 -- they are supposed to run and work up a sweat and feel it. You don't feel it sitting and looking.

FlyerFanatic21 · #**202** 01-14-2009, 10:06 PM

22-36 at the FT line tonight. Just make those and this game is easily put away. 21 3pt attempts is too many for this team as well.

And don't mean to make any of you further ill, but SLU beat down UMass in their 2nd half tonight.

33mins for MJ tonight.

kiefaber455 · #**203** 01-14-2009, 10:06 PM

Originally Posted by anthonycharles

Not when your a team that can only win by playing great defense. I love ST, but he doesn't give you the defense night in and night out like London does.

First of all, this teams defense has almost been non-existent the last 2 games; he fouled on a 3 point shot near the end of a game, that could have cost his team a victory; his decision making was akin to last year's; and did you see the jump shot he took, it may go down as the ugliest shot ever in college basketball

Schraff01 · #**204** 01-14-2009, 10:10 PM

Hopefully we'll get a good seed in the CBI tournament this year and make a good run!

Buster · #**205** 01-14-2009, 10:10 PM

Hey Everyone! I stepped away from my computer for the last 3 minutes of the game. Anything interesting happen???

swish61 · #**206** 01-14-2009, 10:11 PM

I don't want to be negative. So I'll try to put this in a constructive manner....Charlie Coles was right, and in my heart I've known it all along. Play your best guys BG.
Too many substitutions has created chaos on the bench, and on the floor. Guys come in and don't even know who they are guarding. Combinations are spasmodic, and don't make sense. BG, I think is letting his assistants make the call on who goes in, and who comes out, and HE is the one who should be making those calls. I can give you example after example if I cared to type that much, which I don't.
Donoher never lost control like this, and he was a master at getting the right men on the floor. Cut the rotation down, BG put the guys in and out, and we will take off for a new flight.

Sea Bass · #**207** 01-14-2009, 10:18 PM

Originally Posted by swish61

So I'll try to put this in a constructive manner....Charlie Coles was right, and in my heart I've known it all along. Play your best guys BG.
Too many substitutions has created chaos on the bench, and on the floor.

and unless you are playing 40 minutes of hell ... and the Flyers aren't. The wear 'em down thing tends to become less effective.

This team never gets in any rythym.

moville · #**208** 01-14-2009, 10:19 PM

Swish 61 . . . you nailed it man. Too many subs. Donoher got us to the Elite 8 in '84 with seven guys, really 6. The Final Four in '67 with six guys. The NIT championship with, really, seven guys.

I think they still played 20 minute halfs back then. Those guys ran in practice. And ran. And ran. And ran.

Sea Bass · #**209** 01-14-2009, 10:20 PM

BG ought to send Whittenberg a thank you note for scrapping the zone and playing man-to-man that last posession

ud86 · #**210** 01-14-2009, 10:31 PM

Originally Posted by swish61

I don't want to be negative. So I'll try to put this in a constructive manner....Charlie Coles was right, and in my heart I've known it all along. Play your best guys BG. Too many substitutions has created chaos on the bench, and on the floor.

I agree, but unfortunately I don't expect BG to change his tactics -- which I think is main part of the problem. Has BG ever, ever made a mid-season correction change in his strategy? Perhaps he's too stubborn to admit his initial strategy now needs to change.

Ever wonder why we seem to do ok (even well) 1st half of the season, but fail in conference play? Every year, UMASS seems to create a playbook for other A10 opponents to follow to beat UD. Should UD make an adjustment? Yes. But will BG really make a change? Unfortunately, no.

Bill McPeek · #**211** 01-14-2009, 10:36 PM

Originally Posted by Sea Bass

BG ought to send Whittenberg a thank you note for scrapping the zone and playing man-to-man that last posession

Sea Bass...in all fairness, RL pushed the ball so FU never was in a set D. They had to stop the ball which they didn't do. There were 10 seconds left when we inbounded the ball and RL just took the ball to the rim.

UD93 Steve · #**212** 01-14-2009, 10:39 PM

Originally Posted by Flyers80

Can't wait to hear BG's press conference quotes.....

"Well Fordham came out with a lot of intensity and great defense. They play much better than a 2-12 team. We had the flu - but I was really pleased with the great defense we played. Our shooting is off a bit but we had some folks out this week with the flu. Did I mention we had the flu this week?."

from daytonflyers.com
Head Coach Brian Gregory
"We did not defend well, we did not rebound well. On a consistent basis we lost a lot of poise on the offense. When we try to do things quick it's just not going to happen. The free throws and a couple fouls at the end...it was a total lack of concentration. Not going to lie to...I'm not happy."

"The only positive through the whole night was the fact that after Fordham took the lead with 10 seconds to go, we executed the play as exactly as planned to win the game."
"Here's the deal we will not be successful if we let teams shoot 44 percent and we don't rebound well. We play better when we are getting stops. If we're not getting stops we tend to hurry the offense. We've played poorly defensively the last two games."
"As a coach your heart goes out to Derek Whittenburg (Fordham head coach) and his team because they outplayed us the whole game. We just made enough plays to win the game. We played well the last 10 seconds and that's it."
"We won't get the same result against Duquesne if we played like we did tonight. They are very good. They are 3-0 in the league and it's going to be a big game. They are a very tough, physical team...a blue collar team. If you don't match it then you don't have a chance when you go on the road." "Marcus saved us in the last five minutes of the first half. He made some great plays at the basket. He got us energized and got us that lead at half time. He did some good things in the second half as well. He gave good effort on the defensive glass as well. He's been our most consistent player. To be truthful, we need even more out of him."

Sea Bass · #**213** 01-14-2009, 10:41 PM

Originally Posted by Bill McPeek

Sea Bass...in all fairness, RL pushed the ball so FU never was in a set D. They had to stop the ball which they didn't do. There were 10 seconds left when we inbounded the ball and RL just took the ball to the rim.

you can't stop ball with one player when a guy is running at you. The Flyers spread the floor, if DW was going to play man he had to do something to get RL going horizontally befre getting to the 3 point lines.

Fordham's zone had done a nice job of stopping the penetration.

swish61 · #**214** 01-14-2009, 10:41 PM

Originally Posted by ud86

I agree, but unfortunately I don't expect BG to change his tactics -- which I think is main part of the problem. Has BG ever, ever made a mid-season correction change in his strategy? Perhaps he's too stubborn to admit his initial strategy now needs to change.

Ever wonder why we seem to do ok (even well) 1st half of the season, but fail in conference play? Every year, UMASS seems to create a playbook for other A10 opponents to follow to beat UD. Should UD make an adjustment? Yes. But will BG really make a change? Unfortunately, no.

I think that our outgoing Pres had the same problem. Sometimes just too stubborn. We DO need to change some things, and it is evident to observers. Not to say that BG didn't have the right perspective for our first dozen games, in fact, I feel he did awesome the first part of the year. Look at all the playing time the young guys got, that can only help in the future. But now we are in the thick of things, and it gets hairy from here. Alot is at stake. In spite of what recruits have been promised, games need to be won.

Bill McPeek · #**215** 01-14-2009, 10:43 PM

Originally Posted by Sea Bass

you can't stop ball with one player when a guy is running at you. The Flyers spread the floor, if DW was going to play man he had to do something to get RL going horizontally befre getting to the 3 point lines.

Fordham's zone had done a nice job of stopping the penetration.

Time was the factor. Everything happened too quickly. I don't think we really know what D he wanted to be in. We all know that in any D the ball must be stopped before any D can be set. I understand that by spreading the floor created the opening for RL but did FU really have enough time to get back into any D? I do understand what you are saying. So, BG did a good coaching job by spreading the floor? Once RL got the ball past half court FU had to be in a scramble D. He had beat the D down the floor.

pjflyer · #**216** 01-14-2009, 10:57 PM

12 deep?

Dayton's starters:

18-34 from the field

Bench

4-20 from the field

ParkerUD09 · #**217** 01-14-2009, 11:06 PM

Starting Lineup at Duquesne:

Rob Lowery
Chris Johnson
Marcus Johnson
Chris Wright
Devin Searcy

Subs:
Charles Little
Stephen Thomas
Kurt Huelsman

Sounds like a great 8 man rotation.

Bill McPeek · #**218** 01-14-2009, 11:15 PM

While we would like to think that our rotations are set at this point in the season. fact is this team is still evolving. I really think that PW is the key to how things will play ot for the remainder of the year. Will the player rotations be the same say three weeks from now as they are now...time will tell. I don know that I personally would like to see CJ and CW on the floor at the same time.

jumpin' joe · #**219** 01-14-2009, 11:18 PM

Originally Posted by Sea Bass

This team never gets in any rythym.

Absolutely! I saw a team without rythym and chemistry. The substitution pattern didn't work tonight. What makes a good team is having players on the court that know what their teammates are going to do before they actually do it. We didn't have that tonight which means poor rebounding at times, some costly turnovers, and botched defensive assignments. I'm not down on our team. Bottom line...we played horrible and won.

swish61 · #**220** 01-14-2009, 11:20 PM

Originally Posted by Bill McPeek

While we would like to think that our rotations are set at this point in the season. fact is this team is still evolving. I really think that PW is the key to how things will play ot for the remainder of the year. Will the player rotations be the same say three weeks from now as they are now...time will tell. I don know that I personally would like to see CJ and CW on the floor at the same time.

Come on Bill, where are you going with this? What are you trying to say?

Bill McPeek · #**221** 01-14-2009, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by swish61

Come on Bill, where are you going with this? What are you trying to say?

Exactly what I said ....this team is still evolving. What are you getting at? Am I missing something?

shocka43 · #**222** 01-15-2009, 12:27 AM

Originally Posted by Bill McPeek

Exactly what I said ....this team is still evolving. What are you getting at? Am I missing something?

Unfortunately we have been talking about evolution for seasons now. There hasn't been much. Lots of promise and stagnant progress. Somethings got to give and it unfortunately the glass isn't always half full.

They have a LONG way to go in order to accomplish the ideas that most of us have for a successful season.

Better keep the Miller Lite flowing at the Arena and the Maker's Mark at the house. Gonna be a stressful one.

CvilleFlyer · #**223** 01-15-2009, 01:55 AM

Originally Posted by ud86

I agree, but unfortunately I don't expect BG to change his tactics -- which I think is main part of the problem. Has BG ever, ever made a mid-season correction change in his strategy? Perhaps he's too stubborn to admit his initial strategy now needs to change.

Ever wonder why we seem to do ok (even well) 1st half of the season, but fail in conference play? Every year, UMASS seems to create a playbook for other A10 opponents to follow to beat UD. Should UD make an adjustment? Yes. But will BG really make a change? Unfortunately, no.

I agree. Last season after Chris Wright's injury UMass double and triple teamed BRob and took him out of the game and thereby gave every other A-10 team a blueprint on how to beat Dayton. Same thing this season. UMass guards, Lowe and Harris, penetrated to the basket to break down our defense. Notice how that was Fordham's strategy tonight although they kicked it back out for 3's more than UMass. Chances are Duquesne will do the same thing on Saturday and they even have better shooters than both UMass and Fordham! We need to make the necessary changes to counteract our opponents or its going to be a long rest of the season.

flyerpassion · #**224** 01-15-2009, 02:42 AM

Originally Posted by longtimefan67

One that thinks the Flyers don't even come close to looking like the same defensive team we saw earlier in the season?

WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE PEOPLE!!!! It's not that we aren't the same defensive team...It's that we aren't playing St. Anthony's School for the Blind and Deaf anymore. Isn't it pretty clear that every legit team we've played this season has scored in the 70's!

Sorry longtimefan67....I mean no disrespect to you, but I'm just tired of all of the "defense" comments. We're simply playing better teams now....even Fordham. If you watched the games earlier this season in the Non conference at home, and the Fordham game....Fordham clearly had a LOT more talent...especially at the guard spot.