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  #1  
Old 03-13-2014, 11:13 PM
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Defeating St. Joes

The keys to defeating St. Joe tomorrow.

1) Need great post play. Kanacevic hurt UD big time last game. If Kav and Robinson can play like the did at St. Louis (Negate Loe and score), they have a chance.
2) Don't let Roberts dominate. He is big and a force inside on offense and defense.
3) Wear down St. Joe or get them in foul trouble. They are not deep, but they will be rested.
4) Sibert and Vee stay hot
5) Play with pay back in their hearts.
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Old 03-14-2014, 08:25 AM
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The Flyers need to come out of the blocks fast. They have the advantage of already having played a game and will be used to the rims and the floor. sJU sucks at FTs so when in doubt send 'EM to the line.
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Old 03-14-2014, 08:30 AM
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Drive drive drive to the basket. Shot WAY too many jumpers in Philly (partly because of the lack of energy in that game, which leads to more "eh, this shot is good enough" shots). We have the players to get to the line and get the Hawks in foul trouble... Scoochie, DP, VS, JS, MK, JR, heck even KP can all do it. We just need to commit to it and actually do it. Of course, if the refs swallow their whistles all game, we might be in for a really difficult time.
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Old 03-14-2014, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by priceg75 View Post
Drive drive drive to the basket. Shot WAY too many jumpers in Philly (partly because of the lack of energy in that game, which leads to more "eh, this shot is good enough" shots). We have the players to get to the line and get the Hawks in foul trouble... Scoochie, DP, VS, JS, MK, JR, heck even KP can all do it. We just need to commit to it and actually do it. Of course, if the refs swallow their whistles all game, we might be in for a really difficult time.
I like the idea of taking it to the hoop and into the paint. However, our key players who can do this have struggled when the opponent has some shot blockers, and St. Joe's does. I think we should push the ball against this team. They aren't all that quick; it neutralizes their big guys; and their lack of depth hurts them in that type of a game. So Archie's key to success today - push the ball every time down court...and I wouldn't mind seeing a little extra pressure on defense. A helter-skelter game favors us immensely.
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Old 03-14-2014, 10:17 AM
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Play like they did in the 1h yesterday. When we play like that we can play with anyone! The first 5 minutes of the 2h reminded me a little of the game at st Joe's. We were able to work our way out of it yesterday but don't count on St Joe's letting us get away with that (as they proved a couple of weeks ago). I'm on the train right now heading to Brooklyn and if they play their game I'm looking forward to making the trip back on Sunday! Go Flyers!!
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Old 03-14-2014, 10:24 AM
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  #7  
Old 03-14-2014, 10:29 AM
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When our threes fall, it opens up everything.

We have 4 guys who (lately) can hit the three . . . sometimes 5!

I think that will be a key factor.
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Old 03-14-2014, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan View Post
The keys to defeating St. Joe tomorrow.

1) Need great post play. Kanacevic hurt UD big time last game. If Kav and Robinson can play like the did at St. Louis (Negate Loe and score), they have a chance.
2) Don't let Roberts dominate. He is big and a force inside on offense and defense.
3) Wear down St. Joe or get them in foul trouble. They are not deep, but they will be rested.
4) Sibert and Vee stay hot
5) Play with pay back in their hearts.
After viewing the Fordham game in the third row right behind the basket, I would have to strongly agree with STF on numbers one and two. If Kavs, Scott, and JR play like they did yesterday we go back to Ohio today.
GO FLYERS AND LETS EXTEND YOUR NY STAY UNTIL SUNDAY.
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:01 AM
BRob2Perryman3 BRob2Perryman3 is offline
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Originally Posted by LI Flyer View Post
After viewing the Fordham game in the third row right behind the basket, I would have to strongly agree with STF on numbers one and two. If Kavs, Scott, and JR play like they did yesterday we go back to Ohio today.
GO FLYERS AND LETS EXTEND YOUR NY STAY UNTIL SUNDAY.
Scott should not be playing. Id split the "5" minutes 20/20 for Jalen and Kavs. And if Jalen is playing well give him more
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by BRob2Perryman3 View Post
Scott should not be playing. Id split the "5" minutes 20/20 for Jalen and Kavs. And if Jalen is playing well give him more
Scott has to play. This the absolute worst kind of game for Kavs....He gets beat off the dribble and vertical with good big men......Jalen played pretty darn good last game against these guys but can't do it alone. This is the absolute kind of game Scott can play in and play physical. Plus, they're going to need some scrap plays along with his fouls..
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:21 AM
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Devon actually player ok yesterday. Can't say the same about Scoochie -again. Another ofer and nothing much from a defense or rebounding or assist standpoint.
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by BRob2Perryman3 View Post
Scott should not be playing. Id split the "5" minutes 20/20 for Jalen and Kavs. And if Jalen is playing well give him more
Totally agree! Yesterday I was wondering why Archie kept him in the game so long. At one point Pecora brought in this 6' 8" freshman named Leonard, who pushed DS around like he was Josh Benson. Additionally, Ryan Rhoomes was scoring easily while guarded by Scott.
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:24 AM
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Scott had a pretty decent game yesterday. I'm not for giving him the bulk of the minutes, but we will need a few quality minutes from him today. #35 cannot stay with anyone when his man is facing the basket. He has no lateral movement at all. Jalen needs to show up today.

Our problem again yesterday was dribble penetration by their guards. They were getting to the rim anytime they wanted in the 2nd half. Scooch, Khari and Vee need to stop the driving.
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:34 AM
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Scott gets caught out of position to often, is a terrible and i mean terrible overall defender. He plays scared on offense, too many shot fakes, too many fumbling of passes. And on offense he causes unforced turnovers with those **** moving screens. Scott should only play if the other two are in foul trouble. Gotta tighten everything up today. Oliver will be on Kanacevic and im interested in what the other two can do on Roberts. On the plus side, Roberts will never venture far from the hoop and he and Kanacevic are terrible free throw shooters. Everyone in that starting 5 is below average except Galloway
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:48 AM
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For the reasons stated above, we need to be in contact with every offensively-minded and unsigned junior college '5' in the country right now.
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by BRob2Perryman3 View Post
Scott gets caught out of position to often, is a terrible and i mean terrible overall defender. He plays scared on offense, too many shot fakes, too many fumbling of passes. And on offense he causes unforced turnovers with those **** moving screens. Scott should only play if the other two are in foul trouble. Gotta tighten everything up today. Oliver will be on Kanacevic and im interested in what the other two can do on Roberts. On the plus side, Roberts will never venture far from the hoop and he and Kanacevic are terrible free throw shooters. Everyone in that starting 5 is below average except Galloway
LMAO....You could easily substitute, and go even further, the name MK here...Did you not watch theses guys, as well as every other BIG that can fart and pee at the same time, treat MK like a juvenile?? MK is in there to make a few plays a game and maybe pass out of the post....Scott WILL and SHOULD play today and more than you think.
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
For the reasons stated above, we need to be in contact with every offensively-minded and unsigned junior college '5' in the country right now.
Be nice if Big Steve can come in and just be a mountain in the middle. Simply alter shots, grab 6 rebounds make a couple layups/putbacks and shoot 70% on freebies
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by steve View Post
LMAO....You could easily substitute, and go even further, the name MK here...Did you not watch theses guys, as well as every other BIG that can fart and pee at the same time, treat MK like a juvenile?? MK is in there to make a few plays a game and maybe pass out of the post....Scott WILL and SHOULD play today and more than you think.
LMAO? what, are you 12?

Anyway, yeah, Kavs isnt good, but he is a much better option then Scott.

Hes a better defender which isnt saying much and he gives you a 15 foot jump shot.

You have been watching this team right?
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by BRob2Perryman3 View Post
Be nice if Big Steve can come in and just be a mountain in the middle. Simply alter shots, grab 6 rebounds make a couple layups/putbacks and shoot 70% on freebies
Be nice if I could hit the lottery tonite, too...and to play it safe, I'm not counting on either happening...
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Old 03-14-2014, 11:58 AM
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Maverick Morgan would be getting some serious playing time for a freshman. He is buried at Illinois. And not dancing, either.

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Old 03-14-2014, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by BRob2Perryman3 View Post
LMAO? what, are you 12?

Anyway, yeah, Kavs isnt good, but he is a much better option then Scott.

Hes a better defender which isnt saying much and he gives you a 15 foot jump shot.

You have been watching this team right?
So one has to actually be 12 to "LMAO" at the rather irrational and emotional crud you just posted? Again, do YOU watch the games? Go respond to how MK looked against most all athletic BIGS this year let alone the abuse he took at SJU. BTW, who is "hes" and what is "isnt".....Now that's also funny..
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:10 PM
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Barring foul trouble to Jalen and Kavs, Scott will get at MOST 5 minutes
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by CoffeeCan View Post
Maverick Morgan would be getting some serious playing time for a freshman. He is buried at Illinois. And not dancing, either.
Maverick Morgan blew off UD because he didn't want to set picks for the next 4 years. Have you seen how Illinois uses their '5'? He made the right choice.
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:14 PM
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Thanks coach. Guess Devin can now put his game face on with some guaranteed minutes....I was worried there..
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Maverick Morgan blew off UD because he didn't want to set picks for the next 4 years. Have you seen how Illinois uses their '5'? He made the right choice.
Our bigs are setting picks because thats all they are capable of. You dont think Archie would utilize Maverick's skill set if he had him?
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Maverick Morgan blew off UD because he didn't want to set picks for the next 4 years. Have you seen how Illinois uses their '5'? He made the right choice.
Maybe if we had a legit 5 that would change. But not if we dont sign some quality big men. Let's hope StevieMac comes to play and maybe AM will incorporate him in the offense.
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:21 PM
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Think it's a bit unfair to group Archie in with BG and how they use the 5 position offensively. I seem to recall in AM's first year that both Benson (until he got hurt) and MK had pretty good years offensively...Last year they did not have a true 5 so JR and Scott were forced to play that spot. A couple 6' 9" freshmen who ae not C's just learning the ropes did not do too bad.

UD was not good last year and it's quite possible that Morgan wanted to also go to a larger and better conference, a very good BB program, as well, and go against more accomplished BIGS..Not to mention the kid also had a very good relationship with Groce.
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:27 PM
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If we bring the same (lack of) effort on the defensive glass we had yesterday when Fordham had 13 offensive rebounds, we're cooked.
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by BRob2Perryman3 View Post
Our bigs are setting picks because thats all they are capable of. You dont think Archie would utilize Maverick's skill set if he had him?
No. Archie's offense is currently built for slashers and 3-point shooters and he's shown no propensity to incorporate the low post even in situations where we've had a distinct height/strength advantage. He's not going to change it for 1 person as it would affect everyone else's ability to do what they were recruited to do...slash and pop 3's.
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
No. Archie's offense is currently built for slashers and 3-point shooters and he's shown no propensity to incorporate the low post even in situations where we've had a distinct height/strength advantage. He's not going to change it for 1 person as it would affect everyone else's ability to do what they were recruited to do...slash and pop 3's.
We will agree to disagree on that one.

Hypothetically, you are saying if Julius Randle or Aaron Gordon came to Dayton they would be asked to set picks and bring no offense?
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by steve View Post
Think it's a bit unfair to group Archie in with BG and how they use the 5 position offensively. I seem to recall in AM's first year that both Benson (until he got hurt) and MK had pretty good years offensively...Last year they did not have a true 5 so JR and Scott were forced to play that spot. A couple 6' 9" freshmen who ae not C's just learning the ropes did not do too bad.

UD was not good last year and it's quite possible that Morgan wanted to also go to a larger and better conference, a very good BB program, as well, and go against more accomplished BIGS..Not to mention the kid also had a very good relationship with Groce.
MK's offensive success was a function of offensive rebounds and free throws...not the offense isolating him.

Benson's best game was outside the low post and his #1 role was to set picks on the wing or top of the key. Remember the Illinois State 1-point loss at home where Benson - directly under the basket - and where he was scared to shoot and triple pump-faked his way to turnover as time ran out...he had no inside game.
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:36 PM
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archie would throw the ball into the post more if a true center was there to receive it and finish. We have a couple of forwards playing center. If Jalen was playing against 6'8" guys more he would be effective.
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:39 PM
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Benson was averaging 11 ppg two years ago before he went out and MK was at 9 ppg. That's a total of 20 ppg between the active BIGS on that team..Again, that's 20 ppg, folks? Why? Well, a new system conducive to real ball movement, good penetration by a real good PG who can also shoot and is a threat....Me thinks it's really not just Archie..
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by steve View Post
Thanks coach. Guess Devin can now put his game face on with some guaranteed minutes....I was worried there..
No one hopes more then me that your babblings are correct. The fact is Scott is a hack who belongs in the MAC (no pun intended)
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
Maverick Morgan blew off UD because he didn't want to set picks for the next 4 years. Have you seen how Illinois uses their '5'? He made the right choice.
I guess Morgan decided that picking splinters out of his butt for a lesser team would be better.

Kav took at least 3 outside shots yesterday. How about Robinson lately? Our bigs can do whatever they are capable of, and therein lies the problem.
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
I guess Morgan decided that picking splinters out of his butt for a lesser team would be better.

Kav took at least 3 outside shots yesterday. How about Robinson lately? Our bigs can do whatever they are capable of, and therein lies the problem.
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Old 03-14-2014, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
MK's offensive success was a function of offensive rebounds and free throws...not the offense isolating him.

Benson's best game was outside the low post and his #1 role was to set picks on the wing or top of the key. Remember the Illinois State 1-point loss at home where Benson - directly under the basket - and where he was scared to shoot and triple pump-faked his way to turnover as time ran out...he had no inside game.
You could not be more incorrect about how Kavs was used two years ago. He was a central point of the offense with touches because he could pass out of the post, reverse the ball, etc.....He scored on dump downs to the weak side, dish offs, etc. And do you really believe that most BIGS, not called All Americans, score strictly the old traditional way with short jump hooks, up and under's, back to the basket turn arounds, etc? They score in a variety of ways and that includes everything outside of what was just mentioned.
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Old 03-14-2014, 01:30 PM
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"Sandstorm" just came on my Spotify mix of about 2200 songs. I consider it a sign.

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Old 03-14-2014, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by steve View Post
You could not be more incorrect about how Kavs was used two years ago. He was a central point of the offense with touches because he could pass out of the post, reverse the ball, etc.....He scored on dump downs to the weak side, dish offs, etc.
Which doesn't explain why he's used in an opposite way now!

Or is he??
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Old 03-14-2014, 03:08 PM
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Steve,


Devon Scott: 1 missed easy layup. 1 fumbled layup out of bounds. Any questions?
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Old 03-14-2014, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by BRob2Perryman3 View Post
Steve,


Devon Scott: 1 missed easy layup. 1 fumbled layup out of bounds. Any questions?
Hey, nice call on the minutes played by Scott. You realized, once again, your irrational and emotional posts throughout this thread. You started with 0 minutes, realized your absurdity and went to 5, and he ended up with 8. But after your latest post I'm sure you'll find a gloating way to blame the loss on Scott. You're a real gem.

Last edited by steve; 03-14-2014 at 08:19 PM..
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Old 03-14-2014, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan View Post
The keys to defeating St. Joe tomorrow.

1) Need great post play. Kanacevic hurt UD big time last game. If Kav and Robinson can play like the did at St. Louis (Negate Loe and score), they have a chance.
2) Don't let Roberts dominate. He is big and a force inside on offense and defense.
3) Wear down St. Joe or get them in foul trouble. They are not deep, but they will be rested.
4) Sibert and Vee stay hot
5) Play with pay back in their hearts.

Sounds like UD did what it took to win. I did not see the game, but saw the call and read comments.

I guess I needed to add point #6. Find fair refs.
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